Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.
I'll consider partial trades + cash,$200 minimum and a trade to cover the reminder of the $399 asked price,FTF at asked price includes a box of factory hunting ammo.
Email with any questions.C&R OK.Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25 (no FFL required I.D. a must) or Fedex Overnight $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

Also on GB with more pics search for shipping needs.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=272234735

you do not even need C+R for a Loewe, they are pre 1898 , as per BATF

Pre 1 Jan, 1899.

Antique, as far as the Feds are concerned.

I am not a dealer,I just happen to have this old rifle for sale so,if anybody is interested in it,I'll need some kind of 01 or 03 license just for my peace of mind

Listed on GunBroker with link............check

member since yesterday................check

Rare collectable bubba'd milsurp............check

wants FFL's for "peace of mind"...............check

going to ship milsurp rifle "fed ex overnight"............check

Uses bold and large size fonts to show he's serious........check

If you need it shipped is more practical and SAFE on GB........check

Not born on the day I became a member.......check

Everybody is entitled to an opinion on stuff they can't afford.......check

The rifle is logged on my C&R don't expect you to even know what it means.......check

Not everybody has a 20/20 vision but you........check

Get a life so you don't bother others please.

He means you sound kind of like a hustler with all the bells and whistles. The regulars on here don't need either. You want a lot of money for something you think is collectible. Most don't. And don't tell us you want a FFL transfer for "piece of mind". You will ship it to anyone in-state without "piece of mind". Just clarifying. If you sound like a salesman, don't be surprised if you are treated like one.

Here's a whistle for you:By law,in my State,Michigan,long guns can be shipped USPS between individuals with no restriction,paperwork,4473 etc.you can check,don't take my word for it.
I,however,ask for I.D. so I know who to log the gun off to. I'm sure you read that too right?
Why some of the members here are so defensive?If anybody disagree with my price just don't buy it or look somewhere else.

Are you ignorant, or just a consummate azzhole?

Cut the guy a break, he's almost hit double digit postings............almost.

C&R = Crudely Reworked?

The model is from 1891 for sure but,since I'm only a newbie here and I don't know nothing (you are only knowledgeable when you hit the 3.000.000 posts,no matter what they're for.....???),I can't be sure the rifle wasn't made after 1898.
It is in too good shape to be that old and Loewe made these rifle until they were replaced by the 1909 model.....But then again whay do I know...I only have 10 posts.

I see the "class" you're talking about.Nice job.

OK

Welcome to the campfire, your free link to GB. And, thanks for all your past contributions.

http://www.surplusrifleforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=33457

What he was trying to tell you is the last Ludwig Lowe 1891 was built in 1896, so if you could let someone help you instead of spout back your ignorance for a minute you might learn something.

Also before you post that you are going to ship FedEx overnight you might look at what that will cost you. Be ready to see a C-note wave bye-bye.

Had your rifle been built post 1898, but was still over 50 years old, it would in fact be no longer C&R eligible since it's been "sporterized" into it's no longer original military configuration.

I'll bet you didn't make too many friends in kindergarten.

WRONG. Look up the actual section of the law you're butchering, sport. The gun only has to fall into one category to be recognized as C&R.

"� 478.11 Meaning of terms.

Curios or relics. Firearms which are of special interest to collectors by reason of some quality other than is associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons. To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories:

(a) Firearms which were manufactured at least 50 years prior to the current date, but not including replicas thereof;

(b) Firearms which are certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest; and

(c) Any other firearms which derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or because of their association with some historical figure, period, or event. Proof of qualification of a particular firearm under this category may be established by evidence of present value and evidence that like firearms are not available except as collector's items, or that the value of like firearms available in ordinary commercial channels is substantially less."

http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

Pay attention to this key part: To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories...

ONE category, not ALL categories. The standard admonishment remains, PLEASE DON'T POST BULLSHIT. Thanks.

