Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Need for firepower in the field.

Since the original question dealt with protection while hunting, wouldn't the obvious solution be to hunt with (insert genuflection here) a Scout rifle?

If a hunter feels it's dangerous where he hunts, then mabe he should hunt elsewhere!

Nothign wrong with an AR.

You make your own choices.

Sometimes you choose dependingon game, or location etc....

A smart person never puts all the rocks in one basket....

"Under suitable conditions an egg becomes a chicken, and there are no chickens born of stones."

The good news is that apprehensions have dropped pretty dramatically around here. The bad news is that the cartels are pretty much responsible for that. Anything that moves across the border, contraband or illegals, are being moved by the cartels and they almost always have armed guards to prevent the loss of said contraband or clients to robbers.

Since they pretty much know where BP is at any given time, and where they are concentrating their efforts, they are pretty good at avoiding them. Fortunately for those of us living here, they don't want trouble or publicity, so the incidence of burglary and B and E has declined to almost nothing.

I had an issue once when quail hunting in San Diego County, California, several miles north of the Mexican Border. I returned to my truck to see a line of about 150 people walking passed it. A few of them were armed. All I had on me was a 20 gauge Ugartechea side by side.

One of the armed men pulled a pistol on me and told me to leave in Spanish and then very bad English. I responded by telling him his problem was that he masturbated too much, told him we could both just leave each other alone or I'd turn his head in to a salad bowl with my Uggie. My yellow lab started to growl at him, and he backed off. I kept my gun on him as he did this, opened the door on my truck without taking my eyes off him, reached in for my 92F, pointed that at him, put my shotgun in my truck, reached in to my back pocket, produced my Los Angeles County Deputy Sheriff Badge....

I had another incident closer to the border that same day.

I decided that, while the quail hunting seemed good, I'd stick to my old haunts in San Bernardino and Kern counties and points north, as the quail hunting down there in San Diego County wasn't worth the drama I had experienced that day.

With all respect, i think you need to do what you want to do and take the consequences. You had people that live in the area and are familar with what goes on give you some answers, and you are still looking for further confirmation. Does the expression, "squeal like a pig." mean anything to you. Particularly in spanish?
we have had documented, look it up, shootouts on I10 between tucson and phx with a.k's., and running gun battles in peoria, and a few years ago rounds fired in the hundreds at a house in a subdivision here in the valley.
And you think there would be any hesitation in desolate ground?
I keep thinking of that movie "no country for old men".

The only flaw with this advice that I can see is that one might not feel a place is dangerous until one experiences what it is like to be in that place.

In my case, I had been quail hunting since I was 15, but didn't try quail hunting in San Diego County (aside from Camp Pendelton) until I was in my late 20's. I had no pre-concived expectation that I would return to my truck to have an armed man I never met pull a gun on me. I didn't know the score, so to speak, until I saw it with my own eyes. Then, having seen it, yes... There were other places I could go quail hunting. And I did to avoid that kind of drama I experienced when I hunted down there. But I'm irked to this day that I should feel this way about hunting any patch of ground on U.S. soil.

From the responses so far, fear fuels the need for firepower and not actual occurrences. That just the presence of a weapon seems to defuse the situation.

I firmly believe that if ever in a situation, which is an extremely slim chance considering the number of hunters afield in southern NM and AZ and lack of incidences my odds of surviving having two rounds of buckshot a highpower rifle cartridge and 10-15 rounds of 9mm instantly available are pretty good. If I'm wrong on the next hunt I go on the dogs will be steady, all the shotguns will be London's bests, the birds will fly slow and I can again shoot cleanup for my dad.

Ronin your description of violence in AZ sounds like Saturday night in Tacoma and Seattle.

Just spent some time doing a little studying and with all the perceived violence in AZ it doesn't even make the top 10 in a list of violent crime per capita states and none of the cities in AZ make the top 100 cities in murders per capita.

Those stats are misleading. Gang crime in the bad part of town get rated the same as two hunters shot by a cartel 5 miles from the nearest building. If one was near the worst part of Phoenix he would take precautions, hunting 80 miles from town violence is not expected.

All i have to say is , Better to have a Handgun and not need it or need one and not have it. One poster said , Violent is not expected where he hunts , but in my opinion this is when you will encounter it, when least expected.

I'd not confuse fear with prudence.

Prudence-Yes, I will add a high capacity compact handgun to my hunting kit.

Fear-No, I refuse to let fear drive me to go into the field looking like I'm heading out on patrol. Hunting is enjoyable and relaxing for me. I'm not going to let fear turn it into combat patrol. I've done that and there is not one thing enjoyable or relaxing about it.

Just for the record, I never hunt (or even hike) south of NM Hwy 9 without a sidearm. These days I mostly carry a Colt New Agent .45 with an extra magazine on the belt on my weak side. As has been mentioned, it's just the prudent thing to do.

I'd take those crime statistics with a large dose of salt. Why ? Because nobody, that's NOBODY, audits those crime stats. I know for a fact that it is common practice in high crime areas of Kalifornia to change the descriptions of lots of felonies to misdemeanors to the point where the felony rates were reported at 40% or less of their actual rate(s).
The crime rate is what the PC police administrators say it is. E

This whole thing seems like an odd line of questioning to me. If you are prepared to carry, then why wouldn't you? If you are uncomfortable doing so, then why would you?

