Why is the gov, hoarding 22 ammo? a friend Gunsmith told me the Gov is storing it in warehouses. What I would like to know is why FOX news has not done a story on why the gov, is buying and storing 22 ammo when they have little use for it at taxpayers expense. If anyone knows how to get the news on an item with so much waste, now is a good time to do it. I do not know how to notify the news. but with so much talent on here someone should know what to do../.

My guess is they won't cover a story that doesn't have at least one thread of truth to it.

Your source of info. is your friend and "gunsmith" and his source of info. is? Neighbor? Uncle? Brother? brother-in-law? A friend of a friend of a friend?

Who saw a link on Fox news website about the Govt's regular contract purchase of 10 million rounds of .40 cal or something and made a leap or lapse in memory

Mike

WTF are you drinking?smoking snorting? LMAO to type that for pubic view? Don't you know they don't have time for BS like that when they have dozens of UFO's to hide...Jezzz

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2014/04/why-cant-i-find-22-lr-ammunition-sierra-vp-speaks-out/

I just spit some damn good Bourbon out..LMAO!

Gunsmith conspiracy theorist.

If he was to install a ceiling fan, would he call himself an electrician too?


Just ask him.

Well, for starters, if there is any truth in it, they use 22 for military training quite a bit, or have in the past.... govt had bazzillions of rounds of old stuff that CMP would give out to the youth shooters in years gone by.

just because something sounds 'crazy' at first glance, does NOT mean there is no truth to it.
Stop for a moment, and look at what .gov is doing, and think back, say 10 or 20 years. In 1994, we would have laughed at anyone that said .gov was going to be spying on every Citizen, that the EPA was going to ursurp the Constitution, that the DOJ would protect the IRS from it's political thugery. Right?

So, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they are watching you?

dang but that's a funny poster


and I seem to resemble that cat in the hat


or maybe I just have a hat...like that!

I'd be interested in the source of the source as well.

govt has always stored there ammo in warehouses.

Man if someone had the figures to post on how much ammo is stored... folks around would melt down...

well,all this ammo is where? The people who stockpilied and drove the trucks and ran the forklifts...step forward,please..
I grew up at FT Bragg and many trips into the biggest armory on the east cost.I've seen 3M rounds of ammo...

This...

Probably the best explanation yet!

Unfortunately our .Gov has lost a lot of credibility in the last 50 years. Starting with the Kennedy assassination and the secrecy of the investigation. Now we have them spying on us at every turn. They earned that mistrust. It's no accident. kwg

There are 100s and 100s of conspiracy theories out there. There has to be more than a few that aren't just theory.

Probably. But why would the government be interested in .22 ammo? Everything else is quite readily available,so what benefit would it be to hoard .22? Besides, there are some places where its not that difficult to find this ammo. If gov stole it all, it would be gone everywhere.

If you guys haven't read this, it makes a lot of sense. When you read the numbers and realize they are low balling it, it's a Holy Smokes type thing.

One of the primary functions of a government is lying to those being governed. It always has and always will.

really..propoganda?
People beleive the Internet more than the Bible

my buddy knows a guy who's brother works with a guy who used to work at walmart. he said every week the ammo truck comes and they load most of it into an unmarked truck with govt plates.

and theres no one driving the govt truck. it drives itself!!!

DUN DUH DUH!!!

Many were saying exactly that, and no one (smart) was laughing

http://sierrabullets.wordpress.com/2014/04/07/why-cant-i-find-22-lr-ammunition/

I swear I'm not hurting all y'alls chances of buying .22 RF. I'm still shootin' stuff purchased in '99, one dead pig at a time. Just looking at the landscape...you can cast bullets and reload CF cheaper than a lot of rimfire ammo. BP flinters are a LOT cheaper, especially the small bores like .32/.36. 10 grains of BP will make a .32 RB whiz fair sharp.

2 choices: Bitch about it or do something about it.

With 20+ in manufactuing, I would assume that the .22 shortage is because it makes the least profit. The profit from .22's is from volume, millions and millions of bullets at .01 profit per bullet. With shortages in powder, lead, Etc., it would make since that the manufactures are producing the products that make the highest amount of profit first.

I'll go out to a fema camp up here tomorrow and see what's up.

I'm sick of this chit!

