I was looking on Armslist for guns in my home state, figuring if I found something I would just buy face to face after a drivers license check and possibly with a bill of sale.
I found a very nice shotgun at a great price. I contacted the guy and told him I would buy the gun if it was as he described and we could do a face to face. His first reply was that he didn't do face to face and asked if I had an FFL.
Sounded suspicious to me but I think maybe he is worried about getting robbed or something. My next reply was no problem, just name a local FFL and we can meet there. I'll pay for the unnecessary transfer and pay him cash in person.
His next reply is that he is located in Indiana and can only ship to an FFL. My next reply is why is his location listed as Alabama on Armslist and no problem, I can meet him at the FFL of his choice in Indiana.
Now, I don't plan on going to Indiana, but was interested in what he would reply.I also checked Indiana Armslist and there is no listing for his gun.
Is this simply a scam which I strongly suspect, or is there some possibility that there was a mistake about his location? Is there any safe way to do this deal? Possibly getting his local FFL to ship the gun and talking to that FFL to make sure he has the gun ready to ship before I send the money? I would call the place of business myself, not relying on his contact information.
Basically I think this is just a scam but how can someone protect themselves when doing transactions like this, so I will know for future reference?
As you've already found out, if it sounds at all fishy, don't do it. Another red flag is when they refuse, for whatever reason, to talk with you on the phone. Another thing, if it seems like a really good deal, copy the ad details & run a Google search. It will frequently come up as being part of a completed Gunbroker, Gunsamerica, or Gunauction listing. They copy & paste the ad details, and even use the same pictures.
This. I had armslist deal where the guy in NV wouldn't send me the serial number or a picture with the serial number in it. He kept asking why I wanted it. I told him so I could verify that the gun shipped to my FFL as the correct firearm. He was unwilling so I told him I'd take a pass.
Yeah, I watched armslist for a while and then dropped it totally. Won't trust it at all for something that's not face to face, and now I'm not even wanting to do a face to face.
It's a shame. All Armslist would have to do is similar to what gunbroker does, just make people confirm their identity with a credit card or some other method.
I haven't used Armslist , but made a similar mistake on Midwest gun trader. Missed the State block option while listing and by default, my ad came up as Alabama. It's the first one in the list. In this case it may just be an honest mistake.
I haven't used Armslist , but made a similar mistake on Midwest gun trader. Missed the State block option while listing and by default, my ad came up as Alabama. It's the first one in the list. In this case it may just be an honest mistake.
Thanks, I was wondering how that could happen.
Still I was looking for any reasonable ways to do a transaction and protect myself, such as my suggestion of contact through an FFL on his side. I didn't know if something like that sounded reasonable or not.
I have posted this before here numerous times. I buy more guns on Armslist than any other site. Most likely because there are more guns there than any other site. At least twice a week Armslist notifies ,VIA E Mail, that my inquiry has been a scam, I have already labeled it as such. I have a list of questions for seller and phone conversation or 2.. or 3.In the event of a red flag have to be very careful. I sometimes will travel across the country to be sure of seller and merchandise. However, most items are shipped. I have never been burned and have a lot of good deals to show for my efforts. Armslist is not for the pussies or novices. I usually make a good judgement on the phone, The one bad judgement I made was my deal with RH Clark. He did not have the balls to tell me he couldn't do the deal. I asked him to send payment to my wife and he said I changed the terms and he could not deal with me. He did not ask or say he would send payment to me.. But, luck was on my side as it turns out I didn't have to worry about him paying me. RH Clark Armslist is not for you �.you do not have the wherewithal. Now go ahead and look for like=minded nitwits to ask if you did" right". If you gotta ask you will never know. Go tend your trotline. I do not hide behind the anonymity of the internet. I will tell anybody face to face what I post. I am: Chuck Ellison 22620 Cottage Grove Ave, Steger, ILL 60475
I've bought and sold many guns on armslist without any problems. The scams are usually easy to spot. One of the first clues is when they only list a state and not a city. Armslist was designed for local transactions. Face to face. Same as how the classifieds worked when we all read the paper.
