Home Forums Reloading Shotshells Max dram???

Does anyone know why shotshell manufacturers post this on boxes? I may be wrong but is there such a thing as dram equivalent? Since all powders have different sizes how can we ever find a black powder equivalent? Why don't they just post fps?

The black powder in shotshells was measured in "drams", which is a 1/16 oz. The higher the drams for a particular weight of shot, the faster the velocity. When modern smokeless powder replaced Black Powder in shotshells, the manufacturers marked the shells in Dram Equivalent so that their customers could buy smokeless shells that were the same speed as the black powder shells they were used to using. A 12 gauge 1 1/8oz loaded with 3 1/4 drams of black powder load is going 1255fps, so a smokeless 3 1/4 dr eq load is going the same speed. Smokless powder is much more powerful, most shotshells have less than 1 dram of smokeless powder.

It sure would have simplified things if they had just converted to feet per second way back then. Lots of shells are now being labeled in fps, at some point in the future Dr Eq will go out of use.

Michael

Yeah, it is regrettably pretty archaic. But, it is a quick guide for those misguided souls who don't know or care about the exterior ballistics of their shotgun cartridges (and those people probably buy most of the shells sold over the counter). For that reason alone dram equivalent will continue to appear on boxes of ammo. Funny thing is, the ill-informed shooter doesn't have a clue as to what dram equivalent means anyway. "Bigger numbers equal more power. Better gimmee that there box of max dram equiv, they gotta be better."

HaHa Noah! I've been reading about how these guys in the UK and that they are suggesting that a "balanced load" kills more pheasants. The argument for this vs high velocity shells makes sense but I don't have any load data for the Gamebore Black gold or the Kent stuff to even experiment. I don't even know if I want to considering what might happen to my over/under. Does anyone on here have knowledge of this?

Michael and Greg, you guys seem to shoot quite a bit. Any thoughts?

To Clarify, the theory is as follows:

A 1 ounce load shot around 1200 fps has a better pattern and tighter shot string than a 1 ounce load going 1400 to 1500 fps which can have up to a 25 foot shot string with the majority of shot being deformed in the firing sequence. I.e. Barrel rub, inertia deformation etc...

I don't know, but it makes sense. I gotta take a trip down the bore of a shotgun along with a shot charge so I can witness once and for all if any of those theories hold water.

One ounce of shot @ 1200 fps is easier to shoot than the high velocity loads, I think that is the secret. If the gun is slapping you in the face every time you pull the trigger it is hard to stay on the stock and follow though the shot.

The 3/4 oz 28 gauge load is another of the "square" loads that has a reputation for being able to kill efficiently. I think it is simplicity easier to shoot than 1 1/4oz thunder boomers.

The only way to really tell is to shoot some patterns.

If you have not read BoB Bristers Shotgunning: The Art and the Science you should buy a copy. It is a bit dated now, but he put quit to many of the old myths about shooting a shotgun.

Michael

Yeah, that's one of my old favorite books.

Wasn't it Brister who said a 12ga load started at 1330fps and a load started at 1200fps would have the same velocity at 45yards? Just bought a box of Winchester SuperX that had velocity and not Dram Eq. on the box.(item x12p5)

Thanks guys! I have a ton of questions about all this "stuff" but no one really educated to speak to any of this. It seems that when I ask guys around here don't even listen to my questions. They are so focused on their answer they forget to hear what the question is first.

I know the Brits kill a lot of birds with 2 1/2 inch cartridges at longer distance than me, but as many times as they shoot I cant believe they aren't all dead from lead poisoning.

That theory can be proven with a simple balloon. Wind up and throw it as hard as you can, and then gently lob it in the same direction. The hard/fast tossed one decelerates faster than the gently lobbed one, both ending up at about the same spot in about the same amount of elapsed time. Air resistance acting on a round object in flight is a b*tch. The faster it goes, the faster it slows down. One more reason to question the use of high velocity magnum shotgun cartridges. (Increased amount of shot payload is one argument, but that's a moot point too if the gun patterns lesser weight charges nicely. Do we really need 15-18 pellet strikes on a bird versus 10 or 12?)

Interesting about those SuperX box markings. Perhaps the "Times they are a changin'". I haven't bought a box of factory shotshells in years, so wouldn't have noticed it.

Wasn't he the main character in some cowboy book and movie?

I've been looking all over town... Scheels, Cabelas, Sports authority, cant find any Remington STS shotshells. went to Wal-Mart tonight with my wife, guess what. who would have thought.

Dram eq does have its uses for people like me who dabble in the holy black. It allows me to duplicate say the classic super pigeon load of 1 1/4oz at 1330 fps 3 3/4 drams. That way I know that it takes around 102 grains of FFg black powder to duplicate that load.