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A trained and experienced blood trailing dog will do just that..

The Germans (and other Europeans) test their blood trailing dogs as we have bird dog trials. A good dog would be expected to follow a two or three day old trail several miles..They actually test them in the live situation so to sppeak, not just on artificial trails.

The practicalities of things like crossing boundaries and local politics/legalities are of course another matter..

Quote context was edited to omit that I was referencing my own dogs. Really!?

Plenty of tracking hounds will do as described. North American Hunting Retriever Assn. trains and tests on those skills as well beyond Started level.

Sure it would be handy to have a highly specialized dog standing by each season on the rare chance of a bad hit. Guess we just never had that European expertise to guide us in hunting elk.

This was the scene yesterday at Wolf Springs.

I couldn't get them all in the photo. There were elk above on the public land too but the big bull eluded me.

+2 on Trinchera. I've had them run my plates and then leave a note on my windshield to let me know they did just for being parked on a county road near the Trinchera.

True about contacting an officer but I don't think they would encourage one to try to in that situation if they did not intend to try for a good outcome.
I get where that might not be top priority at the moment.
If faced with that circumstance contact State Patrol.
I've always gotten at least a callback from the DOW officer on duty or his supervisor.

Back in 2001 we took a really big bull up in North MuddyCreek drainage during ML season.

Sorry, my mistake, as I missed the original context...

The "German style" of blood trailing is fairly new to the UK, and to be frank, it seems to encompass a lot of elitism and snobbery as to what is considered a good deer dog..

A few years back, I had a Border Terrier I used from time to time on deer.

He was more a pet than a working dog, but he would still follow a trail a few hundred yards into cover, and really that is all I needed..

I doubt he would have passed even the puppy tests the Germans use, but he still managed to be very useful and found several deer that I would probably have other wise lost, so I do get where you are coming from....

I actually think its great when a dog can go to elk camp.
It's probably the highlight of their lives.
I've read about Montana outfitters that use heelers to warn of bears.
A campfire just seems more enjoyable when the dogs are gnawing a hoof or dragging a piece of hide around.
Three elk seasons ago I brought my 12 year old heeler to elk camp because I was sure that it would be her last year due to her health. She made herself valuable guarding the hanging elk meat from the martins and Canada Jays. She is still with us today.
I've noticed that elk are pretty easy for a dog to trail. I think that's because many elk pee a bit as they move. I noticed my dogs could follow an elk trail long after it had been completely obscured by blowing snow.

I was grateful to have mine along on this hunt. A bear had claimed this gutpile by piling leaves around it. The bear was still close by and the dogs were haired-up and barked at his location as we hauled out meat.

Coyote_Hunter: I may have missed this part of the post, but did you invalidate your cow tag once you realized you had lost the elk?

In my opinion that is the ethical thing to do when one loses an animal. After all, an elk hit hard enough to bleed pools and ribbons is no doubt dead, correct?

I would never pass judgement on the shot or your marksmanship, as it sounds as though you had plenty of practice and a good range finder. We have all lost game animals (or will at some point) and it is a painful experience.

Better luck next year!

Dead ain't dead unless you find it dead IMHO.

What folks call pools of blood and such, well lets just say I"ve seen some amazing survivals of game....

So then how many do you hit before you say enough?

my very limited knowledge is from helping to train a drahthaar. the dog is not tracking it is blood trailing. the standards test is about 1 cup blood on a 600 meter(its german) trail with 2 90 degree turns, left for appx 11 hours. the dog will run down this as fast as you can keep up. Rain doesnt effect this as much as you may think. Sounds like bs, and if i hadnt seen it i would have doubted it too.

From over a 100 bowkills and years of experience I can pretty much tell from the way the blood looks and the blood trail starts... and ends...

I"m not going where you think I am or you are insinuating, I'm just saying that a good hunter and tracker can't find an animal, its often not dead. I"ve seen more survive shots they are not supposed to than folks would believe.

OTOH not being able to follow into private land and the animal may well have been just over there dead...

But I won't punch my own tag from a lost animal unless I know in my mind it is dead or going to die. The few in my days that I knew we screwed up and the animal was going to die IMHO, that was a tagged animal for me.

Pretty simple.

Its why I despise the part on a guided hunt that says draw blood and you pay and are done....not that I've done guided hunts. But I totally see why its put into play having guided enough...

And dogs are a huge plus IMHO.

Last deer I trailed for a nephew, I said right away this is a waste of time. Flesh wound only.

Finally called the wife and got the dog. Dog said same thing. Nope.

I wished everyone had a dog. Working on training ours as much more as we can thanks to Ingwe's input this fall.

