So - quick question, is welding still a good career with the oil field slowdowns?

Long question - I will graduate with my bachelors this May. I still have some GI Bill left over. Kind of giving thought to picking up an associates in either welding or CNC machining. Mostly because I can.
Wondering which of the 2 you'd select, were you looking to pick one up for giggles with the idea of having it as a fall back?

Welding is a good skill to have.

As a career, perhaps others can be of more help.

Welding will pay more once you have the certifications.

I weld in nuke plants... id much rather work in one of them than an oil field, the money is still there, but you gotta be good.

Real world numbers?

This is my personal experience. I have been in the welding business since 1981 in South Louisiana almost exclusively related to the oilfield.

1981 to 1990 I worked as a welder and pipe fitter. The next 15 years I managed a welding business. The last 10 years I have owned my own welding business.

In the 34 years in the business I have not drawn one day of unemployment benefits.

I truly believe learning a good trade is as good or better than college education for many people.

I also believe I could have accomplished the same success had I learned to be a machinist instead of a welder.

"Welding" covers an awful lot of ground.

I've taught at community colleges, and can assure you that the "Career Counciling" pimps will be pushing whatever curricula within which there's a registry shortfall.

A two year "associate degree" does not a welder make, and the fellows who started out as helpers, riggers, and deckhands will most often eclipse the performance (and DRIVE) of the freshly graduated fella with ink drying on his ticket.

CNC or welding ?

I say BOTH !

GTC

North of $40 per hour.

Around here McDonald's pays better that someone would earn with an associates degree and no shop experience in CNC machining.

Both would be okay - I work now in logistics. Office type job and I do better than the "starting wage" advertised by the local TC for either career.

The decision to take a course/degree is basically because I have quite a bit of GI Bill left after getting my business degree.

Not interested in simply tossing everything in the truck and headed to the oil fields (see Roger talking about layoffs) - just wondering what would be best were I forced to find work outside of my current gig.

I like the idea of welding because it seems like something easier to make side money with - given I can't see setting up a Haas in the garage to do the same. The idea of machining appeals primarily due to side gunny projects.

Well, Like Mike70560, I've never been able to stay out of work.

Welder, Millwright, Machinist, H.D. Mechanic all seem to stay in demand.

GTC

Take it up, I welded before i joined the Marines in 08, Made about 38k a year with just high school welding class. Got out of USMC in Oct 13 and had a welding/Millwright job lined up before i had my dd 214 signed. Made little over 52k last year doing mostly TIG and stick welding. its a good career if you dont mind being dirty.

I hated the production part of it which is what I did the first go round. Now everything is in the field and it different everyday. enjoy going to work.

On side note use up all the G.I. Bill you can. Im Working on Electrical Engineering now then plan to get a Cert in Cnc/Milling. the more you know the better it is

David

The amount I know about welding you could carry in a thimble-

I'm good friends with 3 guys that own a stainless steel welding business, doing work in food plants, sanitary tig work mainly. Its funny to watch the two older guys put on a hood and try to hang with the 20 and 30 year olds they have working for them. Usually they end up throwing their hood across the floor and bitch about their eye site not being what it was when they first started. They blame it on old age, but I often wonder how much arc flash they've taken over the last 30 years welding on nothing but stainless.

Not bad - would think a person would need to be an active welder with a company to get those certs? What certs?

Local TC doesn't really offer what I can see as certificates beyond the 1 year welder's certificate.

This post reminded me of an add I saw in the local Craigslist for Ag Millwrights.

Teal, no hijack intended, so I'll post it on it's own.

....The outfit running the add is EXACTLY the sort I would be looking to hire on with, were I looking.

GTC

You could learn welding with a machine with CNC like capabilities.

Andrew, Greg can fill you in on the different certifications. My expertise is CNC machining.

Your real world numbers are going to depend alot on where you live.

Machinists seem to top out about 20 an hour from what I'm hearing from my friend who is a manual machinist.

College won't teach you either of those skills, especially welding. You need to be a perfectionist to be an accomplished welder. That said, some skewling will help perfect a skill you are looking towards.

Cross, you're always busy because people know....that you know...how to fix chit and fix it right!


The 2-3 people I know around here who I would trust to work on 'steel' are all about halfway retired. Can't think of any young guys who have anywhere near the knowledge and experience.



Like Cheesy says the actual welding skill might be a touch slower but the 'vision' on how to fix or 'redesign' a bent up or broken piece of equipment is way stronger in 'old' guys.

Specialty operators (boring mill, grinding room, jig bore operators) can make a lot more in the right shop.

