Thanks to you who posted on the #1 sometime back. I appreciate the info and advice.

Lupy put a #1 in a VX3 3-10 and I tried it out tonite. Had a pair of spotted fawns in what my wife and I call a lawn, so early on I spent some time pinpointing spots...but am mostly preoccupied with low light performance, so back to the drill.

Used a Conquest 3-9 #4 on a M-70 and a Lupy G4 3-9x40 to compare with. For low light venison ID--not reading charts.

Like Youper said, you have no trouble seeing the G1 posts...

The Zeiss 4 was my hands down favorite for low-light, as the posts are heavy enough to show well and close enough together to provide plenty of guidance after the fine crosshair is gone. The Lupy G4 posts are further apart. The #1 puts that bold center post right there--no guessing.

Like it matters, really. I would make the shot anyway with those three and so would everybody else that can shoot. And if it's a long ways...then it isn't really low light...:)

None the less, splitting hairs I like it a lot.

For my money this particular VX3 has better low light contrast than this particular Conquest. The color (when I could still see it) is a little richer in the VX3. The Conquest gives the appearance of being slightly brighter, however in very low light I'd give the VX3 with the #1 the edge both for the glass and for the reticle.

Haven't killed anything yet so prematurely FWIW--low light: the G1, then the Zeiss #4 and then a distant third the Lupy G4.

And the heavy duplex somewhere behind...but I'd consider a battery before that happens...:)

I had a G1 in a M8 4x33 and it was probably the fastest sight acquisition I have used. Looking to do another, likely in a 6x36.

The G4 below in my FxIII 6x42 was nice, though seen one way too wide at the 07 Shot show.....why I don't know but I am sure there apparently were variations of the G4 by Leupold.

Notice below, the pic thru the scope, is much narrower than what his depicted on the box the scope came in.

FWIW, the G4 above by Leupold looks nigh identical to the 3P#4 I had in some Burris 2-7x35. Hard to want to go back to a duplex if low light shooting is on your menu.

I know a member here post from Alaska often, but I wonder as I hear they have more daylight hours vs. night time hours and wonder if that is why he does not need as much light transmission etc. to be successful.

http://www.absak.com/library/average-annual-insolation-alaska

Any Alaskan hunters want to chime in? I would be curious to know.

Last season I shot a doe right at dusk in deep woods at 75 yds with a 2.5x wide duplex, immediately thereafter I had a raccoon come in eating the corn my partner throws out, so knowing he will eat them, I was going to take him as well, but in the shadows, the dark shaded coon nearly disappeared in the shadows on the forest ground vs. the tan hide on the deer I had just dropped, and it was smaller. In better light, 150 yds would have easily been possible on the coon with the above scope.

For the coon, a bolder reticle would have helped, as more x's, so I figure a 4x with G4 or G1 would have been the best set up, if not a 6x.

Either of those fixed scopes would have been fine on the coon, and the G1 would have been the fastest to use.

I really wish the Fixed 4x Conquest and FX series came standard with G1 and G4 but perhaps the US public is not aware of the benefits and too concerned with dreaming about shooting 500 yds since they read all the ads with ballistic reticles. Different situations demand different needs in optics which is why there are so many opinions on optics. Many posters are likely right, in what works for them. As the OP states, when the day nears end, the range you can see and are working with is much shorter..giving the upper hand to a bolder reticle.

I never like heavy duplex for paper, but heard many rave on them when hunting, and did have an HD 6x42 M8 on my old Classic 700 in 6.5x55, that I used on a deer in VERY low light one evening on a deer in deep woods w/ease. A fine duplex can fade out in my experience i.e. a 4-14x40, so for hunting a std. duplex is a minimum for what I want in reticle thickness, for game hunting. Shooting ultra long range is not required in my type of hunting, nor preferred and the MAJORITY of my shots have always been at 200 yds or less. I did shoot a deer last year with the above scope close to dusk at 250 yds with the above 6.5x55 in the pic, it does not show the extremely high resolution and brightness, in fact my pocket digital camera would NOT shoot a pic thru the scope looking at a view because there was too much light. Seriously. Maybe an SLR would have, but none the less I cannot imagine much improvement over the scope above for low light, save if a hunter wanted a G1. Either can be had via the custom shop.

I do commend Burris for offering many 3P#4 options, save their now disc. in the 6x40, and a 4x would be welcomed back to their line.

6.5 that looks more like a Premier job to me--they look like Swaro's 4a

....unless it is in the photo somehow

If so, consider yourself lucky to have the impossible.

My G4 are much heavier than yours and I have 3.

Nope, what you see is what it is, from the factory....perhaps the G4 changed, as the one at the 07 Shot Show was very wide (believe it was in a 6x42, possibly an M8 model, def. not the same as above) and not appealing. IIRC, the specs were the fine wire is .7" at 100 yds and the width of opening is around 25.5"

That pic above looks more like the Post & Duplex than the German #4 ... at least when looking at them on Leupold's Custom Shop webpage under "reticle modification."

Yes, until only because the photo is blurry you cannot see that the transition from thick to thin is completely Square, while the PD is indeed like the duplex, tapered....I have had Heavy Duplex, Post Duplex, Duplex, Fine Duplex, German #1, and this is the scope that came out of the box in the picture, as new from the factory with a factory installed German #4. The book specs are listed above. The Custom shop indeed shows a much wider graphic depiction of what their G4 is, and perhaps it is that wide now, Leupold needs to list specs so people will know as there are a few variations of the #4.

Straight from the 2006 Leupold Catalog,

0.7 thin 6.0 heavy 25.2 thin opening

That's what the one above has....

