Been on here for years and never got screwed before. Until now. Bought a Weaver V9 from him. It is fogged real bad. He says the ad says it was fogged. His reply to me returning it.

I put right in the description it is not clear, and i showed in a picture. I am not accepting a return on it. The last picture of the post show is is not clear. You got it at a cheap price due to this reason. This scope in a mint condition scenario is worth 150+....Send it to iron sighters they will fix it up for you to your liking.


Here is the 'exact' ad. Tell me if you can read that this as a bad scope.

I see no mention of fogged optics! If stating not as clear as todays optics means its fogged then it seems to me you were mislead. I wish you luck.

Jeff having dealt with you on sales and just chatting on the phone I know you are not one to put up something like this unless it was absolutely true. No mention of the scope being fogged in that post. Sorry to see you get bit like this.

theduke308 just fooked himself on this site!!!

Maybe we need a thread or a sticky for sales like this !!!

If someone I dealt with felt I misstated the condition of an item I would take it back and refund his money.

The ad dosent say it was fogged, it says not as clear as todays scopes, when you say fogged do you mean fogged with condensation, water vapor, if so he should take it back because that wasent stated in the ad

I wouldn't have expected a fogged up scope after reading the ad. RAS is one of the good guys on here. Gods luck to you.
hwgtyd

It does say "Not as clear as today's scopes but not horrible either". I dont know the guy but just had a dealing with him and was as smooth as silk, super fast shipping on top of that.

I sold a gun to both RAS and Duke and no trouble either way. Lots of communication from the duke.

Sounds like he ought to go to work writing political ads for Democraps! Phugging liar better make it right!

Look at the last picture guys...come on.. wow

I lowered my price for you to buy it from 110 to 95 dollars, you can clearly see the picture and I said it was not as clear as today's optics, which it is not.... And I misrepresented??? A misrepresentation would not have included a picture looking through the scope my friend. I do not give refunds for buyers remorse...look closely at my pictures before you buy my items and there will never be any problems.

Geez, my online reputation is certainly worth more than a rifle scope. Frankly I can't believe the guy won't refund the money even if he feels it was full disclosure and just a difference of opinion in wording.

I don't expect everybody to deal the way I do; but, my policy has always been, even if the guy gets the item and then tells me he changed his mind, I take it back. He/she just pays for shipping. It's just not worth it. Take it back, re-list it, honestly.

"Not as clear as today's scopes but not horrible either. Nice looking outer glass."

I think it would have been much "clearer" to simply state in the ad that: "The scope is fogged."

It's hard to tell from a picture, over the 'net, taken in the way that one was, if it was really fogged or just glare or reflection.

Just an outside opinion, not bashing, but from reading the ad, I would not have expected the scope to be fogged when it arrived...but the seller may have intended to show and explain that it was. Hope you guys can get it worked out.

Edited to say good for making the return offer...

Hey listen, not to hijack, but I will sidetrack slightly. We've seen a few Weaver stories lately, foggy, fuzzy crosshairs (dust inside). I'm the big "Buy a Leupold" guy. I realize there are reasons to want a vintage scope for appearances, but these kinds of problems are not isolated incidences. They must not even be gas filled because the advice for fuzzy Weaver crosshairs is to take them apart and blow the dust off. I think you get what you pay for with $100 scopes. Anyhow, doesn't sound like Jeff got what he was expecting.

$0.02 here...
Seems like if'n you weren't happy with the deal, he should take it back with a refund. Shipping costs both ways would probably be responsibility of the individuals shipping it out.
I don't see in the add where he said it was fogged up.
"Not as clear as today's scopes but not horrible either" doesn't say its fogged. It basically means to me that the new scopes are better quality, not that this one is defective.
I think he should buy it back...shipping might be negotiated.
Doesn't sound like a honest deal to me, sounds like someone wanted to get rid of a bummer scope.

re

Opps! Looks like the return offer was removed. Oh well.

I will take it to a PM with the original buyer, I am not arguing with someone over the public forum about something that is a personal matter... I bet you dont find anyone else that I have sold to on here that thinks I ripped them off, and this is not the case here either. The picture clearly and accurately shows the scope. I never misrepresent items. I lowered the price for him and he still has a beef about it?? Very classy in my opinion.

There's no better or more honest member here than RAS. The seller is here just for commercial purposes, and that's why I didn't do any more deals with him.

The scope was "clearly" misrepresented.

The seller has effectively screwed himself at this site, just like he screwed RAS.

110 bucks for the bottom of a Milk Jug is still 110 bucks for the bottom of a Milk Jug.

And I did offer via a PM to take it back since he wants to make a major public spectacle about his and my difference in opinion, and apparently computer monitor resolution.

By the way, you cant see through a foggy scope, this one was very much see through-able, just that it was not as clear as other scopes I have. I have yet to see a 40 year old weaver that was as clear as a Leupold, bushnell or even a Tasco...

Tag ,for future reference

I'm 47 years old and have learned about 3 things. Nobodies accusing me of being the brightest bulb in the pack, but the way I avoid issues like this is to refrain from buying marginal products. When I feel the need to "experiment" with one, I realize the burden lies on me for doing so. I'm not saying there isn't some intrinsic value in a Weaver, but I don't have any use for one. I've never had one that I've been happy to have on the gun. Others opinions are different than mine, I realize.

You did right by offering a refund. I have refunded or added to trade bait after the fact on deals several times here, even when I thought that my representation was fair and accurate.

Hopefully this is now all taken care of.

I originally told him no to the refund due to the fact that the picture clearly shows how the scope looks. But after making a scene about it and obviously since a picture is no longer worth 1000 words on this site, I will take the scope back but I will not refund shipping either way because I do not honestly feel a refund is right in this situation.

Duke, good for you for offering a refund! I am sure he would have done the same if you were not happy....

This.

That is underhanded, to trick someone into buying your inferior product, through misrepresentation.

We need a "Bad Guy" list.

Again....LOOK AT THE LAST PICTURE

And you're still trying to be clever.

And another thing, he never asked for a refund, he TOLD me I was going to give him a refund, here is the PM I received.

V9
RAS Online content
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/29/05
Posts: 5350
Loc: San Antonio, Texas
Hi Ryan,

Got the scope in. I wish I could report good news, but it is fogged up pretty well. I am going to return it and expect a refund. Thank you...Jeff
_________________________
Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Clever?? By showing a factual picture from the original listing??? I am only trying to show I am not the bad guy he is making me out to be....

Duke - quit trying to weasel out of this. You misrepresented the scope, plain and clear. Show me in the original ad where it said the word "fogged"?