The best advice I can give is always meet face-to-face, deal in cash, carry concealed when you go, and use good judgement leading up to the transaction.
I have posted this before here numerous times. I buy more guns on Armslist than any other site. Most likely because there are more guns there than any other site. At least twice a week Armslist notifies ,VIA E Mail, that my inquiry has been a scam, I have already labeled it as such. I have a list of questions for seller and phone conversation or 2.. or 3.In the event of a red flag have to be very careful. I sometimes will travel across the country to be sure of seller and merchandise. However, most items are shipped. I have never been burned and have a lot of good deals to show for my efforts. Armslist is not for the pussies or novices. I usually make a good judgement on the phone, The one bad judgement I made was my deal with RH Clark. He did not have the balls to tell me he couldn't do the deal. I asked him to send payment to my wife and he said I changed the terms and he could not deal with me. He did not ask or say he would send payment to me.. But, luck was on my side as it turns out I didn't have to worry about him paying me. RH Clark Armslist is not for you �.you do not have the wherewithal. Now go ahead and look for like=minded nitwits to ask if you did" right". If you gotta ask you will never know. Go tend your trotline. I do not hide behind the anonymity of the internet. I will tell anybody face to face what I post. I am: Chuck Ellison 22620 Cottage Grove Ave, Steger, ILL 60475
708-638-3387
60475
Mr, Ellison I've done everything I know to do in this situation with you. Money never changed hands and the only thing I did to you was not trusting you. I did get spooked when you wanted payment in your wife's name. I apologized for that.
You need to get over it and move on. Even when I backed out of the deal, we could have fixed things by talking it out but you immediately started calling me names. I really am sorry it worked out the way it did.
I changed this title to include this call out because this is the second time Cisco1 has butted into a post of mine disparaging my character. he did the same thing when I asked a question about a shotgun that Yar was selling. I didn't continue there because it was Yar's for sale thread and out of line there.
I had hoped that Cisco would simply get over the deal that didn't happen, but he can't seem to move on and continues to snipe at me whenever he sees an opportunity. I don't feel like I did anything wrong and I wanted everyone to see up front exactly what happened.
I have posted this before here numerous times. I buy more guns on Armslist than any other site. Most likely because there are more guns there than any other site. At least twice a week Armslist notifies ,VIA E Mail, that my inquiry has been a scam, I have already labeled it as such. I have a list of questions for seller and phone conversation or 2.. or 3.In the event of a red flag have to be very careful. I sometimes will travel across the country to be sure of seller and merchandise. However, most items are shipped. I have never been burned and have a lot of good deals to show for my efforts. Armslist is not for the pussies or novices. I usually make a good judgement on the phone, The one bad judgement I made was my deal with RH Clark. He did not have the balls to tell me he couldn't do the deal. I asked him to send payment to my wife and he said I changed the terms and he could not deal with me. He did not ask or say he would send payment to me.. But, luck was on my side as it turns out I didn't have to worry about him paying me. RH Clark Armslist is not for you �.you do not have the wherewithal. Now go ahead and look for like=minded nitwits to ask if you did" right". If you gotta ask you will never know. Go tend your trotline. I do not hide behind the anonymity of the internet. I will tell anybody face to face what I post. I am: Chuck Ellison 22620 Cottage Grove Ave, Steger, ILL 60475
708-638-3387
60475
Mr, Ellison I've done everything I know to do in this situation with you. Money never changed hands and the only thing I did to you was not trusting you. I did get spooked when you wanted payment in your wife's name. I apologized for that.
You need to get over it and move on. Even when I backed out of the deal, we could have fixed things by talking it out but you immediately started calling me names. I really am sorry it worked out the way it did.