I'm willing to add a light handgun but I'm not willing change the way I hunt and the equipment I hunt with due to fear because of a very slim chance of being involved in a firefight with drug dealers or bandit. A great part of hunting and being successful at it for me comes from the equipment I use and not just the kill. Call me a "Ludite" but the longer I'm at this the more I'm drawn to the hand crafted firearms of our fore fathers and nearly as successful with them as others.

The question was about is there actually enough of a threat while in the field to warrant preparing to go to war while hunting. Some of the folks I see going hunting are more equipped than I was going on patrol in Vietnam.

I ran up on one particular grow operation a few years ago on NF land here in Southern Oregon. I was carrying a Savage 99 in .358 Winchester loaded with 5+1, and a Ruger 5 shot 357 wheelgun. Extra ammo was stored in my pack. There were several armed guards positioned around the hidden operation. All were carrying some sort of high capacity semi auto's slung over their shoulders on straps. They also had at least two additional magazines each in belt pouches. Overhead nets concealed the grow from aerial surveillance, with thick 1" cables strung from tree to tree to support them. I remember a freshly bulldozed road through the forest leading into the grow.
By the time I recognized what it was, I had been spotted by at least two of the people there. While my wife speaks spanish, I don't, so I have no idea what they were shouting as they all became aware I was in sight of them. Many thoughts raced through my mind at that instant. Where to conceal myself... was there a big log or tree I could jump behind for protection from flying lead? Exactly how many people were here? Which pouch was my extra ammo in and would I be able to retrieve it to reload while taking fire?!
The first shots may have just been warning shots, because I don't remember hearing any bullets buzzing by me. I dove to the ground and crawled back towards where I'd come from about 30' until I found a 30" fir tree to jump behind. 30" trunk, 150' tall, not 30" tall fir!! By now the bullets were spraying bark all around me and striking the tree fast. I couldn't look around the tree on either side as the bullets were just ripping it up. The only solution was to hit the dirt and sneak to a shallow ravine I remembered crossing just a few yards back. Maybe I could get enough cover to either make an escape or avoid getting hit. I don't know how I made it back to the ravine w/o being hit, the bullets were cutting up the brush all around me. Maybe they couldn't see me clearly in the rhododendrons with me in full camo, I'll never know. Later I discovered I'd been hit 5 times, so who knows, maybe I did take a couple then??
Once in the ravine the shooting stopped. I heard lots of talk but I couldn't understand it. I got the impression they had fanned out to search for me. I was hearing shouts all over the woods now as they circled and searched for me.
The first one I shot was creeping silently along with his AR at waist level, finger on the trigger. I jumped up and shouted "Nacho Libre'
Amigo!!", just in time to see him turn towards me before the 200 grain Hornady Spire point from the 358 (loaded to 2400 fps with a middle of the road load of IMR 4198) caught him in the juggler. He fell to the ground clutching his throat, blood squirting out between his fingers as he went down. In retrospect, I got over-penetration so I'll check out the 180 BT's next. Anyway, back to the story. As the rest heard the shot they rushed my position. I emptied the Savage, claiming 5 of the growers with my 6 shots. I think I under-led the one I missed, he was running top speed as I swung on him. I tried to remember my bird hunting and clay shooting, but I just blew the shot, plain and simple. Anyhow, the next 5 all fell cleanly to the Ruger 357 with Winchester 110 grain HP factory loads. Most were at hand to hand range but there wasn't time to retrieve a knife so they got the bullets instead. The one at 50 yards was a fluke, I don't claim to be any kind of crack shot, just dumb luck on that one. His head exploded well, but I'm thinking for the longer shots a guy should stick with the 125's. I can't say enough about the effectiveness of the little 110 on illegals though. Mighty impressive.
As the bullets rained in on me I was able to reload both weapons while surveying my environment. Upon reloading I was able to get another 8 potheads with my sloppiest shooting of the day. The last one fell to my Spiderco because I just couldn't get reloaded in time. Oh well, it was time to sharpen it anyhow. I wish Savage had thought to make 30 rounders for the old 99, that would've been sweet.

In all, I'd say no, I haven't felt a real need for more firepower than a regular hunting rifle and revolver. Sure you need a knife for close work, but hey, we're hunting here so duh, of course you have one. By then it's just cleanup detail anyhow. So if I was the Op I wouldn't worry too much about it. Might want to bring along a few bandages though so you don't have to rip up your scent lok camo clothes for tourniquets. That sucks. Especially since the knife gets all dulled up sawing on neck bones.

JMO. YMMV.

At least someone that got into an actual shootout with bad guys while hunting.

This must be about you wife and son.

The teacher gave her fifth grade class an assignment: Get their parents to tell them a story with a moral at the end of it.

---The next day, the kids came back and, one by one, began to tell their stories.

There were all the regular types of stuff: Spilled milk and pennies saved. But then the teacher realized, that only Janie was left.

"Janie, do you have a story to share?"

"Yes ma'am. My daddy told me a story about my Mommy. She was a Marine pilot in Desert Storm, and her plane got hit. She had to bail out over enemy territory, and all she had was a flask of whiskey, a pistol, and a survival knife.

She drank the whiskey on the way down so the bottle wouldn't break, and then she parachuted right into the middle of 20 Iraqi troops........

She shot 15 of them with the pistol, until she ran out of bullets, killed four more with the knife, till the blade broke, and then she killed the last Iraqi with her bare hands."

''Good Heavens, 'said the horrified teacher. What did your Daddy tell you was the moral to this horrible story'?"

...."Don't Screw with Mommy when she's been drinking."