It's really too bad that your reputation isn't worth $90 to you. Your posts above trying to get out of this or somehow justify it just prove your character - you should have immediately offered a refund and an apology. That's what most of us would have done.

Agree. That picture would have given me pause as a prospective buyer, at which point I would have discussed it with the seller prior to purchase.

On the other hand, $100 is just not that important to me to risk my online reputation.

Good job Duke.

Well I would have, had he not ordered me to give him a refund without asking or any other discussion. How would you feel if someone sent you a PM with a direct order without any other discussion about it? I am not in the habit of taking orders, if someone comes to me with a problem and asks me about it an adult manner, I gladly would help them, but I am not a 10 year old that is going to be told what I will or wont do.

That is exactly why I agreed to lower the selling price from $110 to $95 as he asked. I was under the impression he looked the pictures over and sent an offer according to what he saw. Even cloudy as the picture shows the scope is worth well more than what he paid for it.

You no duke, you seem to whine alot if things dont go your way just give the man a refund and move on. like you said its only $95

I sent him multiple PM's with no reply and he shows as being online...

Bingo, we have a winner.

I have hunted, fished and shot targets with about 12 folks on this site from CA to NC. Many memories have been made and many of them are my friends. Some nice bucks have been dropped. It would be more people if I could live in more places. This site is a lot more to me than just selling stuff. You see the seller has quite an Ebay account on selling things as well. Makes me think that it is safer for him to sell stuff like 'this' here and not risk the bad feedback from Ebay buyers? Anyways, I am done with this seller. I feel that it is beneath me to correspond with such a man of low character. My only goal now is to make sure that everyone knows about this and reads this thread. My original post allows for everyone to "judge" for themselves.

If you agree that I have been had on this deal, please bookmark this thread and step on everyone of his future sale ads with it so people can "judge" for themselves. Sorry for clogging up the classifieds. Just doing a little house cleaning.

RAS

Duke, I am not picking sides. Again, I think it is great to give him his money. However, if I were to look at the last picture, I would see snow in the background indicating it was cold outside. I would assume that you had brought the scope from inside your home to take the picture and that is the condensation on the OUTSIDE of the lense. I guess I would be to naive to think about the inside. I am saying this to give you a perspective of a non-participant.
Again, kudos for returning the money.

I agree, that picture does show a fogged up scope.

You were taken advantage of and you lost capital because of a clever misrepresentation by a fellow member who refused to make it right with a full refund.

That's BS. Send a refund and throw the scope in the trash. Is your reputation on this site worth $95?

Thank you emmerth, at least someone here has some eyes that work. I took the picture and priced it low knowing how it looked. I thought the picture was a fair demonstation of how the scope was... Apparently some people opinions of "fogged" and "not clear" are very much different than others.

THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE BOUGHT FROM ME IN THE PAST KNOW I AM STRAIGHT FORWARD, IF I HAVE SCREWED ANYONE ELSE OVER PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CHIME IN....AND I APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE I MAY SCREW OVER IN THE FUTURE, ITS NOT INTENTIONAL JUST APPARENTLY IGNORANCE ON MY PART.

Now that they guy took it for everyone to see, NOW you want to try and take care of it by PM. You started with that and didn't handle it right.
Had you been more honest about the condition of the scope and not misleading the buyer you would not have this problem.

Not true, I offer a refund he wont reply and publicly stated that he

There is nothing more that I can do

You're GOOD at B.S.......

Good move....Let him stew in the soup he's made.

Convincing us, or yourself?......

I am not going to beg someone to take a refund, just like I am not going to be told that I will or wont do something. Had he approached it in a reasonable manner opposed to telling me he is sending it back and expects a refund, without any other communication whatsoever, does not fly with me. Think what you want I really dont care, I am tired of arguing, I offered a refund, no reply, buyer states he dont want to stoop so low as to communicate to me, so case closed in my opinion.

You could send him his money back with a note asking him to return the scope. I think it would go a long way here in restoring your reputation.

I know that I would NOT have been happy with the scope in that condition. To me, "not as clear" and foggy are two very different issues.

I'm with you on this one RAS.

donsm70

The picture clearly shows a scope with "issues", I see no false advertising here...

Did you really expect a 95 dollar scope to be crystal clear?

Seriously?

Stating "Not as clear as today's scopes but not horrible either." is not the same as statng scope is fogged and will need repair.

Has I purchased it, I would be expecting a refund for misrepresentation irregardless of the price paid unless it was made clear up front that the scope was fogged and needed repair.

Not everybody can see pics and some of us are looking at them on a small phone screen. You should fully disclose when something is wrong and be a man about it.

Donsm70, we have dealt before, I agree not as clear and foggy are two different situations, I assure you the scope is not any more foggy today, than it was when the picture was taken. It is obviously a difference in opinions,and I would have gladly offered a refund initially had he not came across as a hard ass telling me what I would do without even asking for a refund, he tells me "he is sending it back and expects a refund". Well that is not the best way to get something done from my experience.

If your pulled over for speeding and you are sure you were not speeding you dont tell the cop, Hey I wasn't speeding and drive off do you? No you say officer I am sure that I wasn't speeding are you certain that I was? I am fairly certain that NO ONE on this site would like to be told what they will or wont do by an order. I never took orders from a stranger halfway across the US and I am not going to start now

theduke308

You were obviously trying to screw the buyer. Showing a picture does not justify your actions. You're not trust worthy.

All,
I've noticed on at least 6 occasions now in the past few months that the people who only post to sell something on the ads here WAY OVERSELL their product, especially scopes! These are the "Gun Show Creeps" that offer nothing to this site except to sell their junk.

We can do without them.

there is nothing wrong with the scope and it does not need repaired. I have yet to see a Lyman, Unertl, Weaver, Redfield or any other scope from the 1960's that could live up to today's standards as I PLAINLY stated

I am pretty sure if I were trying to mislead someone I would not have even put a picture looking through the scope let alone as many pictures as I did put.

why not just be a stand up guy and return his money ? If I sold something to a member and he believed i misrepresented it , i would without hesitation return his money .

Duke, Si says just get that Star Wars lazer surgery, and the scope will be crystal clear, all for just 95 bucks....

Not trying to be a smart ass, but there's a reason I don't buy used optics on web forums, especially for 95 bucks.

the scope in the picure is not fogged, not clear yes, but its not fogged, when I had a scope fogged you couldnt ever see anything thur it

+1...

Duke, you screwed up. The defects should have been better articulated.
RAS, take the refund and move on.

