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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
M1 .30 Carbine, SAAMI MAP is 40K PSI.

Is there a load that will drive a 150-180 grain cast bullet from that cartridge around 1,000-1,100 fps within SAAMI MAP limits?

Thanks,

Dan


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


BP-B2

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
As a good rule, QuickLOAD will give much better outputs the more detailed the inputs.

***USE THIS DATA AT OUR OWN RISK***

I used a barrel length of 18" and all the defaults in QuickLOAD (which I generally don't like to do). I trimmed out all the loads that didn't give 1000+ fps or that had a an estimated powder burned below 85% (too dirty/inefficient). Normally I check QuickLOAD for sanity against published data, but this heavy of bullet in the .30 carbine is uncharted territory. Be careful with these computer guestimated loads.

Code
=Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 150, LEE C309-150-F
Useable Case Capaci: 12.061 grain H2O = 0.783 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.680 inch = 42.67 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

13 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 70%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                    104.6     12.1     0.78    1732    99.6    40611    2553   1.197  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 296                     102.6     12.3     0.79    1714    93.0    40611    2705   1.218  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                       102.7     12.3     0.79    1679    95.5    40611    2529   1.234  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    93.2     10.6     0.69    1639    99.4    40611    2200   1.247  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        93.2      9.8     0.64    1629    98.8    40611    2185   1.252  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       95.9     11.0     0.71    1614    97.0    40611    2186   1.258  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                      106.0     11.0     0.71    1595    86.1    40611    2327   1.268  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N110                    110.0     10.4     0.67    1589    98.4    34608    2200   1.306
Accurate No.9                       81.3      9.7     0.63    1589    99.6    40611    2005   1.267  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.7                       73.9      8.9     0.57    1576   100.0    40611    1841   1.272  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    96.1      8.7     0.56    1575   100.0    40611    1885   1.272  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N105                     96.9      8.4     0.55    1554   100.0    40611    1643   1.277  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant POWER PISTOL                78.5      6.9     0.45    1529   100.0    40611    1669   1.289  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N38                     91.2      8.3     0.54    1523   100.0    40611    1621   1.295  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                           110.0     11.2     0.73    1514    85.8    34439    2135   1.347
Hodgdon H4227                      110.0     11.2     0.73    1501    85.8    32226    2166   1.373
Vihtavuori 3N37                     79.8      6.9     0.44    1419   100.0    40611    1313   1.352  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     82.8      6.7     0.43    1407   100.0    40611    1278   1.357  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       90.1      6.3     0.41    1404   100.0    40611    1290   1.364  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      80.3      5.8     0.37    1372   100.0    40611    1210   1.385  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    70.5      5.2     0.34    1365   100.0    40611    1215   1.385  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     78.4      5.8     0.37    1330   100.0    40611    1095   1.411  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   74.6      5.3     0.35    1301   100.0    40611    1059   1.440  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     74.3      5.4     0.35    1288   100.0    40611    1015   1.451  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  80.1      5.3     0.34    1275   100.0    40611     983   1.455  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  77.0      4.5     0.29    1245   100.0    40611     970   1.483  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   78.2      4.8     0.31    1244   100.0    40611     953   1.485  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     73.5      4.8     0.31    1227   100.0    40611     902   1.503  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  76.8      4.7     0.31    1220   100.0    40611     905   1.503  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     80.2      4.4     0.29    1215   100.0    40611     911   1.514  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star           100.9      5.6     0.36    1150   100.0    40611     764   1.583  ! Near Maximum !


