Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Custom Rifles & Wildcats Kimber Montana rebarrel to 6.5 Creed

Let me start by stating that I have only owned factory rifles.

I have found a donor Montucky in .338 fed for a very reasonable price and am saving up to rebarrel it to 6.5 Creed.

Is there any reason I should not send it to Pac-nor for a supermatch factory dupe? Other considerations?
What specifications do I need to request? I want to shoot factory 140amax through it, then load same or 139 scenar in once-fired.

Any input appreciated, I want to make sure I am happy with the result.

Twist it 1-8. Send them a dummy round with the bullet you intend to use seated to take full advantage of the length of the magazine so that they can throat it to match.

Should I send them a factory 140amax load? I can reload to that length easily.

The PacNor barrels I've shot were shooters, but you might also consider the Montana profile ShortActionSmoker ginned up with Lilja. They shoot great too. Just another option....

I'd do the slightly beefier Lilja personally...

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/8488561/1

Hart has a slightly beefier barrel for the Kimber 84M also. I just had my Montana rebarreled to an 8" twist 7mm-08 AI, finished at 23". Bare rifle weighed 5pounds 2 ounces before, weighs 5 pounds 8 ounces now. Balancce feels really good!

Sorry, I can't tell u any more about it right now, I'm in the process of moving to another state, guns and reloading stuff have been temporarily boxed up and moved into storage. I'll be shooting it before the end of the summer.

David

Does Lilja chamber and install?

I don't have a smith, and would rather have the barrel maker do the work.

I would probably keep the factory contour, thinking of finishing length at 24.
Anything else to be considered? Number of grooves? Twist?
Any bolt face or feed rail work needed?
Thanks

Pacnor will do whatever you want. In the past, I've had them duplicate the factory Montana barrel contour out to just past the tip of the forend, and then taper to .600" at the muzzle. That works well too.

1-8 twist for sure....

Montana in a 6.5 creed is gonna be the cat's ass..

24" on a Montana is beyond gross in my opinion. 6.5 Creedmoor would be fun though and I'd be thinking that Lilja dupe at 22" or less myself. Easy enough to shorten so it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Please watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1DR9g8RUJk

Throat it for the Scenar you want to reload. I would also cut it at 22" and no longer than 23".

Look up the montana tinkering thread and check screw length, bed the rifle, and have the trigger adjusted.

Good luck!

Oh and especially check the magbox for binding!

And after doing all that work if it's not shooting up to par. Don't blame the rifle. If you are not used to shooting a rifle that light you could be the problem. It took me a couple hundred rounds with my Montana to get rid of all my bad habits. Tell you what though, that rifle did more for teaching me proper shooting form than any rifle I've ever owned. I no longer have mine but I'm glad I did get to play with one.

Good luck. Sounds like a great rifle.
22.125" at the very most.

'Just do it'

I did...Not a Creedmoor but its slightly smaller brother.... 6.5x47Lapua


Heavier Lilja "MOD84M" contour Benchmark barrel finished @ 22"


As shown 6lbs 8.8oz with 3-9x40 Leupold VX-2 scope and nylon mountain sling

How do you like the heavier contour?

Cool. Who smithed it?

Mine is wearing a #2 Lilja chambered to 6.5 creedmoor.
I went with 23" figuring I can always lop off an inch or two but am happy with it as is.
Is 7lb with Talley lows, Z3 3-9x36 and vero vellini sling.

I am surprised some of you are making your Montana's longer, fatter or heavier...like a 700 or 70.

I was planning to rebarrel my 308 to 243AI but ordered a 6.5 Lilja 84M.

I like the look of that 6.5x47 lapua. Do you have any pics of the whole rifle?

I like the 24in barrel on my Montana .280ack, I wish I had a 24in on my Montana .223.
Or a mag and ejection port long enough to load 75 amaxes with the ogive out of the case. But I digress.

I seriously plan on shooting a lot of factory ammo through the Creed, Should I have the chamber throated for the factory ammo?

Modify it to work. It's been done already.

I will if I ever build it. Until then, the 75gr Horn btsp is accurate as all get out at SAMMI length.

That rifle is why I want to build a Creed for factory ammo, HPR match 75gr shoots lights out in the .223. The only advantage to handloading for it is the 120fps extra, but accuracy is the same.

Better than factory...muzzle doesn't wander around as much when firing





Smithed by barrel maker---Benchmark Barrels...I priced a reamer + barrel from Lilja with a longer wait time + smithing cost and it was a bit cheaper and way faster turn-around having it done at Benchmark






Here you go....

