ok keep in mind this wasn't a field test. just my thoughts about looking at some and comparing them to what I normally run leica geovid HD's. I spent probably about 30 mins drooling over the swaros.

leica has its work cut out for them. they are more comfortable in the hand. the bumps on the bottom of the barrel I found in no way got in the way of my hands, in fact they may be more comfortable that way because my hands rest right comfortably against them. I also preferred the rubber on the outside of the swaros its a tad softer more texture and as a result you get a better grip on the units.

I like that the diopter adjustments lock into place on the swaro unit. these can get moved on the leicas, especially because there is 2 of them and focusing these RF binoculars is somewhat complicated. I also think the range on release of the bottom is going to make ranging small distant targets easier, because it will make it easier to hold on the target right when you get the range.

the swaros have the inclination feature which will be very very nice using as a bow hunting ranging unit in the moutains I hunt. in fact the best buck I have ever shot at might be on my wall if I had angle compensation on my leicas, I was taking a longer shot and the angle was pretty extreme. I had no idea how much off the adjusted range should have been and thus the arrow sailed right over the bucks back.

the only thing that concerned me was the hinge was a tad looser than I would have liked. not a big deal and very well could be the particular unit I looked at. as to the glass, WOW its very easy to see these are a lot better than leica's HD units. I would have loved to have done a low light test, but I can say that in the store they were noticeably clearer and brighter.

bottom line is I want some. I am very interested to see how actual field use of the rangefinder compares to leica and zeiss. a guy like john burns needs to give us a full report.

Glad to see Swarovski finally in the game. One thing I wish they would've changed is to somehow cover the metal parts with rubber armor rather than paint, as it doesn't take long before EL's start to look rough along the hinges.

Would love to get my mitts on one to give it a workout.

Dont you think ONE is enough at the cost of these unit's ?
btw: where did you find one at Cabela's ?

Been anxiously waiting for some reviews to come out on these. I know of one dealer who got some in already, and is shipping. Probably others as well. Shouldn't be too long and the reviews will start coming out. My main concern is how the rangefinder works. I can't imagine it will suck, but best to be sure.

sportsman's wharehouse in midvale had some 10x42's in stock. the local cabelas didn't have them. I think they have a big hit on their hands with these. I really want some. I just wanna see someone review them that would know the difference. it needs to be someone who has extensively used the leicas and zeiss units. its going to have to be a western hunter. if someone wants to send me some I will do a video of them being used for long range coyote hunting.

when my source gets them in stock, I may trade up, I can get some for about $400 less than the street price. but they haven't got them in yet.

I went and looked through the same one you did today, I have to admit they were better than I thought they would be.
At $2870 I just want "1" not "some".

i've got some time behind the zeiss. i haven't used the others, so i can't compare the glass.

but the RF function on the zeiss was outstanding on soft targets out to 950. that's as far as i was able to find an animal to range, but it was absolutely no problem whatsoever. i had a leica LRF900 to compare with, and there was absolutely no comparison. so much so, that i would never consider NOT buying a combo RF unit. in a good harness, the weight was not an issue for the 6 hours i used them. if you hunt that way, you gotta have good glass, and you gotta have a good rangefinder. no brainer in my opinion.

hard targets to 1200 first push every time, over that it got iffy.

started out at daylight, ended the day with bright sun in my face glassing into deep shadows.

the glass was very good. these were the 8x56 models, and really IMO it's all pretty damn good in that price range. to me it's more about which ones fit you best, which kind of eye cups etc. i didn't care for the zeiss eyepieces and adjustments, but that's just me.

some days it seems like my leicas work great others it seems like no so much. I wanna be able to range a coyote to 1000 yards the first time everytime unless its raining, snowing or fog.