Registered: 07/30/10 Posts: 1370 Loc: The Wrong Side of the Tracks
Randy, We talked on the phone�.. I made my decision at that time. I would appreciate it if you make payment in my wife's name. I spend so much money on guns and hunts that when I occasionally sell something, I like her to get the money. Linnea Ellison 22620 Cottage Grove Ave. Steger, ILL. 60475 My addy� the same. Best, Chuck
Chuck I have to be honest and tell you that sending the MO to a different person does make me feel a little uncomfortable. I have no reason to believe you are anything but honest, but you hear of so many people that aren't these days, that it makes me feel a little uncomfortable.
I think you are an honest man but this feels a little weird. Are you concerned the money will somehow effect a social security?
Chuck I'm really sorry about this but I'm going to have to pass on this whole deal. Your wanting to sell to me on payments and wanting payment in your wife's name just makes me too suspicious. You may be the best guy in the world to deal with and you really haven't given me any reason to think otherwise, but I no longer feel good about this deal.
I'm probably being way too paranoid and I apologize for that. I'm sorry that the condition of the world we live in has caused me to feel this way.
I wish you the best with your deals and sale of this gun. I'm very sorry I have caused you so much inconvenience and if I have caused you to miss any other sale.
Registered: 07/30/10 Posts: 1370 Loc: The Wrong Side of the Tracks
Well, Randy I blew off a couple buyers to make this deal with you . I just wanted to give my wife a little for all the help she is. I could offer to have you send the MO to my name��.but I think you are using this an excuse , because you got cold feet. I smell a skunk.
I'm sorry you feel that way. Very possibly you are a very nice and honest man that was trying to do both me and your wife a good turn.
The offer to sell to me on payments and wanting the Mo in your wife's name just made me feel too suspicious about the whole thing.
I am not in any way saying you are dishonest.Probably I'm just too paranoid. I hope you can forgive me.
I was all set to make this deal with you until you wanted payment in your wife's name. You could have just as easily given her the money yourself unless something else is going on here.
Registered: 07/30/10 Posts: 1370 Loc: The Wrong Side of the Tracks
I will pray for your unfounded suspicious mind . Nothing illegal, nothing wrong. You have a problem. We are done . Do not bother me. I will be trying to salvage my sale to some responsible person that understands the value of giving his word. Surely you never were that person.
I'm not accusing you. I thank you for your prayers. Possibly you are right. I'm sorry for any harm this has caused you and I ask you to forgive me.
Yes, we are done and it is possibly all my fault.I wish you only the best.I do feel like I broke my word. I ask you to forgive me for that and to please try to understand why I felt suspicious.
I can only tell you that if the situation were reversed, I would understand your reservations and forgive you. You come from a generation where a man's word meant everything. It makes me very sad because that generation is about gone.
I can tell you that in the future I will find out every detail of a deal before I give my word. I do not lightly break my word but I feel like your actions left me no choice.
Registered: 07/30/10 Posts: 1370 Loc: The Wrong Side of the Tracks
What do you suggest I tell the folks that gun was sold? without looking like you l You need more than prayers���..I fell sorry for a goofy guy like you. I think perhaps you should not own a single gun. You obviously do not have the mental capacity to own a gun. What difference does it make if my wife gets the check? She is gonna deposit it in our account. Goodbye, DO NOT BOTHER ME ANYMORE !
Why did you want the money order in your wife's name? Didn't you think that would sound suspicious? Why not just cash it and give her the money yourself? How am I suppose to know she is even your wife? You are asking me to send money to someone I have never spoken to and never met and don't know, that has nothing to do with this deal.
If your gun is priced well you won't have any problems selling it.I'm sorry you are so upset about this deal. I only cost you one day. I even told you not to hold it for me until I told you last night that I would take it. I would have done the deal and all would have been fine if you had not wanted payment in another's name.
Registered: 07/30/10 Posts: 1370 Loc: The Wrong Side of the Tracks
Now, you have pissed me off! What I sell always goes to my wife.
I offer you the best deal you will ever have and you [bleep] it up. You can [bleep] up a free turkey dinner. I have put a curse on you. [bleep] off Randy and take your small meaningless suspicious mind back under you swamp.
