An earlier reading of a posting on this forum reminded me of the first pre-64 Winchester Rifle I purchased, with the intended purpose of "collecting it because I thought it was so cool"!
And that Rifle was a 1950 vintage Model 70 Standard Rifle in caliber 22 Hornet.
I still own that Rifle today.
Over the past 4 decades I have collected (bought and sold!) many and various Models of the fine pre-64 Winchesters including Model 54's, more Model 70's, Model 64's, Model 43's, Model 71's, Model 55's, Model 92's, Model 94's, Model 65's, Modle 88's, Model 100's and countless specimens of pre-64 Winchester rimfire Models.
I "been around" the pre-64's for a long and very enjoyable time. Over that time I have grown especially fond of the rare and VERY handsome Model 64 Deluxe Rifle, with 26" barrel, in caliber 219 Zipper!
I must admit to, on not so rare occassions, dreaming of this particular Rifle!
I am a dyed in the wool bolt action kind of guy and for the last 15 years or so I have only collected bolt action pre-64 Winchesters earnestly - I simply had to give up on the levers and rimfire pre-64's.
I would be greatly interested in knowing other folks "favorite pre-64 Winchester Rifles"!
Oooh... how I long for the good old days of quality manufacture and "charcoal bluing" on factory Rifles!
Alas, those days are gone forever I fear!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Out of my collection the favorite is also a 22 Hornet but in a Super Grade. I do favor the Super Grades but like the FW's such as the 358 and 264's.

Of the five I have, the original pristine pre-64 in .300 H&H I bought about 5 years ago is still my favorite..

mine is my dad's ole model 70 featherweight in 308 win

My BIL has Pre 64 Mod 70 in .264 Win Mag. I think it is called a Westerner. I have a Mod 94 in .32 Win. It's Special to me.

I got two transitionals. 375 HH and 300 HH. They're my favs.

In 1965 I saw a pre-64 Model 70 .22 Hornet in a hock shop for $75. I passed on it because I wanted a .222 Remington.

Paul

The 85 of course. The sporting rifle variant in any straight case cartridge. A classic rifle as good then as any rifle today.

Winchester 95 carbine in 303 British.

Jeff

Here's my list:

Nathaniel: Ooowww.. that would be a dandy - a Supergrade in 22 Hornet!
I have a pair of 358 Featherweights - they look kind of cool from the muzzle end with that big bore on the smallish Rifle!
I like your pick for fav!
I used to shoot a couple of Model 70's in 22 Hornet - just for fun... dit dit dit they went without recoil and they were pretty accurate - as Hornets go anyways!
I even shot a 22 Hornet Model 70 that had been converted to 222 Remington!
It shot well.
The origianal Model 70's in 22 Hornet are just to valuable to take afield anymore.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Redneck: I have a mint condition low 4 digit serial numbered Model 70 "Bull Gun" - it is marked on its huge charcoal blued barrel "300 Magnum"!
I have always wanted to shoot that one just to see how it fairs at the range!
Again to valuable anymore to shoot!
I assume your Rifle is a standard Rifle?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Tbear99: Jim Zumbo Hunted everything with one of those 308 Featherweights and did so very successfully for decades!
I have a couple of the 308 Featherweights today and have owned several more in the past.
Is the 308 in your possession now or does dad still have it?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Croldfort: Yes the standard Rifle in 264 Winchester was also called "Westerner".
The Featherweights in this caliber had a "bark" to them with their shorter barrels.
26" barrels and they very often shot accurately - even with factory ammo.
I have always had a soft spot for the Model 94's - I once owned one in 25/35 - like a fool I traded it off!
Hold into the wind

Paul39: That was the year I graduated from High School - even then I would have borrowed money from my gramma to have owned that one!
And I wish you would have bought it - today you could maybe get $2,000.00 for it even if only in "fair" condition!
If only you and I could see into the future.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

BrentD: What a great looking Rifle the 85 was/is!
And what a classy picture and posing of your Rifle you included in your post!
I bet in my lifetime I have bid on 20 or 30 Low Walls and High Walls and never once have I been successful!
Nope never owned either one - maybe someday?
Tell me about the tang sight and underlever on your posed Rifle are those an optional items or aftermarket non-Winchester items.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

MColeman: Your "list" did not come through.
Are you by chance a "non-believer" or did your "list" get omitted somehow?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I have collected Pre-64 model 70's for close to 50 years and had quite the collection, with the 264's being at the top of my list, having both the westener's and several FW's. Throw in a couple 300 win mags a couple 375's, 308 FW, a 257 bob a butt load of 270's and 06's. Over the years always trying to trade or sell to upgrade. There are really no other guns that will compare to the old winchesters IMHO.