"C&R = Crudely Reworked?"
Is this your way to get to be somebody's friend?
Maybe we met in kindergarten LOL!
Since it looks like you are some kind of spoke-person and,above all an expert,here's the rifle serial #: N5159
It matches on all parts except for the stock,of course.
Could you or anybody here tell me more about this "piece of junk"?
10 posts = the guy's never seen a FedEx office before.....

I can tell you in two weeks no one in the US decided to place an opening bid for your rifle at $368.99. Who knows where the reserve is.

Then I can tell you after you re-listed for $339.98 you still have not gotten a bid.

The point you have missed in all this [bleep] is I/we don't appreciate "folks" who make their first post in the classifieds to peddle their stuff without becoming a contributing member here at the 'fire.

Some forums keep people from utilizing the classifieds until a number of postings or an amount of time has gone by.

That is why it amazes me when folks want to sell there firearms with there first post, and attempt to sell after they have lectured us on all the hoops were supposed to jump through to get the chance to do business with them.

Oh and by the way, it is considered rude to do all of the above, and then post your link to a "pay for service" provider such as Gun Broker.

Let me know if anything I have typed is too confusing for you, I can always type a little slower.

It looks like our resident ambassador "Brick Top" has reared his ugly head, don't let his good looks fool you, he's not very nice.

I posted the link to Surplus Rifle Forum, and specifically a serial number/date match up of the Argentine rifles. Since it's a "N" prefix it was a long rifle built in the last year of production by Lowe in 1896. I've owned several of those rifles over the last years, they're well built and collectable in their original state. An all matching good bluing example will sell for mid 2's to mid 3's. A sporterized version for what someone might want to give, usually $100 to $200. Part of the difficulty in selling Argentines to non collectors is the caliber, the diameter of the projectile being .312 or so makes the reloading options tougher.

Also you might want to check out your rifle and make sure it hasn't been rechambered to 30-06, something that was done in the 50's to try and make them more desirable to American tastes. Unfortunately the bullet travels down the bore barely making contact with the rifling, if at all, and are not very accurate to say the least. If you take the bolt out and hold the rifle muzzle down and a 30-06 cartridge drops in you no longer have a 7.65 X 53 Belgian chambered rifle. If you do have a original chambered rifle, I know that Hornady and Privi Partisan both make new boxer primed ammo for it.

If you want to learn about milsurp rifles the "Surplus Rifle Forum" is the place to go. Now you have to check you "tude" at the door as they run a tight ship and any smart ass postings get you kicked off. Brick Top, although correct fairly often would be gone the first posting he "shared".

I never said I was an expert, but I don't go to new sites and crap all over the people who have been there for years and try to force my for sale items down their throats. You correctly identified your rifle as an 1891 Argentine, your attempts to identify it as collectible is what rubs folks the wrong way.

Unless you went to Kindergarten in Cleveland Ohio in the mid 60's I doubt we were in the same class.

You certainly put me in my place. I wouldn't want to piss off a bunch of socially inept internet nerds with lots of time on their hands.

I have heard of 1909 Argentines being rechambered to .30-06,
but never a 1891. Is it even possible?

That is correct. No Loewe made firearms after 1896. Production was resumed by DWM. And also correct about the C&R status.

Says the guy with over 4,000 posts, most of which he's bending someone over, while hiding behind his Rastafarian disguise. "Socially inept" ,I can't believe you are labeling anyone with that, please show us how to be more sociable like you?

Unbelievable!

I am anti-social, not socially inept.

Bricktop,

Don't judge "morecowbell" by his Avatar He may look like "Marvin Milktoast", but you can't judge a book by it's cover.

His avatar was actually my capstone adviser in the CoE. I'm just eating his ass for GP.

You have been following this rifle for all this time?!?!
Are you one of the GB watchers?LOL!!

Fascinating..... I'm afraid Brick Top is right : You need to get out more.

Funny, I have thought for a long time that "Bricktop" and "MoreCowBell" were the same person in different persona. Could I be wrong?

You really know how to hurt a guy.