Code
Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 160, LEE C309-160-R
Useable Case Capaci: 11.483 grain H2O = 0.746 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.680 inch = 42.67 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

13 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 70%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                    104.3     11.5     0.74    1652    99.8    40611    2410   1.246  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 296                     102.3     11.6     0.75    1636    93.5    40611    2569   1.267  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                       102.4     11.6     0.75    1602    95.9    40611    2400   1.285  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    92.9     10.1     0.65    1562    99.5    40611    2076   1.300  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        92.9      9.3     0.60    1552    99.0    40611    2062   1.305  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       95.6     10.4     0.68    1539    97.4    40611    2069   1.311  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                      105.7     10.5     0.68    1522    86.7    40611    2217   1.320  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N110                    110.0      9.9     0.64    1520    98.8    35020    2084   1.355
Accurate No.9                       81.1      9.2     0.60    1514    99.8    40611    1890   1.321  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.7                       73.6      8.4     0.54    1500   100.0    40611    1731   1.328  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    95.8      8.3     0.54    1499   100.0    40611    1773   1.327  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N105                     96.5      8.0     0.52    1477   100.0    40611    1544   1.333  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant POWER PISTOL                78.2      6.6     0.43    1453   100.0    40611    1570   1.346  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                           110.0     10.7     0.69    1450    86.5    34750    2040   1.397
Vihtavuori 3N38                     90.8      7.8     0.51    1448   100.0    40611    1523   1.352  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4227                      110.0     10.7     0.69    1437    86.6    32520    2071   1.424
Vihtavuori 3N37                     79.6      6.5     0.42    1348   100.0    40611    1235   1.415  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     82.5      6.4     0.41    1337   100.0    40611    1202   1.420  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       89.8      6.0     0.39    1334   100.0    40611    1214   1.428  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      80.0      5.5     0.35    1303   100.0    40611    1138   1.450  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    70.3      4.9     0.32    1296   100.0    40611    1143   1.450  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     78.1      5.5     0.36    1263   100.0    40611    1030   1.478  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   74.3      5.1     0.33    1235   100.0    40611     996   1.509  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     74.0      5.1     0.33    1222   100.0    40611     954   1.520  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  79.8      5.1     0.33    1210   100.0    40611     924   1.525  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  76.7      4.2     0.27    1182   100.0    40611     913   1.554  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   78.0      4.6     0.30    1181   100.0    40611     896   1.557  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     73.2      4.5     0.29    1164   100.0    40611     847   1.576  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  76.6      4.5     0.29    1158   100.0    40611     852   1.576  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     80.0      4.2     0.27    1153   100.0    40611     856   1.587  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star           100.6      5.3     0.34    1092   100.0    40611     718   1.660  ! Near Maximum !


Code
Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 170, LEE C309-170-F
Useable Case Capaci: 9.845 grain H2O = 0.639 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.680 inch = 42.67 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

13 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 70%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                    107.8     10.2     0.66    1528    99.4    40611    2102   1.321  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 296                     105.8     10.3     0.67    1512    92.3    40611    2214   1.343  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                       105.8     10.3     0.67    1480    94.9    40611    2074   1.363  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    96.1      8.9     0.58    1446    99.2    40611    1804   1.379  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        96.0      8.3     0.54    1435    98.5    40611    1787   1.387  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       98.6      9.2     0.60    1421    96.6    40611    1786   1.394  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.9                       83.7      8.1     0.53    1400    99.5    40611    1640   1.405  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                      108.6      9.2     0.60    1399    85.2    40611    1891   1.411  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.7                       76.1      7.4     0.48    1390   100.0    40611    1505   1.410  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    98.9      7.3     0.47    1388   100.0    40611    1542   1.411  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N105                    100.0      7.1     0.46    1371   100.0    40611    1338   1.412  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant POWER PISTOL                80.7      5.8     0.38    1347   100.0    40611    1360   1.431  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N38                     93.8      6.9     0.45    1342   100.0    40611    1319   1.438  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N37                     82.0      5.7     0.37    1249   100.0    40611    1064   1.506  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     85.1      5.6     0.36    1238   100.0    40611    1034   1.513  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       92.6      5.3     0.34    1236   100.0    40611    1045   1.520  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      82.4      4.8     0.31    1207   100.0    40611     978   1.546  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    72.3      4.3     0.28    1200   100.0    40611     981   1.547  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     80.4      4.8     0.31    1168   100.0    40611     883   1.578  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   76.5      4.5     0.29    1143   100.0    40611     853   1.611  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     76.2      4.5     0.29    1131   100.0    40611     817   1.622  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  82.0      4.4     0.29    1119   100.0    40611     790   1.630  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  78.6      3.7     0.24    1092   100.0    40611     779   1.664  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   80.0      4.0     0.26    1092   100.0    40611     765   1.666  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     75.2      4.0     0.26    1076   100.0    40611     723   1.685  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  78.4      3.9     0.26    1070   100.0    40611     726   1.688  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     82.0      3.7     0.24    1065   100.0    40611     730   1.700  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star           103.1      4.7     0.30    1008   100.0    40611     611   1.779  ! Near Maximum !