The LAST fhuqking thing I'd do to a Montucky is add contour or length. The LAST. Though I've only got (3) Custom Montuckies and only one of which is finished at OEM length(7 Whizzum),with the trio being contour dupes.

Mike Rock 1-7" 223AI at 21".



Brux 1-8" 6BR at 20".



PN 3-grooved 1-9" at 24". Which reminds me,that I need to kill sumptin' with it and it's newest paint job. I guess I'll whack a Booner with it this pass,for posterity.



20,21 and 22" Montuckies. Rest assured,that noone who guns a 20" wishes for a 21,22,23 or 24"...let alone more contour. Hint.



OEM outta da box. Mag shim slide,port scallop,ejector trim,yada,yada,the usual.



Dick Rifle contour/length dupe.



BR Box Slide,though 223/223AI COAL is greater.

[img]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/904/zJquWF.jpg[/img]

While the Hornie 75BTHP do leap nicely,the jump cain't begin to hang with a smooch. Read that again. Now one more time. Hint.

Yet another Montucky 223AI slide/scallop. Hint.

[img]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/908/2a6d43.jpg[/img]
[img]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/539/6714df.jpg[/img]

Some 100yd FF clusters from a Slid Scalloped 223AI.

[img]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/829/j5ki.jpg[/img]

Just sayin'.

Boxer- you sure do have some particular tastes in paint.I've never seen anything like your customs. Looks like you have quite a bit of fun.

Is the bolt-stop mod in one of those Montucky threads? Gotta look for that.

Now, back to the Creed..
Any more input for twist and number of grooves? Now looking at shooting the Hornady 140amax ammo, and reloading berger 140gr vld.

Chamber for the factory knowing I can get to the lands with the vld? Or chamber for the vld, hoping that the factory will shoot?

Thanks

I've got a 6.5 8 twist #2 brux. That should work for a rebarrel...

Man, I was excited to see this thread bump back up. Thought for sure I would get some input on cutting the chamber and ideal number of grooves.

Oh well, that brux sounds nice.

I'd go with an 8 twist Brux #2 and have it duped...

I just shot mine last weekend. PacNor installed 7mm-08 1 in 9", polygonal rifling, duplicated factory length & contour. Just fire forming factory loads so nothing great as far as groups, but already better than factory. I'll work some more with it next weekend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1DR9g8RUJk

Again watch this. Measure your magbox's inside diameter and subtract at least .050" and make your dummy round to this length. For the dummy round, pic the longest sleekest higher BC bullet that you will reload and throat using that bullet.

That way the throat will in fact be SHORTER not longer and will kiss all other bullets of less sleek profile and factory ammo because shorter stubbier bullets move the ogive up the bullet. The opposite is true for the high BC bullets, the ogive moves down on the bullet giving you a shorter throat.

I would then call Lilja and ask for a 1-8" twist 6.5 caliber blank with whatever grooves he suggests. You can't go wrong and it doesn't really matter what grooves you choose. Copy the factory contour or if you like extra weight at the muzzle ask for his slightly bigger contour.

That's what I would do anyway, good luck with your build.

And I'd cut it at 22" but definitely no longer than 23".

Thanks for the info. I had watched the video when first posted, but was not sure how it applied to factory ammo.

Am I correct in thinking that if I run a Lilja, I will have to find a smith to chamber and install it?
Thanks

I have 4 rifles chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor, 2 with 22" barrels and 2 with 24" barrels. The 24" barreled rifles are Vanguard2s, a special run made for Cabela's, and I like them well enough that if I was going to build another, I'd probably do it with a 24" barrel and absolutely not less than 22". I've yet to own a 20" bolt gun that wasn't unbalanced to the rear, even with a light weight stock, and I prefer a neutral balance.

The majority of my bolt guns that came with 20" barrels, Remington 7s, 660s, and Winchester 70 Lightweight Carbines, have been rebarreled with longer barrels as a means by which to improve their balance.

The only scenario in which I can envision myself opting for a 20" or shorter barrel is on a rifle that is used in tight cover or in a tree-stand. My 17" Winchester 100 in 308 is a dedicated tight cover rifle.

My 20 fluted light Palma is pretty sweet
That said an S2 would be chopped to 22.5 given contour.
21 is as short as I would chop or build a sporter.

Yes!

Yes you will have to find a gunsmith. Not a bad option at all.

If you go with the PacNor get polygonal rifling. Otherwise I am happy with my Benchmark too.

