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#7994670 08/18/13
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I'm in the market for a 416 bolt rifle. I really don't care whether it's the Remington or rigby. I figure the action size will determine which. I see no reason to have the Remington in a rigby size action.

The rifles I'm looking at are the M70 safari, ruger RSM, kimber caprivi and the CZ American safari and magnum express. Not interested in a M700 or Mark V.

I'm really leaning to the ruger RSM. Anyone have experience with all these that puts one well above the others?


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I put the ruger and winchester above the CZ. CZ's can have feeding issues, and are a lot more rouch around the edges where the winchester and ruger are more refined.

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I had one of the very first RSM rifles imported into Canada, purchased here in Vancouver and then modded to be a "working rifle" for use on "fire lookouts" in the Canadian Rockies, while alone in Grizzly country.

A couple of friends bought these in .416 Rigby and I have shot them and thus have some experience to form my opinion on.

I do NOT care for these and would never buy/own another for several reasons.

I also have handled and thoroughly examined the first Kimber Caprivi .416 Rem. brought into Vancouver and consider it to be poorly finished and over-priced; I WAS going to buy it the year before last, UNTIL I checked it out. The retail here at that time was $3895.00, IIRC and 12% taxes on that...much too costly for mediocre quality.

The Classic Mod. 70 requires some serious mods, but, with these done by a GOOD smith, it can be an excellent piece in ANY of it's chamberings and with these, is probably the most "cost effective" of your options.

I have a CZ-550 American, 9.3x62, just now being finished as a "customized" hunting/working rifle and most of those I know here with these rifles, seem very satisfied with them. I have had 20+ of the older Brno ZKK, 21/22 and ZG rifles and they can also be simply outstanding with some mods, quite simple ones, actually.

So, I would tend to lean to the CZ-550M in .416 Rigby, WITH some "tuning" AND a synthetic stock for your "best" choice and the Mod. 70 would be my second choice here.

While, some CZs CAN have ...feeding problems..., SO can ANY rifle ever made; I bought a lovely Dakota 76-.338WM, made under the supervision of Don Allen, in the late '80s and it would NOT feed the last two of the three rounds in the mag......this is supposedly THE finest US-made rendition of the Mod. 70, etc, etc and after "massaging" by the gurus of Martini Gunmakers, IS NOW what it SHOULD have been when I paid big bux for it.

So, while I would choose a custom CZ-550M in .404J for what you perfer the .416s for, this is how I would approach your choice, if, definitely limited to the rounds you prefer.

If, I WAS going to get a .416 Remmy, I would have a STS Classic Mod. 70 done with a 4+1 capacity, Recknagels, Talleys, Leupy 4x-HD and whatever plastic handle you like and then learn to use THAT ONE rifle as though it were an "extension of my arm". I had a much modded P-64-70 like this in .375 H&H for some years and then traded it and built one much the same, except it wears a 20" STS Classic tube and shoots far better than I now can at 67.

Just some thots, HTH.



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Well mine is close and SS was not a need given where it will be used.

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I have a Ruger RSM in 375 H & H. It is a beautiful rifle and I cannot find anything that needs "fix'n" before it is used unlike all of the other rifles mentioned above. Mine cost me $1880 including a Leupold VXIII 1.5 to 5 scope. It is a bit heavy, perhaps a pound or so but it is beautiful and the action works like the traditional greased pig thru a pipe. The weight helps tame recoil. The action is extremely smooth and appears to have everything a dangerous rifle should have.


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Option 3 would be the Stainless Ruger Alaskan in 416 Ruger. Short and handy 20" barrel, standard length action, controlled round feeding, 3 position safety, synthetic stock and factory ammo/components available at a "reasonable" price. Same ballistics as the rem/rigby. The Alaskans in 375 are a big seller here in No. West Montana and there are actually quite a few 416's as well (I have one of each). Definately worth a look, good luck with whatever you decide!


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I really like the RSM and figure the weight will be less of a problem for the 416. The current ruger offerings in 416 ruger do not appeal to me at all. Maybe if I was getting them for use in the alders, but this will be an Africa gun.


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I have a CZ 550 in 500 Jeffery and love it. I had the action worked on a bit and the magazine follower plus a little polishing of the rails and feed ramp. It is flawless, and shoots one hole groups with 570g TSXs at 2300 fps I can go faster, but then she starts to hurt me a little.

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Had a Ruger RSM in 416 Rigby, there built like a tank, mine never showed any functional problems, in fact, I shot it so much I smoked the throat and had it re-bored to 505 Gibbs, still got it to this day.

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I've got a new production M70 in 416. It needed nothing out of the box, other than to be shot a few times to smooth things up. It is accurate with all bullet weights I've tried, with very minimal load development. I dont have any experience with the ruger or kimber, but the cz safari mag I handed just seemed "cheaper" and way too heavy. I didn't shoot it though, so I can't comment on it any further.

OTOH, I have shot a cz 550 american in a non-magnum caliber, and it seemed to be a very nice rifle. I also own a cz 22 rimfire bolt gun, which is also top notch.

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My problem is I have only shot the RSM. I have handled the RSM, CZ and M70. The M70 feels best but man I like the looks of the RSM. I'm still trying to track down a Caprivi to see how it handles.


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Most of the time, a solid, used DG rifle will have pristine rifling for obvious reasons.

Except for Gunner. He's the only guy I know who actually shoots out a big boomer, .416R barrel... blush

Then, bores it out to an even bigger round... smile

That boy ain't right... cool

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I bought my CZ 550 .416 Rigby slightly used in 2002, and it needed a little smoothing of one edge of the feed ramp and a stronger magazine spring to work perfectly. It has done so ever since, even with flat-nosed solids from more than one manufacturer. Never had any trouble with the nice walnut stock splitting, either, unlike many who buy the walnut-stocked Rugers of any variety chambered for .375's on up. In my limited experience, however, the Rugers don't usually need any adjustment to feed right out of the box.

