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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167 |
In Iowa we have to hunt with .35 to .50 caliber for deer. Is there anything out there hotter than 35 whelen. With the whelens we have been messing a lot to 500. And seems past that we loose so much velocity the bullet must be tumbling. Groups .75 moa at 500. 700 can’t it a 12” plate. So looking for something more. Is there anymore options ?
Never trust a man in a wheel chair...with dirty shoes.
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,958
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2013
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.358 Norma mag or 358 STA are both a step up
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,926
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,926 |
.375 Cheytac. It's a...significant step up from the .35 Whelen and perfectly legal. Along with the .378 Wby Mag. It's pure idiocy that we can legally use .375 Cheytac and .378 Wby but not a .30-30... I'm using an XP-100 in .350 Rem Mag during the late "muzzleloader" season. Comfortable to 300 with it from a good rest out of the ground blind.
Selmer "Daddy, can you sometime maybe please go shoot a water buffalo so we can have that for supper? Please? And can I come along? Does it taste like deer?" - my 3-year old daughter
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167 |
Rules make no sense. Just trying to play within them
Never trust a man in a wheel chair...with dirty shoes.
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 5,495
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2016
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If you can do your own stocking I have a pre-64 Winchester M70 in 358 Norma mag barreled action for sale. $550. PM me if you are interested.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 7,075
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 7,075 |
In Iowa we have to hunt with .35 to .50 caliber for deer. Is there anything out there hotter than 35 whelen. With the whelens we have been messing a lot to 500. And seems past that we loose so much velocity the bullet must be tumbling. Groups .75 moa at 500. 700 can’t it a 12” plate. So looking for something more. Is there anymore options ? The twist on a .35 Whelan was never intended for 700 yard shooting. The STA will shoot a little faster than a .340 Weatherby with same for same bullet weights and has a more appropriate twist rate.
When truth is ignored, it does not change an untruth from remaining a lie.
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110 |
If you can do your own stocking I have a pre-64 Winchester M70 in 358 Norma mag barreled action for sale. $550. PM me if you are interested.
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110 |
Yes I agree that the Whelen is not the first choice for 700 yard shots. I guess I still approach the hunting like I did prior to the rule changes in iowa. Closer is better
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403 |
My brother used his 35 Whelen on white tail does up through bull elk successfully and yes he did shoot deer as far as 500 yards. His bullet of choice for long range shooting was 225 grain Sierra bait tails. His rifle was the 700 Classic, he didn’t need a faster twist. His scope of choice was a K4 Weaver. Yep, not adjustable for power, no adjustable objective, and certainly not a scope that you’d want to twirl the elevation and windage adjustments.
That rifle was his favorite. I tried to buy it when he passed but when I found out his grandson wanted it…
Last edited by Bugger; 03/20/24.
I prefer classic. Semper Fi I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,356
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,356 |
If you can do your own stocking I have a pre-64 Winchester M70 in 358 Norma mag barreled action for sale. $550. PM me if you are interested. It’s amazing that you can consider a 358 Norma Mag on deer, which is capable of killing at long range anything that walks from any angle, and then for public safety purposes apply some idiotic rule that a 6.5 Creedmoor, 7mm-08 Rem or 308 Win is illegal and deemed a risk for use. I suggest that the OP carefully reread the Iowa regulation and if true that any .358 straight wall or bottleneck on up is doable, then I suggest the folks making that rule for Iowa need a full head examination. BTW the M70 sounds like a great deal for someone. The 358 Norma Mag is a potent chamber.
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403 |
Rossimp
The Op is right. You could use a 416 Weatherby if you want in Iowa.
I prefer classic. Semper Fi I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,814
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,814 |
In Iowa we have to hunt with .35 to .50 caliber for deer. Is there anything out there hotter than 35 whelen. With the whelens we have been messing a lot to 500. And seems past that we loose so much velocity the bullet must be tumbling. Groups .75 moa at 500. 700 can’t it a 12” plate. So looking for something more. Is there anymore options ? The twist on a .35 Whelan was never intended for 700 yard shooting. The STA will shoot a little faster than a .340 Weatherby with same for same bullet weights and has a more appropriate twist rate. I'm not sure what you mean. If a bullet is spun fast enough to stabilize properly at the start, then its stability due to twist increases with distance. I think the OP's bullets are having a bad time passing through the trans sonic speed range.
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Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 9,088
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 9,088 |
When I lived in western AK, one of the guys had a 1917 custom in .358 Norma...some of the witnessed long shots he made on caribou were the stuff of local legend. But that was before the days of rangefinders, streamlined bullets and instant ballistic dope at your fingertips. Was it the man...or was it the cartridge?
Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
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Joined: May 2023
Posts: 814
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 814 |
+1 on the Norma Mag., friend had one he hunted the mountains with in NH, very effective. Set up on his was with an internal muzzle break to reduce the recoil a bit.
“To expect defeat is nine-tenths of defeat itself. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It is best to plan for all eventualities then believe in success, and only cross the failure bridge if you come to it." Francis Marion - The Swamp Fox
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,403 |
My brother liked 225 grain Sierra’s for long range (500+) in his 700 Classic. He used a k4 for a scope. No-one told him that fast twist was needed. No-one told him about how his choice of scopes without AO and turrets that spin was needed either. If seen him shoot a dog at a 1/2 mile, one shot. With that 35 Whelen.
I prefer classic. Semper Fi I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 2
New Member
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New Member
Joined: Mar 2024
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Here is another vote for the Norma mag. I had one built several years ago and took it to Sweden for a moose hunt. I thought the other hunters would be impressed that I had was hunting with their domestic caliber but it turned out that none of them had ever heard of it.
Last edited by Litetrigger; 03/21/24.
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,167 |
100% correct on regs.
Also I agree on the trans sonics speed range. As the celp is dropping it can’t handle and I believe they start tumbling.
Also I know they aren’t meant to shoot that far. But when I’m blind hunting I like to have plenty of range and I’m a gun but why not chase the best of the best inside the law ??
Never trust a man in a wheel chair...with dirty shoes.
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,951
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,951 |
I'd be looking at a cartridge/caliber with better commonly available long range bullets rather than upping the powder capacity and the recoil.
The 375's are generally all twisted to toss the 300 Hornady BTSP, Sierra BTSP and the 350 gr. MatchKing or a 410 Berger which will retain more velocity without kicking the crap out of you if loaded correctly. Your problem is bullets, not muzzle speed or burning more powder.
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Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 596
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 596 |
I'd be looking at a cartridge/caliber with better commonly available long range bullets rather than upping the powder capacity and the recoil.
The 375's are generally all twisted to toss the 300 Hornady BTSP, Sierra BTSP and the 350 gr. MatchKing or a 410 Berger which will retain more velocity without kicking the crap out of you if loaded correctly. Your problem is bullets, not muzzle speed or burning more powder. There it is. Well said
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,951
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,951 |
As far as the rules, I'm perfectly fine with them not making sense.
Anything other than shotguns works for me.
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