Just read that South Africa has put a ban on leopard hunting for the remainder of 2016, to be reviewed at the end of the year. They apparently want to try to get a handle on how many leopards there are in the country, under pressure from conservation groups.

First the US Fish and Wildlife import permit debacle with lions, and now this- it could be just a matter of time before leopards will also be nearly impossible to hunt and/or import into the US.

The adage, 'Hunt Africa now, while you can', is becoming more true every day.

Probably because they are an endangered species same as elephants and Rhino, tigers, grizz, just all killed none left. Stick with elk and moose, deer, better that way.

Sir, with all due respect, Elephant are closer to vermin than what it is to endangered. There are way too many. Sure, some pockets are under pressure but in the greater scheme of things, and the population as a whole, we need to cull thousands if not 100 of thousands of animals. They talk about a need to cull 45K elephant in Hwange alone.
The Leopard ban is simply from incompetence of not having the necessary knowledge.
There are plenty of Leopard.

Sir no disrespect but you are in conflict of interest by your bias comments. Most everyone know that all species are threatened in
africa. Cape Buffalo are doing well but the big cats are taking a real beating. You know that so stop BS people so they can book a Safari with you. i live in Africa so i know what is going on.

Lion numbers in South Africa are on the increase year on year, although being from the captive bred side. It's still numbers, no matter where they are.

Here is an extract from Ron Thomson's article on Botswana's elephant population. Ron use to work for the Zimbabwe parks board in Hwange, I believe, for many years. His article reads:
"Well they are based upon the government’s own statistics. The official elephant count in 2000 was 120 604. The figures indicating the progressive increase in elephants during the 1990s could not have been attained unless the population was increasing at a rate of 8 percent per annum. Most scientists will tell you that that figure is improbable. But it is the only one that accounts for a doubling of elephant numbers in the nine years 1990 –1999. In scientific circles the figure 7 percent is accepted as being the probable “maximum” elephant population incremental rate. Botswana claims and incremental rate of 5 percent – but THAT is impossible given the rate of increase of Botswana elephant herds. So let us accept 7 percent as Botswana’s REAL elephant population increment figure. Using this figure, in the three years since 2000, Botswana’s elephants MUST now be sitting at 147 745. And THAT means Botswana will have to cull 140 000 elephants (plus the annual increments over the period of time the culling teams will take to reduce this population) IF the country has any hope at all of getting its now devastated biomes to return to a healthy state. In other words, I am here suggesting that circa. 7 500 elephants is what Botswana needs to maintain its elephant herds at."

The same article also read that that aerial count for Hwange was 50,000 Elephant in 2013. Hwange on the land size, can only sustain 2500, I believe the number was stated. Therefor, Ron believed that a cull of 47,500 Elephant was needed in the Hwange, just to try and save the vegetation that was left. Vegetation that we, in our lifetime, would probably never see restore.

Good luck to you sir. Wondering why a guy who lives in Africa would have a screen name such as Canuck?

I live in North America but that doesn't make me an expert in native animal population and conservation.

Why not? Educate yourself.

WWF list leopards as endangered species, do you research.

Elephant are closer to vermin than what it is to endangered. There are way too many.

Elephants are not vermin, people like you are.

Sir,

That the snow leopard that WWF says is endangered. Not all leopards.

Who is this F'ing PETA loving Canuck??? Where did this guy come from?? Canada, it would seem, but the Canadians I know are better heeled than this guy?? The only people in the world who say that the African Elephant is anywhere near extinction is the PETA ilk. Your bleeding heart, don't hurt Bambi crowd. He mentions grizzlies, yet appears to have a brown bear in his pick. Hypocrital much??? SMFH.....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grizzly_bear

I smell a troll

101% FACTUALLY WRONG.
Neither elephants NOR leopards are close to being endangered. Lions are on the other hand "threatened" but it depends on the country/area. Leopard quotas go unfilled in just about every country where they are hunted in Africa.
Elephant, just in Zim:
[img]https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...bc5622fd3cfc85c80c88f84d&oe=5724F65D[/img]

Lion overpupulated in Zim

I shot that bear 18 years ago in Russia. Not endangered at that time, maybe now. Leopards and elephants are on endangered list. Do some research retards.

Nope, leopards are listed under Appendix I in certain areas of the world & countries but in many there are LOTS of quotas:
Leopard quotas/country

Please avail yourself of facts before delving.....

