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Pre-mil 308 Savage 99 shoots a nice group @ 125 yards (top group).

At 200 yards it turns to crap (bottom group).

Loads are 150 grn. ballistic tips running at 2810 fps. Ballistics shows a 2" drop @200 but I'm getting quite a bit more. Any ideas?


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Groups look like either a scope or a bedding type issue.

The excessive drop could be attributed to a different shooting rest setup, or something else that may change POI, other than gravity.

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Are you shooting with a scope?

Also, both groups are string horizontally. That could be due to strong winds, but I hope not. If not, it could be the bedding of the forend.

Also have to ask: Are you checking the alignment of the bullets in your handloads?


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I'm surprised that no one has chimed in to righteously rip you for having a target backing that was made in China. (or contained a product made therein) wink

Last edited by 5sdad; 01/21/13.

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Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Are you shooting with a scope?

Also, both groups are string horizontally. That could be due to strong winds, but I hope not. If not, it could be the bedding of the forend.

Also have to ask: Are you checking the alignment of the bullets in your handloads?


Scope is a Leupold 3X9 I use for load developement.

Wind was light from right to left.

No on checking alignment Of bullets.

Same rest on both groups. Range has maybe a 3 to 5 foot drop in elevation over 200 yards.

What gets me the most is the drop.

My range less the cow.

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My set up but not the rifle in question.

[Linked Image]

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I ran out of radical Islamist boxes. grin

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lets see about a 2" group at a 100 and about a 5" group at 200 is about on par for one anouther I would be working on cutting the 100 group down before i worried about the 200 ,oops i see now 125 yrd for the top group than add a little wind still not that far off

Last edited by ldholton; 01/21/13.
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What does Federal Gold Medal Match (or other match ammunition of your choice) shoot in your rifle under the same conditions?

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Originally Posted by ldholton
lets see about a 2" group at a 100 and about a 5" group at 200 is about on par for one anouther I would be working on cutting the 100 group down before i worried about the 200


Shot on the left at 125 yard was a called flier. None the less, why the extreme drop, about 7" and a 6" spread, at 200?

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re: drop.....For practical purposes, looks like you are sighted POA at 100 yds....you should be more like 2" high at 100 to be POA at 200 with that load. smile




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Originally Posted by ClarkEMyers
What does Federal Gold Medal Match (or other match ammunition of your choice) shoot in your rifle under the same conditions?


Have no idea. The only loaded ammo I buy anymore is 22 LR and .40 for CCW.

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Originally Posted by boilerpig1
Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Are you shooting with a scope?

Also, both groups are string horizontally. That could be due to strong winds, but I hope not. If not, it could be the bedding of the forend.

Also have to ask: Are you checking the alignment of the bullets in your handloads?


Scope is a Leupold 3X9 I use for load developement.

Wind was light from right to left.

No on checking alignment Of bullets.

Same rest on both groups. Range has maybe a 3 to 5 foot drop in elevation over 200 yards.

What gets me the most is the drop.

My range less the cow.

[Linked Image]

My set up but not the rifle in question.

[Linked Image]

BP...


Serious comment this time: I see that you shoot across a pond, as do we. I often wonder if that creates some variable that isn't there when shooting over land (fluctuating temperature when passing over land/water/land or something).


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Might go to the Hornady site and use the ballistic program there. I just ran a number thru and youir about where you should be at 200 yds. (doing it swag style on my part).


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Originally Posted by boilerpig1


Pre-mil 308 Savage 99 shoots a nice group @ 125 yards (top group).

At 200 yards it turns to crap (bottom group).

Loads are 150 grn. ballistic tips running at 2810 fps. Ballistics shows a 2" drop @200 but I'm getting quite a bit more. Any ideas?


[Linked Image]




I had a rifle that stung horizontal like that once and the problem turned out to be a shifting scope base that bedding cured the problem



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Originally Posted by boilerpig1
Originally Posted by ldholton
lets see about a 2" group at a 100 and about a 5" group at 200 is about on par for one anouther I would be working on cutting the 100 group down before i worried about the 200


Shot on the left at 125 yard was a called flier. None the less, why the extreme drop, about 7" and a 6" spread, at 200?

BP...
well than I don't call 2 shots a group ! Is this kinda groupings at both ranges consistant? is the lower group right of POI as much as it appears ? I know this will go over great for some but an old 99 ain't exatly a precision rifle how good are you looking for ? and is the 2810 chrono speed or listed ? just tring to give you more thoughts.

Last edited by ldholton; 01/21/13.
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Quote
Groups look like either a scope or a bedding type issue.


Is it your experience that a rifle with a scope or bedding issue will shoot good groups at 100 yards?

Really?

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I don't see all that much inconsistency in the two.

The horizontal dispersion is obvious and more than reasonable. I'd solve that first and then see what I had.

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Some of the 99's I've shot benefit from putting a bushing/spacer right over the screw that attaches the forend to the barrel (kind of a free float).

Not so much on takedowns, but the solid frame rifles at times have been squirrley. Once the spacer is in place, the stock still moves a bit, but isn't contacting the barrel.

Worth a try, it's easy, and cheap.

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boilerpig1;
While I've not played with lots and lots of 99's over the years, one thing that I have learned to pay attention to on any rifle with a 2 piece stock is how the butt stock is bedded onto the action.

On something like a .308 level recoil rifle, if it was a 99, Ruger No 1 or Winchester/Marlin lever action, I'd be tempted to bed the front edge of the butt stock so there was a perfect fit between the front flats of the wood and the rear flats of the action.

Some I've even bedded so there is 100% contact with the flats and tang - such as a Marlin Guide Gun or a .300 Win Mag No. 1 - both of which benefited from the bedding.

While you have it apart, check to see if any cracks are happening in the butt stock too, as I've worked on at least one 99 that I can recall where a cracked butt stock caused the groups to go wacky.

Hopefully that was some use to you or someone out there sir. Good luck in getting your rifle tuned up and all the best to you in the upcoming week.

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[quote=boilerpig1]

Pre-mil 308 Savage 99 shoots a nice group @ 125 yards (top group).

At 200 yards it turns to crap (bottom group).

Loads are 150 grn. ballistic tips running at 2810 fps. Ballistics shows a 2" drop @200 but I'm getting quite a bit more. Any ideas? [quote=boilerpig1]


Was this result repeatable? It may be fruitful to establish that the first observation is not an odd example of one.

I would suggest repeat shooting the two groups at the two distances again, twice. Once with the original scope and mounts and again with iron sights. If the 5" drop at 200 yds is repeatable with the scope and not repeatable with the iron sights, the problem is probably the height of the scope over the bore.

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