Where to buy 650-660 Degree Temp Sensitive Crayon For Annealing Brass?

www.markal.com

www.tempil.com

I ordered mine from the local welder's supply outfit. However, consider using the tempilaq liquid instead. The crayon isn't particularly user friendly. HTH, Dutch.

Listen to Dutch, he knows what he speaks about.

BP...

Listen to Dutch and Boilerpig...

Try your local welding supply/gas store.

Local Welding Supply didn't have any, so ordered Tempilaq from Brownells. Thanks A Lot

Ordered it from Brownell's and it came yesterday. Used it today, and will not ever use Crayon again. This is nice. Tempilac is the truth.

Is 650 degrees the right temp for annealing. They don't make 660.

http://24hourcampfire.com/annealing.html

Have fun.. BP...

I read that before. He calls for 660-665, they don't make it. Another guy says 750 is the right temp, what's right?

Luke,I use the 650 degree and paint it below the shoulder as Dr. Howell suggests.

Quote:
"Annealing a longer area � neck, shoulder, and upper body, say � means there's a wider range of temperatures between the mouth of the case and the lower edge of the annealing area. The 650� melting crayon allows a range of about 10� to 15� Fahrenheit. You could use this crayon to mark the lower edge of the area to be annealed, or the other crayon to mark the upper portion of the annealing area."

I use this on all makes of brass including Lapua. I have never had a problem.

Happy reloading and unloading .. BP...

The "window" for optimum annealing is quite large. You're never going to be able to discern a difference and even a �100� isn't going to make that much difference.

And since brass gets progressively softer with rising temperature, who and how was the optimum temperature determined? Think about it. I have and can't find any information on that part of it.

If it gets a bit too soft just run the neck into a die a couple of times and harden it up. Isn't that hardening the reason brass is annealed and softened? It's not rocket science.

As long as the annealing is consistent and holds bullets, it will work and work well, consistency being the key.

Bobski

This is the best chart I have been able to find on the subject; and it shows you are right. There is a wide range of temperatures that apply. What's worse, 660F doesn't fit with this information AT ALL!



edited to add:

Further, in the link below to an engineering manual, the annealing temperature for cartridge brass is listed as 800 - 1400 degrees Fahrenheit -- I suppose it's time to quit quibbling over 650 vs. 660 degrees........

http://www.substech.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=wrought_copper_alloy_c26000_cartridge_brass

Thing is, I have annealed much brass using a 660 degree temp stick, and it WORKS. I get consistent, desirable results. What we do, may be "stress releaving" rather than true annealing -- which may result in the "dead soft" condition described by those who caution against overheating. If so, the 660 on the shoulder is probably the maximum to prevent the neck from going over the 800 degrees listed. FWIW, Dutch.

I've seen that chart, along with a few others to which I've posted links in the very recent past when the subject of annealing came up. One is from a brass organization in the UK, and a very detailed site it is with charts such as this.

There "may" be some relationship to the 650� temperature as this is in Fahrenheit while the chart you posted above is in Celsius. You just can't see exactly where the break points are.

I just don't understand why everyone tries to make annealing so complicated. It's not.

Exactly.

the 800-1400 degree F corresponds with 425-750 C, which brackets the "sress relieving zone" in the graph above. 300 C (the top end of the "stress relieving" is 570 F.

So what we see recommended doesn't match the engineering data or engineering terminology.

But it works. FWIW, Dutch.

Oh! OK.

Thanks guys, it's much clearer now. Paint the 650 below the shoulder, should work.

Very good thread. I like these threads where someone points to facts and practical experience and not just internet rumor or just because.

I've been looking for the information that's in this thread and I'm going to bookmark it.

Dutch - there was a previous thread where I might have slighted you. That was not intended on my part. Sorry. You are one of the good guys.

Bobski and boilerpig1, you're all right too.

fish head

Fish Head, I appreciate your kind words -- don't fret about possible slights: I never noticed...... Dutch.