I once sold.a leupold on here, knew it needed to go to leupold, and stated such in the ad. Sellerknew what he was getting and was fine because the price was right. The easiest way to determine who is right is simple, would Ra's have bought it had theduke put in the ad, scope is fogged and needs work done on it. No, Ra's would not have bought the scope. If I listed a gun with a cracked stock but only showed it in the pica but Dod not state it would that be ok? I think not. Duke is on my ignore list.

I am not falling under the pressures of the narrow minded people of this website. If he had come to me in a sensible manner and ASKED for a refund, he probalby would have gotten it, but the fact the shoots an order at me and tell me I will refund him his money, then cries wolf and posts about me on here, then says he wont stoop so low as to communicate with me and wont reply to my PM's

Pretty low class and childish in my opinion, this is my last post on this, I dont see it getting any better picking at it, if you dealt with me before you know I am an alright person, thanks all that see it from my logical common sense point of view.

If we're going to start dissecting words, what is the difference in "not as clear", "foggy", "hazy", and "clouded".

Not picking sides, but does the scope have actual water vapor in it, or could it also fit one or more of the other descriptions listed?

With that said, a sub-$100 deal isn't worth the hassle. Send his money back, both sides chalk it up to learning to deal on the internet (sellers in giving full description, with no questions or room for misinterpretations, and buyers asking questions before committing to purchase if any doubts or something is not totally clear in your mind).

Myself, if I had read "not as clear", and looked at the picture, I most likely would've just passed and moved along. But if for some reason I really wanted the scope, I surely would've asked for a little more clarification on the exact condition.

Fail.

Pretty lame defense.

If a scope is fogged, yes I really expect it mentioned in writting in the ad. I would also expect a cheerful refund from any fellow sportsman on a product I wasn't happy with.

If you've ever bought ANYTHING from me, the last thing the PM would have said is if you aren't happy for any reason get back in touch with me ASAP so we can arrange a return.

All:

I have owned and looked through dozens and dozens of Weavers. Most of you that have seen my hunting pictures here, usually see them on my rifles, especially my Savages. This is the worst one to date. It is a unusable and has serious issues. I wouldn't even think of sending something like this someone without mentioning that is was really gooned up.

Again, please bookmark this thread and post it on his future ads for others to judge.

And another thing, thanks for the posts and PMs fellas. Things are going just the way we need them to.

I have sold quite a few scopes on here. I have a few that are hazy, not so clear, fogged ,etc.I would be embarased to put them up for sale on here.Maybe at a gunshow so its a face face deal, but not over the internet.Give him his money back.He's one of the good ones.

Man up swallow your pride send a full refund and salvage your name. Or you can keep on about how he got a deal and so on and ruin your reputation as a sealer.

I can't believe some are willing to kill their rep for $95........

Too late, his name is MUD!

Defend it however you will, whatever good name you had has been destroyed by your shady action

Why didn't you just say the scope is fogged?

It's not too late to make things right.

Duke you can stop all the BS & be a man or continue your BS and be a CHIT BIRD. The choice is your`s

If the buyer wont contact me then he can drop it and go away, I am not begging someone to take my money. I can use it many other places than here

Yes, we have dealt before and with no issues.

What I said here is "I am with RAS ON THIS ONE"

donsm70

You have his address (you sent the scope to him, right?).

Send the check to that address. I'm pretty sure your scope will find it's way home too.



At this point, yeah, that's about your only option, as I don't see much of a future for you here after this.

Just send RAS his money back, if you get the POS scope back great, if not ....you can still peddle your chit here!

I once bought a scope off of here that had some pretty bad ring marks. If memory serves me right the add stated that "minor ring marks exist". They were bad enough I didn't even want to put the scope on the rifle. I chalked it up to my idea of minor ring marks weren't the same as the seller, took some good pictures of the scope and sold it on ebay.

I think Jeff/RAS is acting a little high and mighty about all this. All of you condemn Duke over $95, well what about Jeff? Both parties could be way above this if they put a little effort into it. Really, for $95?! Man up.

Dude,
I hear you and you aren't wrong.
On the other hand, duke says his ad said the scope was fogged.........
Did you gather that from his ad?
I saw a crappy pic that I wouldn't draw that conclusion from.
Why didn't he just say.....the scope is a little foggy?
I don't see RAS as ruining his rep.
Can't say that for duke.
YMMV.

Jeff/RAS is a seasoned buyer on auction and web sites. If he's looking at the same photos of the scopes clarity I'm looking at, and he wanted clearer, he shouldn't have bought it. Jeff's no internet dummy.
I think he should accept that he took a risk and it didn't pan out for him. I mentioned earlier that in my opinion when you're shopping for $100 scopes you can't ask for the moon and stars, but apparently he is.
At this point I think both parties are being petty over very little money. And I don't like Jeff's "I'm above this" attitude. I've always been supportive of Jeff and his lovely family, and do not begrudge him, but find this whole exchange distasteful.

I never said it was fogged, I never said it wasn't fogged, I said it was not as clear as scopes are today, and I showed that via a Digital camera picture, its not like I scanned a polaroid image in. The picture, I felt, was a very accurate depiction of what I was selling and had RAS not acted like a bad a s s about this I would have acted differently about the refund.
He is obviously stubborn and arrogant and truthfully I dont feel all that bad knowing how he is acting about this situation.

Is the way to get fair treatment from someone to shoot orders, to ignore PM's, and say that you are not stooping low enough to communicate with me?

I am not saying I am right, I am not saying I am wrong, I am simply saying that if he wants to act like a baby, that's his choice.

Duke,
Before you edited your original post on this thread, you claimed that your ad had stated the scope was "foggy".
Turns out, the ad did not say, or to me anyway, represent that.
Correct?

Then you edited your post, removed the " I said it was foggy in the ad" part along with removing your offer of a refund.

Why the need for all the editing?

Where the hell is Judge Judy when u need her. I normally dont post on these heated topics but i cant resist this one. I do agree if the scope is truely fogged it should clearly state that. I do see this guys point in posting a pic and it does show a fair amount of unclearness. I have sold many Weavers handed down from family and none of them could even come close to being what i would call clear. I would like to see some picks from the buyer through the scope to see exactly how bad this fog is or if it is just not as clear as newer optics. I think this is the deciding factor here to is the scope fogged or is it just really not as clear as newer scopes. If it is fogged and needs repair than the wording was misleading and a full refund with shipping should be made. Lets see some photos and give this guy a chance to continue defending or admit that he should of disclosed the scope needed repair.

