I just ordered a Remington 700 SPS Varmint Rifle in 308 Win. (it has the 26" heavy barrel). Now I have to decide which scope I want to get for it. I really like Leupold Scopes. I had an issue with one of their scopes years ago and they went out of their way to fix it for me and then air shipped back on a Saturday so I would have it for the following Mondays opening day for deer season. That really meant a lot to me so I'm a very dedicated Leupold customer so I'm going to stick with a Leupold Scopes and Mounts.

The rifle is going to be mostly a target rifle that I'll add things to it as I go. Like a Timney Trigger, maybe a better stock, a bi pod and things like that. My budget for a new scope will be $500 to $550 not including the mounting system. I want a good high power scope.

I/we currently have five Leupolds, a VX-I 2-7x28mm Rimfire on our S&W MP15-22, a VX-II 2-7x33mm on my Rem. 7600 Carbine 30-06, a VX-1 2-7x33mm that I switch back and forth with QD mounts between that and my Aimpoint PRO on my Colt AR15 Carbine 223/5.56 (MT6400) this setup works awesome, a VX-1 3x9x40mm "lady's edition" on my wife's Rem. 700 Compact 243 Win. and a VX-II 4-12x40mm adj. opt. on my Remington 700 BDL 223 Rem. It's a tact driver and I really like that scope.

So I'm looking for a scope similar to my VX-II 4-12x40mm adj. opt. for my 308. However I'm not sure if I really need a scope with an adjustable optic. What do you guys think, I don't know the pro's and con's between having a 40mm or 50mm objective? I'm thinking maybe I should get something like a VX-2 series 4-12x40mm or 4-12x50mm, or a VX-3 4.5-14x40 for my 308 Win. Or maybe get a VX-2 6-18x40mm and put that on my Rem. 700 223 Rem. (I shoot A LOT SMALLER THINGS with my 223 then I will with my 308) then put my VX-II 4-12x40 adj. opt. from my 223 on my Rem. 700 308 Win. I've also been considering the fixed power FX-3 12x40mm adj. opt. for my 308.

Will the Mark AR Mod 1 4-12x40mm or 6-18x40mm Scopes work on a 308 Win.? I like the tactical look and the idea of being able to use adjustment nobs for elevation adjustments. However, the marking on the scope/caps are for 223/5.56. Can I get them for a 308?

How do "fine reticles" work on larger caliber rifles for long range shooting? I really like the "LR duplex" reticles but I might be limited to the "fine duplex" reticles on most of the scopes I'm looking at. What about the Custom Dial System (CDS), is that worth getting? How does it work?

Thanks for reading my short story, and I appreciate all the help and input I can get, NYH1.

How about this:
http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/9402

Or this:

http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/9403

3.5-10x with an M1 elevation turret would be hard to beat.

If you want "high power" then you want a parallax adjustment, be it side or objective.

Not a fan of the Leupold 6-18x40.

The 4.5-14x40 doesn't really turn my crank either.

I like my VX-II 4-12x40AO, but it has a lot of eye relief even by my standards. If you use that scope, make sure the mounts you choose will allow you to get it forward far enough.

When you say Leupold mounts, which ones do you mean? There are many styles of those, some being less than ideal.

As 1" tubes grow in their length,their zero retention wanes. 3.5-10x or bust there.

I'd go DD 30mm 10x MQ FF and rock it on the sly...............

I have a. VX2 in 6-18x40 and it's a good scope, but prefer the 4.5-14 scopes that I have - both of which have the VH reticle. I've used a Leupold 4.5-14 for a very long time, and think that's just about the perfect magnification range for hunting, along with 4-16.

If you really want to get precise, I'm a huge fan of the 6.5-20 LR scope with the TMR reticle (SFP). Great varmint scope.

If the 4.5-14 was an "easy" scope like the 3.5-10, then I'd have more of them. But it isn't, so I don't.

I skip past it to the 6.5-20x40LR.

I suppose that it's reasonable that folks would want a scope with magnification range that fits their needs. I like about 4 power on the low end for when I'm in the woods, and I like the 14 on the edge of the hay field. As much as I like the 6.5-20x50 with the TMR reticle, the 6.5 is (to me) a bit much for the woods.

A 5-25 or a 5-20 would also suit me just fine, though I just don't need another scope.

