My grandson is a big 10 year old (5-3 120) who is shooting 22's and 410 / 20Ga shotguns now.

I plan to take him elk hunting at 12 and need to start preparing him soon. I picked up a RAR in 30-06 and wanted to load 110 or 125-130 grain loads that have very low recoil to get him started. I saw a thread some time ago but cant find a good reduced load with search.

Any help would be appreciated - id like him to really enjoy shooting the rifle for a long time before he shoots it in a high adrenaline situation.

I had to go through reduced loads for the -06 when I was doing shoulder rehab.

Hodgdon's youth loads with H4895 is what I used for 130 grain bullets.

I'll see if I can find the recipe, but basically, I just followed the rules.

Kilt a 10 point that year.

http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/H4895%20Reduced%20Rifle%20Loads.pdf


If you are anywhere close to central NC, I can spot you some H4895 if you need it.

19.o gr TrailBoss w/ 125 gr NBT. Right around 1,400 fps. I think this is in the 24 kpsi range. I use it in a low-numbered WW-I service rifle.

Of course you can go even lighter if you use a 150 or 170 cast bullet and something like Unique. Should get acceptable accuracy in the 1,000 - 1,100 fps range.

Speer manuals have 1500-2100+- fps loads for most bullet weights.-Muddy

^^^^^
This - Trail Boss is your friend - if you can find it.

If you can't find Trail Boss, 13.0 grains of Red Dot works well.

I used 35 gr of Reloder 7 and a 150 gr Hornady spire point to duplicate the 30-30 when my son was first starting to shoot his 30-06. A couple of years later, I switched to 43 gr of H 335 and the same bullet to duplicate the 300 Savage.

Data is from the 47th Lyman manual.

He had shot a Win 94 in 32 Spl and didn't like the recoil but had no problems with the 30-06 reduced loads in his Rem 700 with recoil pad.

Dale

25grs IMR-sr4759

This. Have shot lots of these Red Dot loads using Berry's Plated bullets.

Also, a great hunting load is 35 grains of IMR4198 under a 125 grain CoreLokt.

Thanks for the information. I was hoping I'd get a load with something I have on hand but my selection isn't large and almost all slow burning stuff.

Worked my son up on a 30/06 because that is what he wanted...

150 grain bullets...

Started him out at 25 grains of SR 4759...

that worked to 30 grains of 4198....

we are talking 30/30 speeds and 30/30 recoil...

plenty good for a 200 yds deer load...

H4895 and 150gr Partitions for elk. I do that with my 83 year old dad and his tang safety, red pad M77. He refuses to change the pad.....

A Pachmayer Decellerator will make the biggest diff though.

I believe muzzle blast plays a role in a newbie's impression of felt recoil.

Anyway you can swing a smaller cartridge for grandson and his elk hunt will make the learning curve even easier. My 16 year old son uses a 243 and 100 gr Partitions--I killed 5 elk with it, a couple other kids killed 1 elk each with it, then I gave the rifle to my son with lots of good elk karma in it. First elk he killed was at 375yds. He's killed 3 more elk since.

Casey

I've got a 243 that his dad uses more than me that I expect he will use for his first deer. The first time he carries a rifle on an elk hunt I anticipate that he will be 5'8"+ and likely over 150 lbs, I am thinking college offensive tackle size in 5 or 6 years. He already wears size 10 boots at 10 years old so I'm expecting him to be able to handle full boat 06 loads without a problem in 2 years as long as his initial experiences with the rifle are OK.

He will get lots of 22 & 17hmr practice to work on fundamentals of gun handling and marksmanship. If a 243 is all that he can handle comfortably that would be ok but not my preference for elk at 250 yards.

My son is also a very large 10 ya old. He turned 10 on 2/1. And I'd 5'2" and 155lbs and handles full load 100gr 243win. He wants to shoot "Daddy's" gun so I will be doing some reduced loads in my '06 also

Over the years I have handloaded reduced loads for kids with 30/06s, given to them by grandpa and they get beat up at 12 years old with it...

however they can shoot the SR 4759 or 4198 loads I put together for them real well...the funny thing is tho, later I'll get contacted by their dads again and they desire me to load up 50 more rounds for them...