State Quota
Botswana

130

Central African Republic

40

Ethiopia

500

Kenya

80

Malawi

50

Mozambique

120

Namibia

250

South Africa

150

Uganda

28

United Republic of Tanzania

500

Zambia

300

Zimbabwe

500

So now you're a PETA member instead of the NRA or SCI?? 18 years you may have conributed to their demise. What a bastard you are for that one. LOL. Got a big pic of a fat brownie he says are nearly extinct and telling people who know better that elephants are endangered. Troll is a nice word. I have others. Vermin was used above, that works.

Have a nice day bunny hugger. But please, go eat your Tofu elsewhere.

WWF lists the Amur Leopard, native to Russia and far east and the Snow Leopard, native to same as endangered.

https://www.worldwildlife.org/species/directory?direction=desc&sort=extinction_status

Neither are native to Africa. Do your research.

Sad that men have to kill creatures that they don't eat, only for their skin and head. I was like you also when younger but grew up and learned about respect to Gods creatures.

You can't eat leopard? And you believe WWF.... bingo... just hit the button....

I'm sorry, but once again you're missing the boat. it is a proven fact that were it not for hunting (that gives animals VALUE, I figured the link to the possible lion cull would have clued you in, but obviously I overestimated), most of these animals would be long gone. Not to mention the graph depicted on Kenya v Zim where hunting saved the elephant. What is sad are goofs like you who take a ready fire aim approach to these important topics and animals suffer... Get a CLUE, Ace...

Opinion is like [bleep] everyone has one. LOL

Funny. I find it sad when people just kill animals for their meat and don't use the hide, horns/antlers, organs, glands and intestines and every scrap of them.

You know, I wouldn't think a Canuck living in a glass house would be very energy efficient but I Iearn new stuff every day.

Opinion? Gee, I once again underestimated your grey matter, or those factual STATISTICS I posted, including the leopard quotas, fail to penetrate your bean? (rhetorical question)

Forgive me pugs but since i have lived so many years in Africa and seen so much abuse, killing and consuming Gorillas, [bleep], when you go to market and see Gorilla hands, skins of Leopards, you get upset. I respect you but give me a little respect back also.

Now we're on gorillas. So no comment as to the FACTS posted on the subject or did a leopard get your nuts and you can't own up your comments on leopards have been completely discredited.

You make respecting difficult. I'll give you the respect of a non-pithy post.

Hunting is an interesting topic. We all love to hunt. We all hunt a wide variety of things and in a wide variety of ways. We all use all or some or nothing of some of the game from hunt from big and small game to vermin/varmints.

We all want to hunt legally and we all want to ethically. Legally is easy(ish) to define. Ethically is very dependent on ones culture and situation and experience. What is also very easy to understand that as hunters we are under attack from many quarters. If a hunt is undertaken legally, then it is our obligation as hunters to support that hunter regardless if the ethics match ours as long as the pursuit is legal.

I'll be open here. There are types of hunting I have no interest in. Baiting bears and running deer with dogs come to mind but I will defend the hunters that want to do that the hilt where it's legal. That is their ethic and they own it and I cannot compare it to my own and I respect them for what they do.

You've spouted forth some utter nonsense on Leopards in Africa and been shown the errors. You might want to consider the legal/ethic implications on your posts.

We're all hunters. We all define it differently. We all judge the outcome differently.

argue with these people they know the facts, bigcatrescue.org

Well, I tried. You really want to throw your hand in with these folks? If so, you're the enemy of hunters all over the world.

http://archive.wtsp.com/news/topsto...ews-Investigators-raise-questions-about/

http://bigcatrescue.org/extinction-via-hunting/

http://www.911animalabuse.org/Big-Cat-Rescue-News.php

https://bigcatrescue.org/funds-raised-for-fake-big-cat-rescue-copycat/

I'm amazed when I see people like you post. Clueless about the damage you do to all hunters on your high horse. I'm sure PETA will welcome you with open arms. You're not welcome at my fire though.

By this post, IF you indeed ever "lived" in Africa, it was either a church mission or a bunny hugger trek. Gorilla hands at markets? Central African poaching is not regulated hunting, but why (sigh) do I bother arguing with an Anti?

Kill moose = ok

Kill African animals = not ok

Selective ethics at work in the mind of a troll.

I am absolutely certain that everything Marius stated is true, and thus discredits you in my mind thoroughly. Puff off, Buster.

Very well stated.

Are you serious? WWF, a credible source for animal numbers and conservation news? Unbelievable! And... seriously? Big Cat Rescue? That shameful cat "shelter" down in Florida, you mean? The same organization that even a TV viewer who watches Animal Planet sporadically knows is under investigation/indictment? THIS is your idea of an "authority" on wild cats in Africa?