The "demands" of your "needs" and "use"...wouldn't knock the new off of a used pair of boots.

The 6-18x is the most wandering POS Leupold has yet to offer.

Hint..................

I've got or shot every glass you cite.

In 1" the 6x42 and 3.5-10x are KING.

In 30mm the MK4 3.5-10x(M1) and MK4 M1 10x are KING. The MK4 6x would be in the thick,were it wearing M1' in a like rotation.

You want M1,M1,M1...roughly in that order and flush the CDS notion with the rest of the turds.

Hint..................

If the OP is a Hunter, then he would only (normally) be shooting out to about 400. With a 308 he doesn't need BDC or CDS. But, if he was shooting out to 1000, his optics needs are way different, and the scope will likely need turrets.

That said, I really have become fond of the Leupold Varmint Hunter reticle, being a hunter with shots that won't exceed 500 yards. And to say it again, I really like that TMR reticle that Leupold offers. I had it put in my 6.5-20x50 LR.

CDS is just a dial version of BDC, but better. Not at all a bad choice for a Hunter.

The OP can get a great Leupold scope for less than $1k, and it will be all a hunter needs.

I forgot to mention that there are ballistic apps that, if you know MV and bullet BC, you can determine exactly what distances the BDC are good for. I like iStrelok for the iPad.

You are beyond CLUELESS!

CDS and BDC's are "good" for nothing. I'm all ears in regards to the TMR and substension and I can't wait for you to start "telling" me more.

Laughing.

Here I was under the suspicion,that an M1 eagerly accomodated all bullets,at all speeds and in all atmospheres,to the end of the erector's travel? My bad.

WOW................

I really HOPE this is not going to be an awkward silence!..............

A small number of people defend you and speak highly of you. They must see something I don't.

The OP asked for scope info and I offered my opinion. You offered nothing beyond insults, which seems consistent with your normal approach. I don 't understand why you do what you do, but I really don't care.

I have a SWFA SS 12X MIl/MIL scope on my SPS .308 varmint rifle,good glass and turrets .

You "offered" Drooling Dumbfhuqqery via your "knowledge","experience" and "results".

Trouble is,you are lacking enough brains,to be aware of how [bleep] stupid you are...which in fairness,is a right proper Dichotomy and of perpetually hilarious oblivious dumbfhuqqery.

Looking forward to you sharing more of your keen "insight" and PLEASE do not keep those pearls to yourself.

Laughing!.................

I prefer the 10X,if only because I have both...but that glass is farrrrrrrrr and away the most for the least.

Easy to arrange 100MOA/30Mils + on the erector,after a 200yd zero...................

I don't flog nearly as hard as stick and some of these fellas, but the super chickens are a pretty damn good way to go. Don't really see how you can go wrong for the price.

I only have two so far, both 16x.. One on a .22 and the other on the .223 5R here.
The .308 5R will soon be getting upgraded mounts and prolly 12xFF. That's not to say I don't like the leopold, cause I do, but these rifles set up same same I think is gonna be a hoot..

10 Mils on the windshield and another 30 or so on the erector,will do nice things.

Or so I hear...............

10 mils on the bug splattered Superchicken windshield I can honestly live without as the erector has enough to keep me giddy. If SWFA offered the Superchicken sans bugs, I'd have more than a few. I'll concede that the bug splats assist immensely with the wind voodoo...

So, having said all that, there's going to be a couple more MRAD chickens ordered as I have another .22lr and a .223 to set up.

Did you beat on a 16X yet?

And why the 10 over the 12?

1000yd Ball windage holdoff...dope dialed.

10x MQ FF.............

And I've been told...(grin)

Not to hijack but just found the .223 pictured will stabilize 73 gr Bergers and shot them pretty well at 100 anyway.. So lookin to try some zip code fun with that one.

I hear good things about the SS FF in that application, to tie back into the op..

I suffer numerous 16x's but am doing my best to not suffer another. Have 'em in M8 1",MK4 M1 and T's.

As magnification goes up,friendliness goes down(eye-relief,eyebox,ease of acquisition,light gathering,erector travel,yada,yada.).

The 10X is light years better than the 12X,regarding a forgiving nature...............

For the loot,the 75Hornie HPBT is alotta performance for the jingle.

Up to and including 22-250AI speeds(3500fps)..................

Hilarity nudge..................

