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Law would allow lawmakers to carry concealed guns into Capitol



HELENA � As state lawmakers on Monday considered hiring a police officer to beef up Capitol security after a congresswoman was shot in Arizona, a Montana senator has a bill to allow legislators with concealed gun permits to bring their weapons into the statehouse for protection.

At least 17 state legislators appear to have active concealed weapon permits, according to a Gazette State Bureau search of a state Justice Department database.

Senate President Jim Peterson, R-Buffalo, told reporters that legislative leaders met Monday morning and discussed the possibility of adding a police officer to their security. They made no decision and didn't discuss the possibility of adding body scanners or metal detectors, he said.

Meanwhile, Sen. Verdell Jackson, R-Kalispell, on Dec. 30 asked a bill to be drafted to authorize legislators with a concealed weapon permit to carry guns into the Capitol. He would extend the same right to Capitol security guards with permits.

Jackson, who got his permit in 2009, said he put in the bill to give lawmakers the ability to protect themselves in the case of an attack.

�I think what happened (in Arizona) is exactly what could happen right here,� Jackson said.

He said he opposes the installation of metal detectors or body scanners in the Capitol, but thinks allowing those with concealed weapon permits to bring their guns into the building would be a deterrent to attacks.

Utah allows legislators to carry concealed weapons if they have permits, Jackson said, and it prevented a potential incident there in recent years.

�Six senators carry weapons,� he said.

�They had a person who forced his way past the security doors. He swung open the two double doors and was coming down the aisle. He looked up, and six guns were pointing at him. He turned around and ran right into a security guard.�

Jackson said he thinks legislators with permits need the right to carry guns in the Montana Capitol because of threats they receive.

The lawmaker said he drew a number of threats for a bill to allow the state to revoke medical marijuana cards and for opposing a measure that would have allowed school curriculums to include children's books that promote homosexual families.

He is still working on his concealed weapon permit bill this session.

Under the first draft of the bill, any legislators or Capitol security guards with concealed weapon permits could bring their weapons into the Capitol.

The Kalispell lawmaker said he didn't think many lawmakers now have permits.

Jackson said he received hands-on weapon training in 2009 from Gary Marbut, president of the Montana Shooting Sports Association, and had to read several books.

He said he thinks those seeking concealed weapon permits under his bill should receive similar training.

These permits are issued by county sheriffs, he said, and applicants must fill out a form and provide character references.


It's a perfect response to buffer the animated and irrational solutions proposed by the loopy left.
Well Chuckie wannabe, What would Walker say ?

Of course they should....you forgotten 9/11 already ?

Were all CC licensed people allowed to carry, there would have been no 9/11, just a bunch of dead ragheads.

"an armed society is a polite society."

BTW did you know Chuckie was a USAF puke Airpoliceman ? On the AFOQT, the only people with lower scores than APs are cooks.
As long as the voting public can too...
i say if they can legally carry, they should if they want to.
Only if everybody else can.
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.

when do these phumducks get it??? the person is the problem...not the tool...
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.


and no stupid permit required...
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.


and no stupid permit required...


My thoughts exactly, but it is a step in the right direction.

When are people going to realize that the only person that can truly protect you, is you.

And what part of "shall not be infringed" don't they understand.
Originally Posted by CRS
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.


and no stupid permit required...


My thoughts exactly, but it is a step in the right direction.

When are people going to realize that the only person that can truly protect you, is you.

And what part of "shall not be infringed" don't they understand.


What's funny is most politicos who want to pack heat for their protection...probably don't want their subjects doing the same...(not talking MT politicos specifically)
"Guns don't kill people, people kill people."

I don't know the author, but it is dead on. Outlaw flakes like the perp with the Glock in AZ, who was a known nut case.