Brent can respond in his own time, but I'm pretty sure it is an original Winchester lever. (Helm style?) My son just bought an original low wall rimfire action with such a lever.

I'm also pretty sure that the tang sight is a modern production, but I don't know the particulars. Brent?

Paul

I think that Mr. Coleman appreciates the virtues of modern rifles like the Remington 700's.


I have a Transition M70, a M41, a 52B and 1892 rifle that I really enjoy.

Have owned and enjoyed a 77 tube feed, 75 target gun, a 62,
a 72 target, 3 model 12's, and a GREAT M70 pre-war .270.

Hope to someday own: a 61, 42, 86, 92 carbine, and a M70
Featherweight rebarreled to .257R.

Jimmyd223: You know for once I TOTALLY agree with you - I have owned fine Rifles made by Colt, Browning, Weatherby, Sako, Anschutz, Marlin and many others but NONE of them have given me the pride of ownership that my old Model 70's do!
Even though I listed the long barreled Model 64 Deluxe in caliber 219 Zipper as my most dreamt about Rifle - the Model 70's give me the most pleasing and secure feeling when I buy them!
There is NO safer, stronger, better looking, consistently accurate and reliable factory bolt gun ever made than the pre-64 Winchester Model 70 - thats just a fact!
I have been lookig for over 30 years now and still have as yet to find a gunsmith who has ever replaced a broken firing pin on a pre-64 Model 70 Winchester!
I am sure theres ONE out there somewhere but I have as yet to talk to him - and I have talked to a LOT of gunsmiths!
I once owned an African Model 70 in 458 Winchester - I bought and then sold said Rifle before anyone knew exactly how RARE these were/are!
I nearly doubled my money on that one but if I had it today I could sell it for six times what I sold it for or 12 times what I originally bought it for!
Yeah I wish I had that one back!
I have a new in the box unfired 264 Westerner - this one is DEEP inside one of my gun vaults - get over Montana way sometime and I will show it to ya!
MAYBE even let you put the bolt in the action???
Thats interesting though - I think you are the second guntype that has the 264 Model 70 as your fav!
Long live the 264 Winchester Magnum!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

30Gibbs: I see - Mr. Coleman was/is being facetious then???
You know I always have had a soft spot for the Model 42 (410 gauge pump shotgun) myself.
I find myself without one these days as I turnt all my Winchester shotguns into Model 70's (via trade NOT by magic!).
I once owned a Model 61 with an octagon barrel!
I think it also might have been a 22 Magnum of some type???
The mind (mine at least!) dims with age.
Another Winchester I wish I had back was a Model 66 "Musket" complete with original bayonet!
I traded that one off to Felix Bedlan for cash and a Model 70 or two. I hope Mr. Bedlan is still among the living - I have NOT heard from him in some years now?
I was never much on collecting the "older" Winchesters like the 73's and 86's and the like.
That one 66 Musket was a notable exception to that though.
Need I say - I wish I had that one back?
The VarmintDaughter has a Model 77 "tube fed" 22 that I bequeathed to her some time ago - for some reason she just loves that one.
When I was teenager I owned a Model 12 "Duck Gun" (3" Magnum!)
- yep I wish't I had not traded that one off as well!
Many many years ago I bought a pre-64 Winchester Model 70 from the original Eddie Bauer store (yeah kids Eddie Bauer used to sell guns in their stores!!!) - anyway this was a mint condition Supergrade Model 70 serial #5354XX - which meant it had been special ordered in 1961 - or long after the Supergrade had been discontinued in standard production in that caliber. The "proof marks" are "right" on this Rifle - I'll never sell this one though so it doesn't need any further proving up than it has.
Yeah a Featherweight Model 70 in 257 Roberts would be a "cool ride"!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Best of the pre 64's for me is a post war 30/30. Those were really sweet handling.

BTW-Mickey is pulling your leg . . . . .

