They had BETTER do the story justice. So far, seems to follow the events as I remember reading them in the book.
Yeah - I know the actors are weenies who are libs and love to suck crank, I'm there for the story of the men of that Team, not the actors' lives at home....
I don't think I'd be able to shoot an unarmed goat herder's kid. What I sure as hell could do is truss his ass up, gag him, blindfold him and tie him to a tree. Or a rope around his neck and take him with me until safe to leave him...
I had the pleasure of attending a speach Marcus Luttrell speak in TX a few years ago. A Supremely humble man with an amazing story.
Interesting I read the book when it came out. I got quite a bit of arrogance out of it, that turned me off.
Boggy knows the kid or his family IIRC and says he isn't like the book makes it sound, he is a good country kid.
So I suspect the writing f'd the whole thing up and the movie woudl be no different.
A shame, that.
I found the writing in the book to be a bit of a turnoff as well. Great story about great men, but it seemed at times the all the book was doing was trying to convince me how great the seals are. I don't need any convincing.
Another good read is "The Outpost" by Jake Tapper. The placement of that outpost was insane by every measure and cost the lives of alot of good men. Politics over good military judgment.
Wasn't there some also some legitimate criticism of the SEAL mission in Lone Survivor. Ended up costing alot of good SEALS---the four men in the original mission and then the rescue team in the Helo. Seemed like there was alot of second guessing as to the wisdom of missions that risk getting very valuable assets (SEALS) killed when the return on investment in terms of the military target was so low.
I was not at all turned off by Survivor, but I sure was by the book by the Marine Corp sniper who was killed. Lots of gratuitious expletives and the tone was way too full of braggadocio. I too have heard that Luttrell is a genuinely good guy. After reading Survivor you cannot help but respect the guy immensely. How a man can heal from those psychological wounds is beyond me.
I don't think I'd be able to shoot an unarmed goat herder's kid. What I sure as hell could do is truss his ass up, gag him, blindfold him and tie him to a tree. Or a rope around his neck and take him with me until safe to leave him...
wow seem some folks on the fire aint been up to your ears!!! on a patrol..just sayin
I don't think I'd be able to shoot an unarmed goat herder's kid. What I sure as hell could do is truss his ass up, gag him, blindfold him and tie him to a tree. Or a rope around his neck and take him with me until safe to leave him...
wow seem some folks on the fire aint been up to your ears!!! on a patrol..just sayin
EVERY person I know who has actually been in the military can spell. You, obviously, have not.
During the first Gulf War, two different SF A-teams got compromised (their hide sites were discovered) by kids in Iraq. Neither one of them capped the kid. Both times a company of Iraqi troops showed up. About half of the guys on each team were sniper qualified and they held 'em off until they could get CAS to bomb the [bleep] out of them and Blackhawks could fly the over 200miles there to pick 'em up.
SEALS are some hard mofos but they are not noted for making sound tactical decisions. I don't know what training their officers recieve but I really have to wonder if it is as thorough as something like what Marine O's go through at Quantico.
I had the pleasure of attending a speach Marcus Luttrell speak in TX a few years ago. A Supremely humble man with an amazing story.
Interesting I read the book when it came out. I got quite a bit of arrogance out of it, that turned me off.
Boggy knows the kid or his family IIRC and says he isn't like the book makes it sound, he is a good country kid.
So I suspect the writing f'd the whole thing up and the movie woudl be no different.
A shame, that.
Could you be confusing arrogance with confidence? I'd think that's at the top of any SEAL mission list of equipment.
I thought the book make clear what it takes to become a SEAL.
Yes I certainly could be. I'm not sure how that is relevant to the story though, but then again I've done enough reading about what spec ops go through, that having to re read it and be told how bad ass they are, didn't do it for me OR apply to the story.
But I"ve said it before, I'm different, and that also probably applies.
I've been told I was arrogant too when in competitive shooting, and I'm not one to be arrogant at all, simply confident.
You make a good point and that crossed my mind as I read it, but couldn't get it out of my brain to accept it as such.
It may well apply very well to those not as read up on spec op teams as I am.
During the first Gulf War, two different SF A-teams got compromised (their hide sites were discovered) by kids in Iraq. Neither one of them capped the kid. Both times a company of Iraqi troops showed up. About half of the guys on each team were sniper qualified and they held 'em off until they could get CAS to bomb the [bleep] out of them and Blackhawks could fly the over 200miles there to pick 'em up.
SEALS are some hard mofos but they are not noted for making sound tactical decisions. I don't know what training their officers recieve but I really have to wonder if it is as thorough as something like what Marine O's go through at Quantico.
Not noted for making sound tactical decisions?
As to your comparison between Marine officers and SEAL officers goes, I wouldn't want either in my backyard looking for me. The difference is you'll hear/see the marines coming forward, you'll never know the SEAL's were there. Totally different approach to the mission.
Of course hindsight is 20/20. It's easy for us to armchair quarterback the situation, but the reality is that a whole series of questionable decisions were made on that mountain which ultimately got a lot of good SEALs killed. The never give up attitude got that team into the situation and it also got Luttrell out. The book was riveting, hopefully the movie does the story and the men involved justice.
I have read both books and felt both were full of confidence, but nothing more. In Kyle's book, he does not give the number of kills he had. If he was into bragging, he would have gave it.
Bottom line is this. The books were written for entertainment and I am sure there were times the authors had issues with how the editors wanted it written. But beyond that, I am proud of them for the jobs they did for my country. I am grateful they are on my side and I feel bad that SEALs died unneccessary deaths. Both are very good books and I look forward to seeing this movie.... when in comes out on DVD as I never actually go to a movie theatre!