Code
Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 180, LEE C309-180-R
Useable Case Capaci: 9.333 grain H2O = 0.606 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.680 inch = 42.67 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

13 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 70%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                    107.8      9.6     0.62    1459    99.5    40611    1980   1.374  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 296                     105.8      9.8     0.63    1444    92.6    40611    2094   1.396  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                       105.8      9.8     0.63    1414    95.1    40611    1960   1.417  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    96.1      8.4     0.55    1380    99.3    40611    1698   1.435  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        96.0      7.8     0.51    1370    98.7    40611    1682   1.443  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       98.7      8.8     0.57    1357    96.8    40611    1684   1.450  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                      108.6      8.7     0.57    1336    85.6    40611    1791   1.469  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.9                       83.7      7.7     0.50    1336    99.6    40611    1543   1.463  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.7                       76.1      7.1     0.46    1325   100.0    40611    1412   1.469  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    98.9      6.9     0.45    1323   100.0    40611    1448   1.470  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N105                    100.0      6.7     0.44    1307   100.0    40611    1255   1.472  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N110                    110.0      8.0     0.52    1301    97.5    31143    1665   1.558
Alliant POWER PISTOL                80.7      5.5     0.36    1284   100.0    40611    1277   1.493  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N38                     93.8      6.6     0.43    1279   100.0    40611    1237   1.499  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N37                     82.0      5.4     0.35    1189   100.0    40611     998   1.572  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     85.0      5.3     0.35    1179   100.0    40611     971   1.579  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       92.5      5.0     0.32    1177   100.0    40611     981   1.587  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      82.4      4.6     0.30    1149   100.0    40611     917   1.614  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    72.2      4.1     0.27    1142   100.0    40611     921   1.616  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     80.4      4.6     0.30    1112   100.0    40611     828   1.649  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   76.5      4.2     0.27    1088   100.0    40611     800   1.684  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     76.2      4.3     0.28    1077   100.0    40611     766   1.696  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  82.0      4.2     0.27    1065   100.0    40611     741   1.704  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  78.6      3.5     0.23    1039   100.0    40611     731   1.741  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   80.0      3.8     0.25    1039   100.0    40611     717   1.742  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     75.1      3.8     0.25    1024   100.0    40611     678   1.763  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  78.4      3.7     0.24    1018   100.0    40611     680   1.766  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     81.9      3.5     0.23    1014   100.0    40611     685   1.779  ! Near Maximum !


“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
― Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man's Fear
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Campfire Kahuna
OP Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Holy cow, thanks a heap! Lot of info there!

Dan


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Campfire Kahuna
OP Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
My main reason for examining this issue is potentially a new barrel on a T/C Contender with a can on the end. This will serve as a good reference and I appreciate it.

D


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Campfire Kahuna
OP Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Azar, if you don't mind I would appreciate seeing a similar run with the LEE C309-180-R; C.O.A.L of 2.300" in the velocity range of 800-1100 fps. If you can, take the minimum load density filter out of the equation.

Thanks!


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


IC B2

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
Dan,

The bullet isn't long enough for that COAL. It would be completely out of the case. Although, QuickLOAD's bullet database isn't always correct. It's best to measure a bullet and overwrite the defaults. I don't suppose you happen to have bullets cast from that particular mold that you could measure?

At a COAL of 1.680" QL shows a seating depth of 0.620 (so fairly deeply seated). The .30 Carbine appears to have a neck length of right around 0.308". So with 100% neck tension that would give you a COAL of 1.992". Going as low as 75% neck tension (my personal minimum) would give you a COAL of 2.070".

And I can't completely take the minimum load density out of the equation as 29% is lowest allowed.