BMT

I have a favorite along with several pre 64's. I have taken a 1937 300 magnum to Africa twice.That old gun just feels like Africa. It shoots 1/2 inch groups with 190 gr hornady boattails at 3000 fps to boot. My other pre64 are a 338, another 300HH, 375 standard and a transition 375 supergrade that may be unfired!I just like these old rifles.

1954 Featherweight in .270, but then the .300HH is a killer,but the .264 is cool,the .338 has fallen a few,as well as the
.30-06 FW...the .300 Win is rare,but the .375 HH is..
oh I can't do this... I don't know!!

BMT: My lifelong friend Jack from Yelm, Washington is left handed and for decades there was not much out there for the "lefties".
Over the decades he owned in excess of 35 Winchester Model 94's ALL in 30/30 caliber - he loved them but he was always trading them around trying to find THE most accurate 30/30 Model 94 there was to be had!
We were Hunting together one time near Bonaparte Lake in north central Washington state - we dropped him off in the morning with one Rifle and that afternoon he came out of the woods with TWO Rifles - one in each hand!
As he walked towards the truck I said to myself "my gawd he found a Rifle out in the woods"!
Nope - he had found a Hunter in the woods who was bargging up to him how accurate HIS Model 94 was - Jack bought it from him there on the spot - there in the wilds of the Okanogan outback country!
Yep I like the "long wood" post war Model 94's myself. They bring a premium anymore.
I will have to talk some sense into this MColeman guy - NOBODY has owned more Remington bolt guns than I have and I tout their accuracy and prowess at the drop of a hat! AND I own a triple trunk load of them to this day - but on their best day a dandy Remington bolt gun of ANY Model won't make a pimple on the ass of a pre-64 Winchester Model 70!
Come out BCOleman - where ever you are hiding at YOU and I need to talk!
Long live the Rifleman's Rifle!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

TexasMark: Whewie! I bet that "transition" Model 375 Supergrade is a beauty!
Good for you on owning that one!
And yes how COOL would a 1937 vintage 300 H&H Magnum be to Hunt with in Africa - many happy returns of that experience!
Years ago I found a "transitional" Model 70 that was in pretty good shape - it had been made in July 1947 - the month I was born!
I had the wonderful custom Riflesmith Dan Cowen of Renton, Washington make a custom Rifle from it for me in caliber 280 Remington!
To this day this is one of my all time favorite Hunting Rifles!
The action IS as smooth as glass!
Man o fire your 300 H&H is shooting WELL - again, good for you!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

The rifle was made in 1887. It is a mishmash of new and old parts. The rifle when I got it had been hot-dipped over the old case colors. I recolored it. The barrel was pitted to almost unshootable condition so I replaced it with an identically profiled barrel. It was a .38-55, it is now a .38-72.

The sights are Montana Vintage Arms 108 Vernier. Front sight is a.. I forget. Probably a Lyman 17a at that time.

The lever is a Helm style lever. They were originally made by Winchester but this one is a clone.

I have three 85s. This one, a .22 (rebuilt) and a reproduction (by Ballard Rifle Company) in .45-70. The latter is somewhat further along and has now shot about 6 matches. But still not quite finished. Checkering and engraving this winter.

Why have a favorite rifle thread with NO PICTURES. That SUCKS! Even bolt rifles are better than nothing to look at.

Rifle: "I" would NOT criticize your choice of the Model 70 Featherweight in 270 Winchester one bit!
I have a set of Model 70 Featherweights (including a Gopher Special" in 243 Winchester) and believe it or not the most difficult for me to find in "mint condition" was the 270!
People bought them, shot them and then HUNTED with them - in other words they all got USED a LOT!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

BrentD: Wow!
What a beatiful set of Rifles you have there!
And great photgraphy also!
Enjoy your "beauties" to the max!
And thanks for the info on your Rifles as well!
More later - dinner bell!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

M64 " Deer Hunters Special"



Ingwe

I regret selling a Winchester 54 that had been reworked from 30-30 to 30-40 Krag. As was common prior to WW2, it had a Lyman Alaskan in a G&H side-mount that was set forward far enough such that the bolt handle didn't need to be modified and a Lyman 48 receiver sight.

I always thought that the coned breach on the 54s and 70s was a negative in the strength department, as it left a portion of the case unsupported. I think that the post-'64 70 FWTs are far better looking than 99% of the pre-'64s that I've seen and I've seen a few of them.