Oh boy, as the fire turns, some days this place is like a soap opera.
Believe me, I would have rather just let this go, but twice since I backed out on the deal cisco1 has found somewhere I posted and basically called me a liar and said that my word was no good. Once was in the classifieds.
I did hate that this deal didn't happen and at fist did feel like I was breaking my word. A bit later I realized that I gave my word to pay Cisco1 X amount. I did not agree to pay someone else I had never heard of. I now do not feel like I broke my word because he changed the terms of our deal.
Thank you Sir. I've never stolen from anyone and try to treat people like I want to be treated. I do feel bad that all this happened in this way, but I feel like I had to speak up and wasn't given any other choice.
I do now think Cisco is an honest guy and would have completed the deal just like he said.At the time, I didn't know him at all and couldn't find any positive feedback in the good guys list.I hate that it worked out like it did. I just wish he would let it go and move on. I don't have any hard feelings against him, but I can't just let him keep dumping on me every time he sees me post.
Clark. Your NOT a man of your word. If you have to ask : " Did I do wrong" you will never know. I don;t care if you backed out of the deal. I see you do not post the deal I offered you. I offered to sell Clark a shotgun on payments. $ 500.00 dollars down and pay the rest on his terms. If he had posted everything, one would see I was prepared to send gun and my paperwork to his FFL. I would have shipped immediately upon that info. I did not intend to wait for his payment. Hell , if I can trust him for $ 600.00, I can trust him for the full price. I am fortunate the deal went south, but not the shotgun. I see he cannot be trusted. As for the " good guys list" I have asked members on here that I dealt with to NOT put me on that list. I don't believe in that childish crap. Hell. if I looked I might find your name there�and what would that tell me.
Your sniveling excuse is just your way of weaseling out. You could have offered to send payment to me . But, you were in over your head and bit off more than you could chew. All you needed to say was "I changed my mind" But, you still don't have the balls to do that. Every time you see a fine O/U , you will be reminded of your childish actions. I am taking that Merkel I sent pics to you to shoot a few grouse later today. You can [bleep]-off. And hide on the internet. I have nothing to hide. I live with no regrets. Too bad you can't say that
As for Armslist�. I have a constant running ad for guns I want. receive about 3-4 legit responses a year�. 1-2 usually pay out, with some pretty skookum deals. I also, receive about 2-4 scammers a year. I expect that on Armslist, Not here. I will continue to callout sniveling , backpedaling, children. Hell , I will bet the farm,.. none of you Clark supporters know the ATF has a ruling for " spud guns" or" potato cannons". If you don't know and understand the laws you have no business transferring firearms on this or any site.
Can't undo a spell. He will have to live with it. I once put a hex on three local cops about 40+ years ago that had chosen to jack me up at a picnic. I had a bunch of stitches in my head from falling off a bridge I was working on. When I jumped up they all had to un-snap their pea-shooters. Well, within in a year 2 were dead and 1 was crippled. 1 got a rope around his neck that was dangling from a semi-trailer door as he was along the road. The second fatality came as a car hit and killed officer McDonut. Can't say what happened to third guy.
I have bought only one gun off gunbroker and it went very well. I made sure i purchased from a seller that had a great rating. Never bought one off armslist but a buddy of mine swears by it but always meets face to face on transactions. I cant say whats best for anyone but me but I enjoy buying and owning rifles and enjoy a deal as much as the next guy but If had to go thru the torment some of these guys seem to buy a gun I would just go to a FFL and buy a gun. What possible enjoyment coukd you possibly get out this crap. Evidently some folks time and agrevation is worth less than mine.
Dontcha be backing out of a deal, or ol' cisco will start mumbling, his fangs will start gnashing, his body will start trembling and his eyes will start flashing. Yeeeeeeaakkk. Another man done gone......
I have dealt with cisco and spoken with him a couple times. He was professional and good to go. Firearm was as advertised and shoots like a muthaphugga.