I bought the Leica's when they first came out and sold them when the Zeiss RF's came out. I have the Swaro Range on order. I can't wait to try them. Both the Leica's and the Zeiss are great glass. The rangefinder function may be a little better on the Zeiss but not by much imho. The display can be faint on the Zeiss on a bright day. The Zeiss are obviously a little brighter because they are 10/45 versus 10/42 on the Leica's. The Zeiss are also a little heavier. The Leica ranging button is on the left side and the Zeiss ranging button is on the right side which is favorable to a right handed bowhunter. I am hoping that even though the ranging button on the Swaros is on the left side it is close to the middle of the bino and can be reached with my right hand. They are all great glass imho and you can't go wrong with any of them. It's just splitting hairs. I've used the Leica's and the Zeiss on multiple hunts through out the West, Canada, and Mexico. Sheep, elk, antelope, deer, etc. Hot days, cold days, rainy days, snow, ad infinitum. PS The focus is a little touchier on the Zeiss than the Leica's at least on my pair.

one thing I forget to add about the swaro units, when I was looking at them in the store I noticed no stay light, I think this is called flare, whereas with the leicas I noticed a teeny tiny bit. at certain angles to the lights. so the swaro's should work better if the sun is at the wrong angles.

I have looked at the zeiss quite a bit, for me the eye relief is just a tad short. they are also bigger and more bulky. the swaro unit is about .5" shorter than the geovids, the rest looks about the same size.

Sounds good. I have a pair on order hope they get here soon. Sounds like they are starting to show up at the retailers.

Our first EL Range 10x42 delivery arrived the other day and is now sold out. The EL Range 8x42 delivery came in on Wednesday afternoon and we still have a couple left for those that are looking

This product has me very interested. I want to upgrade both my LRF and my bino's. This could be a home run.

This product is a homerun, but like Albert Pujols is over priced (Waaaaaayyy over priced).
If you can afford to over pay for the best then buy this product, if you cant then other options that will work as well are out there.

if you are a western hunter, using them one time in the field will tell you they are not overpriced. its just a matter of if you can afford them or not. having that range button under your finger is priceless, once you have had it you will not EVER go back.

I am a western hunter (just live 15 miles south of you). They are OVER priced !!!!
I can afford them I own a 10x42EL and a Swaro LG.
I have a range button under my finger............priceless(overly dramatic).
once you have had it you will not EVER go back. Never had black dick as you suggest, will have to take your word for it.

I was playing with some today at work. I'm not sure if something was wrong with them or on the wrong mode maybe? But they would hardly pick up anything. We tried ranging some of the mounts in the store and it wouldn't read them. It would only give us a reading on super reflective objects. And when it did give a reading it was slow to do so. I imagine something probably was wrong with that pair because I'm sure swarovski wouldn't put out a product that was sub par.

If you were using it less than 30m (33 yards) the EL Range don't mesure the distance. Hunted with them for more than a month and ranged game to more than 700m close to 800m (around 880yards).
Dom

I don't know where you take the idea Swarovski used paint on EL Range?

What is that along the hinge and around the button, kryptonite? In fact, that pair in your picture already shows wear on the opposite side of the button, so thanks for reinforcing my point.

That's no wear Dear Sir but salt from the mountain where we hunted (old salt mines all around) no paint but metal treatment tough enough even for hard work, . These scope were abused and stand it. I'm no Swaro employee nor paid by them but i think they know a bit how to make a product of that price.

Dom

Yeah, they're somehow magically different than previous EL's. Purely cosmetic, but it won't take long and they'll have that look all along the hinge.

Edited to add, how about wiping the salt off and snapping another picture?

So why you want to have one to play around as you write above?
There other brand that are "plastic" coated, you will have no problem with. I have no problem with my EL even around the hinge and i'm hunting very often with, all terrains all seasons.
Wish you good choice, good hunt and a Merry Christmas.

Dom

All I said is that is one area Swarovski could improve on. Purely cosmetic, but who wants their $2k+ bino to look hell after a short while?

Again, how about another picture with the salt cleaned off?

Got this one, a bit far but... Show me your EL with paint scratched around the hinge. Call Swaro USA to see what they can do for you. Generally their custom service is rather good worldwide... Note that plastic cover also can be scratched and even destroyed when one don't care enough, not to speak of lenses! I already pointed some of their good and bad points but that's only my point of view not absolute truth for other people.They will soon be tested by US gunwriters so you'll get more infos.
I'll stop here to argue with you, buy one, find one to test (ask Cameraland),i'm not here to advertise Swaro or other makers nor to push them. I say just what it was and how it is, no more.