99.9% of the posts from the "theduke308" are in the classifieds. I'd say his selling days here are up in smoke.......

I thought you stated a few posts back you were DONE with your comments on this?

I can only say that had I sold the scope,I would have explained it's condition so that there could be no question the buyer knew what he was buying.

It would seem to me,the seller here explained the condition in such a way that he could claim full disclosure without disclosing the actual condition.

The picture doesn't mean much.Pictures of scope views rarely show the actual clarity of any scope.I would expect a much worse than actual immage in a picture,even from very high end scopes.

Bottom line is that I don't sell junk and the only way I would have offered the scope would be for someone to repair who was looking for a period correct scope.Even then I would have likely just given it away.

I dont see a fogged scope in the pictures, I see a scope thats not clear but in no way fogged, or maybe I dont know what a fogged scope is

duke just man up and admit you were wrong and misrepresented the scope refund his money and let it go. quit trying to play some mind game with your misleading words. do what's right and go on

And the duke goes on ignore..

You didn't say it was fogged! You owe the guy his money back and try to resell it, stating that it is cloudy and fogged! Then if someone buys it, it's at their own risk.

You are another "bad" dealer in my book till you get it right. Hope it was worth your reputation. You should have sent it in or repair, then sold it. You did the buyer wrong. Glad he informed us so I can put you on ignore to remind me to beware.

That whole damn pic. is blurry, just look at the table. Not to mention it looks like the pic. is from inside a porch. You should of just stated blurry view or foggy. Leaving a pic for someone to judge without telling him what you know is wrong with the scope is shady.

You obviously have no clue how a digital camera works..??.. In order to take a picture through a scope, you have to use the macro setting. In the macro setting the scope focuses on a single object, in this case the inside of the scope. It focuses all of its picture taking magic on this one spot thus making the rest of the image cloudy. Sheesh people are getting dumber and dumber and dumber.....and for the record I WASNT SELLING THE TABLE so why would it matter if it was blurry?

This is a total misrepresentation. Saying it's not as clear as today's scopes is totally different than saying it's fogged and you know it. Trying to judge if a scope is fogged from a picture is almost impossible. Is it fogged, is there fog or frost on the window, is it just a weird artifact of the camera trying to focus through multiple layers of glass, or what?

Each time you put pen to paper you devulge more clearly who & what you are. I think the above statement is all telling. Be gone!

DMc

And for the Last Time...I AM NOT REFUNDING MONEY TO A PERSON THAT WILL NOT COMMUNICATE WITH ME... CASE CLOSED

This site really needs moderators to keep stupid posts like these from escalating to sh-it storms

Ain't the first schit storm........ definitely not the last!!!

I guess the objective lense could have been cracked and simply described as "not in 'new' condition" or "not as clear" as newer ones....??? How would you feel if I sold you a scope like that??? You would be right to "expect" a refund and perfectly within your rights to express it that way. Just sayin....

YA RIGHT I bet your done.Now look for the moderators to pull your ass out of the weeds.

and every thing in your picture is blurry, so how would a buyer be able to tell exactly how clear the view is through the scope? THROUGH AN ACCURATE DESCRIPTION you dumb ass. Send him his money back and let him keep the scope. And grow up...

Good-bye.

+1

And theduke308 goes on my "do not buy from" list.

No dog in this hunt; but I sure as hell would not put my reputation in question for $100!!!

i've bought and sold items on the fire for years, and never had a problem. most of my good luck was due to the great (read as honest) folks here. unfortunately, there are cheats everywhere. sadly, we have another in our midst. i'll make it a point to put him on ignore and never do business with him.

I'm the moderator, let me read over the thread and make a decision. Gimme couple minutes.


After further review Duke, the thread stays and you must send RAS his $100 back. If you or anyone has a problem with this..... I will ban you for 5 yrs. Also, I figured out what GFY means and do not appreciate members using that acronym.

Jeff my friend, you are the most honest man I know. I personally know about some of your random acts of kindness to people on the Campfire, elsewhere and to me. If it were me I would take the scope back and refund both the money for the scope and the money for shipping because I know that is what you would do.

FYI I will never buy anything from you.

Who is with me?

Case closed.


P

How can I make things right with a person that wont talk? RAS has given me the silent treatment and I am not going to beg someone to reply to me....I am not sending him money back if he can not grow up and act like a man....IF he grew up and acted like a man I WOULD REFUND HIS MONEY......you dont reward a dog for peeing on the floor do you? Well I am not rewarding him for slandering my name and then not even trying to let me make it right..

So what you are saying is, the difference between you doing the right thing and NOT doing the right thing is HIS behavior?

A gentleman behaves as such regardless of the other person's behavior.

By your action, we know what you are.


P

I do my dealing the same way any other logical person would, you return the scope to me and assuming it is how it left my house, I will refund the money, thats how returns work....try going to Cabelas, buying something, deciding you dont want it and taking your receipt back without the item and expecting them to give you your money back and keep the item....You all need to wake up to the real world apparently..

You people are scolding me for not refunding his money...well why should I give him the money back and let him keep the item???
Why is everyone so quick to blame the seller in these situations?

Because you are wrong.


P

Maybe that's part of the problem...you see this as a store front setting whereas many of us see this as a home away from home. Where one's word means more than anything...

I have , on a couple of occasions sold items that the buyers were less than pleased with. On both occasions I refunded the purchase price and paid shipping in both directions.

Just saying......


Mike

Just send Jeff his damn money back. I'm quite certain you'll get your scope......

you compare Jeff to a dog now? And if I recall he DID give you the chance to make it right, and you blew it...

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep].

A supposedly objective photo can misrepresent a multitude of sins; a little favorable light does wonders. Think we've all shopped gunbroker/ebay before. A view thru said lens was of a snowy scene outside, through a window. Too clever by half. Add some artful use of english in the ad. Neither excuses what was transparently intended as a deceit. Digging the hole deeper does the seller no favors. Were it an innocent mis-communication, finding the sense to make it right would be easy. In this case, not so much. The "why" is pretty apparent.

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep]

We don't like to question a mans Honor , but we do like to count on it.

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep]

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep]

Rot in hell you [bleep] [bleep].

^^^ this guy is mature lol^^^

When you don't get it,
I guess you don't get it.

If this were me, at this point, getting a POS scope back would be the farthest thing from my mind.
Keeping my integrity, would be the highest priority.
I don't expect you to "get that" either.......but I tried.

theduke308,

I believe you have successfully hung yourself



Mike

Steelie's not a dishonest Crook though........give Jeff his money back and shut up would be the best advice I could give you.....