Cisco1 I wasn't ashamed to post all our correspondence, I just didn't see it as relevant. I offered a trade, you turned it down and I said thanks and wished you luck. During that conversation I had said it was just bad timing for me since I had just bought my daughter a shotgun.
Then you offered to sell me the gun for $500 down and you would send me the gun and I would pay the rest at $150-$200 a month. As I've already said I do now believe you would have kept your word and I know I would have kept mine.
The problem came up when you suddenly asked me to send the $500 payment in your wife's name. I didn't know her, and it made the whole deal sound too weird to me. At first I was willing to take a chance on $500 but I was really upset when you asked for payment in your wife's name.I got paranoid about the whole thing and backed out in the nicest way I knew how.
With any normal person that would have been the end of it. You sir have some serious mental issues. As for a curse, I am blessed by God. You cannot curse what God has blessed. If you continue in your witchcraft, you will be the one to be cursed. I will pray for your soul.I hope that you will repent and make Jesus your savior. You need peace in your life. You are filled with bitterness and it will destroy you if you won't let it go.
Travis I don't doubt that Cisco was fine to deal with. I don't think he is dishonest, but he does clearly have some other issues.
I have posted this before here numerous times. I buy more guns on Armslist than any other site. Most likely because there are more guns there than any other site. At least twice a week Armslist notifies ,VIA E Mail, that my inquiry has been a scam, I have already labeled it as such. I have a list of questions for seller and phone conversation or 2.. or 3.In the event of a red flag have to be very careful. I sometimes will travel across the country to be sure of seller and merchandise. However, most items are shipped. I have never been burned and have a lot of good deals to show for my efforts. Armslist is not for the pussies or novices. I usually make a good judgement on the phone, The one bad judgement I made was my deal with RH Clark. He did not have the balls to tell me he couldn't do the deal. I asked him to send payment to my wife and he said I changed the terms and he could not deal with me. He did not ask or say he would send payment to me.. But, luck was on my side as it turns out I didn't have to worry about him paying me. RH Clark Armslist is not for you �.you do not have the wherewithal. Now go ahead and look for like=minded nitwits to ask if you did" right". If you gotta ask you will never know. Go tend your trotline. I do not hide behind the anonymity of the internet. I will tell anybody face to face what I post. I am: Chuck Ellison 22620 Cottage Grove Ave, Steger, ILL 60475
708-638-3387
60475
So now every crook in Ill.knows your name address and phone number and that you have guns. Absolutely brilliant!!!!
With any normal person that would have been the end of it. You sir have some serious mental issues. As for a curse, I am blessed by God. You cannot curse what God has blessed. If you continue in your witchcraft, you will be the one to be cursed. I will pray for your soul.I hope that you will repent and make Jesus your savior. You need peace in your life. You are filled with bitterness and it will destroy you if you won't let it go.
Trust me, that don't help your cause. If a man needs to bring Christ into it scares the [bleep] out of me (see safariman, and many others)
With any normal person that would have been the end of it. You sir have some serious mental issues. As for a curse, I am blessed by God. You cannot curse what God has blessed. If you continue in your witchcraft, you will be the one to be cursed. I will pray for your soul.I hope that you will repent and make Jesus your savior. You need peace in your life. You are filled with bitterness and it will destroy you if you won't let it go.
Trust me, that don't help your cause. If a man needs to bring Christ into it scares the [bleep] out of me (see safariman, and many others)
I didn't say it to gain sympathy. I'm sorry there are so many who claim to be Christians but are only hypocrites. I am who I am and Christ is part of that. I don't apologize for, nor am I ashamed to mention the name of Christ.
I don't claim to be perfect on my own, but in this case all I did was back out of a deal within 24 hours because it started sounding too fishy to me. I truly am sorry for the bad feelings I caused to Cisco. I never lied to him though. The deal would have gone through if he hadn't suddenly asked for payment in his wife's name. I may be guilty of paranoia but nothing else.