Jeff

Model 94

model 52

Well I only have three of them.

My Dads 32 Win special
My Grandfathers sweet 16 model 97
My Uncles on my mothers side Model 70 first year .264 Win

ingwe

I picked up a M64 last year, what a sweet rifle it is.

I'll go with the Model 69; it was my first rifle and I received it for Chistmas 1956. It is more accurate than either of my 2 Browning Model 52 sporters.

The favorite of the one's I own: Low four digit pre-war .30 Govt '06 Standard Grade.

It currently sits in a Rimrock stock but still has the original bluing.

My favorite of all time? Apre-war Super Grade in .300 H&H It belonged to a farmer I hunted elk with a few times. No finish from the back of the grip to the red pad. Looked like a 2x4. The rest of the stock was probably 90%. Amazing workmanship, inletting, etc. Bausch & Lomb scope too.

It was complete as posted. I am not a fan of the Model 70 no matter what the year. (I kinda posted it as a gouge at Redneck but all in fun).

I am, however, a great fan of the Model 94 Winchester. I had four but am down to one (in pieces) and a 94AE that is ready to go. I've never owned a 94 that was not accurate.

I hate the claw extractor model of the 70 like God hates sin. (I have a ruined Lilja barrel in my scrap pile that makes me hate 'em.)

MColeman, there are OTHER Winchesters besides the M70 you know.

I know. I've owned a ton of them. I had a Model 61 that I sold for, I believe, $40, a Model 69 and many others. My grandfather had a Model 53(?) or 63(?) rimfire that loads through the stock. It was a fun rifle to shoot. I think my brother wound up with it but I'm not sure. I had a Model 70 in .338 Win Mag that would kick you so hard you'd have to clean the boogers off your scope.

I have two.
1885 in 38-55 and
Model 74 .22LR

Mine are a pristine Model 71 .348 and a Model 70 Standard in .30-06.

What about a 25WSSM dipshitt?

My favorite as well.

My 264 Westerner is the best and most accurate rifle I own. When my boys are all grown up, they will say that rifle was "Dads rifle"...

I loaned it out to a Marine that I serve with and he killed a big eight point buck with it a few days ago.

I had the pleasure to meet up with one of the greastest Winchester bolt action collectors in the country. I viewed his whole collection persoanlly. He agreed with my assessment on the 264. And he killed deer with every cal the 54 and 70 was made in.

I held the very first production 270 of any make ever produced. Model 54 w/ serial #3, in 270.

RAS

I call myself a bolt guy, and love my 300H&H standard rifle and 270 fwt. But when push comes to shove my favourites are a pre-war M64 30-30 with Redfield 70 receiver sight, and a pre-war M62A with Lyman #1A.

Is the 25 WSSM a pre-64 dipshitt?

Jeff

I have always admired the Model 71. The one and only time I fired one, I dead centered the bullseye at 100 yards, with it wearing a receiver sight. The owner was dumbfounded

My brother has 3 Model 70's, but I confess I think the M70 starts to work well in the bigger calibers, just due to weight. I'd enjoy having a .338 or .375.

And yes, the 1885's are still something special, many years after JMB designed it.

Now there is another great observation by a Mensa candidate.

Let's see, 35,000 posts in 7 years, that's 5000 a year. divide that by 365 days in a year and you have someone that spends most of his time posting on a website that gives him his pleasure with no real life contact.

Boy, brother, you are a winner. 35,000 one liners with great insight. That's why I come here to learn from the likes of you.

My two favorite pre-64 Winchesters are family hand me downs.

My uncles Model 71 and my grandfathers Model 1890.

I used to follow my uncle thru the black timber chasing elk, when everybody else thought that hunting mule deer was the thing to do, and he carried the 71. Haven't carried it in earnest since I got it a few years ago, but an elk rifle hunt is in the plans for 2010.

The 1890 shoot 22 longs, which are getting hard to get. But the first time I shot a rifle it was in my hands with my dad telling me it was OK and my grandfather standing by. It always gets out for a shooting session on my grandpas B-day.

John(Dog)

LMAO..

Mickey, you just have to tell it like it is.. My answer would be the same if the question asked about favorite Rem 742s..

Now that you mention it the 742 is on the same list.

