I just got a real surprise. I have some of their brass from 204 factory ammo. Upon the second firing or second sizing, I lost 20 of the hundred or so from neck splits. When I spoke to them, they said their factory ammo is not sold as reloading components. When I asked him if it is the same brass as used for components, he said yes, but it is not warrantied. Exactly the opposite as I thought would be the case. I told him it was the last time I would ever buy factory ammo from them. He was not fazed at all, and really could not have cared less. I am still very surprised.

"factory ammo is not sold as reloading components."

Makes sense to me..

I don't buy a whole lot of factory ammo, preferring to handload, but I have observed a clear visual difference in Hornady's 6.5 Creedmoor brass in their loaded ammo (which is some of the factory ammo I DO buy and shoot) vs. their component brass. I realize you're dealing with the 204 Ruger; this is just an example I have experience with.

Specifically, the annealing is visually very different in terms of how far down the case body the color difference goes.

I do NOT believe for even a moment that the brass is a different material or quality between the two types, but again visually it's obviously been treated differently.

I've had no issues with either component or factory ammo brass from Hornady, so I guess I'm sorry about your luck. Were I in your place, I'd break out my 25-cent candle and anneal my brass after the first firing if I didn't want to buy component brass that was packaged as such.

I'm thinking it is annealed differently. Like you said, the color on the neck is very short. I'm still wondering why they would anneal differently for ammo or components. I can't imagine it is a cost thing to change something like that. I definitely learned something today.

We noticed that, too, over on .204Ruger.com, when the cartridge was new, that Hornady cases had a lot of neck splits. To my knowledge, no one bothered to call them about it, though. We just bought Winchester cases and moved on.
In my case, I lost about two cases per box, but the other 18 would, and are, still going strong.

Loaded some of those just yesterday, in fact. Stiff charge of H-322 and Nosler BTs in 32gr.

I bought a bunch of hornady 204 once fired and have been using them for my 6mmx204 and have had no problems with them. Ididn't anneal them befor expanding and didn'tanneal them after and have at least a couple of loads on them. I am loading them with a bushing die so they don't get worked very much. Mine is a few years old and I hear that Win brass is getting brittle also

Had same problem with Hornady brass for .204 Ruger

The guy I spoke to said the load, ie powder, bullet etc., could affect the brass. ?? Bunch of crap if you ask me. I will keep loading the good ones just to see how long they last.

Not to be a total jerk, but in the current environment, when all ammo manufacturers are back ordered and selling all the components they can ship and can't keep up with demand, honestly, what do you expect? If you don't buy any more of their products, there are at least 10 people lined up behind you waiting for the products to become available. Kind of changes the priority of customer service in the real world. Sad.

It is sad to find out that Wall Street or Madison Avenue has invaded the ranks of the shooting industry to the point that you now have a bunch of "White Collared" businessmen that don't know, much less care, about the the goods they sell or produce. My son was guiding a couple of Benelli executives a few years ago and was excited to have them using his services. He asked them about Benelli's, Super Blackeagles specifically, and they didn't know one from a peanut butter sandwich. It is all dollars and cents, the days of the passionate gun guys in the manufacturing and sales of this stuff is almost a thing of the past...

Does not surprise me one bit. I've been blown off by Hornady a few times.

Same here... I picked up a 100 rounds of it at the range..

had a lot of neck splits on the first batch of 25 I loaded..

I annealed the rest of them, and the neck splits quit...

however I picked up some Winchester 204 brass and it has been excellent.. I have a few batches of 10 that have been reloaded about 20 times so far...

I annealed all 204 brass before using tho, and then anneal again every 4th time... problems disappeared...

I have noticed expecially on 17 bore brass, that they seemed to be annealed before they leave the factory, unlike larger calibers... I conclude that the narrower the bore, the more likely there must be for the necks to split easily or the greater the need for annealing...

I don't quite understand how it is feasible to go thru two different annealing processes for ammo and components. Seems it would be cheaper and easier to just do it all the same and use it wherever. I'm definitely using Win. from now on.

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Winchester can split, too. I have not had an issue with component brass, but I bought a box of 32-20 that split 3 out of a box of 50. That was the first firing...not reloads.

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I know there has been some back and forth on threads that had to do with prepping new brass...

but I have also had problems here and there with new brass, although I don't purchase much of it...only maybe for a new caliber I might be playing with...

I do think there is a major lack of QC anymore... they are more interested in getting numbers out the door... read that as accountants and bean counters running the show...

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You have got it.

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I understand what you are saying about market conditions TODAY. But like what happened in the last ammo/gun scare prices eventually stabilize even though that is usually at a higher price then before the rush.

One of our LGS will ride the price wave upwards to the sky and usually is at the head of the wave. After the last go around of panic buying I went back to Sportsmans Warehouse and complimented them on their pricing. They were out of inventory just as much as the LGS but when the inventory did come in it was not priced at those sky high prices. The store manager said that they priced their goods to retain their customers as they believed the run on guns and ammo would not be sustained.