But at least I'm not a dishonest, POS, idiot.

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep].

I could refund the money right now, what good would it do?? Quite honestly what good? My "integrity" is already thwarted so what makes the difference? Like I said if RAS would communicate with me I would gladly refund the money, but since I no longer have his address and he wont reply, then my hands are tied.

Another load that a mother should have swallowed.

Repeat.........I tried.



Fail.



To bad.




So long, Duke.

[quote=Steelhead
[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep] [/quote]

I like your style.


Succinct as hell.

P

theduke308,
RAS's words about your character were quite vague compared to the degree of clarity your own words have presented.
Jerry/AK

Spoken like a true POS.

If you use this site to only peddle your schiet, then be proud that you screwed one of the most honest members on this site.

I wouldn't trust you as far as I could throw you.

(Maybe you should read my signature line.)

GFY

Any way you look at it......it WAS misrepresented. Another name on my black list!

Doc Les

[bleep] you, you [bleep] [bleep].

This site moderates itself just fine, in case you haven't noticed

Pulling some bullshit and then crying wolf don't cut it around here.

Send Jeff his money back, and quit diggin' yourself a deeper hole..........

Reminds me of a once well respected member who refuses to send an item to the owner because "he isn't being nice about it"
Frigging crooks will go to any length to excuse their own dishonest behavior.
It's always somebody other than themselves at fault when they cheat someone

If you send the $ back to RAS, I will send you this crystal clear Swarovski at no charge.

That's some funny schit. Hopefully DipschitDuke is off swallowing his own cock right now though.

Well said, brother.

You screwed the guy, plain and simple.

Send RAS his money with instructions to throw that junk scope in the trash where it belongs.

You should not have put it on the market to begin with.

Sell your garbage somewhere else.

Speaking of childish...someone who will not do the right thing because of the tone someone they had wronged. If you were an adult and had just done the right thing he would not have had to call you out. BTW GFY

Somehow, I bet you DO have it somewhere.... PM string that you used when selling it maybe?

I really tried to look at this objectively, but your continued digging, as well as my recollection of a few lowball offers from you when I was selling something, have pretty much "cleared things up" for me (pun, get it? ).

I'm interested.

What reticle?

Do the mounts stay with it?

Will they fit a pre-64 M70? (It looks to be of about the same vintage, or at least it has enough "character" to seem that old).

Think it will hold up to the recoil of a 375 H&H?

Any pictures looking through it?

Do you offer a return policy if I'm not happy?

I've heard of some bad deals on this board lately, and don't want to get burned on this one (I can't afford to just throw that kind of money away if it's not going to work for what I need!).

Doing the right thing ain't always easy, but its always right.
JH

"I put right in the description it is not clear, and i showed in a picture. I am not accepting a return on it. The last picture of the post show is is not clear. You got it at a cheap price due to this reason. This scope in a mint condition scenario is worth 150+....Send it to iron sighters they will fix it up for you to your liking."

So he paid $85 for a screwed up scope that you admit needs a rebuild by a company that would probably cost him $100+ to fix it to be useable, which puts Jeff's total cost above the $150 you say a GOOD scope would usually go for.


Too bad YOU didn't get it fixed, then sell it for $150, but I see why, as you would have lost money doing so.

Send RAS a pm asking how to give him back all of what he spent to buy this scope, your add should have read "scope isn't useable as-is, will need to be sent to IRON SIGHTERS for rebuild. I don't want to spend good money after bad, so please buy this and save me $. If nobody wants this I am going to Ebay it and sell it to some sucker, as Ebay isn't set up to give me any negative reviews for selling CRAPOLA like this scope is."


You had included a decent picture BUT POOR DESCRIPTION, after understanding from Jeff this is a foggy scope. I have seen many crappy pictures on the net, Jeff used your words, not a picture, to decide to send you $ to buy the item. I'll bet most people who have read this will now ask the seller if a crappy picture is a crappy picture, or a representation of what it looks like to the seller. Thank you for educating us on how a seller can make a mistake.

Look in the mirror and ask yourself if you did the right thing ( and would you expect to be treated the same if YOU got this pos scope), so far. If the answer is yes, GFY, if the answer is no, THEN SEND JEFF A FULL REFUND, I am sure you will get the scope back in the same shape you sold it in. WHEN YOU GET IT BACK, SEND IT TO IRON SIGHTERS AND GET IT FIXED, OR SCRAP IT.

It is telling that you have now based your decision to refund the $ on weather your reputation is tarnished for good, and you know refunding Jeff will not remove the people who will never buy from you in the future.

Do you want to do the right thing, or only do the right thing if you gain future sales by doing so? If I read that right, you are right, you will never sell anything on here in the near future, you will be "dogged" by good members here to make sure you never sell another POS , as that is how we roll. We don't appreciate POS sellers screwing other members, and up until you refund Jeff, IMHO You are a POS seller.

All this and it wasn't a new member,goes to show ya the number of post doesn't always mean anything.

ALL the [bleep]'s posts are in the classifieds that says a lot right there.

You have his address. You don't need him to talk to you Oprah. Just figure out how to admit you were wrong, which you obviously are, and send him his money. You are making this way harder than it has to be.

You are in a hole. Stop digging.

Pay up, shut up...let's put a fork in this, it's done.

Yes, you did.

You were trying to create an impression that was not true. Be a man, admit it, and refund the money. Period.

I happened to sell some thing here that the member was not happy with. My fault, as I did not check product function completely. Refunded money and told them to keep the product.
$$$ ain't worth it. A person's reputation is priceless....

I always remember this saying on a plaque above the toilet while I was growing up. Read it every time I pissed.


You got it from your father,
It was all he had to give,
So its yours to use and cherish,
For as long as you may live.
If you loose the watch he gave you,
It can always be replaced,
But a black mark on your name son,
Can never be erased.
It was clean the day you took it,
And a worthy name to bare,
When he got it from his father,
There was no dishoner there.
So be sure you guard it wisely,
After all is said and done,
You'll be glad the name is spotless,
When you give it to your son.

I think the scope was deliberately misrepresented.

WELL SAID!!!!!!!!!!


Roy

Duke - your responses on here are what has trashed your reputation. You could have just said, "Yeah - I thought I had had properly described it, especially with the picture that showed the fogging, but I obviously screwed up. Send it back and I'll refund including your shipping. Sorry for the misunderstanding".

