I've read the thread on binocs for sheep hunting and gained some good insights, including the repeated emphasis on a good spotting scope for judging whether a ram is legal at long range. I knew a spotting scope was needed, but it became crystal clear through that thread. That thread led to some questions about spotting scopes for sheep hunting in the mountains. Some of the reponses in the binoc thread cause me to think there might be differences between Alaska sheep hunting and bighorn sheep hunting in the Lower 48 Rockies (e.g., how much contrast there is between the color of the sheep and its environment), so please mention which scenario you are talking about.

1. How much exit pupil does one need in a spotting scope used for bighorn sheep? Is viewing in low light an issue? How does this all affect the magnification that could be used in a variable power eyepiece?

2. How much magnification does one need for bighorn sheep hunting?

3. Is there an advantage to carrying the extra pound (+/-) for a 80mm-class spotting scope instead of a 60-65mm-class scope for judging bighorn sheep at long range? With some brands, the larger scope means the scope has more magnification at the high end. Does the question depend on whether you would have more magnification with the larger scope, or is exit pupil of the scope as much of an issue?

4. Is there an advantage to either the straight or angled spotting scope designs for bighorn sheep hunting in the mountains, or is the preference just a personal preference? Does it vary between Alaska and the Lower 48 Rockies?

RR,

I've hunted both Dalls in AK and Bighorns in CO, so have some experience with both. Without getting into binos, exit pupils, power ranges, etc. I can tell you that in both cases, at least for me, overall weight and size are usually the primary considerations, given that you have good, premium glass like that of the Big Three. However, I will try to answer your questions.

1. I don't know much about exit pupil but for both Dalls and Bighorns, viewing in low light is not usually an issue. Usually, unless you have bad weather, use of the upper power levels is limited due to mirage.
2. In some limited instances, I wished for higher magnification than the 45X in my 65mm scope. However, those were few and far between, so I was never sorry that I opted for the smaller scope that made it easier to pack.
3. As mentioned above, I personnally don't see the advantage of carrying the extra weight and volume to gain extra magnification during a sheep hunts. Yes, there will always be times when you wish you had a little more, but in most instances, you can make do without the higher X.
4. I don't see much of an advantage between either the straight or angled scope designs. Mostly personal preference I believe. If you're keeping watch on rams over a long period of time I can see where an angled scope might make viewing easier on your neck. However, getting the scope on the animal initially is slightly easier with the straight design, IMO. I don't think this varies from AK to lower 48 hunting. Both animals are usually in steep, rocky terrain, so the setups are usually very similar.

Hope this helps.
Test

I still have an old B&L Elite 15-45x60 roof prism. It seems to have been left behind quality wise by the new generation of optics.

One simple thing I have found is that it really helps to use my glasses or contacts when looking through an optic. I have mild astigmatism and it isn't perfectly corrected by focusing the optic. Eye relief has become of real import to me and I am looking a the Leupold Gold Ring in the bent path 60mm version. It might night have the excellence of some of the higher end scoped but it looks really good and is compact as well. I hesitate because I think an angled eye piece might have some uphill advantages.

I think the key is to go to a shop which lets you examine the optics closely over a day or two in different conditions and decide based on your own eye, ergonomics and pocket book.

The Gold Ring HD is the undisputed king of eye relief in the spotter world. It has great glass too, and may well be the toughest one there is. The angled/straight argument is a matter of personal preference.

Except for the USO Field scope...

Never heard of it, much less used one.

I have no expirience hunting Bighorn, so I cannot comment.

I mentioned the 20-60x80 Svaro spotter on the onther thread and just wanted to point out, that I by no means deem this a necessity. Nice to have, but could get by with a top notch 65er as well.

I only use the big one as it is what I have - and I am at a station in life where a pound of glas is still easier to carry around a month sheep hunting than the check for a new, lighter/smaller spotter...

Both of us are eyeing a band of rams in an unlimited bighorn unit here in Montana. Same scopes, different eye pieces. I like fixed power and usually run a 23X. Great field of view and clean from edge to edge. Both scopes are Zeiss Diascope 65T*. I've used mine hard for 8 years and it's never let me down.

The Zeiss Diascope 65 is what I use as well. I have the zoom eye piece, but I can see where a fixed power eye piece would be clearer. However, I still like dialing it up when they are a long ways away.

Scenar you find 23x a good all around sheep power?

I've read some not so flattering comments on the US Optics spotter.

I have only been along on Bighorn hunts so take this for what its worth.

65mm Objective is fine. An 80mm would be nice but I looked at sheep just as often as the guys next to me with their 80mms. We switched scopes a few times just because and I didn't see a problem. Maybe its just me. I dunno.