Other one under rain an sleet so not too"clean"

Take a CURRENT picture with the salt wiped off. Is that really too much to ask? Slap it on your desk with this thread in the background. Should be interesting.

And I don't currently own a Swarovski EL, but have had enough of them in my hands over the years to know the durability of the paint along the hinge is their weak point.

The binos tested were send back to Swarovski France last week after six weeks of use and abuse, can't take pictures today. I told you Sir i don't argue with you any more. Ain't nothing to proof or justify, just said truth (not obliged to believe in), but will return you the problem: post your pictures, then i could see what i can do for you. May be i could even call to Absam see if they can help. Nothing more to add. Have a good day.

goodness sakes all GW pointed out was the hinge area is prone to being scratched. if you have followed GW over the years you will know he has owned just about everything in the optics business at one time or another. sometimes I wonder if he is an optics dealer, LOL.

I never thought about the hinge area scratching, but could easily see how it could be. the only people that has really written anything about these units was a guy in new zealand and this guy in france. I wonder why in the world no one from the US go their hands on these first, because that is where most of them will be sold anyways. as to the comment about not ranging in the store. they ranged just fine in the store for me. if you are used to the leica push to range, range on release seems faster.

Much experience beyond 1000 yds with them?

I fondled a pair of these yesterday at the same Sportsman's Warehouse Cummins did.

I was underwhelmed.

A few things stood out to me. The knobs on the bottom of the bino were bigger than I had expected them to be. One of the things I love about my 2 pair of ELs is how ergonomic they are. They just feel right. The EL range is quite a bit more bulky. It may be something I could get used to, but I didn't like the feel of them.

Ranging - 2 things. Like we've talked about before, the button on the wrong side is a killer. When I've got a bow in my left hand I want to quickly and accurately range something with my right hand. I learned to do this with my geovids, but it was never comfortable. The same can be said for these. It requires a regrip and an extra long reach to hit the button.

Also, why in the world did Swaro let these come out with the minimum range so high? I tried ranging a bunch of stuff in the store and most of it wouldn't register because of the closer distance. It's true that most of the time if something is under 30 yards I wouldn't need the rangefinder anyway, but I might. I also shoot archery tournaments where every yard is very important. Handicapping the EL range that way sucks.

Optics were great, as far as I could tell. Store conditions aren't good for testing that. The focus system on each barrel was interesting. It would take some getting used to.

I was anxiously awaiting swaro's rangefinding bino, and I was sure I was going to buy it. I don't think that's the case now, unless they come way down in price. I'm still looking for the perfect rf bino.

If you were underwhelmed after you checked these out, and you are looking for something cheaper..........you might be pushing daisies before you find it.

If you want to range a coyote at 1000 yds in the grass, this is what you want.





Vectronix Terrapin. They will range reflective objects to 3km +, soft targets to half that.

They are just under $2 grand.

Or a G7 BR2. Just got it yesterday and have not played with it a lot but it did range a barn at 2025 yards today. I was impressed to say the least. I know that's a big Target BUT my Leica Geovids wouldn't even come close to doing that. I think the G7 is going to be a hit. Especially with the ballistic software. It calculates all variables and tells you the line of sight range and the a calculated shoot to range. It's really impressive so far.

I am really hoping the el range's rangefinder packs a serious punch. if anyone wants to let me try some on monday I will write up a detailed report, LOL. there isn't a whole lot more challenging than ranging coyotes at and beyond 1000 yards and monday I should be doing lots of it.

Nice but they put the rangefinder button on the wrong side for a RH bowhunter..

For just a little more money, you get a Swiss built rangefinder that can range reflective targets to more than 4000 meters according to several who have been testing them. You can range about anything to 2000 meters. I promise that the G7 can't do this.

No your right. I'm not going to argue with that, but in all honesty do you really need to range that far? And dose it have the onboard ballistic calculator? This is a real plus if you shoot long range and hunt at different elevations and tempatures. It sure beats punching the numbers into a ballistic calculator. Saves a lot of valuable time that you sometimes don't have. It will shoot your range out in a MOA reading or a BDC reading so just dial to the corrected amount and pull the trigger. NO OTHER RANGEFINDER CAN EVEN COME CLOSE TO THIS FEATURE.