I've got a couple-three M700s.. They're 'ok', but I'd ditch 'em in a minute for a nice M70... Hehehehehe..

That ought to get your blood pressure up a few pounds..

As I've only been into pre 64s, the model 70's for 5 years or so now,it's hard to come up with a favorite since,that can only come throughyears of use. I am feeling it may be one of my fwts in either 30'06 or .270 but I'm also really liking my newest, a 1955 300 H&H. I have also managed to put away a fwt for each of my 3 kids knowing they will only get harder to find.

Model 71!

I've got several pre-64's

My favorite 22 is a 62A with a tang peep.

My favorite "deer gun" is a pre war 94 30-30 with a Redfield receiver peep sight.

My favorite jackrabbit gun is a 92 32-20 with a tang peep.



And my favorite "bear gun" is a 94 rechambered to 38-55.

Haven't owned a pre 64 model 70.....YET! Am dreaming of a 257 Bob.

Virgil B.

Handwerk: Good for you getting the youngsters a quality, safe and classey Rifle for their futures!
I have a friend that bought each of his three sons a Remington 722 in caliber 257 Roberts for their own uses.
Each of the 3 sons harvested a Mt. Goat with their Rifles and many Deer and Antelope.
Neat thing you did - hope they enjoy them as much as I do mine.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Vbshootinrange: I hope your "dream" of a Model 70 in caliber 257 Roberts comes to fruition!
Decades ago I and a friend were doing a favor for another friend and we were delivering a Model 70 in 257 Roberts to another state.
The Rifle was being sold from one person to another.
We stopped in a gunshop along the way and there was an old box of 257 Roberts ammo on the shelf for just a few bucks!
I bought the ammo and then we went looking for a place to shoot. A while later found a place to shoot "rocks" with the neat old Model 70!
The Rifle was just absolutely sweet to shoot and rather accurate with the open sights on "boulders"!
The Rifle functioned flawlessly and recoil for that heavy 1950's vintage 257 was very mild.
That was the only time I ever fired a 257 Roberts in the old Model 70 Rifle.
Those little Model 62's were great feeling and good shooting Rifles!
I was maybe 7 years old and was visiting relatives in eastern Oregon when my Grandpa asked my older brother to go shoot the Rock Chucks that were invading his garden!
Grandpa showed my brother how to load and shoot his little Model 62 Rifle, for all of about three minutes - and off we go.
My older brother shot a Rock Chuck near the garden and we were sitting in the rocks waiting for another to show up when a Raven flew right over us - my brother shot that Raven out of the air with the first shot!
I was so young I did not even have an idea how difficult that feat was.
Again hope you run across a nifty 257 at a good price.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

MColeman: "To each their own" - I repeat.
If there was damage done to your Lilja barrel oncest it was fitted to a Winchester pre-64 Model 70 action then I surmise it was not the fault of the action BUT WAS the fault of the gunsmith!
I have seen hundreds of Model 70 custom Rifles (including one that won the very prestigious Wimbledon Cup!) with "new" barrels affixed and own several myself - never once have I even heard a rumor as to the old Model 70 action "ruining" a barrel!
Indeed just the exact opposite is my experience!
I see custom Riflesmiths BEGGING for Winchester pre-64 Model 70 actions!
They LOVE to build custom Rifles on this handsome, strong and safe action!
Like I say to each their own but again I will inquire as to just exactly which factory action IS stronger, safer, better looking and more versatile than the Winchester pre-64 Model 70?
Long live THE Riflemans Rifle!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Back in the 50's when I was about 8 years old I had a beautiful cap gun rifle that was modeled after a Winchester Model 64.
I showed it off to one of my aunts and she said she had one just like that. Next time I visted her house she showed me her's and I was forever convinced that this was what a real deer rifle looked like.
I never could afford a real Model 64 as they continued to go up in value, but 10 years ago I found someone who wanted to trade my pre-64 Model 88 for a really nice Model 64. SN shows it was made about the time I had my plastic model 64 cap gun. So now I do own a REAL deer rifle.

The only other pre 64 I own is not a Winchester, but I love it just as much. It was 100 years old this past April and I still hunt with it.
1909 Parker Brother 16ga. VS grade. These are two great classic long guns.

What does one of those 64s go for and what calibers are they found in? Any chance of a .38-55 or possible a .40-65?

You won't be finding one in .38-55 or .40-65...