They executed a Soviet-style "raid" on that airfield and got their asses handed to 'em. The operators knew it was stupid but they were ordered to go. I would have told my O's to go FOAD.
Perhaps the thought and why some think that they don't make sound tactical decisions is that these folks are driven and many just don't understand that. Driven beyond sacrifice. They understood that when they signed on that line it was for all the marbles, they fully realize the consequences of that and have moved beyond that. They understand that their teammates are of the same thinking and it goes unsaid but understood. They see the bigger picture, have weighed the options and made the choice. These men are true heros and like true heros expect nothing in return for what they have done but peace and quiet.
An underlying theme I noticed in most books of this ilk is how the Geneva convention and our present government determine what's black and what's white in gray areas. These operators are given a mission and told how to do it by someone with zero experience, micromanaged throughout the mission and then judged by the same people when things go awry. Against an enemy with no scruples, our men are held at a ridiculous standard that alone compromises their objective. Political correctness and liberal bleeding hearts put these highly trained operators in harms way. My thought, give the orders and get out of the way. Don't ask questions afterward. Maybe then the goat herder boy wouldn't have compromised the situation. My feeling is if they had executed him, the seals would have been crucified. Undoubtedly, they'd of been scrutinized if they'd neutralized him non lethally. Can't win for losing....
They executed a Soviet-style "raid" on that airfield and got their asses handed to 'em. The operators knew it was stupid but they were ordered to go. I would have told my O's to go FOAD.
wow seem some folks on the fire aint been up to your ears!!! on a patrol..just sayin
Sure haven't. Is it a common practice on patrol to whack unarmed kids? Serious question.
In my limited experience of three trips/tours/missions to Central America in the late 80's when we were dealing with Ortega's Sandinistas, I personally was involved in two incidents where we unexpectedly encountered non-combatants in sensitive areas, and one was a boy, there was never any question of harming them in any way. They were free to go. One incident, we believe our cover was blown as a result, the other it wasn't.
It was fairly well known in the military community that pre-GWOT, SEALs were not the guys you wanted for a mission that strayed very far from water and involved much time patrolling, or for more prolonged missions. Nothing wrong with that. A unit only has so much time to train, and the SEALs were specialists in other areas. Doesn't take away from their effectiveness, it's just that a guy has to keep in mind they aren't a bunch of freakin' James Bonds, capable of all tasks.
Since 9/11, much of that has changed. In large part due to a constant deployment cycle to the Mid-East where these guys get a lot of time on the ground.
wow seem some folks on the fire aint been up to your ears!!! on a patrol..just sayin
Sure haven't. Is it a common practice on patrol to whack unarmed kids? Serious question.
In my limited experience of three trips/tours/missions to Central America in the late 80's when we were dealing with Ortega's Sandinistas, I personally was involved in two incidents where we unexpectedly encountered non-combatants in sensitive areas, and one was a boy, there was never any question of harming them in any way. They were free to go. One incident, we believe our cover was blown as a result, the other it wasn't.
Thanks for your service and personal story, sir. Sounds like you served with honor and distinction, and I appreciate the input.
Point of interest; IIRC Chris Kyle in his book refrained from shooting a small boy sent to retrieve an RPG w/launcher. This after shooting the original adult male owner plus a second adult male who made the attempt. He did not shoot the child even though he knew he had been sent by the enemy to retrieve that weapon.
I could GAS if he were arrogant on account of I do believe that by his actions he preserved the lives of mare than a few our troops.
I was not at all turned off by Survivor, but I sure was by the book by the Marine Corp sniper who was killed. Lots of gratuitious expletives and the tone was way too full of braggadocio.
"As part of Luttrell's recuperation he was given a yellow Labrador puppy. He named the dog DASY. Each letter of the name "DASY" represents one of the members of his team�Danny Dietz, Matthew "Axe" Axelson, Southern boy (Marcus), and Michael "Yankee" Murphy. She was given to him in recovery to help him through rehabilitation.[11] On April 1, 2009, four males approached Luttrell's property and killed DASY with a .357 Magnum revolver at approximately 1 A.M.[11][12] Luttrell proceeded to chase the individuals through four counties in his truck armed with two 9 mm Berettas�until Onalaska Police apprehended the individuals.[13] Upon arrest, the suspects verbally threatened Luttrell's life and taunted him.[12] Alfonso Hernandez was arrested on-scene for driving without a valid drivers license and later charged with animal cruelty.[14] Michael Edmonds turned himself in on April 7, was booked, and posted bond on the same charge. The other two individuals were not indicted. The males are also suspects in the killings of other neighborhood dogs.[11] On Nov. 29, 2011, Marcus posted on his Facebook Page that "Court date on Thursday for DASY's killer's I'll keep y'all posted on what happens. It's only been almost 3 years glad it's finally here" and again on Dec. 1, saying they were found guilty.[15] On March 7, 2012, Alfonso Hernandez was given the maximum sentence of two years in a state jail for the felony charge of animal cruelty and fined $1,000. After his guilty plea and testimony against Hernandez, Michael John Edmonds was sentenced to five years probation and fined $1,000 for the same offense. At the sentencing, Luttrell testified that he was �still pretty upset� about the killing of DASY and that he felt both defendants should have gotten the maximum sentence.[16]"
Skeezix- As stated, thanks for your service and insight.
Always find it intersecting those who have never even served discuss "operators" as if they know what they're talking about.
As for killing the kid...... Really? How american. Not exactly by, with and through is it TAK.....
Here's some reality. No one, no organization, no unit is as good as the public thinks they are. When members of those organizations start believing their own hype bad things happen.
Marcus endured. Good men died. A modicum of tactical knowledge and maturity would make it obvious that they made a lot of very bad decisions that led to the end result.