No rangefinder has all the data you need. It would have to be an altimeter, thermometer, inclinometer, compass and store data for all the bullet/velocity combinations you might need. It might be a great shortcut, that much I will give you.

I like the idea of being able to range 3kms to plan for long shots on located game. It blows to hike all the way to a vantage point only to discover that you are too far to make the shot and now have wasted the day getting there. It is also the reason we used powerful magnums instead of a 308 for all this long range hunting stuff; we want to mitigate any problems that crop up- winds, moving targets, uncertain ranges due to environmental issues.

Just my thoughts on it having run up against all of these concerns.

But the G7 dose have angle compensation,a thermometer, a altimiter, can read barimetric pressure, and can store up to 5 ballistic profiles. You put all the data in yourself. That is every thing you said except a compass. Like I said I'm not here to argue with you. It's as close to perfect for long range shhoters that is out right now. Do some research on it. Len Bacus did a review over on long range hunting forums. Read his review and dosome research on it. Even call and talk to Aaron and or Mike at G7/Gunwerks. It is quite impresive. Like I said I'm not arguing with you but it is a great unit. Pm me if you wish or call me. 765 969 7479

send me one to test. I will test it in the high deserts of wyoming and nevada on coyotes in fields and on stand at all manner of ranges. if its great or not I will know in a couple days of testing. It will need to out range my leica geovids for me to be impressed. if I could pull a range on an animal the first time everytime out to 1000 yards I would be pretty happy.

I will put a hundred dollar bill that the G7 will out do the leica geovids every time. I owned the HD geovids and they wernt reliable in all weather conditions. If it was foggy or misting rain or raining they would not range. So far i have not had these issues with the G7. I would give Aaron and Mike a call and I bet they would let you try one out. Only complaint with mine is it is a tad slow ranging but not overly slow. FWIW I have no affiliations with Gunwerks/G7. I have bought and paid for all of my stuff from them. They have the best customer service I have delt with.

After watching their show a couple times, I'm afraid I couldn't have a phone conversation with either of the Davidsons for fear I'd tell them just how big of idiots they are. IMO, they're first rate douchebags!

GW, I haven't seen the show, but do understand how people can disagree with their methods of hunting. but here is the deal as I see it. in this industry if you look at where the money is going and where the real product development is going in the firearms and shooting industry its all going to the tactical market and geared toward 20 something year olds.

these guys are at least trying to give us better more capable hunting products. they are one of the very few doing it and I have to commend them if nothing else then for that. look at leupold and bushnell, they develop or sorts of new products for the tactical market, like the 34 and 35mm tubed scopes, IMO not needed even for the tactical people. But what products are specific to long range hunting??? None by those companies. we have to cobble together a system that works for us rather than having it all in one. graybull is another outfit offering us specific products. notice how leupold was not the one that came up with the reticle graybull uses. Their focus is tactical, its just a bigger market. my point is don't hate on those trying to help us

They'd still be douchebags even if they never had a thing to do with the "long range shooting" industry.

The BR2 does have most of the needed features. It is a little bit limited by the 5 profiles that you are able to put in. I would have to see just how flexible it was to field programming.

Looks like it might work pretty well for 95% of us. I would like to see some real world reviews from people that don't have their heads up Aaron Davidson's a$$.

Until then, I am going to keep an open mind but don't count on me drinking any koolaid anytime soon.

GreatWapiti that's pretty harsh considering you have never talked to either one of them. Give them a call and talk to them I bet you will change your mind. Have you ever talked to Jim Shockey? Now he is a arrogant d bag. Aaron and Mike are very professional and will talk to you as long as you have questions. They will answer emails in the same day and sometimes within minutes of sending. Not many douchbags I know will be that professional. They have brought a lot of great things to the table for long range enthusiast and aren't affraid to try new and better things. Their guns might be overpriced but they will flat out shoot tiny groups hot or cold dirty or clean bore. They are the most consistant guns I have ever shot. The first 800 yard group I have ever shot period with my Gunwerks was 7 inches. Sometimes you just can't judge a book by its cover. A lot of people don't like what they are doing marketing long range to everybody and I agree but people should practice and know their limitations. There are a lot and I mean a lot of so called hunters that have no business shooting 100 yards and I think we both will agree on that. Some people like coke some like Pepsi is either one right. It's all about personal prefence.