OK. So then this elk in question could still be suffering ... or not.

The question still left unanswered is How many?

"Dead ain't dead unless you find it dead" is a whole lot different from "... that was a tagged animal for me." Lots of room between those two positions.

IMHO once you pull the trigger you are responsible for that animal, live or dead, period. It should take a while before that is no longer the priority. Few landowners will want a life to go to waste regardless of whether they allow hunting.

I'm OK with a guide stating draw blood and you're done. If he doesn't state that then what does the client expect - a guarantee? If the guide gets the client blood he did his part.

Anyone who knows their rifle and their limitations, who does their level best to find a wounded animal, and who genuinely feels bad for losing one is not the problem. Sometimes they get away, that's the truth. If you have the time and the drive, I say fill that tag if you can.

Conversely the guy that shoots at any range, doesn't even look for blood, doesn't really care if he finds it or not after a short look... he's not gonna quit either. He'll wound them til he gets one.

The point is, the first guy deserves to fill a tag and it's his business if he wants to keep hunting, not yours. Come to think of it, it's not your business either way.

Well said huntinazz! Plus that blue heeler & bull picture is awesome!

CH I feel your pain. If you hunt long enough something like this will happen. Four pages into the thread and no one has stated what I consider the obvious. That shooting 3-500 yards at the range is/can be different from actual hunting conditions. Most rifle ranges have a flat terrain where we can see the wind at different yardages. Some ranges even have flags set up on the range. It is much easier to dope the wind at the rifle range where we have these types of indicators. This changes in an actual hunting condition and as CH stated the wind gust was not noticed until after the shot. Beating up on CH is not my intention. Just stating that sometimes what we think we know, we don't. Spoken by some one who lost an elk a long time ago and still remembers the event.

Coyote_ Hunter: Sorry about that Elk not coming to bag for you.
It happens.
Better luck next Hunt.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Well this sort of thing is going to happen the longer you hunt, sounds like you gave it your best effort in trying to find the cow. The fact that it bothers you speaks well of you, I had a fellow on my property shoot a deer, claimed a big buck and well spent three days looking for it, lost the trail, a tracking dog would have done the trick, but the Nature of Deer hunting in Connecticut and trespass rules made a mess of the whole thing along with his poor shooting, should have never taken the shot in the first place, live and learn and he has not been on my ground since! This was dam near 30 years ago and it still bothers me to this day when I read your account, I remember my own, if it didn't bother me, it would be time to not hunt any more! You did fine in my opinion!

It is hard not to feel for someone who has had misfortune on a hunt.
Who wouldn't?

The obvious white elephant in the room is when that person is someone with thousands of posts about their experience, marksmanship skills, hunting accomplishments, and pages of advice to others. That bragging sets the bar high for themselves. No one else is doing that but them. OK to play cowboy as long as it is not all hat and no cows. Torture elk with novice mistakes and then expect sympathy? No.

Private ranch with limited access in a state hunting program? Most of us would treat that with respect from the start. Can't get in range on a ranch? Flinging a long shot under those circumstances? Even if you were a public land DIY guy faced with the only shot opportunity of the trip are you gonna risk that? Ya gotta think your hunt still ends well if no shot is fired. Not so if it turns into a rodeo. If you really are, for lack of a better word, an 'expert hunter' how do you justify that risk over a cow?

So for whatever reason an accomplished hunter decides this is acceptable risk. Goes bad. Still - this could happen to anyone. The cardinal rule no matter what type of trouble you are in is don't make it worse. There is more to being an experienced hunter than hunting skills. Most do not get to that point without developing some better judgement and skills - for instance, - becoming experts at contacting landowners. Gotta think that nearly any ranch knows its adjacent ranches. If not - the phone number on his burglar alarm system will know to contact the owner for sure and it is often posted at the gate. Locked gate call CSP or county dispatch and get help. That's just a few offhand ideas. With a smartphone there are more possibilities.

Continue to hunt? Some years go by where I don't come across an elk carcass fully in tact that was never found by that hunter. Most years I find one.
What is worse than finding that carcass?
Finding a second carcass nearby. Hope he got the 3rd one.
Possibly even worse still is someone else finding it - someone not on the side of the elk hunter. But just tell them it's nobody else's business. If you are at that stage where you are supposed to be setting an example and showing leadership how is continuing to hunt doing so ... and over a cow?

One could empathize with young man making these mistakes who is doing his best to improve. On the other hand someone who talks themselves up but then devotes more explanation to their radio programming than their elk recovery - not so much.

It took 33 years to lose the first one. I hope never to lose another.