You'll be laughed at applying for either gig here without the paper. Just the way it is unless you're being hired by a friend who already knows your skills.

Here in Alberta it seems there are welders all over. Most are busy, but most work on the road a lot. Machinists and millwrights tend to work in the local manufacturing shops.

If it was me I would do machining. Less fumes and home more. But what do I know. I run analytical labs!

SS

This in spades.

I don't know what he does exactly - I do know he's made some gear and trans parts for the local race heroes like Johnny Greaves -

He made the trans and transfer case parts for this truck. 850-900 hp with a lot of on/off throttle. Has to be stout.

I'm in a related but different industry, Steel Fab.
Beams, columns, handrail, stairs, architectural wet dreams, new construction and remodels.
If all a man can do is weld it won't go too far in my world.
Welding is only one of the skills you'll need to be a fabricator.
We've been desperate for a couple guys that can field measure existing conditions and adjust the drawings to work, build the steel and install it, holy cow, it fits!!!!
Before oil prices fell we couldn't get anybody to apply for work.
Now we get "welders" applying that have a rig to pay for needing work but they have no construction math skills, no clue about construction and are expecting to be treated like gold because they can "weld".

"Welding is great but it's not enough!"
Separate yourself from the crowd, if you can do more, you'll be worth a lot more.
Welding is Job Specific, pipeline and oilfield is different than construction/fab is different than high pressure is different than production is different than machine shop welding. Mig, Tig, stick, sub-arc, spray, dual-shield... If I knew more, I'd have more options too!!
The trades are desperate for career professionals and there is money to be made, if not with oil, there are options!

I'm a 27 year injection mold maker/machinist/TiG welder/Fabricator

The key to a long career is deversability

I don't make nearly $40 an hour but I'm home every night....warm in the winter and cool in the summer......factory

save your GI Bill for an MBA?

Sycamore

This is farm country and a good welder can always find work. Key words are good welder. miles

MBAs are losing value quickly...oversaturation of the market.

Was original plan - just been soured on it lately. Not sure I really want to spend the rest of my life in an office. Not super thrilled on spending 2 years going over case studies.

That's the thing with machining. You can take a class on Solid Works or Master CAM but that only scratches the surface. Apprenticeships are generally 8000 hours of documented work, there's a lot more to learn after you've completed the program.

Teal,

There are a number of different certs that a guy can pick up, and a lot of regional welding supply companies also have training and CWE/CWIs that can hold certification tests. These certifications are limited to specific parameters, and will generally expire after 3 or 6 months unless you perform inspected code welds within that time frame to keep them current

What you need to know is that if you possess the skills to certify, many companies will hire you based on the expectation that you will pass their certification test.

Stick welding (SMAW) is the most versatile process for construction or heavy industrial type work. These are also the best paying type jobs for welders.

Learn to weld pressure vessel tube or pipe with an E6010 root and e7018 fill and cap. practice this until you're comfortable in the 6G position.

to add value to your resume learn to do TIG (GTAW) roots with an E7018 fill/cap.

MIG welding is growing by leaps and bounds, and is making inroads into the industries dominated by Stick welding. It's not there yet, however, and you're better off learning to Stick weld. Most assembly line or production/piece rate jobs are done with the MIG process or one of it's spinoffs.

Write down or print out what I have in green above. take that to someone who can teach you to weld. He already knows all this, but it might help him to understand your goals.

There are ads on TV daily for schools teaching guys to weld and get a job. These are mostly for Mig welders looking for entry level factory production jobs.

Just did a case study for my corp finance class. Learned a ton in the class, love the instructor but spending hours going over how some small sporting goods store in Nebraska saved a point on their loans by providing the bank some better ratios made me want to jab an ice pick in my ear.

Really kind of miss the old days when I was doing more manual work.

I'm 25 minutes from Miller Electric - I should walk in there and ask to speak with someone...

In my 27 years I've seen hundreds of guys come and go that claimed they could weld....

Not many....maybe only a couple were really good

Most were flat awful

Excellent post!!!
"Layout work" is a whole nother story, but every guy who welds needs to be handy with tools in general. Some rigging experience, math skills, and training are pretty valuable, too...

This is why the machinist/tooling industry co-exist as welders

I think the hard part is around here - pay and requirements are all over the board. For giggles, I looked at some want-ads.

3 years experience and degree required. Pay - 12 to 16

Next ad was offering 30-35 an hour but only said SS cert required.

There's a jargon I don't have my head around just yet.

That's the issue I've ran into around here. GM combined millwrights, pipe fitters, tin bangers and welders into one trade (millwrights). I know who to trust with the welding I need done and who to run from if they've done some welding on parts I need to machine.