603,

There's more to it than magnification. A 6x Leupo has nearly the same FOV as the 4.5-14x. And its easier to get behind without the tunnel vision.

I agree with Mathman and others... the 4.5-14x ain't my cup of tea. And the 4-12x has a shhit ton of eye relief. Had a 30mm 6.5-20x but sold it before it got broken-in.

Hay field?

J

Not your average hay field.

A big one.

Laughing!...............

4th, you have a good point about the 6 power. I used a Leupold 6 for a number of years, and it'll allow plenty of long range shooting. The reasons for my 4.5-14 suggestion are mostly based on the fact that it's a VX3 and not a VX2, and I like the VH reticle, which I don't think is available in the VX2. The VX3 is just a bit better grade of scope. If he has the money, go for the higher quality.

6x is not enough for distant pursuits and too much up close.

The VH reticle RULES.

Laughing!...............

You seem to enjoy being a Dickhead
I'm not sure why so many others like it
|
Maybe they are dickheads too

I'll feign my "surprise",that yet another Clueless Phuqqing Window Licker was powerless in her refrain,to keep from Whining.

Congratulations?!?..................

I was laughing so hard at your Whining ass,that I forgot to grant you the glorious opportunity,to say something "Snipery".

Dare ya'.

Laughing!.................

603,

If its not clear, you've been given rope to hang yourself with. The bail is wide open, sans drag, for you to run.

You offered CDS, TMR, and references to BDC. Stick challenged that view with the M1. Insulted or not, I think you've glossed over the discussion... TMR or CDS vs M1.

Look at it this way... its REAL easy to give advice for shooting over hay or corn fields. But when someone challenges your view it looks silly to say you were "insulted" and run to the corner.

I'd like to hear you sell the CDS or TMR, and how it relates to an M1.

Jason

Sir,

You are MEAN,to try and entrap the handicapped in such a fashion!








But I like how you roll.

Laughing!.................

If I thought for a second that the two of you honestly had a question, I'd spend some time on an answer. The OP has all the info he needs to make an informed choice.

Maybe I can get some help here too although the application is a bit different. I need something for an M700. Shots close......usually between 50-200 yards. Needs to be more rugged than sophisticated. I'm not smart enough to turn all those dials and the rifle usually gets dropped more than once and stays wet for 7 days. Any advice on bullet proof mounts also appreciated.

Get a Leupold 6X42 and some Talley LW's.



Travis

Leupold DD bases/Burris Signature rings. That will grant mechanically centering windage and reap max erector latitude.

Crosshairs that don't coincide a bullet's impact...ain't much to swoon.

I have have heard good things about the 6x42 myself,especially when wearing M1 ele...................(hint)

stick, why the 42 over the 36 ? I'm really liking the FXII 6x36 with M1s as I can get them really low with DD rings - so much so that I'm converting all to such over time. At my skill level I've got no business shooting at game over 700yds so distance/magnification isn't really a factor.

The 36 is a POS in compare. It takes hits in all optical facets,that bear fruit and I honestly don't know a single soul who can stomach one...though there's literally 100's of 6x42's in circulation with pards.

Distance is a function of knowing same and correlating POA/POI intersections,which mechanically are limited by:

1) erector travel latitude
2) reticle subtension latitude
3) their melding in conjunction

This of course removing atmospheric wind from the equation,which is VooDoo more so than Physics and moot as per erector discussions.

I OFTEN hear "I'm never going to shoot that far!",prior to taking someone out for some hands on for the first time. It's a lovely Theorum,that holds water...until the first shot.(grin)

To connect those dots,prior to doing same,I always offer the constant of whatever distance you can break a clean shot on crosshair intersection,that's what you can do with POA/POI correlation. Typically it isn't a function of "too much" distance,rather a function of the Operator's abilities,in conjunction with their knack for finding and using a field rest. I'll ALWAYS ask "can you hold it?",prior to a round being chambered and if so,bet your ass that is where it will go. So it's "send it".

The 6x42 has no equal in eye-relief,ease of acquisition,exceedingly generous eye box,brightness and erector travel to weight ratios. None.

Very easy to eek 50MOA of erector latitude out of one,the other side of a 200-ish yd zero and slap schit in other zipcodes silly.