Then re-list the item with an updated description that includes the picture and the words, "this scope has some slight fogging as you can see in the picture."

But instead you posted 20 different responses blaming the buyer, blaming the age, blaming the posters and being a general, all-around [bleep]-stik.

as one gunfighter said to the other before they pulled their pistols "sometimes you win and sometimes you lose" and thats just the way the cookie crumbles,and as I see it from time to time someone still gets a knife stuck in his back or gets a good ol screwin without the kiss and the smile here on the good ol classifieds and as Im very grateful that Ive not been drug over this bed of coals I also understand that anytime you walk out on this plank you may get a good ol soakin so as momma used to say if you choose to play ball on that field and you get hit in the nose with the ball dont come home cryin to me for you knew this could happen befor you got involved in the game.

Good post.

This dishonest seller will soon show up under a new name. He's finished, here.

Everyone has some blame on this one.


The Duke made a piss poor representation of his scope but if he was really trying to hide something he wouldn't have posted the close up of the view from the scope.


RAS should have paid a little better attention and should have asked for a refund instead of the way he went about it. He has a legitimate gripe but I get ticked off when someone tells me what I'm going to do instead of just asking.



Send the scope back, split the shipping and move on or you can each bitch and moan over a couple bucks shipping and drag this out for pride when in the end, you'll both look a little silly.

Because YOU ARE IN THE WRONG HERE.

Stop making excusses why you can't or won't refund the money and make it right.

'flave is top notch.

If anybody was wondering.


Travis

There's absolutely no reason he shouldn't get his scope back if he refunds the money. That's plain BS.

BS


You're a bigger horse's azz than me.



Course, I'd still drink with you and buy any foggy scopes you had.

I totally get that.

All:

Thank you for the support on this via posts and PMs.

With nearly 5000 views, I think we got the word out effectively. Though look for a new name.

Now, as the seller has continously says that he couldn't get a hold of me or my address to refund the $. That is a complete and total lie. I paid via Paypal. Yes, Paypal which shows transactions for 30 days. In 5 minutes the man could have refunded the $ and posted the transaction here. But no, he kept saying that he couldnt get a hold of me. It surely fits the narrative so many of you have come to. It doesn't surprise me one bit.

This person is of low character and I peronally want him out of this site where there are so many good people. You can make your own decision. Again, I apologize to all of you for clogging up the classifieds section. I consider the matter closed on my end and I will not post on this thread anymore.


All the best,
RAS

Duke - quit trying to weasel out of this. You misrepresented the scope, plain and clear. Show me in the original ad where it said the word "fogged"?

It's really too bad that your reputation isn't worth $90 to you. Your posts above trying to get out of this or somehow justify it just prove your character - you should have immediately offered a refund and an apology. That's what most of us would have done.
X2

[/quote]

Again....LOOK AT THE LAST PICTURE


[/quote]

I don't feel bad for RAS, if I'm buying something online, weather its $30 or $1300, and i see a questionable picture like that, I'm asking question's. Seems to me he took a gamble on an old scope and lost.

Lesson learned for everyone. Make your ad's as clear as possible and if you're buying make sure you know what you're getting.

I don't know the Duke, never delt with him but i HIGHLY doubt he would ruin his rep by trying to make $95 piddly bucks by cheating someone. Cmon guys think about it...

Best post in this whole thread ^

The original ad said that he accepts PayPal "gift" Sorry but I have a real bad feeling in my gut for anybody who does this as they are cheating PayPal and if they will cheat them they might not be so honorable. Plus by using the gift option you have no recourse with PayPal.

Makes for a sad day when you read a man committing social suicide with every statement he writes.

That picture doesn't mean squat to me. Snow on the ground and could be snowing at the time it was taken and the magnification could show snow/fog outside. The dumbazz had a play on words and lied by omission, nothing more, nothing less. Even worse is how he's trying to justify his actions and play the victim. Man the [bleep] up and refund RAS' money! If he paid through PayPal, Duke doesn't need his address! All he needs to do is to log into PayPal and issue a refund, which would take all of about 30-seconds!

Where's BrickTop, he'll get this schit straitened out!!!

Why dont you just say in the ad that it was fogged? I cant tell from the ad that there is any problem. You also state visually and mechenically in great condition. A scope should not fog, it is not in great condition either visually or mechanically. Mechanically, it is no longer sealed, and visually, you cant see well through the optic. Saying that the item was fairly represented is a lie. I have only read the first page so far.

+1, Me either. It doesn't matter anyway. If I sold you a scope and you opened the box and aren't happy with it, You'll get a refund. That's just the way it works. It's amazing someone would think otherwise.

Again....LOOK AT THE LAST PICTURE


[/quote]

I don't feel bad for RAS, if I'm buying something online, weather its $30 or $1300, and i see a questionable picture like that, I'm asking question's. Seems to me he took a gamble on an old scope and lost.

Lesson learned for everyone. Make your ad's as clear as possible and if you're buying make sure you know what you're getting.

I don't know the Duke, never delt with him but i HIGHLY doubt he would ruin his rep by trying to make $95 piddly bucks by cheating someone. Cmon guys think about it... [/quote]

I'm not convinced anyone involved learned much from this.

First the guy "RAS" Jews him down, then gets the scope dont like it, and replies with a smart a$$ directive, the only person I let talk to me like that is my dad and mom. In the many pics I seen he posted of this scope, its a old vintage 40 year old scope which clearly shows it not to be clear glass. What did RAS expect? A return is a nice gesture , but two things come to mind, what was this guy expecting for under 100.00 REALLY??? lol, and the spouted orders he sent (not very nice), but I seen many guys on here on the forum that i can tell they are jerks just by the attitude and wording of the post.

I would love to see some pics from the buyer through the scope just to see how bad it really is. Like i commented before if it is truely fogged and needs repair than it should of clearly stated that in the post. If it is just a poor quality 30-40 year old optic than the seller might b justified by stating it is not as clear as newer optics. The last pic does show some sort of unclarity. Would love to see a few more.

A good friend of mine and fellow member on here actually had dealings with both RAS and Duke on a scope. RAS told him he was way out of line on the scope and offered him $80. Duke bought it for $250. Looks like he tried to get a super deal in a questionable scope and wasn't happy. I think everyone is being way too critical on Duke.
FWIW on the PayPal Gift comment. He's not cheating Paypal. The only difference money wise is the sender pays the fees not the one who sales it.

Did you send the scope before you got his money? Money moves first ( I think it should go at the same time). You obviously misrepresented the scope in the ad. I would have assumed camera glare, because an honest person would state the scope was fogged, or not in its factory condition. This is like trying to teach a Junior High kid about ethics and integrity!