Wayne
[/quote]

What's funny is most politicos who want to pack heat for their protection...probably don't want their subjects doing the same...(not talking MT politicos specifically) [/quote]

I think that might be what's known as pride in stupidity.
I think they should be issued a carry weapon and ammunition to train with. Why in hell anyone in a public position WOULD NOT want the means to protect themselves and those around them I'll never understand. It's very easy to imagine (conscious dream) a situation where having 2 or 3 good guys returning fire on the bad guy would be good. Just like airliner pilots. If someone in the Arizona crowd had opend fire on skinhead before he emptied that first mag there may have been friendly fire casualties. But I'm betting there wouldn't have been as many intentionally killed by him if he was put down early. Shootem
Sounds fine to me. The more honest (assumption :-) folks carrying the better.
+1
I'm all in favor of legislators being able to carry in the state house......as long as any other citizen who goes there is also allowed to carry.
Originally Posted by TBaker5390
As long as the voting public can too...
Right on.....
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.


and no stupid permit required...


Permit.
License to do that which without said license would be illegal.

ie (aka) Permission.
Same root word. Same meaning. Same, same, same. It's like a hall pass from your high school teacher to go potty.

Follow me so far? Okay. Let's see here what we got. Law makers of a State (a State, mind you, with a Constitution which includes restatement of the Second Amendment... which is a restatement of a BIRTH RIGHT that long preceded the very concept of governments in the first place...) legislating unto themselves permission to do something that without permitting themselves said permission would be illegal. Of course this is if, AND ONLY IF, they have already sought and acquired a permission slip known as a 'Concealed Carry Permit'.

Have I got that right?
They're giving themselves the nod to do something, right? Something which has already been granted them by Lawmakers, right? Something that has already been CLEARLY stated in LAW as their RIGHT, right?

Is this even legal?

How long ago was it that this permission they seek to grant themselves was granted to them in what is commonly known as the Supreme Law of the Land? How many fricken lawyers does it take to figure this out and get it right.... at long last? How many times must this permission be sought and granted? At the risk of sounding like Gus, who's in charge here, anyway? Anybody know for sure?

Can we vote on it?
What of those who vote against it? Are they barred a right while those who vote in favor are granted the permission?
Do we need some lawyer to sort this out? Or have they already sufficiently convoluted the thing?

Only time will tell, right?

Maybe the NRA can fix it. Have they got any lawyers on retainer? Do they have any specific goals?

I'm shaking my head over here. Will someone please help me understand, beyond the customary obfuscation? Please help me in my quest - my persuit - of life, liberty and happiness.

Someone PLEASE pass a law already, will ya?
Let's get this settled.
We need to get this settled.
Hire some lawyers... STAT!



TexasRick,
The Texas state capitol building has an express line for citizens with concealed carry licenses. You don't even have to go through the security check. You just run your permit through a swipe card machine and walk right in.
Originally Posted by TBaker5390
Originally Posted by CRS
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
Originally Posted by ColeYounger
Only if everybody else can.


and no stupid permit required...


My thoughts exactly, but it is a step in the right direction.

When are people going to realize that the only person that can truly protect you, is you.

And what part of "shall not be infringed" don't they understand.


What's funny is most politicos who want to pack heat for their protection...probably don't want their subjects doing the same...(not talking MT politicos specifically)


over 80% of Montana homes have guns, concealed carry laws in Montana currently only matter inside city limits, outside a town and concealed carry is legal without a permit.....wouldnt think it would take much of a step for Montana to extend that to in city limits, not like getting a CC permit is hard in Montana, fill out a form, hand it to your country sheriff and they usually rubber stamp it and the state sends you the permit, atleast on the east end of the state.....

Originally Posted by TexasRick
I'm all in favor of legislators being able to carry in the state house......as long as any other citizen who goes there is also allowed to carry.


grin Montana must be looking at Texas. Here you sure as shooting (pun intended laugh ) can waltz in with you CHL and packing. Matter of fact there are two lines to enter the capitol building. You got your CHL you walk up to the gate, present it to the rent a cop and go right on in packing your piece. No CHL you got to be inspected and go through the metal detector. Hell of a lot longer line for the no permit folks.

Lots of people who have regular business in the State House are getting CHLs (so I am told) just so they don't have to stand in line to get in.

I know our newly elected State Rep carrys and does so in the State House.

As to that deal I don't see why State Legislators should have any less or more rights to effective self defense than anyone else.

It is Montanas business and not mine but I still would say let them carry if they want to.

