http://brooksmoulds.com/

Received a custom mould from them about 2 weeks back and took a few laps with it today. Can hardly describe what a great mould it is. The bullets cast today were sufficiently concentric that I cannot measure any run out on base, shank or bore rider nose. The mould seam is right on the edge of invisible. Bullet weights consistent within .1 grain for 15 successive samples, casting at 183.5 gr.

When ordered I was looking for a major diameter of .309. Steve told me he was good with that +/- .001". They cast at .310" w/30:1 alloy. I can fudge that a little by juggling the mix, or just shoot them as cast.

Cut off the sprue, turn it over and it fall off. Open the mould and the bullet falls out. I do not have another mould that is so...boring. Based on a sample of 1 I highly recommend their moulds.

They are dandy well made and just as you describe..I have a really nice loner .45 cal 500 gr PP of jorge's that throws a super pill and shoots lights out.

Beautiful! Looks like a great .30-40 bullet!

Ed

Ed, it might be that, I am not familiar with the cartridge at all. They are intended for the .30 Sneezer. Or Geezer? Something like that.

Dan, that looks to be a dandy, actually both the bullet and the Sneezin' Geezer. I'd never heard of that wildcat before. What are the load specs for your 180-185gr cast bullet? I'm loving the smaller cases and bigger bullets more and more as I get older!

Interesting cartridge. I concur with HnS. It might also be a good candidate for insertion into a small Martini, too. Now you got me thinking. A dangerous thing, that.

That bullet also looks like it would be dandy fit in a standard .30 U.S. military ball seat throat. If you were in the business of casting for profit, I would order a hundred of them to try out in the Springfield.

The cartridge is one thought up for a specific purpose and gun. T/C Contender, hogs and other pests. The mould was step 2; the muffler process began a few months back. The reamer is being crafted by Pacific Tool & Guage as I hunt and peck. Redding for dies, Bullberry will do the barrel, likely 18" in length.

With a little luck it will do MOA at 100 yards or less, target MV 1050 fps or a bit less. Couple of issues that led to the case design: looking for fairly high load density with the objectives listed, a longish neck for the soft lead bullet.

I think the idea of a supersonic load in a suppressed gun is a bit of an oxymoron. Really isn't, but here in the close quarters I work precision is my friend and FPE a very distant concern. In consideration of dimenishing sprint and climbing abilities I opt for something a bit more aggressive than CB shorts for whacking hogs and such. Here in Floriduh last fall they made it legal to hunt with suppressed guns, so the path was fairly obvious to me.

A fellow here at the 'Fire ran some numbers thru Quickload awhile back based on the .30 carbine case and 180 grain bullets. Case capacity is slightly different (less) with that case, but close enough to give ballpark numbers for charge/pressures/velocity. Looked at a number of cases as a parent, .32 variations, .30 carbine, even the .32 WSL and .32-20. Looked at the .30 Badger, .30 Reece and finally settled on the .357 as parent for several reasons not especially important. One was my sincere desire to stay out if the supersonic realm. Don't care much for powder rattling around in empty space so I went off on my own tangent. At present I have preliminary data for a half dozen powders that will provide the target velocity at 80% load density or greater.

The bullet is a plain base design and the mould was spec'd for 30:1 alloy. My way of saying it won't be rode hard with any success and hard alloy will bump the diameter up slightly. The grease grooves are small, .015 wide and .010 deep. My intention is to tumble lube with variations of the ALOX goop and put a wax lube on it rather than grease. Packing a suppressor with grease or gas checks is not a good idea.

Given that, anyone wanting a small sample, send a PM with mailing address and the alloy mix you're looking for. If I can kluge that up I'll send some your way w/o charge on a small scale, say 25-30 bullets. $10/100+ shipping one a one time basis.

Steve Brooks can modify the mould design to accommodate gas checks or alloy variations I'd think...drop of a hat.

Why not a flat point for hogs and such?

Hmmm. I have a small Martini (well two actually) that I acquired with the intent of transforming into small something-or-others. One is getting the Hornet treatment and the other? Thoughts leaning toward a made to order cast bullet shooter for 100yd. paper punching. I had looked at the "standard" .30-.357 and didn't like the short-ish neck. The .30-20 was getting the most votes among my (rapidly dwindling) brain cells, until I saw this.

Will your new reamer cut a throat configured for this bullet? Rate of twist you settled on for the barrel?

A wise man told me a long time ago that when paper punching a bullet only has to make it as far as the target, which has driven my choice in a couple of cartridge selections. I wouldn't contemplate shooting any animals with it, nor do I need to be very quiet. What I do need is to start out either sub-sonic or start out high enough over that threshold so as not to drop under on the way to the tareget. That long relatively heavy bullet would look to fill the bill in the first count, and the case should fill the bill (with lighter bullets perhaps?) for the second.

You may get a PM from me. At the very least I still think that bullet would make a pretty fair low vel candidate for use in the Springfield.

Great little cartridge design, Dan! I hope one day I have the kind of funds necessary to pursue this kind of stuff. I'm already drawn to tinkering in the realm of loads and bullets!

The Bullberrys I inherited are so good that they make every T/C barrel I use seem like garbage by comparison. I'll be going Bullberry here on out with any new acquisitions.

I'm thinking I'd like to try a few of your design out in a 30-30 Contender. I'd likely want them a bit harder than the 30:1 you've got there, as the hope would be to get 14-1500 out of them.