Think I spot a jerk now...

Not completely accurate.

If you link it out of your bank account, NOBODY pays any fees.

Don't hold your breath. At this point any picture seen will be the worst possible, so this is really no longer an objective discussion, if it ever was.

The old adage that being silent and allowing others to think you an idiot comes into play here.

Whether not as clear or foggy, I would never have my name attached to a product for sale that I wouldn't be able to use myself.

Too, admitting that you might as well keep your money because your rep has already been tarnished was the killer for me. That other old adage who you are when no one else is looking is really who you are. Now you can go to other sites and sell and buy but you are still who you are.

You could have easily saved face by just a "sorry guys misrepresentation wasn't my intent" and though I don't like how RAS expected his money back I'm refunding it. After reading all of the replies you made though I don't think you think you are in the least bit wrong. By the way expecting and demanding are different from my perspective.
JM2C

+1. If the buyer is not happy, I'll take it back & issue a refund.

Only thing I will not do is accept a certified signature check payment to be picked up at USPS.

If you never misrepresent items, why didn't you put it clearly in writing that the scope was fogged? You tap danced around that minor issue because you knew that would affect the sale, and that was wrong. Continue to dispute this and your reputation will be in the crapper here. You should have said it was fogged, and the fact that you refuse to work with him on this proves your deception, and hopefully will make others think twice before dealing with you.

What a bunch of horseschidt! Do you really think he wanted, or would have bought a fogged scope if it was described as such?

This is from a person with 10 posts, 9 of them are in the classifieds. With all due respect, you're really not a member of this community.

why wouldnt you want to cheat pay pal? there are so anti gun, they make donations to take away our gun rights

If you weren't trying to miss lead someone WHY DIDN'T YOU PUT IN THE ADD THAT THE SCOPE WAS FOGGED?

And it only took you 10 posts on this forum to fit in an ethnic slur....

They aren't "cheating" anyone. When you give a PayPal "gift" the payer is the one who pays the fees instead of the seller. The fees still get paid.

Here's a funny fact, the NRA accepts PayPal! I guess they can't be all bad.

I got a Leupold 8.5X25 LRT thats fogged that I will sell you

Again, not true.

Straight from the PayPal website at https://www.paypal.com/webapps/mpp/paypal-fees :

"Transferring money

Usually Free - Sending money to friends and family is free for you and the recipient when you fund the transfer with your bank account or PayPal balance. You can also use a debit or credit card or make an international transfer for a small fee.

PayPal balance or bank account: Free when sending money inside the US."

A fogged Leupold I'd take.

A fogged Weaver, not so much.

yes its fogged in fact theres water inside

Steelhead's been on here a long time. Some folks have had disagreements with him, but most of these things have worked themselves out. You are digging a hole you'll never climb out of here, and taking cheap shots at long term members will get you absolutely nowhere. I hope Ric pulls the plug on your sorry azz.

gemby, whatcha want for the fogged Leupold ?

I don't understand why any seller would think a man would pay anything for a fogged up weaver scope that is more than 40 years old, and maybe this is the reason he didn't state in his add it was fogged. The photo really shows nothing other than the camera may have been out of focus . This scope should have been trashed in the Garbage from the beginning and not even put up for sale and especially without a full description of its condition . Sorry but the seller set up this mess and is 100% at fault and should man up and make it right. I guess a small amount money is more important than Integrity and Reputation . The seller must be a Democrat.

Great thing about these threads is they serve as a warning to members, new or old, not to attempt any foul play in the Campfire classifieds. Any dealings that are not straightforward and above board, and you will get called on it. Folks on this site are great, but they don't tolerate funny business in classifieds transactions. That makes me feel much safer about the transactions I enter into here.

I guess you missed the the word "usually. " So yes, it is true. So is the part about the NRA accepting PayPal for payment.

Man, all this over $95.

I'll drink to that.

GFY.


Travis

If you think it is just about the $95 then you are missing the point...

Unscrupulous sales people always resort to what I call " weasel wording". Not all truth , not all lies. It is their way of internally justifying plucking someone.

What's the chance he won't refund the money because he already spent it. Kinda hard to give what you don't have.

They rob Peter to pay Paul so they can stay in business.

It is all about misrepresenting a item and not making good on it , when the buyer isn't happy .

Bea, that pic in your sig line cracks me up every time I see it.

Lubbockdave, you still pissed at me from couple yrs ago?

Don't think u r getting a Lil Hunka Luv teddy bear for Valentine's day.

Yea, you mis-represented the product, and apparently intentionally. If the scope is fogged you have an obligation to say so, not use some obtuse method of comparing today's product with yesterdays as your declarative statement. I have to ask, are you a liberal?

Felt like telling someone to GFY today, guess you"ll do JB069.....GFY!

"Lil Hunka Luv teddy bear".... WTF!....You listening to Elvis today John?

Dammmm Vermont teddy bear adds are on TV again.

Oh bye the way, SMFB

Thank you...I shall steal that.

One time I tried hunting some deer with a scope and I looked through the scope and it was real damn foggy and I said "what the hell, is there a ghost in this scope", and I panicked and dropped the rifle and ran home. Man, that really dredged up some old memories.

Say, what are we talking about again?

...because he will do anything to keep the good opinion of she-who-must-be-obeyed.

Still in the honeymoon period.

Actually, no I didn't.

Full comprehension and context...

"Usually", as in free to both parties if you use a bank account or paypal balance. I even highlighted it to make it more obvious. The "not always" part of "usually" is the part where they say if you use a credit card. Read both lines together, and it's pretty plain.

You can gift money with no fees on either end, quite easily.

And I never doubted the NRA part. They aren't selling guns or high cap magazines.

When your one true love is yourself, your whole life is the honeymoon period.


XOXOXO,
Travis

Ummm...Stoney...I didnt think you as a moderator allowed the "GFY"???

Yap, I do it all the time. They make plenty off my business monthly, so now & then I f*ck'em back by using the gift option.....free to both party's.


Nothing wrong with "Go Find Yourself" Steve.

Not $95.00...a man's word.

This thread only had 4 pages when I looked last night.

I think this serves as a testament to the quality of people on here, and the tight knit community within gun/hunting enthusiasts. In the few dealings i've had with folks here, it has been exemplary! Better than dealing with my own brother. Hope everything turns out well for you.

I think what J. means is that a seller let this all transpire over a flippin' misrepresented $95 pos scope.
Truth in advertising has some importance around here.