That's why I do my own

Welding and machining

I don't believe you can just "decide" to become a good Welder,

it takes skills that you may or may not have.

Also, every time I'm around Welders over the age of maybe 45 or so, I hear the same thing others have mentioned, the aging eyesight is a huge hindrance...

Teal, nothing personal, but real soon you're gonna have to figure out what you want to be when you grow up.

Welding is looking good right now and is supposed to stay strong as more welders are retiring than what are being added. I've been in the trade since the late 80's and I've never seen so many job openings. But on the flipside, there are lots of low pay welding jobs that will have you looking for something else real quick. If you want the big money, you have to hit the road for a few years.

Welding is a perishable skill also. To go through a couple years of welding school and hope to fall back on your skills if you're away from it for any length of time isn't a good plan if you want to get a good paying welding job. Passing a cert test of any difficulty isn't likely either if you don't stay sharp.

How old are you Teal? Welding is best started young when eyes and hand/eye coordination is at its best. I've also seen a lot of broke-down welders by the time they reach their later 50's.

Some of the CNC machining I've been around could be done by monkeys and the pay reflects it.

If I were to pick up another trade or start all over again, I might forgo welding and be a electrician. We ain't going away from electricity anytime soon and the pay is always good.

Operators are a dime a dozen. There is money to be made if someone has experience with set up/fixturing parts.

I used to mark the Cycle Start button "operator banana dispenser" till a boss told me I couldn't do it any more.

There isn't a thing in the world I can't learn. The point of the welding/CNC decision isn't a career change but to have options should I really decide to phugg the office life. I am completing a 4 year degree in 20 months with a perfect 4.0 while working full time and putting in approximately 5 to 10% of the recommended time for homework in my classes. I don't say that to brag but to point out - I'm no dummy.

The additional schooling is to simply learn something for the sake of learning while burning up the benefits I earned. I think it's ridiculous to leave them on the table. There's not enough there to get another 4 year degree (nor the desire to push as hard as I have the last year, it's really messing with my walleye and pike fishing) but there's enough to learn something new. But it makes no sense learning something that has little value down the line. Who knows - the right opportunity comes along and I go with it.

I'm good at my job, but there's little challenge. I'm busy but not challenged if that makes sense.

I've done home construction (HVAC, carpentry and insulation), run a 980F front end loader at a lime plant, truck driver, been a service writer for OEM Class 8 dealership among other things. I speak English, Serbian, Croatian, Bosnian, some German and understand some Russian. Learned those in less than a year. Serbo/Cro to native speaker fluency.

Point being - I've never figured on a career being who/what I am but just a means to an end and most end up boring me eventually - I see no nobility in doing the same thing for 40 years straight. I do what interests me.

I'll never be something when I grow up - I simply will do the "next thing that interests me".

Can't - blue/green and red/orange color deficient. There must be a billion homes wired by guys who were/are color blind before testing was normal but it ain't happening today.

Pick up a basic machining class and go from there. It isn't a cheap hobby...

I understand what your saying,,,,I think......

4.0 grades and speaking Croation means nothing when it comes to Welding, you have the physical abilities or you don't.

It just seems like your always bored, or unhappy with your current gig, If your gonna get "additional schooling", isn't there something that really ignites your interests, so to speak?

If you have to fall back on Welding at age 48 (example), your most likely gonna struggle, or fail. And you continually mention " having something to fall back on"...

I got a friend, also very smart, with a Masters degree and other various degrees and certifications,

basically he was a lifelong student with NO real world hands-on job experience,

In his mid-40's, he is currently working for a Armored truck courier, picking up the cash, pistol strapped to his side, and bored out of his mind.

I hope you find what ever it is that you are looking for..

I'm not necessarily unhappy - just bored. It's too easy. Think of something you do well - how many times can you do it over and over before you're bored with it? (professionally)

There's zero challenge. Even BS made up challenges. I'm good at it, it pays the bills but doesn't stretch the mind. Excel probably makes more people blind than anything. I've been in transportation my whole life. I was on the road with my uncle or grandfather, unloading trucks when I was 7. I've been a lumper, driver, shipping and receiving clerk, service writer, M&R specialist, intermodal specialist etc.

Taking the welding/machining classes - I hope to stretch the mind some. Be forced to figure things out that I haven't had to in the past. Whatever I've put my mind to - even things requiring physical talent - I've achieved. This is simply one more thing on that list. If I can drive an 18 speed, eat a burger and talk on the CB at the same time - I can learn other things requiring physical dexterity. That's not nearly as difficult as learning proper buoyancy control where you can hover 18 inches off the bottom of a lake, rise over an object and then back to those 18 inches without using your hands - only inhale/exhale.

