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That's some funny stuff right there.

180 Partition

Advice......

1. Huck them target bullets and get either 180 or 200 grain partition or accubond bullets. That horse hauky about accubonds exploding is just that, horse hauky. Carry on with Working up a load to your liking with ether said bullet.

2.Find a legal wapiti to shoost at.

3. Hope legal wapiti is not @597 yards on the last half hour of light on the last possible day of hunt

4.Once wapiti is found, Place bullet into and or threw vitals or destroy major structure bone ie: hips, shoulders, spine, brain pan.

I'll admit that I'm still scared of Bergers, MatchKings and Scenars on elk. Myself and hunting partners have taken more with Partitions than anything else, but I think the Accubonds are starting to creep up into the picture more. Hard to beat that 200 grain Accubond. Did recover one from a .300 Win Mag at about 50 yards that was caught in a rear ham. Elk died.

I am fairly green if not extremely green. But looking at the old barnes reloading book that lists the XLC (coated) bullet. In the 180 XLC the 30 06 was dang near if not better than the 300 win mag in performance. Therefore it is my belief that the Magnum 30 cal cartridges begin to shine above the 3006 at 200 grains or better. The 200 grain stuff will better utilize the slower bigger burning powder column of the mag cases. The sectional density of the 200 would give Boddington a chub , and the ballisitc coefficient even with flat bases will nearly match a 180 boattail. It is my humble opinion if you can group a 200 grain with your 300 mag, hunt with it or use a 3006/308 winchester.

A lot of appropriate Nosler bullets mentioned here so I'll mention the 168-gr Barnes TTSX. It won't fail up close and you can easily kick it out fast enough from the 300 to get some expansion at 500. Usually very accurate too.

Bla Bla Bla, this is good, that isn't...

At the risk of sounding like Boxer, I have killed over 60 elk, the most of them were killed (around 40) with a 165 grain Hornady spire point in a 30-06. Nothing special, just good shots at distances of 80-400 yards.

Due to circumstances on a hunt, I decided to get something for longer range than the 30-06 so a 600 yard shot could be made reliably. I settled on a 300 Weatherby magnum with a 180 grain Nosler BT and have killed several elk at over 500 yards with no loss of elk or meat.

If you think that a standard bullet of today's major manufacturers won't work, you are mistaken. I would stress that the shot is more important than the bullet. As much as people badmouth a Remington Core-Loct bullet, I wouldn't hesitate shooting them either. I have killed elk with those bullets out of military surplus rifles.

As was mentioned earlier, shooting is more important than the bullet, being in shape for the hunt and a good pair of boots would worry me more than the bullet...

While I can't be sure the number of times, but Muledeer has explained this to you before more than once. And he did so once again in this thread.... Don't you think its about time to take a hint and realize your info is outdated and irrelevant?

If it was irrelevant, wouldn't Nosler drop that line from their BT website page that says it's for deer sized game? It doesn't cost that much to buy a bullet that's actually recommended for the game you're hunting.

Well....... this sure sounds nice in theory, but if you ever see an elk slapped with a 180 gr bullet from a 300 magnum at 400-500 yards you might forget about these theories. A 180 gr flat knocks the snot out of them.

I've used the 200 gr NPT on them.and 180's as well...on average it will penetrate a bit deeper but any difference in actual killing over a 180 of similar construction is more theoretical than real.

Game animals would have to get to be the size of a Cape Buffalo or rhino(never hunted either one) before I gave a thought to hunting them with a 300 magnum and a good 180 gr bullet:certainly nothing in NA.

Bob I would definitely not be afraid to shoot an elk w/the 180gr .30 or .338 BT's. They hammer our large hogs(200-400lb)here in Texas with much authority. Having used the .284 most of my life...when I began hunting w/the 338-06 and the 180-200gr BT's I saw an instant difference in knock down and killing power. powdr

powdr: Great outfits!

Never used those 338 bullets you have, but 30 cal 180's an be used on just about anything.

I've used 180 Accubonds out of a couple different 300 mags on several bull elk. I've also used the same bullet extensively from Antelope to Caribou and a variety of African plains game. Performance has always been as advertised with the Accubond. It is an excellent bullet. I've also shot big game animals with Partitions & TSXs without issue. Elk are pretty darn tough. A good bullet is a must IMHO.

Bob....I was trying to say with the 300 Mag cartridge with bullet use under 200 grains the cartridge does not begin to distinguish itself from the 3006. By no means is a 180 in 30 cal modern hunting bullet in adequate for 800 pound elk. As long as it is going fast enough when it hits the elk.

The barnes reloading manual #3 shows in a 3006 the 180 grain xlc will do 2986 fps to 3091 using 51 to 62 grains. (how the heck you fit 62?) of powder.
The 300 win mag pushes the 180 xlc 3053 fps to 3148 fps. These speeds require 73 to 80 grains of powder.
So the 3006 will average 3038.5 fps on 56.5 grains.
The win mag 3100 fps on 76.5 grains.
2 % more velocity using 35% more powder.

