Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Subsonic loads ......

I use a light load of 9 gr Unique with a 40gr VMax for a soft 223 load in the Ruger American Predator.

That load will not cycle the action in either of my AR-15s. One is a rifle gas system, the other is a carbine gas system.

Why an issue with a bolt?

For the other "22lr suppressed is better" comments, I own two 22lr cans. And yes, for those on a tight budget and wanting a suppressor, a 22lr can is the cats meow.

Winner for the most worthless comment.

Thanks

Just wasn't easy to get there.

Reduced loads, yeah. But subsonics with the heavies just didn't work out. And when I got them sub-sonic, they weren't stabilizing in an 8" twist. The lighter stuff was ok at shorter ranges, but otherwise sucked and wasn't worth the effort to me.

I ended up using the .308 for sub and super sonic stuff and it has worked really well for me.



Travis

And the Blackout has the twist for it, and companies have developed bullets specifically for this purpose as well.

What is 'shorter range'? 100yd would be fine with me (calling coyotes).

You are saying the heaviest did not stabilize regardless of twist? I have an 8" twist.

Did you try the 40gr?

All of my research to date shows subsonic in an AR15 is not doable. I don't like that result.

Another reason I want to get a subsonic to work is for full auto (fun only).

Factory ammo has been historically available in 100+gr (crazy right?) for subsonics.

Any source for these ultra heavy bullets?

Please explain why one would use a 77 or 80 gr bullet moving 900-1000 fps To shoot coyotes. I shoot a few coyotes each year with 223 and 77 gr SMK's at 2700 fps on up to a 243 AI and I've never wanted less velocity nor have I needed a quiet first shot. Most that I know who use suppressors do so with supersonic ammo and take advantage of the sound being harder to pin point. So yes shooting more and typing less would be beneficial to some.

But I'm interested in hearing how a quiet subsonic 223 could put more fur on the ground.

A subsonic 223 is at the top of the oddest idea I have heard in a while, and makes zero ballistic sense.

But go prove us wrong, I would love to see you with a pile of coyote's shot with your subsonic AR15.

I tried the 40's but they weren't quiet enough. Still had the crack when using them.

My test bed was an 8" twist. The A-Max wasn't stabilizing at sub-sonic speeds.

You could probably get decent enough accuracy to 100yds if you played with them enough. I did all my testing at the 50. I bought a threaded .308 and a threaded .223 to determine which would be easiest to use with both sub-sonics and regular loads. I found the .223 to be a waste of time and kept the .308.



Travis

Another concern with subsonic heavy loads in the .223 is getting a bullet stuck in the bore. The heavy bullets have a lot of bearing length and I think at subsonic you're treading really close to a bore obstruction.

If I was looking for a subsonic supressed game getter on the AR platform, I'd be looking at rounds with larger bores than the 300 bo, not smaller.

I can't think of anything a subsonic .223 can do better than a .22lr or .300BO. No matter what, you will have to build or buy a dedicated upper so why in the world would you stick with a .223?

As for the noise, wanting a hollywood quiet AR that cycles is not going to happen.

Personally, if I were to be hell bent at launching .22 caliber projectiles at subsonic speeds and doing so quietly, I'd get a threaded bolt action .22lr.

I'm one of those "on a budget" that decided after shooting 223, 9mm and 308 with cans, that the 22lr made the most sense if a quiet 22 caliber was my goal.

However, maybe he could use a Noveske switchblock and shut the gas off for subsonic, aimed with maybe a 45 degree offset iron dot and then turn the gas back on to shoot supersonic after changing mags and using the scope for those extra coyotes...

I doubt a switch block would even be needed. The subs probably wouldn't have enough oomph to kick the bolt back.

Hey I'm just trying to be helpful!

No if I was trying to be helpful I'd suggest the OP learn how to handle his coyotes.

(You might sense a little sarcasm in my posts.)

I should have known better ........ opinions and assumptions.

Anyway....

I'm down to needing one more can and that's for centerfire pistol. I'll be buying one that can handle the pressure of the 300 BO and more than likely setting up a 300 BO so I can kill two birds with one stone.

That's the path I'd take.



Travis

Some men when they stumble over the truth, pick themselves up and go on their way as if nothing happened at all.

To the OP's question, I'd look up the twist of the rifle in question and find the formula that tells you what is the longest bullet it can stabilize at 1000 fps. Then the question is will that bullet work acceptably well at that speed. My bet would be no. I'm sure coyotes have fallen to subsonic .22's in the past, but probably not quickly.

I tried the 223 in AR, but too much trouble and settled in 22L I have 22L, 300FB, 308, 9mm, 45 ACP, and like the most 458 Socom in 16" bolt gun and 9" AR