w/gas check be suitable for a 30-30 or will it still be too soft? I have plenty of pure lead and wheel weights. What lead/ww ratio would be good?

Pure lead would be way to soft for a 30.30.
I think the better question is what kind of a wheel weight, lino mix would be about right.

+1

Just use straight WW alloy and air cool them if you want a little expansion that should give you a BHN or around 11 or 12. If you water quench them it will give you a bullet around 15 to 18 BHN. If you want a softer bullet than 11 to 12 mix 3 parts PB to 1 part WW should give you a BHN of around 9.5

Adding pure lead (PB) to WW alloy even at a 50/50 ration is only going to bring the BHN down a couple points so the PB is better used for BP bullets or adding a little tin or WW's to makes some good expanding HP bullets.

The Meplat on the Lee GC 170 gr. 30-30 bullet probably has the smallest FN area compared to some other bullets but it will kill just as well if you put the bullet in the right place expanding or not. It scores about a 105 on Varel Smiths DV scales which should put about a 1" hole through a deer if you shoot it around 1700 to 1900 fps.

Thanks for all the answers. I've never shot cast bullets in a rifle but have shot thousands in handguns but those were nearly 40 years ago.

I've noticed that Powder Valley is almost out of all brass and I expect bullets to be hard to get in the months to come hence my switch to cast bullets. (Sorry, but I just can't make myself type/say 'boolits' any more than I can say 'bagas', maters' and 'chokes for rutabagas, tomatoes and artichokes). It's just one of my many 'peculiarities.

mix 50/50 WW's and pure lead and then when you cast them drop them into a bucket of water out of the mould. You will have the perfect hunting bullet.

Thanks, Blammer. I'll try that.

Don't worry about the "boolit" thing Mickey. I can't do it either.

Alan

(Sorry, but I just can't make myself type/say 'boolits' any more than I can say 'bagas', maters' and 'chokes for rutabagas, tomatoes and artichokes). It's just one of my many 'peculiarities."

Ditto Micky. And I can't call a powder measure a powder 'drop' or 'dump', a rifle a 'stick', a bullet a 'pro-jo', a removable magazine a "clip", a meplat a 'point' or a fat gal 'cute'. Us old guys care about the language more than that!

AMEN! I can't call a barrel "the tube" or a blackpowder rifle a "smoke pole". I'm glad to know that I'm not alone in this 'wilderness'.

I had this crazy idea once of taking linotype cast bullets and cutting them in half, putting the bottom half back in the mold and topping it off with pure lead, sizing and adding a gas check to make the IDEAL cast hunting bullet.... I never did it.

Alan

Straight wheel weights +1% tin air cooled sized .001 over bore and Lyman lube will work great of course including gas check.

I cast my .30 hunting bullets out of straight WW's with a pinch of tin to give me better mold fill out. I have found that the resulting 10-12 bhn gives good expansion at .30/30 velocities without leading. Then again, my go-to hunting bullet has a very wide meplat.

For a while I used a ratio of 50/50 WW/pure lead, for a bhn of around 9. They splattered a bit better, but leading commenced after a few shots in the .303 Savage at 'full power' and I didn't want to contend with that so I compromised.

This is what I do for my pistols. I do add a bit of 95-5 solder for the tin. WW are getting hard to come by.

Running a 170 at 1,900fps, with a gas check, what percent tin would you run if you wanted to rule out leading. Jeff

Very little. It is more useful as a means of getting good mold fill out with WW material without having to run the pot crazy hot. A percentage point or two of tin won't increase WW hardness appreciably.

I think you'll find that bullet size and shape, powder used, and bore condition will have more to do with leading at that velocity with WW material- but it is getting close to the upper limit in velocity w/o leading with WW's, IMO. Another couple hundred fps and one is well advised to switch to a harder alloy.