Mathman, CNS is the target and nose form is pertinent only to placement, not terminal performance. In any case there isn't enough velocity to promote cavitation, that being the primary benefit of wide meplat design.

Gnoahhh, let me know. Guessing here but it can probably run maybe 10-11 BHN without getting too fat. Don't know if you have tried any but I have a good 311041 mould that casts about the same weight and diameter using harder alloy. with a gas check. Shoots well in my .30-30 up to around 1600-1700 fps. I size them to .309".

HuntnShoot, same to you. If you haven't done so, slug your barrel to verify bore and groove dimensions.

That round is very interesting.

Would powder coating the bullet so no need for lube work for round and it's use?

I'm sure it would work if dimensions were compatible. I don't powder coat and know little about it but understand it adds to diameter in measurable amounts.

How slow will they be going?

A standard loaded 38 Special whaps things like armadillos, possums and coons harder with a flat nose than a round nose.

True. How do they work at 100 yards?

Haven't stretched my 38 that far.

Dan, do you do anything special when loading with PB bullets? Cardboard seated at the base? I've been playing with some that stuff, and have yet to determine whether it matters.

My 30 cals do fine sized at .309". In fact, with 5/6 of the bullets I cast, .309" shoots better than .311" in 30-06. The 30-30 Contender slugs at .308" plus maybe .0001-.0002" a few inches into the throat and shoots all cast bullets best at 309". 30-06 is actually a hair less than .308" according to my measurement. It tends to be a "slow" barrel, and shows pressure before it hits appropriate speed with jacketed bullets.

I have Lee's version of the Lyman 311041. It is easy to get to shoot very well. It is the least finicky of all my designs as far as sizing goes, and I mainly size to .309" for simplicity. The 311041 has a great reputation as an all-around target/hunting bullet. I'm sure I'll end up with that mould someday. Another I'd love to try is the RCBS 180.

I'm very interested to see what I can do with your custom design. I'm with you that shooting for bone is the best way to use moderate-speed cast bullets, regardless of nose shape, and that cavitation is not required. If I lived in pig country, I'd certainly test the theory more often!

Have you ordered custom moulds from other makers besides Brooks? I'm curious how the various custom shops' moulds compare to each other. I've read a lot of good things about Veral Smith's moulds.

Experienced with moulds from Mos (3), Hoch (1), and now Brooks so far as the casting goes. They are all very good moulds in all regards, but I've not had one quite as uneventful as the Brooks.

One a road trip at the moment but will touch base with you on particulars a bit later and see what kind of alchemy we can cook up. FWIW I've achieved fairly high velocities with plain base bullets in the .25-20, say 1600 fps. Given proper fit you might top that with a mix I call my 1.5 alloy. It has an air cooled BHN of 9-10.

Card wads are quite useful. Sometimes.

Will be in touch.

Mathman, when I get settled this evening I'll toss a pic your way to illustrate how soft alloy behaves amidst meat and bone. Flat nose bullets have a place certainly but there is no free ride or magic in the mix. BC takes a hit for example.

If you want to make big holes in stuff with a .38 try the Hornady 148 HBWC loaded backwards. Funny stuff that is. Use about 3.0 of Bullseye, very mild crimp

D

My wyf's self defense load in her 36-1

Thanks Dan, I haven't worked with (known) 30:1 alloy.

I've still got some of those Hornadys left over from when my late father was bulk buying in the days of cheap shipping a long time ago.

Just don't use them with your muffler!

The .30-40 Krag was built around a 220 gr RN bullet. It has a long neck, ~0.485", and really loves cast bullets.

My Contender Carbine has a 1:10" twist, .308" bore and really likes 180gr-200gr cast bullets (20:1?) @ 1,500-1,900fps. One issue with using some of the older .308 caliber cast bullets in most "modern" .30 caliber guns is the greater number of grease grooves, causing them to seat the bullet way down, past the neck and into the powder space.

Your cartridge's long neck should grip that bullet perfectly. I have a .30 Reece case sitting in front of me now. I met Mr. Reece at the Wanamacher's Gun Show in Tulsa a few year ago and we talked a bit about this type of cartridge and it's potential.
He collaborates with MGM to make barrels for his creations.

I can't wait to see the results!

Ed

No, won't be doing that.

A couple of pics for Mathman of soft bullets and what they do.

This is a CB short bullet, BHN of 8 recovered from the neck of a largish hog after it penetrated fully thru the skull and brain. MV ~710 fps



The skull:



A 300 grain pure lead paper patched .44 Mag bullet of pure lead, 1600 fps at the muzzle. 1.5 caliber ogive radius with a very minor flat on the nose of 1/8th" or there abouts. I don't have a pic of the bullet unmolested. BHN 5. Hit a deer at ~75 yards, broke both forelegs, 5 ribs and cut the heart in half near the top. Retained weight is 297 grains.



I have another of similar form that did a hog of about 125#, high on the right shoulder found under the hide in the back of the left ham. Bone carnage included shoulder bones, ribs, vertebrae, the hip and socket of the left ham bone. Retained weight was about 285 grains, impact at about 15 yards.

The 30:1 alloy runs about the same hardness as the CB short bullet above and this particular bullet will have a BC of about .300 on average over the flight of the bullet to 100 yards. In this affair placement trumps other considerations to a very large degree. It will expand at the higher end of the velocity envelope.