Not sure whether this is the appropriate forum for this subject, but since I've seen some chatter here before on the subject, I figured to start here.

After a long 5 months my Russell, Joe's PH's (Special) showed up on the doorstep today, courtesy of the brown truck. So without hesitation I opened the box and tried them on making sure to wear like socks as were worn when I had my feet measured (at the Russell store). Low and behold, and in general, they seem large. The ball and instep fit well, but the length both in front of the toe and behind the heel seems long, as well as the heel seeming wide.

Has anyone had issues with Russell's fitting, out of the box? If so, did you return them for a re-make, or refit, and what was the turn-around? Don't get me wrong, these are wonderfully made boots - quality throughout - but I guess I expected a better fit on a custom-made pair of boots, that were measured for fit by the Russell folks themselves.

I plan on talking to the Russell folks in the morning, but am trying to get an early feel for what to expect. From the testimonials I heard and read, I expect that they will more than make them right - just not in another 20 weeks

WiFowler; If the boots don't fit you right, take or send them back to the good folks in New Berlin for reworking/refitting. I have used their boot for over 35 years, and though i've never had them measure my feet, (always used tracings and measurements on their fitting form) i have never had a poor fit in some 14 pair of boots and shoes. They have all been among the most comfortable footwear i've ever owned. My two sets of PH's in split Cape Buffalo are likely the best boots a man can wear. Light, comfortable, and the most durable material on earth!

They also stand behind every shoe they make 100%.

Unfortunately, it's not at all unusual. If you search on other hunting-related forums, you will find pages of issues with Russell shoes and boots. I have a pair of Joe's PH low safari boots, which I like, but my Sheephunters never came to a successful conclusion. They made them too small, then stretched them to no avail, then completely re-made the boots, but this time didn't include the "pocket" that your ankle bone fits into. They hurt even lacing them up. I finally gave up.

Russell will keep trying, but it's way too much back-and-forth for my liking. I can put on just about any manufacturers boot in size 10 D and it will fit like a glove. If I was to buy another pair of Russells, I would try a pair on at one of the shows, like the Dallas Safari Club, and if they fit, I'd buy them there. The "custom fitting" is for the birds.

I have a pair of Russels. They are nice boots. But like you, Biebs, and decent set of 10Ds fit me well. My feet are "normal". Fancy custom boots like the Russells were/are a waste on my feet. A top of the line pair of Danners or Mendeil's or any of a number of others will suit me just fine for less money and hassle.

Thanks guys. As I mentioned, I'll call in the morning and see what the next step is. I'll likely end going up to the store (about an hour away, and 10 minutes from my folks) to get what ever process is decided on, started. As Biebs points out, I hope it's not a back and forth thing.

Interestingly enough, when I stopped in to have my feet traced and place an order, I was wearing a very well worn pair of Danner Pronghorns that fit like a glove. Unfortunately they've seen their better days. I would have settled for another pair (Danners) but the newer Pronghorns seem to be cut slightly different and the fit is way off compared to my older pair. I was also looking for something a bit lighter with a softer sole than the Danner's.

Russell will try to make good on the fit. Two things to keep in mind the lasts they use run large and the moccasin style is not as supportive as some other shoes. What works best for me is to have the shoes large enough to add a more supportive insole, a fairly flat one but with a heel cup. You might try different ones with the boots before any drastic rebuild.

Just to get an idea pull the insoles out of your Danner's or other boots and see how it feels with the Russell's. You lose some of the ground contact feel but not that much.

Many stores like REI and the running shoe outfits will have insoles to try on before you buy.

I hunt in Russel boots 100% in Africa. It took longer then hoped for to break in and fit comfortably. However, that passed and now they are flawless.

There was a time when I thought they not gonna work out. Looking back, I would do it again, as they have out lasted anything else made. The thorns would go thru any boot sole ( or truck tire) I have ever worn, when I had these made they lined the boots with turtle skin ( snake proof fabric). I have never had a thorn go thru the bottom yet! They also made a double leather toe cap. This has proven to be an excellent option for the wear and tear on the boots toe which takes a beating in the thorns as well.

My experience has been different- mine fit too tightly at first. I got a pair of regular PH boots 4 years ago and like them very much. I ordered a pair of the Thula Thulas right after this year's DSC convention. I received them 3 weeks ago (less than 2 months from order to delivery). I love the fit of these boots- the Munson last is perfect for me. I only wish that I had ordered the 4" instead of the 7" version. My wife ordered another pair of the casual collar oxfords at the same time and received them last week.

My experience with Russell was not satisfactory.

My wife was fitted at either SCI or DSC (January) by Russell people at the booth. We needed the boots by July-August for a September hunt. They arrive in time for the hunt but were literally four sizes too big.

Sent them back to Russell with the proper sizing information. We needed them back for our next hunt in April. Again they arrived in time but were still at least two sizes too big.

So after 16 months and missing two safaris I asked for a refund. To Russell's credit they promptly mailed a check.