I ask them if their son has shot the initial batch up already?
and it is very common to have them say, that NO they liked them enough, that the second batch is for them...

I loaded them for the kids for free, if Dad supplied the components... but for themselves they offer to pay me for my time... I decline, but load there's up to equal the reduced Managed Recoil which Remington Sells... which by the way, uses IMR 4198 ( or a powder with the same burn rate)... 36 grains of it with a 125 grain bullet...

48 grains of Varget, 150 Accubond. That's what my then-12 year old boy hunted with.



P

The LEE reloading manual has a whole section on developing a reduced load, the info is applicable to any caliber. I would be sure that the bullet selected was a big game bullet capable of penetration on an animal like an elk rather than a varmint bullet as many of the lighter bullets are.

Reminds me of an anecdote from 40+ years ago. I watched a "Grampaw" training his approximately 14 year old grand daughter to shoot a 1903 Springfield, in prone position. She couldn't have weighed 100 pounds on a fat day. Each shot jolted her so that she had to squirm back into position for the next shot. As I recall she shot a near perfect score and put most of the rest of us to shame. I heard later she went on to shoot well in state championships.

I'm just the opposite of that kid. I don't like getting belted with every trigger pull, and even today my pet hunting loads for the '06 are powder puff 40-42 grains 4064/ 165 Sierra (when I'm not shooting cast loads fueled with pistol powder or 4759/RL-7/2400).

I'm with you. I'm happy with my 7mm-08 and 140 Accubonds.



P

I probably wasn't clear enough - I remember shooting the A303 and it not being any fun as a very young boy. I'm not looking for hunting loads - I'm looking for that initial practice load that won't see anything but paper or water filled plastic.

Hunting loads are 2 years away - and they will be as much as he is comfortable with shooting, he is a big fairly tough kid they may be as hot as I can load.

What I want now is something that makes a 243 seem a little firm in the recoil department so he thinks of it as no big deal to shoot. Right now grandpas old 30-30 rifle is a little too much for him. The 7mm-08 is great for deer and he may like one - but he is only getting one rifle from me above ground and an 06 is the most versatile.

If you want to punch paper and milk jugs, try a 150 grain cast bullet with 10 grains of Unique. BTW, .243 is not an adequate cartridge for elk no matter what others here may say. Develop a .30-06 load with a bullet suited for thick skinned, heavy boned game like elk. Practice with that load at distances you think you'll encounter on your hunt. When I was preparing for my first elk hunt I purchased some elk silhouete targets and went to the range as early and as late as possible to simulate shots under those conditions.

OP,
If I understand this correctly, the lad is 10 and you are going elk hunting when he is 12 years old. That's smart planning. I think I would have opted for something in the 7 mm to get higher sectional density than in the same weight .308 bullet. That said you have a 30-06 for him so simply "Google" the "reduced loads for .30-06". The bullets listed will likely be too lightly constructed (IMHO) for elk hunting but you have two years to work up to something in the 165 grain bullet or more in the 2500 fps range. You never know how much a kid of 10-12 might grow so its hard to make any firm decisions now. I started my grand-kids younger and took them to Texas by 10 with bolt action 30-30 rifles and modest hunting loads. All but one of the girls took to shooting and hunting nicely. They all had fun and got their animals. Have Fun, that's important.

I started several kids out on a Remington Sportsman 78, Plain Jane Remington 700, that I cut the barrel back to 18.5", and cut a couple inches off the stock and installed a soft recoil pad. I loaded 110 grain M1 Carbine bullets down to about 2200 fps. Very little recoil but kind of noisy, so I always made sure they used good hearing protection.

XMP 5744 and IMR SR4759ares made specifically for reduced loads.

