Just curious. I know it's a thick tough case. Here's the scenario. I'm loading some 300 wsm for a friend. I only have hornady fl dies and they seem to work the brass pretty hard compared to alot of other cases I load for. By the 3rd reload I'm seeing a light ring right where the sizing die stops. I've gone to 5 loads now and still see a ring. I'm pretty sure this is just a mark where the die is stopping and not oncoming separation. The chamber on his gun is pretty tight so I know that this brass wasn't stressed like say a belted mag can with new brass. The sizing die leaves about .002-.004 headspace depending on the brass.
I guess what I'm asking is.....has anyone seen a separation on less than 6 reloads???

I am observing the same thing on both my 300 wsm and 270 wsm cases, I have to full length size my cases or else they won't chamber in my rifles, my short mags are the only ones causing this issue. I can partially size my 264 cases and they fit with a little resistance, I have fired some of my wsm cases 10 times with no signs of seperation.

No, I have not had no separations at 10 loadings. I have been loading for the .300 WSM since March of 2006 and only had splits in the junction of the neck and shoulder. Most of the time it was in new W-W brass, first loading failure. On new brass I always true up the primer pocket, flash hole, graphite the inside of the neck, lube lightly, neck size stopping just before bumping the shoulder, trim, chamfer the mouth with a two angle chamfer on the inside; standard and low angle. my rifle is a Savage Weather Warrior with a middle of the road chamber, with a good factory finish. I use 165 gr Sierra HPBT Game King bullets at 3050 fps with a Federal GMM 215M primer, using RL-22. This load shoots into a single hole, less than one half inch at 100 yds and slightly under an inch at 200. I tried Barnes 168 gr XLC's and could not get a repeatable group, so after a hundred or so abandoned the effort.

I have noticed the same ring near the base on my brass you mentioned also. I check for a ring inside near the base (artificial headspace) caused by setting the shoulder back during FL sizing and have found none. I think you are good to go. If you want to make a cheap tool to check for a headspace ring a piece of .041" stainless safety wire works well with a short 90 degree bend with a rounded end at one end. Reach inside the case and feel for a ring. None = Good
Good shooting,
Marcus.

To avoid excess working of the brass you might try this:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=628674

Lee Collet Neck Sizer and Hornady's great seater makes ultra-low runout ammo for me.

At last count, I believe I've had 5 or 6 300 WSM's and 1 270 WSM... never had any issue as you describe it.

I suppose the obvious question is what are your loads like (bullet weight, powder and charge, velocity)... I tend to think some have slightly unrealistic expectations as to what the WSM's can produce velocity-wise and when those expectations are not realized they tend to push the round pretty hard.

Not saying you're doing that, just a general observation having loaded for the 300 WSM since 2001...

Got a collet die coming. I checked the inside of one of the casings that was loaded three times and could not find a ridge or beginning of a separation near the head. So far the posts make me think the ring is external. I dragged a fired piece of brass from this gun through my calipers and it measures .544 just above the base. AFter sizing it's down to .542 and that's right at the "ring" I see.

I noticed the same with my 300 SAUM brass, but at 5 loadings it hasn't changed any from loading #2, nor have any separated. Great question though, as I wonder the same thing each time I loaded them.

I have noticed the ring on winchester brass out of my browning 300 wsm before and I use redding dies . most of my brass is probably on 5 or 6 reloadings and I think the ring is just external where the die stops . I partially resize with a full length die . I have noticed something peculiar , I reload for a friend who also has a browning 300 wsm but a much newer gun that is stainless and brass fired from either gun will rechamber in either gun without sizing . also ammo the has been partially resized to fit my gun will chamber easily in his and also shoots very well , is that unusual or am i missing something ?

Probably not unusual...you may have very close to matching chambers. If you load anything alot....and especially the wsm's I'd recomend the hornady headspace bushing kit to take measurements and see what's going on with dies and brass. I load for ALOT OF different cases and this $35 tool tell you alot. The wsm's are like a whole new experience. What I can tell you is that the more loadings the less your die seems able to push things around. I can take 1 time fired 300 wsm through my sizing die and it will knock the shoulder back .004. Without changing the die the same brass by the 5th load will only knock the shoulder back .001-.002. This stuff is tough and hard and a very interesting reloading experiment. Just look at all the posts where people say.....what's going on.....my wsm brass always went into my gun fine but now after 4-5 reloads they chamber hard......comes up quite often.