For me Russells were the most uncomfortable boots I have ever worn. When I purchased my first pair they were so bad I was convinced it must be a fluke because so many people hold them in such high regard. The following year at DSC I had different style custom made and they were just as bad as my first pair. I do not dispute anyone else's experience with Russells, but mine was horrible. I actually threw both pairs away as I did not feel comfortable trying to sell them to anyone. One of my posts in the Army was with the 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry), for those who don't know that means A LOT or road marches; in all that marching I never had blisters like I had when I did a seven mile hike with the Russells.

I have two pair of Russell PH's. The first were an awesome fit, the second didn't fit and were returned at SCI. Ditto for a pair made for my wife. We are awaiting the new pairs they are making.

Shoes are a lot like a pair of jeans. Sometimes they will fit, sometimes they won't. even in the same size, It's your anatomy and personal perception that governs fit. Personally, the most comfortable boots I have ever owned are the Courtney Safari's. I have several pair. But YMMV.

I agree, after my Russell experience I purchased Courteney Selous and they are the most comfortable pair of safari boots I have ever worn.

Been waiting for my pair for almost 3 years...

I have had four pairs and absolutely love every pair I have.

I do have an "odd" size foot, and regular boots just don't work for me.

My Russell mountain PHs were a perfect fit and required no break in. Unless I plan to hunt in severe cold or swamp - conditions they are not intended for - these are my go-to boots for any trip. Several trips to Africa and a fair amount of Western US hunting later, I'd buy them again.

I had my feet measured at the DSC show this year and am awaiting the arrival of a pair of modified Thula-Thulas. My son has Russells that he wore to Zim in 2010 and has already had resoled. He bought a pair of Courtenys in Victoria Falls and never could get comfortable in them.

IMO, it is not Russell's fault that some find the fit perfect and others do not. If you need custom made, you may have problems with any maker. That is a risk that you take. Keep in mind that maybe they should be a bit loose so you can use bulky socks when appropriate.

I wore custom made shoes for decades when I was doing a lot of world travel and could shop for them abroad, and frankly they were not superior in fit to good Aldens or Allen Edmonds. In fact, they often were too tight for hard use like carrying packs, extensive walking, etc. where my feet would swell.

I bought a pair of Russell birdshooters almost exactly 30 years ago, based of the fact that Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas, a walking fool, tramped all over the West in his. Like Biebs and BrentD, mine are standard 10Ds and I found the best fit for ME by adding good insoles. My birdshooters went to Africa and a lot of other places in heat, snow, ice, etc. and I still wear them today in Japan. I wonder if they will ever wear out.

I have worn Nu Balance walking shoes on four trips, and soon to be five in three months. Personally I have never seen the need for boots in Africa. Good comfortable walking shoes and some leather gaiters and you're good to go.

Mike

I got measured by Russel last fall at the Vintager's meet here, but haven't ordered yet. I had got a pair from the "off the shelf" but didn't fit the way I wanted them to. I can't wear most store bought shoes, as can't put up with the junky bottoms. New Balance, etc. make my feet hurt. I'm looking for a good set of shoes, like the Thulas and will probably, eventually, get a pair of the Russels, but recently bought a pair (then a 2nd pair) of some ankle high shoes, that are soft leather, but have tough bottoms, made for Wolverine, as they fit right and feel right, though I am going to get a better footbed. I have a pair of Danners from years back, that are hunting boots and feel fine, but are kinda heavy.

Lhookz, why would you "throw away" a pair of boots that cost $100s when they come with a no questions asked refund?? The off the shelf pair I got from Russel didn't "quite" fit right, and I returned them, and got a refund, no problem.

BTW, Danner is now importing a "cheap line" of boots from China, so take note. If they're under about $250, they aren't "real" Danners. I personally feel that , that's a good way to ruin your reputation.

ghost, ive got bad knees and as such what shoes i wear matter greatly....though they have good reviews New balance dont work for me either.....on the off chance our feet are similar you might try Columbia for normal shoes/hiking boots.....not all of them work for me but bout 1/3 of their products fit me like a glove.....might be worth checking if you find yourself in a store that carries them... tend to be able to tell right there in the store if they will work or not....

I purchased the first pair off the shelf so I figured they were just lower quality than their custom boots. The second pair I was measured and had them custom made. As I stated they were just as bad as the first pair. I thought it might be a break in issue, so I actually wore them on a couple of hikes in AZ, the last being the seven mile hike I referenced. I did not feel it would be right in trying to get a refund after I had put that much mileage on a boot. I also did not feel I could ethically sell them as they, in my experience, were crappy boots and were used. I paid my money and took my chances, and decided that ethically the financial hit should be mine to bear.

I bought an off the shelf pair of Russell "Art Carter" boots and I think they're about the most comfortable pair of shoes I own. I only wish my next pair will fit me this well. I'd love a pair of Imperials in french calf.

From the Russell web site and the same as their catalog.

"[color:#000099]Custom made goods cannot be returned or exchanged, but we will be glad to remodel if a satisfactory fit is not received. All credit card order charges are put through at the time the order is entered. Goods shipped from stock will be willingly exchanged if unsatisfactory in fit or otherwise.
Your boot will fit correctly if proper care was taken during your home measurement process. Do not wear boots or shoes outside, unless you are sure they fit. Soiled or scuffed footwear cannot be returned."[/color]

This is far from a no questions asked refund. No where is a no questions ask refund mentioned anywhere on their info that I have found.