IIRC they were made in .219 Zipper, .25-35, .30-30, and .32 Win. Spl.

Depending on condition etc...they'll start at about $600+ and I'd guess an original one in good shape in common caliber would be pushing over $1K now.......
Ingwe

What would a mint 1953 Model 70 Supergrade 257 Roberts go for nowaday's?

Don't bother me one bit. I've been raised to pray for those who are 'limited' in intelligence. :)<grin>

I freely admit that I was the one that screwed up the barrel. Never claimed otherwise. Having to cut that confounded extractor slot was the reason I screwed it up.

The Remington 700 is proven to be stronger and stiffer than the Model 70. As to 'better looking' that's up to the individual. There are people who like flat chested women so there's no accounting for taste.

If you prefer the Model 70 then by all means go for it. I'm not about to argue with you over the point.

MColeman: I take your reluctance to answer the question "just exactly which factory action IS stronger, safer, better looking and more versatile than the Winchester pre-64 Model 70" as being an admission you are wrong.
You sir have now stepped into a trap of such overwhelmance that there is NO escape!
Pretending you have not been trapped is a futile endeavour - I must point out that you are trapped and your tangential statement that "if VarmintGuy prefers the Model 70 then go for it" is simply NOT sufficient!
It's not myself that "prefers" these wonderful actions but hoardes of collectors, shooters, Hunters and Riflesmiths - literally around the world!
Your baseless and erroneous "toutations" of the Remington 700 as being "stiffer and stronger" than the pre-64 Winchester Model 70 are just that!
I have been shooting, customizing, buying selling, trading and Hunting with pre-64 Model 70 actions for 50 years now and have as yet to see one of those actions fail in any way shape or form - so AT BEST the Remington 700 COULD be as strong - but certainly not stronger in any regard!
I can not say the same for my extensive experiences with Remington bolt actions - yeah they have failed myself and my friends on rare occassion!!!
Again, I take your acquiescense regarding the Model 70 as a reluctant admission that indeed the pre-64 Winchester Model 70 IS the most versatile, strongest, most handsome and BY FAR the sfaest factory Rifle ever made!
IF you ARE touting the Remington 700 as the "safest, strongest, most versatile and most handsome factory Rifle ever made" (and your tentativeness regarding this confuses me to a point!) then I declare you to be WRONG!
Am I correct in my assumption of your tentative position?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

1885
1886-71
1892-65
63


Late pre-64 Model 70's have never impressed me any more than a GOOD Mauser or 1903. No experience with early 70's.

Bruce

Nice looking rifle, what range would you say you are accurate to with that old girl?

Accuracy? As far as one cares to shoot. I use that rifle or ones similar out to 1000 yds. But I think you probably mean as a hunting rifle. In that case, 300 yds is pretty straight forward if you are practiced at range estimation. Beyond 300, it is not so much the accuracy that's the issue. It is the time that the bullet is in the air. Long enough that an animal that is stationary when you break the shot could move a substantial amount in an unpredictable direction.

So far, 260 yds is about as far as I have ever shot an animal. Never had to shoot further. That buck was about 80 yds.

Brent

My favorite Pre-64's are the M21, M70, M94, and M88. But I like many more of them too.

You need to read Stuart Otteson's books 'Bolt Action Rifles, Vol 1 and Vol 2.

It's obvious that you are a fan of the Model 70 and want to deride anyone who does not agree with you.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You are free to like whatever rifle you like and I have the same option. I don't care what another person likes or doesn't like, especially you.

My 270!!

Beauty. I wish like hell they would have made a few in lefty.

Done!

I like so many of them I have to keep buying them. Here is a picture of the oldest guns...



A couple of Model 70's, a 1949 270 and a 1950 30-06...




I have also just ordered this nice pre-war 22 Hornet...





And my 257 Roberts in the field

Mickey - you are one funny dude - LMAO!