Dennis that's all I'm asking is for people to keep a open mind and just give them a chance to try it. I would send you mine but I've only played with it for a week. But I am impressed. Give me a few more weeks to play with it and ill send it to you to try out and post a review. I am limited with it use here in Indiana. Give me a call or PM me. I am not blowing smoke.

hi joelbiltz,

Your not comparing apple to apple, Zeiss, Swaro, Leica and even Bushnell Fusion are not range finder but binos combined with range finder; that's not the same story. If Leica or Zeiss want to make such thing they can. Have you ever look through a Leica Vector...If you know military or police "pro long range guys" ask them lot of them use such rig. The combo binos are first binos to observe then RF. The G7 is pure RF and don't tell me it's as good as the other to observe....and that is even close when light is dim.

Merry Christmas.
Dom

I never once said it was better for observing or using them as a bino which they are not. I simply stated that as a rangefinder it is about as good of a unit there is for long range shooters. I will still be getting a Swaro EL range but the G7 Br2 dose a lot of things that any other rangefinder can not do. I was not comparing rangefinding Binos to the BR2. Thanks.

Did anyone get the new Swarovski for Christmas?

DAMN!!!! That's a killer for me, as I need these to work for archery as well. Of all the reading I've done on these, can't believe I failed to see that their minimum range is 30yds. Just won't work.

I don't see that as a show stopper for archery. my top pin is 25 yards. shoot a faster bow if 30 yards is too much distance for your top pin.

I'm sure your right and it'd work out OK, but I'm not comfortable with not knowing the ranges I'm shooting at. Most of my shots are under 30yds as well, so it makes no sense to have my top pin at 30. And I certainly won't buy a 2 cam bow to accommodate a rangefinder that was designed piss poorly.

I did - WOW WOW! they are awesome. truley great in every way. just sold my pair of Geovid HD's and dont miss them a bit

I would like a pair too. Of course I need a NULA MODEL 28 IN 300 win with a Swaro Z6i 2.5-15X44 BT- 4A-I too.

Wow.... That worried about if you can range under 30 yards, I to shoot archery shoots that you can use range finders and they have never had more than one target under 30 yard, and also most single cam bows today have enough FPS to obtain one pin from 0-30 easily and if you can't judge a target distance from 0-30 then you obviously don't go anywhere without a range finder strapped to your hand and you should practice ALOT without one I mean ALOT. and if the selling point on a range finder for you is if it will range less than 30 yards then you should get a 500 dollar range finder so you can range that crucial 22 yard shot that in all actuality you should be able to make any day of the week under any circumstances wih a single pin, as far as the new sworo EL range bino's I bought a set and they are incredible and I have ranged targets from that.... Crucial must have a range finder or else What will I ever do cause I don't practice enough range of 30 yards all the way out to 1700 yards .. Yes I said 1700 yards, 1702 to be exact and they are very fast and accurate and I would tell anybody that wants a bino/rangefinder combo to check these out they far surpass the Leica and zeiss by a land slide and there glass is the best in the business.

I presently use Swaro 10x42 EL binos and a Leica CLR1200 rangefinder for bowhunting, shooting a 283 fps Hoyt Carbon Element. I'd buy the Swaro combo bino-rangefinder if it ranged down to 20 yds. A 33 yd minimum is a deal breaker for me. I like to know how far out 20 yds and 30 yds is when sitting a tree stand waiting on a grizzly, whitetail, etc. I spot and stalked a nice black bear last fall, shooting him at 29 yards. It was great to know the yardage exactly, not having to deal with a "no-reading" result under the pressure of the hunt. Sometimes my system has too much adrenalin to deal with stuff that isn't simple when the moment of truth arrives.

Should've put some of that money toward getting your GED..

Friggin' Jeez!

Any additional experience with these out there?