The MOA specs you cited in your last post vary a different power settings. Perhaps the one you saw at the show was at some power less than 6.

tomk: I'm glad you liked the G1. I like and use the two I've got now, but don't plan on getting any more. I do plan on trying the G4 someday just to satisfy my curiosity.

Youper, My MOA Specs are per FXIII 6x42 on page 71 in the 2006 catalog. This is a fixed 6x with 42 objective.

The scope at the '07 show may just have been a variable with different specs. I do seem to recall it was a 6x 42 obj. and could have been an older show sample - an M8. If you get the 3P#4 in a Burris, it will not be too wide, some Euro scopes are, and I will try contacting Leupold some time in the near future to see if they had changed the specs in the 6x's over time....

The same '06 catalog does show the 'thin' section of:

3-10/ 74.8 and 25.0
1.5-5/ 97.8 and 32.7
3-9/ 66.5 25.2

Thanks Youp.

You are welcome to give my VXII 3-9 G4 a spin if you like. It's riding a 338 and isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Am aiming to spend a bunch of time at camp this year...:)

how thick is the #1? seems like the custom shop pics are a little "cartooned"

Well, FWIW, that looks pretty much like it but methinks the horizontal are a little closer to the center than that...

you can see it...:)

The German pic 4 ain't even close...looks like that's the one they ran out of magic marker on.

The German #1 I have on my Leupold FXII, 4X has heavy sections that cover about 8 inches @ 100 yds. E

The thick is really bold, as I prefer as you will never lose the reticle and it jumps out at you, meanwhile the vertical aiming chisel point comes to a fairly fine point, for more precise aiming.

Its a great reticle IMHO for hunting, save shooting at extreme distances, not my norm.

do you find that a problem? im going to buy a vx II 1-4 but i am up in the air about which reticle i want. i have a few standard duplex modles in the cheap vx I and being and open sights guy im trying to somewheat duplicate my sight picture

No. When I first got it, I had the immediate thought that I should have it changed to a Heavy Duplex.
In time, especially when using it in really bad light, I've discovered it works quite well.
The only "odd" thing about it is I notice I tend to shoot a little high. The center post's fine point is at the top of the horizontal posts, not in the middle of them. In other words, just like using irons, not like using a scope with a conventional reticle. E

Using a #1 is like using a Peep/front sight, you simply 'Paste' your target as your focus is on the chiseled point.

I did some plinking w/a 4x33 G1 scope on my 357 lever and I shot very fast with that set up as your eye gets a fast sight pic.

A heavy duplex would be an option in the 1-4x that likely is not going to be used at long ranges.

im trying to decide between the #4 and the #1.......w/ out shooting one or the other its a dificult choice

I've have several Leupold 3 x 9s that I have had the Heavy German #1 installed on, and they really work well...

not exactly considered a varmint hunting reticle by many, I tried one of them out on a light sporter 223 on a Model 700, as a walking varminter...

what 6.5 BR called the chisel point, I always call the 'steeple', like a church steeple....

however that heavy post with the point at the top makes for very quick target acquisition..... much better than a target dot in a varmint field...trying to line up fast moving small varmints whose fur blends into the dirt quite well...

the other thing I loved is that the upper half of the scope is totally clear with no obstructions...so its effect on being able to spot fast moving little brown ground squirrels,and line up the top of that post or steeple on them is pretty darn easy....

a heavy German # 1 is an often overlooked very useful reticle to have...

after trying it out on the 223, I put one on a 17 HMR..

bet I am one of the few guys in the country with that combo....but it darn sure works for me..

after using it during varmint season....using one for deer hunting, you couldn't ask for a reticle that gives you quicker target acquisition...

thanks for the input

As fast or faster than anything I've used. That includes the Post, the Post and Crosshair, the Tapered Crosshair, the standard, old style crosshair, the Medium and Heavy Duplexes, the German 4a, and the Leupold Post & Duplex.
Not nearly as bad for precision shooting as you'd think. Just perch it on top of the pointed, vertical post and shoot. E

Resurrecting this, as it's all I've found regarding Leupold's German #1. I've found a VX2 1-4, that I'm considering having a #1 installed in, to ride on a custom .357 Max bbl for deer/hogs at <200. Any further insight on the reticle vs HD, #4, and P&D for speed and low light use, would be appreciated. Already have some HDs on other Leupys, and like them just fine.

I did find some absurdity from Chuck Hawks about the German #1, that gave me a chuckle:

....and further resurrection: my 1-4 is getting a #1....would I be crazy to put one on an old m8 6x42, also?

I have a Meopta 6x42 with a Nazi #1 and I like it.

No #1's left. I do have a Zeiss #2, which is pretty close. Close enough.

Over time discovered I wasn't worth a crap at shooting at running deer with a #1. Sitting for low light, they are excellent for me and they certainly show up, but for running deer I ended up shooting high, just like some guy said. After using Leica's pointy #1, did prefer that much over Lupy's round top version.

And fwiw, if a guy wants a crosshair style that will always show up in the evening, the Leupold HD's subtension will provide that.

Finding the perfect reticle was about the same as most other pursuits--slogging through the snow thinking you are getting somewhere and then come across your own tracks...

That Meopta looks to have a pretty decent point on it, eh?

I would prefer a more defined point, but the leupold #4 looks too wide in mos pics.

It does, it just doesn't show up well in that photo.

Meopta #4 in a 6x42

Meopta has done a bang up job. With that narrow center, if it was dark enough to fade the crosshair, it wouldn't matter. Do you know what that center subtends, Scott?

About 8"?

Yeah, that narrow design of a #4 makes a difference. Wish the Leupold was that tight.

I don't know, I just shoot stuff. The pic is looking at leaves about 70 yards away.

Noted...

Zeiss used to offer a reticle #11 --a cure for shooting high with a #1. Since then it seems their scopes have gone the route of the big box