I am always bored - sorry but what others find difficult, I don't.

Hoping that the mental gymnastics of welding/fab or machining would provide that - even if it's a short while and quite honestly, the classes are literally free for me.

I'm not quitting my job for this - just simply stating that burning the rest of my GI benefits on a tech degree/cert for cooking (as an example) makes little sense as there's zero chance I could/would fall back on it.

Skills - any skills, are always useful and I was here asking which of these 2 would others see as the most useful.

If forced - I'd probably go back to driving truck under my own authority before anything else.

I do have a huge broad base of life experience as everything I've ever studied or learned was OJT or done outside of work. I've never really been a full time student with nothing else to do. Always at night.

Was simply asking other's opinions on the 2 skills and what they saw/thought of them as full time work because like anything - it's fun for 45 minutes at a crack. A 15 hour day is completely different. Plan on the 15 hour day, be enthralled when it's not.

I'm pretty much going to always agree with my good buddy crossfireoops on this since his expertise in this field is second to none. By the way I went in for a weld test today . With what has been said, the more you can get under your belt the better. Steel/metal trades and construction based knowledge is great. Personally I'd also suggest getting a CDL and other certifications pertaining to the trade. To give you an idea, I am state certified and ABS/Coast guard certified in all positions (most of my work is done in the marine industry), have an AA in machine tool tech and about 8 terms of college welding. I am also state LBC crane certified. Every little bit helps in this trade, trust me...

Class A with tanker endorsement. Used to have Hazmat but let it go after 9/11 - wasn't using it and didn't feel like paying the $$ unless someone was paying me for it too.

At last count, a week or so ago, I had ~350 welders working on my project. The majority are very young and most all are very good. Just reached 65,000 pipe spools installed. It ain't rocket science.

The last "office job" I had wasn't exciting, but it paid north of $45 an hour. Sometimes shuffling papers in the air conditioning isn't too bad.

My daughter works for Miller. They just finished paying for her MBA. She's in the marketing Dept. for the Hobart division. I told her 4 years ago when she took the job she'd have to learn how to weld and she's pretty good. Doesn't have to do it for a living but she knows enough.

As far as manual machining goes, it is dead opportunities are few and far between. Everything is now CNC, operator pay is $18 and hour or so, somewhat more if you can set-up or program. In my 40+ year career as a Journeyman Tool & Die Maker I did some CNC set-up and operate work. Found it to be boring due to the volume and pace of the work, too repetitive. As a Tool & Die Maker I had reached the top of the scale with my employer making mid $60K which was in the top 1-2% of Toolmakers nationally. To make it possible to continue getting merit increases the company reclassified several of us at the top of the T&D pay scale. Since we were doing the work of Manufacturing Engineers and some of us had our CMfgE Certification we were bumped into the MfgE payscale. I was riffed when the economy tanked in '09 and after an intensive 18 month job search could not find work as a Toolmaker, largely due to age discrimination. I finished the last 18 months of my career working in Quality Assurance.

What's she working on there? Looks VW Bug ish but I know it's not.

Teal, if you're bored all the time you need an outside job.


Welding at -20F.




And if anyone needs a halfass weld done I'm your man!

Actually took welding in high school and got the basics down but IMO welding is an art. Anyone can 'weld' but a good welder is an entirely different story.

looks like a mustang fastback.

Sam I totally understand , I learned to weld at home at like 12YO than had welding class in HS AG classes . I've stuck lots of things together,some may look like a cow's ass sewed up with a grape vine but they always held together.

Hey Ed,

Are your kids mig welding your spools out? Does insurance regulation hinder you as to process?

Holton, last weld I made lasted just long enough before is started to crack.

Gear box on a 10"x60' grain auger. Weld looked like total dogshit but it lasted through harvest!

A few years back Miller was querying business owners and clientele for ideas and I had some interesting conversations with Engineers and marketing folk in Appleton.

I recommended that they re-invent the old "Legend" machine in compact form and call it the "Mojo" model.

Also recommended a mid 300 amp version of the Trailblazer with onboard air compressor and call it the "Honcho" model.

And a 3rd model with 400 amp dual bus welding, onboard air, and onboard self priming trash pump, called the "Rancho"...

They declined, but I still think highly of the idea...

Good luck.....you won't make it far with thid attitude

Define "far" - I've done a hell of a lot more than most people my age, have zero debt (buying a new home soon so that will change) and I pay my bills with more than a little left over for savings.