I had my 6.5x47 Montana ready for deer season but didn't shoot it, a few weeks ago I shot my hunting loads at 600, 140 Amax over RL26. The two groups on paper averaged .895 MOA and the rest were spent blasting steel.

I loaded some 123 Amax's over RL17 and shot three groups at 200 yesterday, the average was .499 MOA.

I am sure a 6.5 Creed would be one in the same, fun.

Either way, after the drive back from the range I was building the 6-6x47 Montana in my head to replace the 700 I had put together before deer season...Montana's are addictive.

Is your Benchmark cut or button rifled?

I am having trouble finding a smith without a one year wait to do the work. gretan et al

Any ideas?

Just sending it to pacnor is a idea

Got my latest Custom Montucky,earlier this week and it too is stellar.

Gunned it a smidge in OEM guise as a Turdy Twat-Six and it was sound,outta da' gate. Nothing mechanical needed done,to yield round groups,that was tidy in their clustertitude. Chopped 2" offa the OEM spout and it MUCH improved balance and handling. Fast/easy way to pinpoint pendingBuild Balance. Hint.



After 4 days of fun flingin' Skinner Smooches,I sent it off,along with a Brux 1-8" #3 contoured .243" blank(.236" bore).




Asked for the OEM contour to be duped at 22.25",while wearing a reduced shank,chambered in Six Twat-Six...to again improve balance/handling and it is a fhuqking PEACH.

105 Hornie HPBT smooches whistle along at 3300fps on the nose and it is stupid accurate. Been blowin' 50mph+ the last coupla days and I've only had it out to the 1350yd line,but it is a fhuqking HAMMER. More than a few folks have shot it and all are craving same,which is never a bad sign.(grin)

The bitch shoots soft,it has lotsa ass,cases are a single pass affair,whether 25-06,270,280 or '06 and the false shoulder Virgin Poke is easily realized. It's really doing exceptional things,while forming Virgins,which ain't ever a bad sign.

With a 250yd zero,it's but 6 Mils to the 1000yd line. The reticle gets it to 1275yds. All out it'll reach 2100yds++. Need to swap bases/rings,so as to eek more Fixed Fhuqker erector goodness,though 26Mils is a fair start.

Tough to get a feel for the shank differences,especially as the OEM Twat-Six spout was on good enough,to require a plunge/relief cut along the receiver,to soften 'er up. Anywhoo...you might can see the differences here.



The OEM SAAMI 223 Montucky spout puked and needed rebarreled,so I sent it out with a Bart' 1-8" #4 contour,to again dupe existing. Had it punched 270 for 105's expressly and went with 18.5" of spout,which is a fhuqking KILLER parcel. That rifle is simply sensational and now everyone is building 270's for 105's.

18.5" Bart 1-8" 270 in foreground,Brux 1-8" 20" 6BR next,1-7" Rock 223AI 21" and OEM Montucky 243Win at 22". Schit pic,but lends an inkling.



Others here. Coupla PN 1-9" 7 Whizzum's and Sister's OEM 7 Whizzum.



There is NO fhuqking way I'd exceed OEM contour or length in ANY chambering and I'm quick to nip both,to improve the parcel. Losing shank,never hurts the equation either. Hint.

Never had to wait more than a week on a build,unless the weather blew up and stopped the Mail.

It happens.(grin)

Think I'll go catch a feesh.









(addendum: I'm ALL feeshed up and forgot a "tidbit")

Benchmark fhuqked a pard HARD,with their "Smith" work...avoid it like The Plague.

Don't fret the spouts,just don't have them Plumb it.

You've been led to water.

Hint.

Hey jmsdad, I like your style!

Here is my Pac-Nor dupe 6.5x47 Lapua.

Peeshooter,

How's that 6.5L shooting for you?

John

http://davebrunorifles.net/

and

Ray Perry in Bridge City Tx

Ray's Firearm Repair Service
350 Henry St
Bridge City, TX 77611 - View Map
Phone: (409) 735-4007

Weaver's rifle.....I'm sending mine off this weekend. Kevin is great to work with.

I love this rifle and the cartridge. 3 shot groups at 100 yrds are almost always touching. So far I've shot hand loads and Factory Lapua ammo, same result. Load development is a joke, pick a load! Fun to shoot distance too, I'm liking the LR reticle on the FX3 6x. Pac-nor did my 223AI too, same results.
Matt

Target from last Sunday, 6.5x47 on bottom and embarrassing results from 6x47 Remington above at 200. Both Lilja barrels, #1 on the 700 and Montana dupe on the Kimber.