I used IMR 4895 as I had a bunch on hand. Speer shows loads for their 110 grain Varminter bullet that is not supposed to be loaded faster than 2800 fps, starting load is 44 grains @ 2500 fps, instant reduced load. Most any fast to medium IMR powder will work, just pick a starting load.

Curiously, lots of folks are killing deer these days with .300 Blackouts shooting 110 grain bullets to about the same muzzle speed.

Michael

Thanks I was thinking 110-130 grains and a very light load to start him off - my thinking on the elk load is 165 grain TTSX if it shoots well but might drop to 150's if needed. I have had vey good luck with my 7mm RM on elk with that grain bullet in TTSX so that wouldn't be the worst thing.

Eventually I'd probably load him up 180s if the 165's wont shoot - but I'm ahead of myself. Right now it is a steady diet of 22 and 17 with the mild load 30-06 in a few weeks. I've got the cases in the tumbler right now. We hunt public land near a ranch boundary so anchoring the elk is important - not that you can't kill elk with a 243 but not what you want to keep them from travelling very far or any shots at a challenging angle.

My nephew's dad and grandpa took him elk hunting with a .243, took four shots to anchor the elk. My choice would be the 165 grain bullet in .30-06, they shot very well for me in .308. I took the .308 on a couple of combination deer/elk hunts, only had the opportunity to harvest mule deer though. When hunting elk in areas where they may cross onto land we don't have permission to hunt I used my .338 WM with 275 grain bullets. It never failed to anchor an elk, but it was definately not a rifle/load suitable for a youth or the recoil sensitive.

For elk, any of the Barnes TTSX will work fine at ranges out to 300 yards or so.

You could run the 110 grain and do just fine, but the sweet spot is the 130TTSX over 53/54 grains of Varget.

I have used SR 4759 for reduced loads on occasion, it can be hard to find due to the fact it is not produced on a continuous basis. I now use Unique, Red Dot and 2400 for cast and pistol bullet loads. Very economical using Unique, 10 grains with a 150 cast bullet in .30-06 and 15 grains with 200-225 grain cast in .35 Whelen. Also I always thought 110 grain bullets were plinking and varmint bullets, not heavy enough jacketed to be used on big game. Are there 110 grain bullets with heavy enough construction to be used for big game?

The Barnes 110 TTSX-FB would certainly be a big game bullet. I don't know about elk because I've never hunted them but for deer they would be lightning in a bottle. I wouldn't run them at reduced speeds though.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/65...-110-grain-flat-base-lead-free-box-of-50

130 TTSX...that's the route I would go for an Elk load.

You can drive it fast out of an '06 and it will still be very easy on the shoulder. Some pretty big guys I know like this combo as an all-around load, because it's a knock-down laser inside 400 yards.

Another good choice is the 125 Nosler BT...it's a lot tougher bullet than it might appear at first glance to those who have never tried it.

I didn't know any better back then, but the '06 was my first rifle. I bought it used at 12yo. I guess I was a tough kid at 12 but so were my friends, and we all shot '06 and 8mm mil surplus loads just fine. 30-30s actually kicked a lot more from the bench.

Factory 180gr was no problem. We shot Win Super-X when we could afford it for the brass, but my reloads with Hornady 180 and 4064 kicked more. Since the RAR is a couple of pounds lighter than our rifles were, the 130 gr will tone it way down.

In a reduced load, I would use 4895, as it's more consistent than Varget at reduced pressure.

Actually, as I am remembering it now many years later, the blast and kick of the big bores was part of the thrill for us, and probably why I am still here!

I started my son at 12 with a 30-06. I think its a good choice for a rifle as he can grow with it. If your boy is already shooting a 20 ga, even better start to centerfire. So, the load I started him out was 46grs H4895 and 150 Hornady RN. He had absoloutely no problem with it offhand!
For his first moose trip later that year we switched to a 150NPT. I would think a 130 gr load in a BAR would be even easier!!

Moosey