Had a .416 Remington Magnum Model 70 Classic for a while too, and it fed perfectly with most ammo. It did break a glass-bedded Boyd's laminated stock (busted out the recoil lug area) so I put one of D'Arcy Echols' McMillans on it, which solved that problem.

Have noticed a lot of CZ's in the hands of African PH's, which says something, but dunno if Rugers are available over there. The cheapest solution would probably be an Alaskan model Ruger, as they feed well and the synthetic stocks won't split.



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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Most of the time, a solid, used DG rifle will have pristine rifling for obvious reasons.

Except for Gunner. He's the only guy I know who actually shoots out a big boomer, .416R barrel... blush

Then, bores it out to an even bigger round... smile

That boy ain't right... cool

DF


Well dang DF, I didnt want to cut the barrel up and weld it on for a headgate handle. grin laugh

Gunner


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laugh

Well, that would work, too.

I've worked my share of those things... smile

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Originally Posted by Mule Deer
I bought my CZ 550 .416 Rigby slightly used in 2002, and it needed a little smoothing of one edge of the feed ramp and a stronger magazine spring to work perfectly. It has done so ever since, even with flat-nosed solids from more than one manufacturer. Never had any trouble with the nice walnut stock splitting, either, unlike many who buy the walnut-stocked Rugers of any variety chambered for .375's on up. In my limited experience, however, the Rugers don't usually need any adjustment to feed right out of the box.

Had a .416 Remington Magnum Model 70 Classic for a while too, and it fed perfectly with most ammo. It did break a glass-bedded Boyd's laminated stock (busted out the recoil lug area) so I put one of D'Arcy Echols' McMillans on it, which solved that problem.

Have noticed a lot of CZ's in the hands of African PH's, which says something, but dunno if Rugers are available over there. The cheapest solution would probably be an Alaskan model Ruger, as they feed well and the synthetic stocks won't split.



I knew ruger had a problem getting a 416 ruger with a wood stock that wouldn't split, but did that also apply to the RSM? The 458 lott must really be bad if that is the case. I would assume ruger will not fix a split RSM stock since they are out of production?

Is the stock and bedding on the new M70 adequate?


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Originally Posted by Kodiakisland
Originally Posted by Mule Deer
I bought my CZ 550 .416 Rigby slightly used in 2002, and it needed a little smoothing of one edge of the feed ramp and a stronger magazine spring to work perfectly. It has done so ever since, even with flat-nosed solids from more than one manufacturer. Never had any trouble with the nice walnut stock splitting, either, unlike many who buy the walnut-stocked Rugers of any variety chambered for .375's on up. In my limited experience, however, the Rugers don't usually need any adjustment to feed right out of the box.

Had a .416 Remington Magnum Model 70 Classic for a while too, and it fed perfectly with most ammo. It did break a glass-bedded Boyd's laminated stock (busted out the recoil lug area) so I put one of D'Arcy Echols' McMillans on it, which solved that problem.

Have noticed a lot of CZ's in the hands of African PH's, which says something, but dunno if Rugers are available over there. The cheapest solution would probably be an Alaskan model Ruger, as they feed well and the synthetic stocks won't split.



I knew ruger had a problem getting a 416 ruger with a wood stock that wouldn't split, but did that also apply to the RSM? The 458 lott must really be bad if that is the case. I would assume ruger will not fix a split RSM stock since they are out of production?

Is the stock and bedding on the new M70 adequate?

They make an attempt at bedding the lug.

It's for sure adequate when I get done with it, as I Steel Bed the lug. I've not had one mess up and don't think I will.

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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
laugh

Well, that would work, too.

I've worked my share of those things... smile

DF


Me too, and had a set of bruised ribs to go with it. laugh grin

Gunner


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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by Kodiakisland
Originally Posted by Mule Deer
I bought my CZ 550 .416 Rigby slightly used in 2002, and it needed a little smoothing of one edge of the feed ramp and a stronger magazine spring to work perfectly. It has done so ever since, even with flat-nosed solids from more than one manufacturer. Never had any trouble with the nice walnut stock splitting, either, unlike many who buy the walnut-stocked Rugers of any variety chambered for .375's on up. In my limited experience, however, the Rugers don't usually need any adjustment to feed right out of the box.

Had a .416 Remington Magnum Model 70 Classic for a while too, and it fed perfectly with most ammo. It did break a glass-bedded Boyd's laminated stock (busted out the recoil lug area) so I put one of D'Arcy Echols' McMillans on it, which solved that problem.

Have noticed a lot of CZ's in the hands of African PH's, which says something, but dunno if Rugers are available over there. The cheapest solution would probably be an Alaskan model Ruger, as they feed well and the synthetic stocks won't split.



I knew ruger had a problem getting a 416 ruger with a wood stock that wouldn't split, but did that also apply to the RSM? The 458 lott must really be bad if that is the case. I would assume ruger will not fix a split RSM stock since they are out of production?

Is the stock and bedding on the new M70 adequate?

They make an attempt at bedding the lug.

It's for sure adequate when I get done with it, as I Steel Bed the lug. I've not had one mess up and don't think I will.

DF


How about this lug on the barrel?

[Linked Image]

Does it really add to the strength of the stock? I assume it would have to be bedded as tight as the action recoil lug. Does it affect accuracy having the barrel with a bedded recoil lug? Is that glue on the factory stock?


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