Six months after the scare was over last time, that LGS was running sales trying to attract customers back and with the conversations I had with other guys none were going back.

Now many believe that this scare is going to be longer and deeper than the last one but many lads have memories of some of the pricing and customer service problems and will not return. Me included.

My experience with Hornady is exactly the opposite. They have always had top notch support when I have contacted them. The people they put in their booth at the SHOT show reflects that also.

Were you expecting free new brass? Brass will split from being worked. After it leaves the factory it is out of Hornady's control.

Let's assume that the customer rep was telling the truth: that .204 factory ammo is not sold as reloading components.

That means they assume it will be thrown away after one firing. (All .30-30 ammo is assumed to be fire-and toss, btw) It therefore makes sense that they would not fully anneal such cases, and might relax some QC parameters as well. That keeps the cost of factory ammo as low as possible, to the benefit of that large percentage of shooters who do not reload.

Brass sold as components, however, would get added anneal, added inspections, and tighter QC control. That costs the maker more and therefore component brass costs us reloaders more.

I'm not sure just what kind of response you expected from Hornady. The brass did what was expected of it from their standpoint and you had already shot it at least twice. What were your expectations? Granted most brass lasts longer than two or three firings but I've never seen anything guaranteeing longer life for the reloader.

I had a few boxes of Hornady bullets 20-some years ago that had a fair number with defects in the jackets.

There were irregular jagged splits in the copper, mostly starting at the front and headed back. The splits were not the straight ones that you see as a result of normal manufacturing, or designed to facilitate expansion. I took a few (I distinctly remember one that had a hooked/looped split; it looked like an upside question mark), ran a black Sharpie over the cracks to highlight them, and mailed them to Hornady.

A couple weeks later, I got the same bullets back in the mail, with a note that basically said "We see nothing wrong with them".

I've always had a slightly sour taste towards Hornady since then.

Mickey, they have only had one firing or two sizings, not two of anything overall. Just disappointed they will not be very reliable. I will keep a closer eye on them from now on.

I have some Hornady .223 brass I had no problems with but after I fired it I annealed it.

Me no believe.

We've got a couple shops like that here. They rely on New Clientele, after running off us old-timers with their "new-age" business tactics. Where they once had a lot of repeat customers, now they have to rely on unfugged newbies, until THOSE folks catch on to what they're doing.
It sure seems like poor business practice to me, but what do I know? I don't go in there often, I've taken to driving 2.5 hours to Whittaker's, or go to Bud's, and avoid that kind of crass greed.
Prior to these episodes, I'd have laughed at anyone suggesting I'd save money by driving 2.5 hours to save money. Gas ain't cheap, after all...............

JeffP40: I started using Hornady brass (from factory ammunition) for my 204 Ruger Rifles back in 2,004. I have not had a single split neck to date.
I am sure some of that brass has been fired 5-6 times and some used in two different Rifles!
I wonder if you are not using enough sizing lubricant or have a die problem.
Maybe even not chamfering the tiny case mouth enough might cause the splits - although that is a long shot???
I use Redding dies for most of my 204's and RCBS dies in one along with Imperial Sizing Die Wax for all.
That is a VERY high loss you are experiencing.
I am puzzled by your situation - and I hope you can figure it out quickly - with the price of brass anymore that is a notable loss.
Puzzling respnse from the Hornady folks you would think they would like to work with you and find out whats what for themselves?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I wonder if loosey goose neck/throat dimensions might be coming into play.
Excessive sizing?
I'd start my trek measuring fired,sized, and loaded dimensions.

COLDBORE; Are talking about 20 year old loaded Hornady ammo or just the bullets ? I started reloading in 1953 and have used Hornady bullets since then and brass cases as they have become available. I have not had any problems with their bullets or brass cases. I have some of their reloading equipment but most of my equipment is RCBS and Redding.

Plain unloaded bullets.

I know they have a fine reputation, and should probably try them again, but that response was a real turn-off, and I am well-settled on my Nosler/Sierra/Berger choices now, so don't really have a need to change.

Good example of how a bad experience can steer somebody to different choices and affect business for many years.

When I bought my .204 a few months ago the only component brass I could find was Hornady. The price was a little high but decided to give it a try and i'm getting ready to do my 6th loading on this brass and have only lost 1 piece and that was due a fault of mine. I guess what i'm saying is I would buy it again when the need arises.

I'm sure there would be no problem with component brass, that is what the thing is. The ammo brass is not under the same warranty as components. ? I asked if it was the same brass and was told yes, but no warranty.
VG, I am sure it is not much used brass, it is splitting very easily, and on the first sizing or second sizing.

I can believe they might cut the annealing cycle short on cases intended for loaded ammo. Not necessarily for cost reduction, but to increase production rate. Annealing may be a bottleneck in the process.

Jerry

I'm gonna guess that the brass is all the same. It certainly wouldn't be smart to run two production lines.

I don't even know if Hornady makes their own brass. They may be buying brass for their loaded ammo from one source and component brass from somewhere else.