OK,lets try this one more time: I'm not a dealer,I'm not trying to make money here nor am I twisting your arms to make you click and look so,not to piss anybody off I took any link I could off this post,I deleted "collectable" from the description and the FedEx option is now 2 day service for $35
(I'll worry about how much it costs me to ship it that way).
I did not feel I had to but if it makes some fellow shooters sleep better...... Why not?

I like big font,since this option is available I'd like to use it.
Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for hair crack at the tip of the forend and the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.
Email with any questions.C&R OK.
I got it shipped to me as C&R,it's logged in my book so,regardless of all laws or personal opinion and what not,it needs to be logged off to the buyer somehow,no matter what.
Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25
(no FFL required I.D. a must,yes WE can legally do that in MI)
or Fedex 2 day $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.
Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

So clean you wouldn't believe it's an antique..... Great shooter too.



Also posted elsewhere.

you are wrong about it not C&R eligible.

OK,lets try this one more time:asked price's $340
I'm not a dealer,I'm not trying to make money here nor am I twisting your arms to make you click and look so,not to piss anybody off I took any link I could off this post (by now if you've been looking at this you know it's on Gunbroker too),I deleted "collectable" from the description and the FedEx option is now 2 day service for $35
(I'll worry about how much it costs me to ship it that way).
I did not feel I had to but if it makes some fellow shooters sleep better...... Why not? :shrugs:

I like big font,since this option is available I'd like to use it.
Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for hair crack at the tip of the forend and the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.
Email with any questions.C&R OK.
I got it shipped to me as C&R,it's logged in my book so,regardless of all laws or personal opinion and what not,it needs to be logged off to the buyer somehow,no matter what.
Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25
(no FFL required I.D. a must,yes WE can legally do that in MI)
or Fedex 2 day $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.
Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

So clean you wouldn't believe it's an antique..... Great shooter too.



Also posted elsewhere.

Morecowbell,
I must apologize. I have now been educated by someone close to you. Now I know there is no relationship between you and Bricktop. You are esteemed.
Jerry/AK

Gemelli5,
What is the current asking price?
Jerry/AK

$340

BTT

Btt Mauser

OK,lets try this one more time:asked price's $340
I'm not a dealer,I'm not trying to make money here nor am I twisting your arms to make you click and look so,not to piss anybody off I took any link I could off this post (by now if you've been looking at this you know it's on Gunbroker too),I deleted "collectable" from the description and the FedEx option is now 2 day service for $35
(I'll worry about how much it costs me to ship it that way).
I did not feel I had to but if it makes some fellow shooters sleep better...... Why not? :shrugs:

I like big font,since this option is available I'd like to use it.
Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for hair crack at the tip of the forend and the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.
Email with any questions.C&R OK.
I got it shipped to me as C&R,it's logged in my book so,regardless of all laws or personal opinion and what not,it needs to be logged off to the buyer somehow,no matter what.
Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25
(no FFL required I.D. a must,yes WE can legally do that in MI)
or Fedex 2 day $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.
Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

So clean you wouldn't believe it's an antique..... Great shooter too.



Also posted elsewhere.

I like big font,since this option is available I'd like to use it.
Asked price's $340
I'm not a dealer,I'm not trying to make money here nor am I twisting your arms to make you click and look so,not to piss anybody off I took any link I could off this post (by now if you've been looking at this you know it's on Gunbroker too:Argentine in the C&R section),is part of my "collection" so,to me it's "collectable".
FedEx option is now 2 day service for $35 (I'll worry about how much it costs me to ship it that way).

Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for hair crack at the tip of the forend and the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.

Email with any questions.C&R OK.

I got it shipped to me as C&R,it's logged in my book so,with all due respect to the law or regardless any personal opinion and what not,it needs to be logged off to the buyer somehow,no matter what.

Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25
(no FFL required I.D. a must,yes WE can legally do that in MI)

or Fedex 2 day $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.
Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

So clean you wouldn't believe it's an antique..... Great shooter too.



Also posted elsewhere.

Seems like there is not a single thread Bricktop, aka the fake Negro, is not attacking someone and providing no actual facts.
It's also interesting to note that we never see his incredible gun collection posted here.