The profit in 22's? Resale! The walymart clerks taking $10 to make a call when rim fires come in and the night shift guys coming in at 3 am and buying the lot. Then re- selling the stuff for 3 to 5 times cost.

If we stop buying the over priced stuff, it will settle down.

So for now, reload .

A few things come to mind:
- some military, at least the AF transitioned from 5.56 to .22 LR for the majority of their qualification training.
- there are more badge/gun carrying units in the Federal government than ever (not that I agree with it, but I'm sure that factors into total buy numbers.
- a good portion of all Fed ammo is warehoused or bunkered somewhere just yo meet regulations.
- most of the contracts you hear about are "blanket" or "not-to-exceed" quantities which do not necessarily reflect what is being bought.

FWIW.....

.gov is hoarding all the black powder too

Add Strike Anywhere matches to the list as well

PA is fertile ground for wild imaginations.

This is not far fetched at all, and could be entirely accurate.

Back in the 80's my father's best buddy, hunting buddy, and second father to me, was a field grade officer in the Army, worked at several army depots across the US. I remember him telling of one in particular, close to where we lived, where he said they had bunkers full of .22lr ammo. As with some here, that surprised me as I wondered what use in the world the Army would have for that much rimfire ammo. His explanation was this: The .22lr was the most commonly held firearm in American households. If a household has at least one firearm, it's a damned good bet there's a .22lr in the mix. The ,22lr ammunition was being stored in the event of an invasion of the US by another country, whereby attempts would be made to distribute the ammo to civilians for use in a resistance to the invading forces.

Zero reason to doubt him, the guy never bullshitted a day in his life.

No schit!!! Someone finally got a photo of TRH

" The ,22lr ammunition was being stored in the event of an invasion of the US by another country, whereby attempts would be made to distribute the ammo to civilians for use in a resistance to the invading forces. "

20 years ago, that might have been the case. IMHO it would more likely be used against us, rather than protect us (at least by the current administration).


The REAL reason for the shortage is that Eric Holder has been handing out bricks of 22LR to the illegals as they cross the Rio Grande, along with instructions for free housing, welfare checks, Obama phones, drivers license & voter registration info. Or, at least that's what I heard. :-) -TomT

Uh, horsefeathers....

Since when?

Not saying its true, but with merely 100 more guys just like you over the past 10 years- a paltry 10 gvmt workers per year- there could be billions of additional rounds stored.

You alone have seen 3million rnds. What's so special about you?

They may not be hoarding but they, along with state gov, sure as hell have made it more difficult to obtain.

Damn near every mom and pop has been forced out of buis within 30 miles of me. dozens. Remaining chains and local chains consolidate availability, no one really bitches about it, and then they concede to rules on who, how much, and what fees are placed on purchases.

a lb of 777 or similar is approaching $40 a lb, ifyou can find primers they are outrageous, tarrifs on net purchases preclude cost efficiency.

Hoarding, no, but close to everything else to eliminate it short of outright liegislative bans.

and then there was the Y2K ordeal too , now how was that , that turned out oh yea some people made lots of $$ form scared people, personally I never noticed a damn thing

Never underestimate what the government has. In late 1968 or early 1969 I was standing guard duty at our motor pool facility in QuiNhon, Vietnam, when another soldier asked if I wanted to see something weird. When I was relieved, I went and looked at a conex full of Ben Pearson longbows. No strings or arrows, just boxes of new bows. We were a communications company. They were setting there when I got in country and still there when I left, one year later. miles

The author is right, but leaves one important point out. The usual market reaction to rarity in the face of high demand is for prices at all levels to increase until equilibrium is restored between supply and demand. For some reason, the prices at all levels are not increasing to restore said equilibrium, i.e., manufacturers, suppliers, and big box retailers are artificially maintaining a very low price point in relation to real demand. This leaves the market vulnerable to the gougers, who have made a business of going around and waiting in the early morning hours for the deliveries, buying up all they can, and reselling it at gun shows at exorbitant profit to eager hoarders.

If the prices, starting at the manufacturing stage, were matched to real demand, then the prices at the big box retailers would have to be high enough to eliminate any possible profit motive on the part of the gougers. The result would be a rapid return of equilibrium between supply and demand, followed by a return to realistic pricing and supplies on the shelves.