***USE THIS DATA AT YOUR OWN RISK***

Code
Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 180, LEE C309-180-R
Useable Case Capaci: 16.677 grain H2O = 1.083 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.070 inch = 52.58 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Winchester 296                      86.2     14.2     0.92    1711    98.8    40611    3445   1.273  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                     87.3     13.9     0.90    1690   100.0    40611    3012   1.272  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot X-Terminator               109.7     18.1     1.17    1685    87.9    40611    3614   1.265  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder- 7                 108.5     16.1     1.05    1678    94.6    40611    3392   1.275  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                        86.8     14.3     0.93    1671    99.7    40611    3168   1.288  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4227                      101.9     14.3     0.93    1654    97.6    40611    3153   1.274  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N120                    110.0     15.4     1.00    1644    98.3    36811    3205   1.308
Accurate 1680                       95.1     15.7     1.02    1641    90.5    40611    3259   1.285  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H335                       110.0     18.5     1.20    1638    84.4    38732    3535   1.301
Accurate 2200                      107.2     16.7     1.08    1634    85.5    40611    3293   1.287  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                       91.9     13.2     0.86    1633    94.8    40611    3188   1.289  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                           100.0     14.1     0.91    1632    96.7    40611    3066   1.285  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N110                     96.9     12.6     0.82    1626   100.0    40611    2699   1.296  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4198                           110.0     15.2     0.98    1623    93.5    37852    3230   1.309
Hodgdon H4198                      106.9     15.4     1.00    1609    88.2    40611    3079   1.297  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    78.6     12.3     0.80    1608   100.0    40611    2628   1.307  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       81.5     12.9     0.84    1606   100.0    40611    2708   1.305  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        78.7     11.5     0.74    1605   100.0    40611    2632   1.305  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-10x                110.0     16.0     1.03    1590    90.1    31169    3415   1.393
Accurate No.9                       69.2     11.4     0.74    1563   100.0    40611    2415   1.319  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    81.8     10.2     0.66    1537   100.0    40611    2284   1.328  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N130                    110.0     15.8     1.02    1534    89.1    30736    3102   1.423
Accurate No.7                       62.5     10.4     0.67    1533   100.0    40611    2226   1.334  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2015                      110.0     16.4     1.06    1529    86.8    28125    3249   1.458
Vihtavuori N105                     81.0      9.7     0.63    1492   100.0    40611    1998   1.357  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N38                     77.5      9.7     0.63    1480   100.0    40611    1987   1.356  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant POWER PISTOL                66.8      8.2     0.53    1479   100.0    40611    2053   1.354  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.5                       50.8      8.8     0.57    1463   100.0    40611    1965   1.360  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon HS-6                        55.9      8.5     0.55    1383   100.0    40611    1665   1.409  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N37                     68.5      8.1     0.53    1373   100.0    40611    1646   1.419  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Longshot                    53.2      8.2     0.53    1366   100.0    40611    1614   1.420  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot True Blue                   52.7      8.2     0.53    1364   100.0    40611    1608   1.421  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 540                      51.9      8.2     0.53    1363   100.0    40611    1605   1.422  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     71.2      8.0     0.52    1363   100.0    40611    1606   1.424  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       77.3      7.5     0.48    1358   100.0    40611    1621   1.431  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester WAP                      57.1      7.6     0.49    1333   100.0    40611    1534   1.443  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Silhouette                  56.9      7.6     0.49    1331   100.0    40611    1527   1.445  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      69.1      6.9     0.44    1328   100.0    40611    1530   1.451  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    61.3      6.2     0.40    1325   100.0    40611    1546   1.448  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.2                       51.1      6.6     0.43    1294   100.0    40611    1409   1.468  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     68.1      6.9     0.45    1292   100.0    40611    1401   1.474  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   64.9      6.4     0.42    1264   100.0    40611    1357   1.502  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     64.5      6.5     0.42    1250   100.0    40611    1301   1.515  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  70.1      6.4     0.42    1243   100.0    40611    1273   1.514  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 231                      56.2      6.5     0.42    1239   100.0    40611    1281   1.518  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Zip                         50.2      6.5     0.42    1239   100.0    40611    1281   1.518  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon HP38                        55.1      6.4     0.42    1231   100.0    40611    1261   1.524  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  68.5      5.5     0.36    1220   100.0    40611    1271   1.536  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   69.1      5.9     0.38    1217   100.0    40611    1243   1.540  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     64.7      5.8     0.38    1199   100.0    40611    1176   1.559  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  68.5      5.8     0.38    1198   100.0    40611    1194   1.554  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     71.4      5.5     0.35    1193   100.0    40611    1197   1.563  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon TiteGroup                   47.5      5.9     0.39    1187   100.0    40611    1162   1.565  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N310                     56.6      5.1     0.33    1130   100.0    40611    1030   1.626  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Clays                       69.1      5.1     0.33    1125   100.0    40611    1037   1.623  ! Near Maximum !