We're just waiting for 6/1/2012 which will be a very big day for him. Keep watching his posts around that time. Don't put him on ignore as you won't want to miss it !

Reloadable brass Ammo readily available less than $16 a box
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/71...ne-mauser-180-grain-soft-point-box-of-20

Technical Information
Caliber: 7.65mm Argentine Mauser
Bullet Weight: 180 Grains
Bullet Style: Soft Point
Case Type: Brass

Ballistics Information:
Muzzle Velocity: 2542 fps
Muzzle Energy: 2588 ft. lbs.

Comparable to 308

Technical Information
Caliber: 308 Winchester
Bullet Weight: 180 Grains
Bullet Style: Soft Point
Case Type: Brass

Ballistics Information:
Muzzle Velocity: 2542 fps
Muzzle Energy: 2588 ft. lbs.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/71...ne-mauser-180-grain-soft-point-box-of-20
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/userposts/id/40222

btt

btt

Asked price's $340 and by now, if you've been looking at this you know it's on Gunbroker too,
FedEx option is 2 day service for $35


I like big font,since this option is available I'll use it.
Sporterized Argentine Mauser.Caliber is 7.65x53.It has 23" barrel. Receiver is marked "Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891. Manufactura Loewe Berlin." It also has clasped hands stamped on all major components. The action and barrel are in great shape,bore is bright, the wood is good except for hair crack at the tip of the forend and the usual minor dents due to normal usage.
Has weaver scope bases already attached.
Email with any questions.C&R OK.
I got it shipped to me as C&R,it's logged in my book so,regardless of all laws or personal opinion and what not,it needs to be logged off to the buyer somehow,no matter what.
Ships USPS Priority within Michigan for $25
(no FFL required I.D. a must,yes WE can legally do that in MI)
or Fedex 2 day $35 to FFL/C&R to lower 48.
Personal check payment item ships when check clears.

So clean you wouldn't believe it's an antique..... Great shooter too.



Also posted elsewhere.

I've been viewing this post for a long time, with each update, thinking that eventually you might lower the price. But that obviously isn't going to happen and that's certainly your right. It's also my right to quit watching. Over and out.
Jerry/AK

I also have viewed your post and kept up with the banter.I would caution you that your offering to ship this rifle to a C&R holder would not be legal.If the rifle was in its original military configuration it would qualify for C&R.It has been sporterized and therefore does not.Good luck with your sale and thanks for removing the collectable moniker.
Joe

Sporterizing it changed the year it was made?????????????????????????????????????????????????????

BT,
The sentence I've high lighted in red above, tends to cause doubt amongst the big importers who import 99% of all the surplus rifles to hit our shore. If they put a non military stock on a military rifle, they believe it is no longer C&R, despite the fact that it is over 50 years old.

Why do you think you are more knowledgeable than people who handle the sales of tens of thousands or surplus rifles each year?

Seems to me it's possible you may not be correct.

Put that in your crack pipe and smoke it.

Mike

Holy Crap..........I really cannot imagine that the ATF intended for anyone to read more into this than there really is.

Its option a). How hard is that?

78CJ,
Try to imagine this:

http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/curios-relics/update-january-2009-june-2010.html

Any firearm that is at least 50 years old, and in its original configuration, would qualify as a C&R firearm.

Read it and then ask yourself, I wonder why they specifically say "and in it's original configuration" if that doesn't have any relevance.

How hard is that?

Next take a look at this, it defines the curio and relic definition, and what is meant by original configuration. It's two pages long but it's big type.

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-85-10.pdf

Now if you're done drinking the Rastafarian's Cool-Ade, you might learn something.

You guys are hilarious:

Morecowbell can't help it to let everybody know that he knows better..... It makes you wonder how many rounds he get to shoot a week with all his never-asked-for-teaching job LOL
BTW nobody asked anybody's opinion.The rifle was purchased as C&R and logged as such: how would you sell it?

Jerry/AK is pouting: he'll stop watching and he won't eat his veggies either....

joes64gto is concerned of what I call MY rifle....... here's an idea:don't agree?Don't click on it.