I like the angled eyepiece for extended glassing because it is easier on my neck. I rarely glass downhill and that is the only advantage I see to a straight eye piece. Also, the lower the tripod is the steadier the scope will be (in theory) so angled wins there too.

Regardless, if you can afford it, buy good glass from the big 3, Meopta or such. My limited experience with the Leupold Gold Ring was very positive too. I wish Steiner made a spotting scope.

Don't know much about the pupil gawk so I won't comment. I can see the advantage to a fixed mid range power, but have always had variables.

Personally, I just upgraded to a Swaro ATM65 20-60. It is awesome and can't wait to get it out on the hill.

It works for 90% of it I would say....I have a 30X eyepiece handy if I think I need a little more. The great thing about the 23X is scanning with the scope....huge field of view. Way larger than a 15X45X set at 23X. Brighter too.

I ran a Zeiss Diascope 65mm 15-45 for two years. Until one day when I ran it against my buddies Swaro 20-60X65mm (Non-HD) scope. Conditions were perfect and allowed him to take advantage of the 60X and we both agreed that the 60X did give more detail under these conditions looking over different game across the valley some up to 5 miles away. There was no wind and no heat mirage.

After that I picked up a Swaro 65mm 20-60 eyepiece w/HD for $1200 from Doug. Figure if there is no weight plenalty why not have the option to jack up to 60Xs for the 5% of the time when condiitons do allow for it. So for me the upgrade was worth it. Especially consideriing I bought the Zeiss Diascope new w/ eye piece for $850 and sold it for $1200. Then picked up the Swaro 65mm HD w/eyepiece for $1200. Basically got paid $350 to get a Swaro HD scope.

Bushnell Elite 15-45x60 is the way for me and i tried in the field some and this is the one my eyes love.

+1.

Equipment for mountain hunting requires compromise because the hunter must balance weight with utility. How much heavy equipment do you want to haul up a sheep mountain?

For most of us, this means that our 10 lb 30/378 with the 56mm scope gets left at home in favor of a 6 or 7 pound rig. And so it is with a spotter. I LOVE my Kowa Prominar 824 with the 82 mm lens. But I've carried it up exactly one sheep mountain. My B&L Elite 15x45x60 is usually in my pack. Most days in the mountains, mirage hurts the high end of the power range, so I've seldom wished for more than 45x. Also, sheep hunting is much more of a daytime endeavor than, say, elk or deer hunting, so you're not very likely to be spooting rams at dusk far away from camp and a warm sleeping bag.

For me, a 6 lb ULA .284 Win and a B&L Elite spotter is my go-to sheep outfit, but if you want to carry twice that weight, then I'm all for you. The best solution would be to get a buddy to carry all your stuff for you. Your gear always weighs less when someone else is carrying it!

It wouldn't be my first choice either, but it does have something like 3 1/2" eye relief...I think essentially its one of their sights sans the adjustment turrets..

True, but it has so much eye relief that its field of view is limited to the degree that I sold mine.
Loved the MOA reticle in the FFP , but really disliked the field of view.
It has more eye relief than is needed for one who wears glasses like me.

BTW I really like the HD Gold ring spotter

I think they are primarily designed for the military market and the long eye relief was to make it compatible with a respirator (gasmask)..

At one time it was one of the few spotters available with the a reticle..Nice bit of kit, but not really aimed at your typical hunter..

I agree completely on what is was designed for.
The MOA reticle in FFP and size is what drew me to it.
If they would use the original design as a starting point to make it suitable for hunters it would make a really nice field scope.

In my experience sheep hunting in not a low light affair... so a 77/80/85mm is not necessary. A 60/65mm spotting scope is lighter and easier to carry. The spotting scopes most I've seen guides use are of the "Alpha" variety with the Leica being the one I see most often. They also like the APO/HD/FL lenses in them. Not for the color correction, but for better definition in low light. I recently purchased a used Leica 62 APO with the 16x-46x variable eyepiece the size and weight are tolerable and the image clarity is wonderful. It's the angled model so looking up hill is a breeze. I carry a medium sized tripod and I use it for my binoculars as well as the spotting scope. You can find a lot more sheep with your binocular mounted on a tripod than by hand holding them. I like using quality 10x or higher binoculars for locating sheep, then use the spotting scope for judging the rams. Most of the time I find my eyepiece set on 30x. Hope this helps! Ovis_Chaser

P.S. The best advice I can give you is to get into the best shape of your life� Sheep hunting involves �getting up the mountain� and is physically and mentally demanding. Unless you work at a job that keeps you in shape, you�re not in �Sheep Shape�� being in shape is more important than any gear you take with you. O_C

JG I think Pete means US Optics. USOPTICS spotter

Listed ER is 3" like a riflescope and sort of like Leupold.


"Except for the USO Field scope..."

U.S. Optics review