In the same manual the 3006 will push a 200 grain xfb 2482 to 2680. Or 2581 avg.
The 300 win mag will chart a 200 grain xfb 2590 to 2908. A 2750 avg. That shows a 6.5 % velocity difference.
So the velocity advantage increases by 350 % If one shoots a 200 grain bullet versus a 180 grainer out of a 300 Mag compared to a 3006.

So my advice to you jeffbird.... pick a rifle you own you can shoot well out to 500 yards. Look for a sectional density around .25 in the bullet(165 grain 308) and twice the animals weight in fps upon impact.....roughly 1500 foot pounds. For most bullets to function properly it seems they should strike the animal at or above 1800 feet per second.
Monolithic bullets will penetrate above and beyond their sectional densities predict. However lighter bullets (less sectional density) can also be lower intheir ballistic coefficient. The lower the BC the more prone a bullet is to drift. Another consideration is an errant hit with a lighter bullet will posses less energy. We all know a proper hit in the fatal area almost any bullet will harvest. But if a bullet strikes the Rumen/intestinal area foot pounds of energy will come into play as to how shocked the animal will get.
If you choose your 300 mag by all means shoot the bullet you can shoot the best. However some of my reloading manuals state under 180 grains the magnum cases are prone to incomplete powder burn causing variation in bullet velocities. I just got a 308 Norma mag and my neighbor has been loading a 300 win mag at my house so I been reloading and studying the magnum cartridges intently for the first time. I usually hunt elk with a 300 savage. Why? So I can post pics on the savage forum! I do not believe having 300 mag stamped on your barrel will make elk flop over dead....you gotta hit em where it counts! Good Luck!

You need to throw that book away.. 180's at 3100 outta an '06 looks good on paper, and many reloaders found that to be the only case.

That book had some ridiculous loads.

I wouldn't want to be around anybody shooting a 30-06 that was getting 3100 with a 180...

Angus where to start....

First, you can't really use the XLC data in the manual as "typical" because the bullet had a slick blue coating that supposedly cut resistance to the bullet traveling down the bore and gave somewhat higher velocity than most standard bullets.IIRC they may also have been mad slightly undersized to further reduce resistance, the difference in diameter being mad up by that blue, slick coating. It was a neat trick. I have actually loaded and chronoographed some in the 300 WM.

I think you might be cherry picking your data a bit since a quick look at 2 other manuals don't show velocities much over 2800 fps from a 30/06 and 180 gr bullet..I would regard the Barnes data you cite, showing 3091 with a 180 gr from a 30/06 as pie in the sky with any other 30 caliber 180 gr bullets.If I saw it, I'd be running the other way from that load.


I'd consider 2900 fps as really stretching a 30/06. I know that some people have hit those velocities with MRP but have to consider anything much over 2800 fps from a 30/06 as hardly typical.



Any garden variety 300 Win Mag I have loaded for will get 3100 fps with a 180 gr bullet. I hunted for years with long throat 300 Win Mag and 24" Krieger SS barrel that gave 3140 with good case life.No 30/06 I have ever seen would give any where near that velocity level and the 300 beats that cartridge by 200 -300 fps.at pressures I can live with.There is no free lunch.

I would like to see a dozen 30/06's average 3038.5 fps from a 180 gr bullet on 56.5 gr of powder,as you state in your post.... I bet you $100 right now you won't see it....nowhere near close.

I have not looked to see if Barnes makes the XLC anymore but like i said, that bullet was/is an anomaly and hardly typical of what you can expect with most any other brands.

Does Barnes still make them?

My point is that the 300 win mag has substantially more powder capacity than the 30/06 and will show a velocity advantage of 200-300 fps no matter what you feed either one and loaded to the same pressures.If a 30/06 narrows that margin it's only because you are loading it hotter than the 300 and for no other reason, including magic bullets and powders.


In any event,the point of my post was not to start comparing cartridges for relative efficiency...a pretty big waste of time since powder capacity always wins the race ...but to simply state that you could kill elk all day long with either a 180 or 200 gr bullet from a 300 magnum and if construction is good with both you won't see much if any difference in how they kill.

^^^^^^ Listen to this man, I live in Wyoming and his stories are told here in quiet secluded places^^^^^^^^
P.S. I killed a bull with a 7x57 with a 150 gr. core lokt at almost 2600 fps , so anything bigger will kill them just as dead.

I shoot Barnes 165 gr. TSX bullets to kill elk, out of my .300 Weatherby.
A better bullet for elk would be hard to find, IMO.

Well said! This barnes xlc is an anomaly! Possesing Monty Hall "lets make a deal"type figures. However I did get a measured 2950 with them using a Colt light rifle. This load also shoots out of my jc higgins fn, and a 1903 A3. (I never measured either rifles velocities) But lets look at a few other things about the 300 Mag......Does it not require a 26 inch barrel to get the optimum performance? Do they not tend to weigh .75 or more pounds than a 3006 or 308? Do they not, in fact as I have stated, show superior ballistics using a 200 grain projectile? (Compared to the 3006/308) Is not a 200 grain bullet superior to a 180 in sectional density and ballistic co-efficient? If a 200 groups as well as a 180 why would you need to choose the 180? Thanks........I just can't get my head around not using the 200 grain bullets in my 308 Norma.