BCR
This is actually a very good thing. Legislators taking personal responsibilty for their own defense makes it much easier in "borderline" states to convince legislators that the upright everyday John and Jane Q.Citizen are actually much more at risk in their daily lives than they are. Yup. This is the sort of thing that could work out much in our favor if handled correctly.
I think you guys are missing the forest for the trees.
You're blinded by slyness.
And other assorted rot.

I've never understood those who are, seemingly by their very nature, permission seekers.

Not to mention, I've always had a special disdain for permission granters...

My God, man. Be what you're created to be.
Give yourself the nod of approval. It's not like you're some school boy needing to have a piss.

Someone please define sovereign.
And do it without the advice of your fricken attorney!



If one does not have the brains and sense to work with what favorable things they have, then it will never be possible to get to where we need to be. The perfect ambush ain't worth a tinker's damn if some idiot fires a spoiler shot.
As the OP says, Utah legislators can and do carry firearms into the capitol, just like any other permit holder. My son accidentally bumped into one of them one day, and assures me that the good office holder was packin' heat.

Our legislative session is just beginning, and two of our Reps have promised to introduce legislation allowing any person not barred from possession to carry concealed without a permit.

In Utah, anyone with a permit can concealed carry in any public school. Female teacher being stalked by crazy ex-BF? No problem.

There are some things I just love about this state.
I heard a guy (legislator?) on state talk radio that said all legislators should carry that way when all those .45's fell on the floor and go off it would wake up the legislators from their sleep. He was joking of course.

Yes, legislators should carry. That opens the door for everyone to carry.
The "DOOR" is already open.
Originally Posted by EvilTwin
If one does not have the brains and sense to work with what favorable things they have, then it will never be possible to get to where we need to be. The perfect ambush ain't worth a tinker's damn if some idiot fires a spoiler shot.


True enough.

I reckon my only question is, why must one return to a place he's never actually left? He's been made to believe he vacated his position but that has no bearing on the fact he's always been right where he was meant to be... with full rights and authorities wholly in tact.

Favor.
Interesting choice of words...

Here's the way I see it: it doesn't matter where I stand, the whole thing is beneath me. I AM precisely where I was created to be. There's not one thing in the entire cosmos, including God Himself, that can ever take that away from me.

End of sermon.


Originally Posted by EvilTwin
This is actually a very good thing. Legislators taking personal responsibilty for their own defense makes it much easier in "borderline" states to convince legislators that the upright everyday John and Jane Q.Citizen are actually much more at risk in their daily lives than they are. Yup. This is the sort of thing that could work out much in our favor if handled correctly.


You are soo right. Gonna be interesting to stand back and watch. I think that anybody that can legally purchase a handgun should be cleared to carry concealed but that just isn't what the law says. Maybe these lawmakers are on the right track and we just might be the winners.

One can only hope.
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
Originally Posted by EvilTwin
This is actually a very good thing. Legislators taking personal responsibilty for their own defense makes it much easier in "borderline" states to convince legislators that the upright everyday John and Jane Q.Citizen are actually much more at risk in their daily lives than they are. Yup. This is the sort of thing that could work out much in our favor if handled correctly.


You are soo right. Gonna be interesting to stand back and watch. I think that anybody that can legally purchase a handgun should be cleared to carry concealed but that just isn't what the law says. Maybe these lawmakers are on the right track and we just might be the winners.

One can only hope.


actually the law does say that if your outside city limits......Montanas concealed carry laws only apply inside city limits and the usual government buildings and such that are found outside of city limits.....if your out hiking and can legally own a gun you can pack a pistol concealed legally without a permit.....wouldnt be much of a stretch to change the law to remove the city limits stipulation or even go farther....
Yes they have the right.

Quote
Jackson said he thinks legislators with permits need the right to carry guns in the Montana Capitol because of threats they receive


That, however, rubs me the wrong way. Legislators should not pass any law/regulation that grants the exclusive rights.
Everyone should be packing from the Atlantic to the Pacific.
and don't get caught packin' in a logging camp...
Originally Posted by Bigbuck215
and don't get caught packin' in a logging camp...


I was going to say I thought the law also included what I think is referred to as "incorporated" camps. Logging and railroad are two that come to mind. I would imagine fire camps would be another.
Right on then we don't have to buy them body guards.
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