This thread is why I do biz here on the 'fire.
I trust the guys I buy from, and most everyone keeps it real in selling.

I had an issue with a rifle I sold. The customer was not happy, he sent me a scathing email. I didn't get upset, as I understood he was upset, because something was not right. I sent him an email, to have him call me.

He did, I refunded his money, plus paid for the shipping back. Why, because it was/is the right thing to do.

I could have sent him back an email, telling him to pound sand, but then I would have to look at myself in the mirror. And that guy see's exactly what character you have.

RAS is good people, have done a few transactions with him, hope to do more.

The seller could not lay straight in bed...his word is no good.

It's obvious you didn't. I took the word at lt's literal meaning not what I wanted it to mean.

I just went by my own personal experience. The last time I gifted money through PayPal it cost me roughly 3%.

Only time i get charged by PayPal is when i use a credit card. Just sent 220.00 by cc and it charged me 6.68 and that was a gift. Never get charged for a gift if i use my checking acct.

Roy

Wrong again...... My dad sent me $$$$ via gift and it cost ZERO.

Are you replying to me?


Roy

No Im not.......

Gotcha. Sorry....

Roy

$95 might just as well be $1000 if you don't have it.

So crooked he has to screw his socks on.

No, I'm not wrong.

I remember those days and I am glad they are past me.

Yet again a poster that has 99.99% of all posts in the classifieds comes up in one of these types of threads.

I use the ignore function for one reason, as a reminder for these type of affairs.

I bet the dicwad never sells anything here again. Just in case he ever tries to, this is how to post a scope with "issues"

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...w_3_9x40_Burris_FFII_Ballist#Post7407667

I'm happy....the buyer is happy.

Huge difference in fogged and "not as clear as" todays manufactured. Description & pictures ebay quality, not 24 hour Campfire qualty. GW

Ad was not full disclosure......buyer deserved a refund IMHO, shipping cost should be split to be fair to all, call it a day and move forward, my 2 cents

Well stony, nice of you to ask. Had you on ignore but logged out And happened across this post of yours...and goodness no I'm not still mad about you for telling me a scope was "mine" then selling it to someone else. I forgave you a Long time ago but I appreciate you concern about my feelings on the matter. And so close to valentines day and all...my Stony-bear is showing a sensitive side for all to see. Well Stoney bear, don't give it a second thought sugarpants.

And of course GFY...

Dave

That was special. You two need some alone time?

I just kinda held a towel up in front of the monitor and turned my head away for a few minutes to give them some privacy...

I think I might need a cigarette after that...and I don't even smoke!

"Do you smoke after having sex?"

"Well, I don't know. I never looked".

I karaoked kum-bye-ah, while crying.
It was special.
Thanks, man.

I disagree. But hey it's in the past and today is Valentines so pm me your address I'm gonna ship you some home-made chocolate brownies and a jar of Tennessee home-made lemonade. Chewing Stoney's brownies and strolling down Buddy Holly Ave will be the greatest day of your life.

You mentioned scope, thought it was bullets?

Gary, why do you have a towel at your monitor?.......never-mind nobody needs to know.

Because a kleenex isn't always enough?

+1 That's the way this should have been handled also.

This thread is getting better and better! lol.

Eric

'flave is still a great guy.



Travis

Stoney, it was a scope but no big deal my friend. Imma pass on the lemonade and brownie offer. I'm more of a sweet tea and pie guy. Love me some pie...

Dave

I can't believe I read this whole thing. I wish bricktop would offer thread summary services and make a ruling on paypal

Better advice would be to not buy from you period!!!

Valentine's Day does that to some people.

I know what this is about, it's the seller that doesn't want to return the money so bottom line is, for him, it's the money.

im gonna give my two 2 cents because i read this whole freakin thing....of course a scope of that age and products used back then is not gonna be any were near as clear as todays fine optics, even if you took it out of the original sealed box... period!!! but your add did not any were say that in fact it was "foggy" wich you say was totaly noticable in the pic looking through the scope, well IMO no matter wether you have a pic of looking through the scope or not it should have been stated in or around pic that its foggy a little or alot, PERIOD!!!!! to vaguely state that a used scope made in the 70's is not as clear as todays scopes, well no S*@$ guy, come on man, thats like sayin a stock used 57 chevy pickup doest have "quite" as much power as a brand new 2013 duramax... HMMMMMMM REALLY!!!!!!!!
i would say MISREPRESENTED, help him get it fixed or return money, save face dude. Is $95 really worth being a hard ass and getting a bad rep

Yeah, but there's that ugly rumor about the self-fascination-genitalia thing...

Yep that pretty much sums it up, and is how it should read to anyone but a dumba$$........

So two wrongs make a right? If you don't want to pay the fees then don't use PayPal! If a person is so quick to cheat PayPal (or anyone else) I don't want to do business with them. Plus you are setting yourself up for fraud because you can't go back to PayPal and argue the charges. And FYI when the gift option is used no one pays any fees unless you're using a credit card to pay.

So every once in a while you believe in screwing someone? Check one person off that I will never buy from. If one doesn't see a problem cheating PP then I bet they don't have a problem cheating a person every once in a while.

Dammit Man, I just lost a customer for future sales.

Before paying I re-filled my coffee cup this morning after drinking 20% of it at the 7-11 store. I cheated them also.....It feels good to talk about, thanks reelwoman.

What a [bleep]' drama queen. I'm 100% honest with every one of you on this site, no exceptions, and yet I get great pleasure in [bleep] anti-gun paypal out of their cut. I send as many paypal gifts as possible.

Good For You

What's wrong with that??

Pretty much sums it up.

1-800-I-SCREWED-711.

I'm calling them right now!

I bet I even get a reward!!

When I buy with PP I also get PP backing up my purchase in case I get ripped off like it appears the OP was. If you're asking me to not follow PP's rules then you're also asking me to trust you completley and not be able to do anything if you screw me. Sorry but I don't know you and I won't trust you if you can cheat one person you can easily cheat one of us. If you don't like PP's policies that's fine and I can respect that - but then don't do business with them instead of cheating them.

Amen. Fuuuuuuck Paypal.......

Gee whilikers ! I still want to buy that fogged up Leupold. Can we get off the PayPal rant ?

Damn this post is more entertaining then artificial inseminating cows.

ROTFLMAO!!!

TTT for the weekend crowd.

Travis is a good guy.

Beings this is settled how aboit removing it.

Or just stop posting on it and it won't come back to the top...

I beleive todays scopes are not as foggy as the older styles and just better.