This is a "For Sale" add,not a discussion room..... Take your little frustrations somewhere else

Oh you asked, and were told, and continued to be a consummate
azzhat.

Next time try having a clue as to what you own, and what it's somewhat worth, and how legally to sell it.

And please if at all possible, do it somewhere else.

I'm sure I'm not nearly as frustrated as someone who is forced to work around you on a daily basis, from what I can see, you're a dandy. Have there been unexplained suicides with work associates? Do you have a job?

Try proof reading your post before you hit the submit button, it's hard to follow when you leave out punctuation and add or subtract letters.

Go [bleep] yourself and the goat you rode in on.

That would be one "d".

How is that sale going for you?

So it's true: you don't do much shooting,you just surf other people posts to run your mouth,even -especially- if nobody asked you.
I bet a lot feels hard to follow for you regardless of the punctuation.
Man... you must be bored.I feel sorry for you..... Try Facebook: it'll keep you occupied.

Thank you for catching that. You should arrange a play date with morecowbell.....
You two have way too much time on your lap.... So sad.

Ok... Hate to do it but I've watched just enough of this train wreck to be amused.. Ok.. Beyond amused..

1.Yet to suck in some poor schmuck by advertising as collectable"
2.Is Bubba's rifle really in the "Collectable" status?
3.Do you really think after all this resentment you've created your going to make a transaction, rephrase that.. ANY Transaction here??

You already started off by ruining any credibility you might have had simply by advertising as Collectable, then shooting yourself in the foot by arguing so vehemently with the members regarding your description, which in turn added salt in your wound turning into personal barbs and attacks.. I for one (not that you care) would not purchase so much as a box of used primers from you.. Coz, as your well aware.. You simply don't care that you started out with a tone of dishonesty in your original description and are confronted here by people who do.. Guess who I would do business or would be welcome in my home or camp..

MM

Bolongney5,

I don't do Facebook, I'm over the age of 15.

When you posted you wanted to learn about your rifle and we told you what you had, you went back and edited that out. You're such an azz, if ignorance is bliss is true, you must be in hog heaven.

And "It makes you wonder how many rounds he GET to shoot a week" is another well thought out gig, I hope I can recover from your rapier wit and carry on.

To prove I'm the bigger man, I want to leave you with this thought. Go [bleep] yourself and the pig you road in on.

Actually,"bigger man",this sounds more like what a 4th grader would say....
Is that why you're so good at spelling?
Spring is here: get out of the basement and go play outside.... It'll be good for you.

You have been watching?If you hate to then don't.

1.I am not sure I've seen your name before......Looks like somebody got sucked in....
2.I don't recall asking your opinion on what I should call anything but,if you really need a purpose in life.....
Glad to help.
3.Not really worry about what anybody would or wouldn't do... Isn't this a free Country?

I am really bummed not to be able to spend Thanksgiving at your house though.... (What?)
This gets funnier and funnier.......

This is funny.think of the type of fire arm or mdl as the receiver . it dosen't matter what you do to it if it has a 1891 receiver that is what it is. you have to read ALL the C&R rules to get the real truth of it.If you put a remington 700 barrel on a pre 64 mdl 70 winchester what mdl is it?YES it is still a pre 64 mdl 70 so stop arguing over that point it is clearly stated in the C&R regs that modifying a military rifle does not change it Status . unless you change it from a semi auto to full auto.

To Hubert
Thank you,I couldn't agree more!
Anyways the whole argument is kinda pointless: I purchased this rifle from a major dealer on Gunbroker
- hopefully they know what they are doing or maybe some members here could give them legal advise -,
it was shipped to me as a C&R,it's logged on my C&R book thus it must be logged off as such no matter what anybody unasked opinion is.
The rest of the chat is just bored people with nothing better to do than boss "newbies" around interfering in a post uninvited......
For years I have been a member of several forums nationwide,found 24hourcampfire recently: this is the first I see getting this bitter this fast..... Such a shame.

I sure appreciate a detached,non-emotional input for a change.