Code
Cartridge          : .30 Carbine
Bullet             : .309, 180, LEE C309-180-R
Useable Case Capaci: 15.209 grain H2O = 0.987 cm�
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.992 inch = 50.60 mm
Barrel Length      : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 40610 psi, or 280 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Winchester 296                      89.2     13.4     0.87    1671    98.2    40611    3199   1.288  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Lil'Gun                     90.5     13.2     0.85    1657   100.0    40611    2817   1.283  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H110                        89.7     13.5     0.87    1633    99.4    40611    2950   1.304  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4227                      104.8     13.5     0.87    1608    96.6    40611    2904   1.295  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder- 7                 110.0     14.9     0.97    1604    92.6    38204    3066   1.324
Accurate 1680                       97.8     14.7     0.96    1592    88.9    40611    2972   1.307  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N110                    100.2     11.9     0.77    1592   100.0    40611    2518   1.310  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                           102.9     13.2     0.86    1587    95.6    40611    2819   1.306  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 5744                       94.5     12.4     0.80    1587    93.6    40611    2925   1.311  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot X-Terminator               110.0     16.5     1.07    1585    84.5    37142    3185   1.338
Accurate 2200                      110.0     15.7     1.01    1580    83.6    40611    2981   1.312  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Enforcer                    81.2     11.6     0.75    1574   100.0    40611    2451   1.323  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant 2400                        81.3     10.8     0.70    1569   100.0    40611    2454   1.323  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4100                       84.1     12.2     0.79    1569    99.9    40611    2524   1.324  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4198                      109.8     14.5     0.94    1559    86.5    40611    2796   1.322  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N120                    110.0     14.1     0.91    1553    96.5    33272    2894   1.383
IMR 4198                           110.0     13.8     0.90    1530    90.7    34645    2865   1.383
Accurate No.9                       71.4     10.7     0.69    1529   100.0    40611    2246   1.337  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BLUE DOT                    84.3      9.6     0.62    1504   100.0    40611    2120   1.347  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.7                       64.5      9.7     0.63    1500   100.0    40611    2066   1.352  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-10x                110.0     14.6     0.94    1491    86.6    27974    3008   1.479
Vihtavuori N105                     83.8      9.2     0.60    1463   100.0    40611    1853   1.374  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N38                     79.9      9.1     0.59    1449   100.0    40611    1839   1.376  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant POWER PISTOL                68.9      7.7     0.50    1448   100.0    40611    1901   1.373  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N130                    110.0     14.4     0.93    1440    85.7    27770    2728   1.508
Accurate No.5                       52.3      8.3     0.54    1431   100.0    40611    1817   1.381  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon HS-6                        57.5      8.0     0.52    1352   100.0    40611    1535   1.431  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori 3N37                     70.4      7.6     0.49    1344   100.0    40611    1518   1.441  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Longshot                    54.7      7.7     0.50    1336   100.0    40611    1487   1.442  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot True Blue                   54.2      7.7     0.50    1334   100.0    40611    1481   1.444  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N350                     73.2      7.5     0.48    1333   100.0    40611    1481   1.447  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 540                      53.3      7.7     0.50    1333   100.0    40611    1478   1.445  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant HERCO                       79.5      7.0     0.45    1328   100.0    40611    1494   1.454  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester WAP                      58.6      7.1     0.46    1303   100.0    40611    1412   1.467  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Silhouette                  58.4      7.1     0.46    1301   100.0    40611    1406   1.469  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant UNIQUE                      71.0      6.4     0.42    1299   100.0    40611    1408   1.475  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant BULLSEYE                    62.8      5.8     0.38    1295   100.0    40611    1422   1.473  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.2                       52.4      6.1     0.40    1264   100.0    40611    1293   1.494  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N340                     69.8      6.5     0.42    1263   100.0    40611    1286   1.500  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Universal                   66.5      6.0     0.39    1235   100.0    40611    1246   1.529  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N330                     66.1      6.0     0.39    1221   100.0    40611    1194   1.542  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1250                  71.8      6.0     0.39    1213   100.0    40611    1166   1.542  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 231                      57.5      6.1     0.40    1209   100.0    40611    1173   1.546  ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Zip                         51.3      6.1     0.40    1209   100.0    40611    1173   1.546  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon HP38                        56.3      6.0     0.39    1201   100.0    40611    1154   1.553  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Nitro 100                  69.9      5.1     0.33    1190   100.0    40611    1162   1.566  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant GREEN DOT                   70.6      5.5     0.36    1187   100.0    40611    1137   1.570  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N320                     66.1      5.4     0.35    1169   100.0    40611    1075   1.589  ! Near Maximum !
Accurate Solo 1000                  69.9      5.4     0.35    1168   100.0    40611    1090   1.585  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant RED DOT                     72.9      5.1     0.33    1162   100.0    40611    1093   1.595  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon TiteGroup                   48.4      5.5     0.36    1157   100.0    40611    1061   1.597  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star            91.7      6.4     0.42    1102   100.0    40611     923   1.665  ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N310                     57.6      4.7     0.30    1100   100.0    40611     936   1.663  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Clays                       70.1      4.7     0.30    1093   100.0    40611     941   1.662  ! Near Maximum !