In a free market, where pricing is allowed to increase at all levels whenever demand outstrips supply, short supply of manufactured goods just doesn't occur (it ordinarily only occurs in centrally managed economies like those in communist countries), or at least not for very long. We need to find out why manufacturers are holding down their prices to artificially low levels in the face of high demand, thus throwing a monkey wrench into the normal operation of the market and a return to equilibrium.

There was a thread on ARFCOM that I read last night. A guy in Alaska bought 32 bricks, 72,000+ rounds from a walmart that got something like 1 million rounds between 3 walmarts and was going back for more.

LINK: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/16..._FIRST_POST_MANY_PICS_OF_NECKBEARDS.html


THIS is why the rest of us who actually work for a living and don't have time to be at walmart first thing every morning cannot buy ammo.

Fuqtards like this are hosing everyone else.

I have bought exactly 2 bricks since all this started. It is non existent around here, unless you do unscrupulous stuff like this guy.

We are our own worst enemy....

Sure, many of the theories are likely false, as to the details. That's not to say, however, that conspiracy isn't normal practice in the halls of power. It's part and parcel of human nature to corrupt systems in which they wield power in order to clear the way for conspiracy. It's been the norm since the dawn of civilization. How anyone who's made even the most cursory study of history cannot know this is beyond my comprehension.

PS Particular theories regarding conspiracy, however, ought to be backed with significant evidence before being believed. This one fails that test. Could it be true? Well, that's an entirely different question, and the answer is clearly yes.

Make sure that when you find it, or powder, or bullets, you post about it on numerous forums so people can get it before someone else does..

We used to pick up ammo at Red River Army Depot for CMP stuff.

We'd get something on the order of 100K rounds of 22 every year plus others. When you drive by the bunkers and realize how many other folks were getting it, 3M rounds of ammo ain't squat....

Armorys IIRC< are not for storing ammo, thats why you go to a depot...for storage of stuff.

Being that we were buying ammo made in the late 60s... one can only wonder how many bazillion rounds of all kinds of ammo would be in storage.

And of course the other explanations, you used to have to shop for ammo...

In this technological day and time, you can google a search every morning for ammo... and where in the US it might be. Used to be you'd shop local here or drive to a larger town to Carter Country or such...

And now when anyone finds anything, its posted here and other places on teh web on forums to boot, and its gone almost instantly.

Technology mixed with fear can be an awesome thing.

Regardless when the folks that are going to come kill me to fill their fema coffins, and I"m not saying it couldn't happen, will have guns and ammo of their own. To the winner of those confrontations go the spoils... I"m figuring if I"m lucky or good, I"ll have more than enough to go around for a while each time it might happen.

So, who wants to be the depot and who wants to be the armory?

Yep

gun show in northern BC this last weekend , one table had any 22 ammo [ style and manufacturer] that you wanted and over 100 lbs of powder not to cheep not 2 expensive , but nothing left at the end of show.

norm

come on due the math 32 bricks are only 16'000 rounds , somebody's [bleep] u.

norm

Laughin'...



Travis

Doesn't matter if the math is wrong or right, the point is, folks that knew they could buy a few boxes or a brick every time they needed it are now FINALLY thinking about buying by the case instead.... and if they would have to start with there would not be all this panic...

I've always TRIED to buy enough whatever to have a years worth stashed for reserve. Whatever that amount means to you.

When everyone now is buying probably 4X at least, of what they normally bought when they went to the store. And are panicked enough to not just go to the store but to order on line, drive to look for it etc... and then the scalpers get involved... its really easy to see why we are where we are.

Of course allt hat being said, everytime I've looked online for 22 ammo, I"ve always found it easy to find if someone wants to pay the price....

most every store I walk into has it .

norm

You've been listening to Travis. And I agree.

Yep. Just heard another second-hand report of a WM employee facilitating is ammo-scalper friend.

Two ways to fix this....find a way to get the ammo manufacturers to raise the price to reflect the market, or this....

Those of us who already have enough to get by should buy every bit of it that we happen across at "normal" prices....and then offer it to people we know who will USE IT, at the same price we paid. I like the idea of that even more, because if enough of us do it, some scalpers are gonna get burned.

That's because there is relatively little demand for it in your country.

I know a guy whose wife's hairdresser's second cousin once made up a conspiracy and posted it on the internet.

Must be true.