MColeman "I" OWN Mr. Otteson's books!
I am looking up at one of my bookshelves in my library at his two volume signed set, right as I type this.
In fact LET me quote from Mr. Otteson's book regarding THE Winchester pre-64 Model 70 - if you don't mind?
Page 97, writes Mr. Otteson in Volume One, "The coned barrel, combined with the MASSIVE non-rotary extractor, receiver mounted ejector, and partial bolt-face rim added up to form a system tailored to feed, extract and eject cartridges with the utmost speed and CERTAINTY! Purely from that standpoint, there has NEVER BEEN a better system! AND to try and prove this cone breech unsound from a cartridge head support standpoint is POINTLESS! IT has proven adequate through decades of HARD use"!
End quote!
Some capitalization and emphasis added by me to give you direction!
Mr. Otteson goes on to explain many "strong points" of the Model 70 but as do you he does NOT admit that the safety mechanisms built into the Model 70 make it the safest factory bolt action ever made!
Mr. Otteson lists 8 specific and impressive "strong points" regarding the old Model 70 (YOU sir should REVIEW these points!) and then he really has to dig/stretch things to even come up with 3 possible weak points to this action!
One of his "weak points" is that the action has "an inconvenient floorplate release" - I directly disagree with this assessment of his, after many decades of use - I declare that the magazine release IS convenient and it is almost immune to accidental release OR release due to recoil! Those shortcomings are MUCH MORE prevalent on Remington bolt Rifles!
Are they not?
Another of his "weak points" regarding the wonderful old Model 70 action is that the Rifle has a "two piece trigger guard/floorplate assembly" - well at least this statement is true but I again can find NO WEAKNESS or detrimental effect what so ever in this fact!
Beauty is INDEED in the eye of the beholder - AND it can be in the eyes of hoardes of beholders as IS the case for those that love and seek out the exquisitely handsome old Model 70's!
I have many many dozens of Remington bolt action cenetrfire Rifles in my possession right now and NONE of them can be described as anything but passingly plain and simple when it comes to esthetics!
I again state that: Your baseless and erroneous "toutations" of the Remington 700 as being "stiffer and stronger" than the pre-64 Winchester Model 70 are just that!
Ever hear of a factory stock (untampered with!) pre-64 Winchester Model 70 bolt handle breaking off?
Me neither, but I have heard of MANY Remington bolts breaking off!
The Model 70 is more than "strong enough" where strength counts!
Ever hear of a Model 70 trigger part breaking?
Me neither!
I know of several Remington triggers that HAVE outright broken though - I was even served warning (via a registered letter from the fine folks at Remington Arms Corporation) that a Remington 700 PSS I had bought some years earlier had been made with "inferior metal" inside the trigger and was in danger of "doing bad things on me" (I forget the Remington folks verbage here but that is exactly the message they relayed to me in the registered letter).
They sent along directions for me to ship said Rifle back to them so they could replace the trigger at their complete expense!
"Factory recall" in other words from the folks at Big Green!!!
Yeah the Model 70 is much stronger and much safer and much better looking, more versatile and more desirable than even the best of the Remington bolt guns!
And I base that NOT on some gun rags utterings but ON MY own personal experiences with over 100 of the pre-64 Winchester Model 70's and, over 180 Remington centerfire bolt guns I do and have owned!
I want you to know I am not letting you off the hook - I want you to publicly state your choice for the strongest, safest, most versatile, best looking and most sought after factory bolt gun!
I will add "please" to this simple request this time.
This is the third or fourth time I have asked and I will NOT hesitate to ask again and again UNTIL you make that side of the YOUR argument that for some reason, you are "skirting"!
I have stated my choice publicly - why won't you?
Long live the Riflemans Rifle!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Schrapnel: What a great set of pictures!
I especially like the one with the 257 Roberts and the Mule Deer!
Great work there on the harvest and keeping that Roberts alive and well (in good condition!).
Clean the buttplate off on that Roberts especially well will ya - it looks like it was in the blood and ice!
Again thanks for posting the great pics!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Well said..!! Wish I had a hat or something to send you....
Any Remington's I used to own were traded and booted to get Winchesters and Mannlichers,I miss them NOT...
Those that I could not trade off,I gave to people I don't like much anyway.. now ex in-laws...

I have model 70's as they represent the best America had to offer in the mid 20th century. They weren't made as collector's items, they became that after decades of use, abuse and respect for what they embodied in American manufacturing for mainstream use.

This is the 270 this fall on an antelope hunt...





I have to laugh at unique ways of stating common concerns. I once had a 458 Winchester magnum rifle I was trying to sell. One guy came up and said "Everyone should have one of those in his safe and when someone wanted to borrow a gun, loan him the 458. He would never ask to borrow anything again."