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Posted By: Rifles And More COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
I have a Husky 4100 30-06. I am attempting to measure for OAL with Sierra 165gr boat-tails.

With the bolt in, I marked a cleaning rod inserted into the barrel. Next, I installed a dummy round with the bullet seated out farther than normal in the chamber and held it in place while remarking the rod.

Measurement ~3.125

This is way short! The load manual calls for ~3.300 If I seat at that depth I have a hard bolt push. With the 3.125 the bolt moves smooth, as it should.

With the bullet seated at 3.125 it is so deep it that the case mouth is on the ogive.

What am I missing here? Can the chamber really be that short?
Posted By: Blacktailer Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
Have you cleaned the chamber and bore? Could be something stuck in there. Is this a new (to you) rifle? Have you tried a factory round? Are you sure the bore is .308 and not something smaller? Are you sure your bullets are 308 and not something bigger? Might be time for a chamber cast.
Posted By: mathman Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
Are you taking into account that the tip of the bullet in your dummy round is going into the hole in the end of the cleaning rod?
Posted By: fish head Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
Just for the heck of it try a different method of measuring COAL.

Run a fired case into the sizing die just enough to resize about 1/8" of the case neck. Seat a bullet long by hand, chamber the dummy round, close the bolt, remove and measure. Repeat to verify.
Posted By: Rifles And More Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
I will look at both things.

I'll have some time tomorrow to play around.
Posted By: Blacktailer Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/21/14
Originally Posted by mathman
Are you taking into account that the tip of the bullet in your dummy round is going into the hole in the end of the cleaning rod?

Good point. I have taken a screw that is the correct thread for the end of the cleaning rod and ground the head flat. Also make sure the firing pin does not protrude from the bolt face when you are getting that measurement. That should give you a true MAX COL.
Posted By: bsa1917hunter Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/22/14
Originally Posted by fish head
Just for the heck of it try a different method of measuring COAL.

Run a fired case into the sizing die just enough to resize about 1/8" of the case neck. Seat a bullet long by hand, chamber the dummy round, close the bolt, remove and measure. Repeat to verify.



Nothing like simplicity. I also soot the bullet so I can see if the lands grab the bullet and pull it out a bit upon extraction. This does happen, but if you soot the bullet, you can see exactly how far the bullet was pushed in by the lands, even if it does get pulled out a bit. Works every time and is a pretty damn accurate and easy way to find max OAL (aka lands)...
Posted By: fish head Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/22/14
Yep.

Another thing I've done to get an understanding of the bullet/lands relationship is make a dummy cartridge with a fully sized neck, seat a bullet to max OAL, black it with a sharpie, chamber it, look at rifling marks, then decrease the OAL in .005" increments, and check the rifling marks at each stage.

It gives you an understanding of jamming the bullet, just a kiss/partial contact, and no contact.
Posted By: Freddy Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/22/14
That is the method that I use and it works every time.
Posted By: turkish Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
I tried all the above. Only the Sinclair tool gave me repeatable (within 1-2 thousandths), and only then after recognizing some cases needed more force to chamber.

This was a finicky property to measure for me and the Sinclair tool was what I needed.
Posted By: denton Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
I use a variation of fish head's method. I FL size the brass, then cut and deburr two slots at 180 degrees to each other, the length of the neck, with a Dremel tool. With a little fiddling, that gives the right tension to hold the bullet just enough to get the OAL to the lands. As mentioned, I repeat it a couple of times to make sure I'm getting consistent results.

It's a very good method.
Posted By: KMS Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
I use denton's method.
Posted By: Bbear Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
+1 for denton's method. Just have to remember to re-do the whole COAL measurement whenever I try a different bullet
Posted By: RiverRider Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14

[Linked Image]
Posted By: lastround Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
The Hornady Lock & Load overall length gauge thingy works for me.
Posted By: Mule Deer Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
I use yet another variation--crushing the neck of a case fired in the rifle very slightly, either with pliers or a vise, just enough to hold the bullet.
Posted By: Steelhead Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/23/14
That's all I do. Seat the bullet long and jam it home, pull it out and measure. Sometimes a bullet gets caught in the lands, sometimes not.

What I don't want is MORE stuff around, I have enough stuff.
Posted By: 16bore Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/25/14
Split case for the initial measurement then set the seater a few thousands long. Chamber the dummy to see land engagement (sharpie), adjust as the load tells you.
Posted By: 16bore Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/25/14
...and use a comparator
Posted By: RiverRider Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/25/14
+1 on the comparator. It's just a lot more repeatable.
Posted By: 16bore Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/25/14
I don't know how people go without it. The Hornady one with inserts is the cats azz as far as I'm concerned. They can keep the modified shell chit though. Once size my brass, I'll take one piece and make a cut with a dremel. Then when I've found the COAL I want, it goes in the box and gets used to set the seater for each batch. Each lot of brass stays designated to a box (50 rounds, well 49 actually) with a designated dummy, and all loading data and drops stuck to the inside lid.

Easy peasy.
Posted By: 16bore Re: COAL Problem ? - 07/25/14
Like this...

[Linked Image]
Posted By: claybreaker Re: COAL Problem ? - 08/01/14
Originally Posted by denton
I use a variation of fish head's method. I FL size the brass, then cut and deburr two slots at 180 degrees to each other, the length of the neck, with a Dremel tool. With a little fiddling, that gives the right tension to hold the bullet just enough to get the OAL to the lands. As mentioned, I repeat it a couple of times to make sure I'm getting consistent results.

It's a very good method.


THIS... get that Dremel tool out, does a great job on the slot. Repeat to check results.
Posted By: Rifles And More Re: COAL Problem ? - 08/03/14
3.290"

Finally had time to look at this again.
Used: "Run a fired case into the sizing die just enough to resize about 1/8" of the case neck. Seat a bullet long by hand, chamber the dummy round, close the bolt, remove and measure. Repeat to verify."

Thanks to all.
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