Looking at your dope,there's no way I'd zero a 280AI at 150yds for ANY reason. The 160X is a bitter pill,even though noone LOVES X's more than I. The whole point is to maximize the platform,so as to yield the most potential as a default setting,which is of course it's zero. That is factored by numerous things,including application,velocity and BC.

In summation,I am happy to launch 162's out of a 7-08 at 2700fps and a 225yd zero...well past the 1000yd line via the 6x42.

Flip side being,you couldn't run fast enough to catch me,in order to GIVE me a 6x36 for free.................(hint)

thanks for writing all that up. I'll be working on my son's 7-08 in the offseason and will keep it in mind (it's already in service this season - in fact he killed his first deer with it Saturday last).

I'll inquire about the TSX elsewhere ---> elsewhere

For the OP:

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...upold_3_5_10x40_VX_III_w_TMR#Post9128058

Available immediately. If you're going variable it's the choice. I could do without the TMR or M1 on the side, but can live with it.

...or you could just get a 6x42 with M1 and be just fine for less $ and a new scope...not that used bothers me.

...or you could go 6 or 10x42 SS. I've only played with the 6x but have more than a little trust in what others claim for the 10x.

For the poster wanting simple and rugged with nothing that turns: 6x42 - go ahead and get the LRD, it shines in a fixed power (even if you think you won't use it). Go DNZ on the rings, simple and strong.

He seems good at trapping himself?!

If anyone questions what I write, I'm going to tell Ric that I was insulted. May even request that he/she be banned. That will be at my discretion. But in no way will I defend what I write.

On a serious note... I've spooled too heavy, yeah? Need to work on that.

More serious... what's worse... 1.) feelers hurt or 2.) hit-n-run advice? Only one person gets their feelers hurt (if they let that happen) with #1, or the dozens or hundreds that get affected by bad information in #2?

Hmm... this is a tough one...

And don't question my questions or I'll go to Ric.

Them that "do" the least,Whine the most.

Take it to the bank.................

This was my first thought....

Stick is spot on.

I can't see how anyone can favorably compare the 6x36 to the 6x42. The 6x36 is pretty unimpressive. They are not in the same league, nor close. I have been saying as much for some time now. Of course, others opinions seem to differ. Everyone has a right to their opinion here, even if it IS wrong......

Its a constant, isn't it?

Slow on the uptake on my part.

J

I like the Leupold Dual Dovetail bases and rings.

NYH1.

What is it about the VX-2 6-18x40mm scope you don't like?

NYH1.

It doesn't hold zero....

Probably because they don't hold zero...... To start with.

Dual dovetails are pretty solid.

A little bit off topic, but I have heard people banging on the 4.5-14x Leupys... does this apply to both the 30mm and 1" tube versions?

Yes, but more so for the 1" version.

All versions suck ass................

I went to our semi annual gun show this afternoon and bought a used Leupold VARI-X III 4.5-14x50mm Long Range Tactical Scope with a 30mm tube, side focus and target turrets. It's in great shape.

NYH1.

Would a 15, 20 or 30 MOA offset rail/mount be worth going with now instead of the Leupold Dual Dovetail mounts and rings? I'm going to be shooting from 100 to 500 yards for now. I guess I could always go with the Dual Dovetail mounts and rings for now. Then if or when the time comes when I need to go with a 15, 20 or 30 MOA offset rail/mount on my 308, I could always put the Dual Dovetail mounts and rings on one of my other model 700's that have the standard Leupold mount and rings.

Thanks, NYH1.

I ended up going with the Leupold Dual Dovetail Base and Rings. For the price.

So this is what I have altogether so far. Remington 700 SPS Varmint 308 Win. 26" 1/12" twist barrel, Leupold VARI-X III 4.5-14x50mm Long Range Tactical 30mm, side focus, target turrets w/ 4" sun shade tube. Leupold Dual Dovetail Base and High Rings. Timny 510 trigger.

I'm not going to be able to buy a good stock anytime soon so I'm might get a pillar bedding kit and install it in my current stock.

NYH1.

Forgot to mention, I'm going to send my scope to Leupold this winter to have the turrets changed to M1 turrets and maybe have the reticles too.

NYH1.

I've still a fixed scope fan, but after putting a 4-12 with a bdc turret on it and dialing a perfect 300 yard shot last year I would say a 4-16x40 something with a BDC turret would be great if you are shooting beyond 400 yards.