I'm not against mixing in another alloy or lowering velocity. The most important thing to me is not messing up my grandads Winchester. I'm looking for a mix a little on the hard side "to avoid leading" that will still be a hunting bullet. WW's are what I have and if the thing to do is mix them 50/50 with something else, that's fine. If I should lower my velocity 200 fps that would be fine to, as long as I could still lay a buck down at a 100 plus yards. I'm simply out of my range of experience. Any suggestions from you gents would be much appreciated. Coleman I apoligize for highjackin yer post. Jeff

Jeff, don't give it another thought. I learn stuff by other people asking questions and I have a lot to learn about casting bullets.

That 170gr. bullet at 1900 fps is just fine for deer, as long as you don't try to shoot into the next county with it.

Remember, the softest you can get away with is best, even if you give up a tiny bit of accuracy. Good expansion with 2 MOA accuracy with a soft bullet is better than 1 MOA accuracy with a hard one that won't expand much if any..

You won't mess up your heirloom Winchester- provided you attain that velocity with the correct powder. 3031, 4895, etc. vs. Bullseye for example. Loaded intelligently it'll be a bit less than standard factory pressures.

Here's a little anecdotal tidbit. The thumbnail test for hardness is fine when starting out. It'll tell you if the alloy is soft enough for deer hunting. WW alloys will tend to age harden after they're cast. Not a whole lot, but some. I like to cast my hunting bullets during the week before the season to be assured they won't be as hard as the ones I cast a year before.

It sounds like you've hunted cast bullets for a while. How slow could I push the 170 and still be deer hunting. Do you have any cast load combinations that are tried and true in the field.I plan on using h-335 and the Lee 170 but it's all up in the air. I have a bit of theory but lack in puddin - if you no what I mean. Thanks Jeff

Your ability to shoot, and to hunt, will determine how low you can go. If you have nerves of steel and can let that trophy buck get really close, and can thread that bullet exactly where it needs to go while the adrenaline is pumping in your veins, then you can go a heckuva lot slower. Personally, I would stay at the 1900fps level- it just plain works.

I haven't messed with H-335, so I can't comment on it. If Hodgdon recommends it for loads at that power level, I would try it and find out. I automatically reach for 3031 when building hunting loads in the .30/30, but that's just me. My favorite load is 28gr. 3031 under, usually, a 190 gr. bullet, but it works just as well with my 'substitute standard' 180gr.- in both the .30/30 and .303 Savage.

Speaking of hunting, I need to get out of here and up into the deer woods. Catch y'all later.

Thank you and good luck today. Jeff

I shoot a Air Cooled WW alloy out of my 30-06 at 1850fps chrono'ed and dropped a doe at 160yds. One shot. You have to know where your gun shoots. :)Air cooled WW's do just fine.


Shooting lead bullets in your old gun won't hurt it, if you lead the barrel, just take a few strands of a copper choreboy wrap it around a tight patched jag with some oil and in 3 passes you'll have it clean. Leading will be more of a bullet fit issue than anything else.

I have a 35 whelen I shoot a 210gr GC bullet, (this bullet is water dropped so it's a tad harder but not much) at 2475fps and get no leading at all, even after 50 shots.

Here's a pic of the target.yea I flinched the last shot.

Blammer, I've looked at your target more than a few times now - that's some impressive casting,loading,shooting. Years from now, when I have some idea what I'm doing, groups like that,from a hunting bullet would still probably be more than I could hope for. Very inspiring, thanks. Jeff

Don't have a lot of experience with cast bullets but did run some of Blammer's alloy a few days back thru a .30-30. Lyman 311041 mould casts at 184.5 grains, Alox tumble lubes with motor mica dusting. Bad eyes, 1,600 fps, leaf sights on a Savage 24 went 5 shots in 1" at 25 yards with the starting load. Bumped velocity up to around 1,700 and it shot smaller. No leading at all. These bullets were not quenched. Pigs are in trouble...

Pure lead will run at more sedate velocity over black powder, dunno about smokeless. I run a pure lead GG bullet in a slug rifle at about 1,100 fps without issues. And sometimes I paper patch them and go full Monty. Pure lead at 1600-1800 fps = carnage.