With any normal person that would have been the end of it. You sir have some serious mental issues. As for a curse, I am blessed by God. You cannot curse what God has blessed. If you continue in your witchcraft, you will be the one to be cursed. I will pray for your soul.I hope that you will repent and make Jesus your savior. You need peace in your life. You are filled with bitterness and it will destroy you if you won't let it go.
Trust me, that don't help your cause. If a man needs to bring Christ into it scares the [bleep] out of me (see safariman, and many others)
I didn't say it to gain sympathy. I'm sorry there are so many who claim to be Christians but are only hypocrites. I am who I am and Christ is part of that. I don't apologize for, nor am I ashamed to mention the name of Christ.
I don't claim to be perfect on my own, but in this case all I did was back out of a deal within 24 hours because it started sounding too fishy to me. I truly am sorry for the bad feelings I caused to Cisco. I never lied to him though. The deal would have gone through if he hadn't suddenly asked for payment in his wife's name. I may be guilty of paranoia but nothing else.
It isn't germane to the subject, but feel free to Christ's name.
So you go to purchase a firearm on the internet. You say 'I'll take it'
PM comes and they say make the money order out to Larry Lipshitts, how do you know the guy your PM'ing with is Larry Lipschitts? Does it matter?
The gun is going to an FFL, the FFL will log it and do the deal.
I spoke to Cisco on the phone. I didn't know his real name except what he told me and it wasn't in question. He then asked me to make my $500 money order out to a woman's name I had never heard of, saying he gave all his gun sales money to his wife.
Yea, it made me paranoid about the deal, especially because he had also offered to sell me the gun on payments when he turned down my trade plus cash. I'm sorry that it triggered my paranoia but it did.
Was I suppose to send cash to a woman I had never heard of? I never accused Cisco of being dishonest. All I did was back out, tell him why, and ask him to please forgive me.
So if he told you his name was Rubber Duck, how the [bleep] do you know his name was really Rubber Duck? Do you ask for a copy of his Driver's License prior to sending Payment? How do you know the copy he sent you is actually his?
[bleep], from almost a month ago.
Originally Posted by R_H_Clark
I offered a trade deal on a gun to someone. He turned down the deal and I said it was just bad timing for me because I hadn't had time to recover my play money fund from some recent purchases.
The guy then offered to sell me the gun on payments with about half down. I would send the payment and he would send the gun and I would pay the rest within 4 months. I spoke on the phone and all seemed fine. We were about to do the deal when he asked me to send the money order payment in his wife's name.
Maybe I'm too paranoid but I told him I would have to pass on the deal. I feel bad because I feel like I broke my word on a deal. AT the same time I feel a bit relieved. The guy may be the most honest and trusting person in the world but both the offer of selling on payments and sending payment in his wife's name sent up paranoia flags for me.
Did I do wrong by breaking my word? Should I have dismissed my paranoia and distrust?
So if he told you his name was Rubber Duck, how the [bleep] do you know his name was really Rubber Duck? Do you ask for a copy of his Driver's License prior to sending Payment? How do you know the copy he sent you is actually his?
[bleep], from almost a month ago.
Originally Posted by R_H_Clark
I offered a trade deal on a gun to someone. He turned down the deal and I said it was just bad timing for me because I hadn't had time to recover my play money fund from some recent purchases.
The guy then offered to sell me the gun on payments with about half down. I would send the payment and he would send the gun and I would pay the rest within 4 months. I spoke on the phone and all seemed fine. We were about to do the deal when he asked me to send the money order payment in his wife's name.
Maybe I'm too paranoid but I told him I would have to pass on the deal. I feel bad because I feel like I broke my word on a deal. AT the same time I feel a bit relieved. The guy may be the most honest and trusting person in the world but both the offer of selling on payments and sending payment in his wife's name sent up paranoia flags for me.
Did I do wrong by breaking my word? Should I have dismissed my paranoia and distrust?
Correct me if wrong[which I'm sure some azzhole here will] but this thread didn't start with RHC saying anything about CISCO until the Voodoo Dr entered the thread of his own ph ugg in free will and started whining and bitchin.