My personal experience was they were unable to make a pair of Airports that fit after several attempts. I can honestly say I have never tried on a pair of shoes that fit worse. I was measured at the store more than once. Yes, some shoes fit better than others, my expectation was not that a custom measured and built shoe for my feet would be the worst shoe I ever tried on. I had a pair of Carters made previously and those required several trips to the store to get them sort of right. I had very high hopes for Russell�s and really wanted them to work out, but was not the case.

I am in the same boat, Merrill hikers and sandals are great but I wear a pair of ECCO track 11 ankle boots for just about every outdoor active thing I do.

I bought a pair of the bird hunters that are made from kangaroo. I loved the look and wanted something for warm weather. Wen I tried them on they felt horrible. There was a bump where the tongue folded over, my heel slipped, balls felt cramped, collar was irritating, etc. It took several tries at different insoles before every thing fell into place. Now they are one of my most comfortable pair of shoes.
My suggestion would be to try different insoles. It worked for me and saved me from tossing away a good pair of boots in disgust. I do wish I added a shank and padded collar. I don't know if they could add these after the boot has been built?
On the other hand, my Merrels fit just as well and cost a lot less.

What about sizing compared to Merrils or tradtional shoes? My Double H's are 10EE but my Red Wings are 11D. Sneakers are 11's. I have read to size down 1/2 a size but have never put my feet in a pair.

My re-made Russell PH's arrived today and they were a perfect fit right out of the box! Very pleased. Will, of course, break them in thoroughly, but they had a "broken in" feel when I put them on. I hope my wife's re-made boots fit as well.

Namibia, here I come!

I purchased a pair of Russel PHs several years ago and for one reason or another just never really liked the feel of them. I'm somewhat flatfooted and these just don't offer the support that I get with Danners or New Balance. I own a pair of Courtney Selous (Cape Buffalo hide) that I've broken in and they feel alright, but certainly not as comfortable as my "off the rack" Danners or New Balance favorites.

Are the thorns really that bad in Tanzania (I'm heading for the Selous.), or will a good walking/hiking shoe/boot suffice?

These are what I'm using now and find exceptionally comfortable: http://www.bootbay.com/31014-Mens-Zigzag-Hiking-Danner-Boots/DA31014/Product

http://www.shopnewbalance.com/men/shoes/walking/country/MW646BR

I cannot say about the area your going to be in. However, I expect a flat tire once a week. At one time we used split rim wheels with inner tubes just so the boys could get them patched and fixed faster. I was also carrying two spares.

There are some places worse then others, and some places without roads which are always worse. I've had thorns go through my gordens more times then I can count. Twice now I have had the thorn so deep into my foot, I could not get my boot off as it was pinned into the boot. I had to pull the thorn out with my leatherman. It had to come back out of through the sole. That was a gruesome event needless to say. Especially when your many miles away on foot and now have to walk back!

The turtle skin lining has never had a through and through puncture, with the airbob sole. I do have dozens of thorns embedded in the sole, but non-have gone through.........yet!

One other memorable puncture. I was on a rhino dart hunt. We were closing the gap to make the shot and I made a ninja quiet stalk with my hunter. We had only a couple meters to move to clear the brush. At which point I had a whole branch stuck to my boot with the thorn deeply embedded in the sole. I had become fully connected to the branch.

It's not easy to explain the stress of having to work this out while trying to keep your eyes on this rhino at about 30-35 meters. All the while this anxious hunter has an adrenaline rush beyond anything imaginable and I'm hobbling and preoccupied with a branch stuck to my boot.

I don't understand why you guys fool with this stuff.

Just go to your local outdoor store and buy a pair of light hiking boots for warm weather. Goretex and Nubuck and no breaking in. Buy the pair that fits. Saves money too. I prefer the lower cut ones.

Or just do like Buzz Charleton in his new elephant hunting video. He wears a pair of croc slip-ons, no socks, no gaiters.

Wish it were that simple. My feet have needs not found in 99.9 percent of shoes and 100 percent of any commercial made boots I have seen (out of hundreds). So maybe now you can understand why everyone is not just like you. Some people have needs or wants that are not found in commercial chinese shoes.

I hunted the Selous with ankle-high Timberland leather boots, and they were fine. Don't worry about it.

I got the Thula-Thula model a few years back for my Botswana trip. One of the pair was just a tad off and I called and sent it back. They fixed it quickly, and perfectly, and I had it back within two weeks.

Off-the-shelf books work fine for local light use for me, but I have a dropped metarsal in one foot. Russel fashinioned an inner sole that worked perfectly. I logged a fair amount of miles during those ten days and could not imagine being so comfortable with off-the-shelf boots.

Not trying to make light of your needs, but I am very adverse to buying boots and stuff in the mail, custom made or not, without trying them on first.

Are you sure (thou probably are) that a good podiatrist would not make up something and then you could try that in boots at a good outdoor store?

Really, for me, cheap Chinese copy or not, my Lowas are as comfortable as any boots I've ever used.