Allow me to give you the real reason behind all this in three words:

Pogo was right.

Pogo was right about a lot of things. I miss Pogo.

Doesn't matter where the price increase starts, either horizontally or vertically. If Wal-Mart suddenly doubled its prices, that alone would serve. It'd give competitors room to double their prices as well, and if there was a big gap between retail pricing and distributor pricing, that'd make room for more retailers to get into the market, which would bring demand on the distributors up and raise prices at that level. Ammo would cost more, but at least you could get it when you wanted it, if you wanted it badly enough to pay for it, rather than having it at rock-bottom prices but all sold out so that you couldn't get any no matter how much you were willing to pay.

The best thing that could happen to the 22LR market at this point would be for some fairly large retailer--doesn't matter who--to raise their prices until they could maintain at least a little stock.

Remember that decades-old Super Bowl commercial with the white screen over the busy signal? CompuServe was making the point that while a CompuServe subscription cost more than an America On-Line subscription, dialing into AOL was very likely to produce a busy signal, while dialing into CS almost never did. It was a powerful message that resulted in a powerful response (I was working for CompuServe at the time), and some company could make a killing with a reputation for reliability: "You want ammo? No problem: we have ammo for you. No shortage here."

Dominos would start falling at that point that would either clear the market and settle prices back down to near what they used to be, or make Big & Visible the real reason for the shortage, whatever that may be--or for what we now view as the shortage, which may actually not be a shortage at all.

Given that the big retailers are choosing not to do that, the small retailers (scalpers) are trying to fill that role, which is commendable, but they're not big enough to swing the kind of weight Wal-Mart or even Cabela's or Cheaper Than Dirt could.

Charging the highest price the market will bear is not a bad thing: it's a good thing. So is paying the lowest price you can find. Prices are the information that keeps the market flowing, and artificial or false prices are lies that screw it all up.

Didn't Cheaper Than Dirt raise it's prices to scalper levels? I seem to remember a thread a while back that was HIGHLY critical of Cheaper Than Dirt for raising it's prices to "obscene" levels. Have they since lowered their prices? Was that because of the criticism? Did Wal-Mart and Cabela's learn from that? If they did raise their prices, were they not big enough to cause Wal-Mart and Cabela's to raise their prices?

This will all end when people quit being afraid. When will that be? Your guess is as good as mine.

Very funny.

Concisely stated, and correct.

I don't really know. I bought several kilorounds of a number of different calibers of ammunition (I'll only own a gun if it's chambered in one of five specific calibers, so it's not that big a deal) just before the big shortage began, and I'm still shooting that, so I've been pretty much out of the ammo market since then.

I bought a 555 box about a year ago and I've still got half of it sitting on the shelf. I've also added a box or two here and there since then. The fact of the matter is, I don't have time or money to go out and shoot like some of these others around here do. I want to see the insanity end and I can wait until it does. Once it does, I'll buy another brick or two and be set for a good long while. I might even buy a case and be set pretty much for the rest of my life.

For those of you too young to remember, Pogo was a renowned comic strip. One of the most-often-quoted lines from Pogo was:

"We have met the enemy, and he is us."

Truth.

Thanks Rocky, but I'd already looked him up!

yes

It's been difficult to find BP for several years. I gave up searching. I just use 777 now.

Not difficult at all. These folks ( LINK ) will deliver right to your door.

Ed

Right
Right

25 lbs minimum order. That's that difficult part I had run into.

Way more than I would ever need for my 32cal system 1 T/C

The way people overcome that is to get a bunch of other people to go into the order with you, for example by posting an ad on the bulletin board at your gun club seeking others to go in on the purchase.

THE PUPLIC IS DOING MOST OF THE HOARDING.

That's my view, too. But there's a natural solution that's being prevented from applying itself. I talk about it in my first post here.

There is not min order with Powder, Inc. There is a quantity at which they do no charge HAZMAT.

It has taken quite a while. But people are finally realizing I'm right.



Travis

Correct.

What would these small order rookies do without us?



Travis

I just found some 22s. I bought 2 boxes, and am ashamed to publicly admit I paid 7 bucks a box for blazers.

Going rate dude. Not much you can do.



Travis

Yeah I/we will have to deal with an out of control gopher population again this summer.

Was that way for a good number of years before I retired in 2004. At least for other than SPs. Different now?