Re Brad....We're using brass that came from federal ammo that was loaded with 165 partitions in a browning x bolt. That ammo clocked at 3120 in that gun. We worked up to 3120 fps with ttsx's and re 17 and wlrm primers. There were some extractor marks we found on the original fed factory loads. We don't see any with the re 17/ttsx (65.5 re 17)at the same velocity. Also...we are using the really "ez to seat" wlrm that are copper colored. Many times I've experience just a slight pocket expansion makes these primers too loose. AFter 5 reloads most are still respectively tight. So....by my seat of the pants experience I think we're on track with a reasonable load. And we are really happy with accuracy. We found a seating depth that this gun seems to like most any bullet and this load is giving us 1.5" groups at 200 yds and super accuracy at 300-350....I don't think the load is a problem. My buddy is going on a moose hunt. We've got a batch of 30 loaded for him but we've used 7 individual casings over and over again with super luck, accuracy and confidence.....never a flyer with that load and these casings. I want to mark these 7 (with 5 reloads under the belt) as the "magic load" to give him confidence.

Freddy: What it is about your chambers that will not let a previously fired cartridge fit? I've neck sized for 30 years with about 15 different calibers (everything from 22's to 45-90's), and if a cartridge came out of one of my units, it always goes back in. Hard to see how a cartridge can exceed chamber dimensions.

If trying to neck size with a FL die, it is most likely contacting the sides of the body and squeezing them in some and lengthening the brass (due to the WSM's having very little body taper).

Everyone I have seen that says neck sizing doesn't work has been trying to use a FL die to partial or neck size. I have Redding bushing neck dies, and all of WSM's (8 or 9) have worked fine with neck sizing using a neck sizing die.

TXRam: Same here. I use nothing but neck sizing dies.

Not yet...knock on wood

When I began reloading(only a few years ago) I asked a similiar question about the ring. If I remember correctly somebody said it's called the datum point(whatever the hell that is) and that it's normally visisble on fired/sized cases.


Last Winter when I was bored I took a 300WSM case(WW) that had been fired 15x and one that had been fired only a couple times and cross-sectioned them. I was curious about the ring and wanted to compare sidewalls.
The 15x fired case looked just like the 2-3x fired case, they were both thick and even.
I currently have about 500 pieces of 300WSM WW brass ranging from 8x to 18x firings and haven't had one single issue. This is using standard RCBS dies.
My favorite thing about loading/shooting the 300WSM is the brass. Lasts forever and requires very little trimming.

Can't know for sure but could be his chamber is out of "round";cases swell on one side,and not the other,so don't go back in the same.I experienced this with some early M70 WSM's,which was a real PITA.Plus WSM brass is very tough stuff,and resizing does not always iron out brass bent like a banana.

This did not happen with a Kimbers, and a recently manufactured SC M70 in 300 WSM accepted fired cases slick as a whistle.

Sam---are you annealing?? If not does seating the bullet feel different on those cases that have been fired many many times? Seems that as I seat bullets in fresh cases there is consistant tension as the bullet goes into the case. On my 5x fired cases the bullet goes in and then tension seems to even out really quick letting the last bit of the bullet seat much easier. I'm thinking this is coming from hardening of the brass with more firings.

You may have misread my comment, if I attempt to rechamber a fired case it will rechamber, however if I only partialy resize a case it will not chamber, if I full length size it it will fit also.

Freddy - see my comment above, guarantee that is your problem. If you use a neck size die, it will size the neck and chamber easily. PM me if you don't understand what I posted.

Kraky, negative on annealing and I haven't noticed any uneven tension when seating bullets.
I did forget to mention that one neck split last time sizing the 18x fired lot(100 pieces) of brass. Fairly sure I got my money's worth out of that stuff though....(grin)

I've had case head separations using factory 223 WSSM ammo on first firing, but ONLY on a 'new' (newly-acquired and newly-re-barreled) rifle whereon the headspace was not set properly. After correcting that, no more issues. I have had that same factory ammo split cases on first firing on the shoulder. Don't know why, but believe it's from the brass being too hard in that area.

I agree with TXRam that neck sizing is best accomplished with a neck sizer rather than a FL sizer on the WS(S)Ms. I also have found that some lots of brass need to be annealed after the first firing or even before firing. Not all component brass has given trouble in this regard, though.

Sam,

You neck sizing or FL sizing?

I am using standard RCBS dies and screw the die in just enough so that the brass has a little resistance when closing the bolt. I think some refer it as a crush fit.
When I load up hunting ammo I turn the die in a skosh more so the brass chambers without any resistance.

Regardless the die is turned in slighty past contact with the shell holder(cammed over).

When resizing for my Roberts and 270WCF I also use standard RCBS dies but they basically work the neck and don't need to push the shoulder back which is required for the WSM's.