Jeez.

+1 Doc...the WWF has absolutely ZERO to do with conservation, habitat acquisition etc....but it is well versed in fund raising......

Gee.. I learned something today. Those Brown bears that frequent my yard on the Kenai Peninsula, Alaska are endangered?

Whodda thunk?

That's news to almost everyone in Alaska - the ignorant ones being either uninformed or of Peta ilk, or both.

378Canuck sounds like he might be 15...

'Scuuse me - I have to go replace bearings in my snow machine now. There's something out there that I have a bullet for, but I gotta get to it....

Go shoot every living creature left on earth. I really don't give a F**k. The next few generations may thank you for that I'm sure.

Sir, I ask you, if there is a Lion, Rhino, or whatever past his breeding age(14 years for Lion, also the same age as Cecil) stopping the younger males from breeding with the females, and a hunter hunts him, creating an opportunity for the younger males to get to the females, injecting money into the area on top of it, how is this not conservation?
The same area where Cecil was killed, now have a surplus of 200 lions this year, that will likely be culled, and due to the import ban of Lion trophies to the USA, zero dollars will come from it. Had that been open to hunters, they would have injected roughly $10 million into the area.
The Black Rhino bull hunted in Namibia last year, was past his breeding age, attacking younger bulls and preventing them from serving the cows, raised $350K which was injected directly into Rhino conservation. That money was used to fund the anti-poaching teams, buy food for the other Rhino's during the drought in Namibia. How is this not conservation?

Don't you dare compare hunters to poachers and the gorilla feet and hands you saw at the markets. We are not the same. Unless you have personally put your life on the line chasing poachers at night, like I have, and actually do something in return for wildlife, that actually matters, you have no place to talk. I'm not talking about sending $1 via PayPal to some scam animal justice movement, I'm talking about making an actual difference.
No one does more for conservation than hunters.

If I had the money and time, I would. At least I got the satisfaction of handing you your ass with published FACTUAL data on the various animal populations and numbers, instead of your emotional, estrogen-laden bullshit.

I'm thinking someones kid is having fun with his dad's account...

It always surprises me that someone who claims to be a hunter is so willfully and stubbornly ignorant of the link between hunting and wildlife conservation.

I have to wonder if we're not being trolled by somebody else using Canuck378's login info.

He started here on the 'Fire in 2006. Put in a lot of good comments about hunting, hunting equipment, and so forth. Seemed like a pretty straight huntin'/fishin' kinda guy. Heck, his avatar is a nice-looking dead griz, so he's clearly not opposed to killing big predators.

If you look at his post log, he was averaging about 40 posts per month, less during hunting season and during summer months. Then last year he dropped off the forums mid-January and did not show up until November. Post count has been lower than his average previously, and length of posts is shorter as well. Also, some of his posts since his return are just plain bizarre and/or creepy. Like posting that bears die quickest when they "bite on the muzzle of my 30-30 in the culvert trap".

I have to wonder if ol' Canuck has got sick, or somebody else is using his log-in info. His comments on this thread just seem so far out of character for the guy.

Could be, Doc, but who knows, he might have joined a Women's Club or something.

Yeah. I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it, let's put it that way. I got sh1t to kill. I'm booked for black bear in Alberta in May/June. 2 tags on one license, good chance for a 7-footer.

I didn't know about these postings until I got a PM from a member. I'm presently working on a drilling rig in Congo. I have 28 days off and someone was posting on the company computer. I will take care to sign out next time. I have African co workers who are very anti hunter in this office. Thanks Doc Rocket.

Welcome back! Thought we lost you there for a second....

Wrong again slick, Google a surgical procedure called a proctectomy! Double LOL

Could you be the reincarnation of our esteemed member "bcd"? cOUld bE, ENJoY.

This topic is about as volatile as I've seen for a non-political subject! Well, someone is telling a big lie because these numbers can't be THAT far off!

There certainly was a lot of bull crap peddled locally with our famous dentist and a lion hunt.

The public schools have brainwashed well. The millenials in general would rather have a tofu sandwich made from sustainable farm practices, gluten free, chemical free, non-GMO, fair trade labor, COO labeling, recyclable packaging while waiting for their free public transportation that will take them to a Bernie rally.

Ok sorry, that is off the spoor of the original topic.

On the other hand, maybe a Boko Haram tag could be substituted for any other game in short supply?