Hopefully you can find a safe load that meets your criteria. Don't blow yourself (or your firearm) up. wink


“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
― Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man's Fear
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 55,886
Thanks is not sufficient, so in the spirit of possibilities, if you ever find yourself headed down this way, let me know! Drinks are on me! And more.

The actual bullet I developed that OAL from is the NOE 180 FN seated ~.300" deep w/ a custom chamber cut. It measures 1.085" long. SAAMI spec on the case length for the .30 Carbine is 1.29" and you are correct, I miscalculated on that. The 2.07" COAL is a good reference.

Thanks again, and your note of caution is not lost on me. Just a ballpark guess at present, but the initial loads will probably start at about 70% of what is indicated as Max on your tables. The objective is 'quiet', not thunder.

Started looking at increasing OAL when I saw the load density projections and looked at a bullet/case combo at the 1.68" COAL. Trying to imagine what it would take to stuff 12-13 grains of Li'l Gun in the remaining space made me twitch a little. Powders of choice will likely be Bullseye, Red Dot and maybe Clays.



I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
Good luck!


“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
― Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man's Fear
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 4
M
New Member
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New Member
M
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 4
Just a follow up to the info that was previously run for me:

As I have been reading around the forums and comparing information, I decided to test out the Optimum Barrel Time calculator, I found posted at http://www.the-long-family.com/OBT%20tool%20V1.xls
I measured my barrel length as 23.7 inches from the bolt face to the recessed crown. I plugged this info in the calculator and came up with multiple predicted nodes where the harmonics should be optimized on my gun. I used the quick load data that was run for me here, and figured out that 42.1gr was the last predicted node, before I started exceeding chamber pressure. I worked my way up to this load today, and was surprised at the results. I shrunk a 5 shot group to a .333 inch group at 100 yards when I reached 42.1 gr of RL17, which was about half the comparable loads. I was super excited to see the predictions come to life. I'm new to the forum, but I'll try and figure out how to attach a picture as well.

Last edited by MoonMan; 01/03/15.

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