I hunt when I want, fish when I want - again, how far do I need to get before I have it good?

Just saying I never felt compelled to be anything. Some people grow up and say "I am an accountant!" or "I am an engineer!" and that's all they ever wanted to be in life. That's never worked for me. I have far too many interests to simply stay with one thing or to think that one occupation defines a person.

I am a fully grown human male - the rest is fluff.

I took your statement as a cocky insult.......no nobility in doing the same thing for 40 years

Good luck

Your words are telling on your maturity level.....good luck and be carefull when you hit the work place.....old timers don't have much time for cocky newbs

It's the attitude that always worked for me...

From the time I was 17 til I was 31 I never struck an arc. Pretty much decided I never would. Had 2 kids of my own and was hungry when I came to repentance...

Really full of ourself this AM, aren't we ?

You need to adjust your wize old sage / Gandalf hat, Bozo.

GTC

Friends occasionally note that I no longer have that "hungry" look...

My PREFERENCE for not working the same thing for 40 years bothers you. Fine.

The fact I don't consider someone great just because they've done the same thing over and over bothers you - fine.

Note that has nothing to do with how well they do something. After all we have 40 year tenured politicians but that's cool, they've done it a long time - they must be great.

That's what I mean by no nobility in doing the same thing forever in and of itself. You're a 40 year T&D man that can hold .00002 TIR with your eyes closed? Great but what's cool is what you can do not how long you've been doing it. There's a difference. I guarantee you there are people in professions 40 years who haven't learned a thing or gotten better since year 2.

I don't derive satisfaction from doing something repetitively - I need to be challenged and to learn new things, that's me and not everyone.

It doesn't work for me and I never said it had to be the same for you.

That comes from time on the job amd maturity.....more of a cool swager....you have btdt so you dont get all tuned up over just anything.....old bull and young bull story

Well as a 20+ year veteran of the Transportation industry, I'll remember to mind myself around my elders.

You'll notice I've not derived any particular pride from how long I've done something but how WELL and that's the damned problem with this country.

People think because they showed up they are special. GMAFB. It's not enough to show up - you need to perform.

This old-timer has made good money identifying the cocky newbs and hot sticks and turning them into smart, agile, productive crew...

I hate to get involved here, but I've worked with a lot of grown men that thought they could weld and fit. Had to send some down the road packing too because they could do "everything", but couldn't do what I wanted them to do, which was make a good weld .. Some of these types didn't know the difference between straight and reverse polarity, CC VV OR CV, couldn't square up a plate (didn't even know what the 3 4 5 method was, Pythagorean method was way out of the question for them), do layout to save their azz, expand measurements, use trigonometry, shoot parts in, make jigs, etc. etc... A real tradesman will become exceedingly proficient in his trade and always add to his tool box of knowledge. My grandfather was a welder (as was my dad) and he always told me that "a good welder will always have a job".

3/4/5 is voodoo to a great many people. Sad really.

And....if you perform you will last

No union in this part of Missouri and Missouri law requires no reason to fire

If you don't produce you will be moving on in these parts

But I need to point out.....I'm not a welder.....welding is part of what I do

Like stated in a prior response.....filling your toolbox with skill sets

THAT's the ticket !

GTC

Most people burn out.....Im lucky

My job finds me doing something different each day.....sometimes all day and all night

It all can be put in simple terms and seem like the same ol same ol

mill
drill
grind
burn.....edm
turn
check prints
sweep floors ect etc

Years ago someone hung the nickname "hotstick" on me.

Lately they mostly call me "den mother"...

Same here but I'll take a humble youngster with a good attitude every time over the one who knows it all strait out of school

Just occasionaly it comes down to "mother ------"...

I don't see many kids coming out of schools, other than the apprentice program...
If you are burdened with loud, cocky, know-it-all kids, I might have a place for them an any given job...

What we are seeing in todays work hires is the group of people who all got to bat during little leage and everyone got a trophy at the end of the season

Welding flash caused me to have cataract surgery when I was 50 years old.I was a weld fabricator most of my career.Did a little bit of everything including machine work.About 75% of the guys I worked with died from cancer.Should tell you something about welding as a career.

Those types usually don't make it past the interview

When I was 31 I was a complete dick. Just not quite as complete as I thought...

Long story short, I was laboring in a steel mill for about 2$ per hour over minimum wage. Got assigned to labor for the melt shop mechanical GF. Worked for him for 2 weeks before he heard my name.

Heard my name and knew my dad and uncle. Told me he had a job that would make my pocket jingle if I could pass a weld test.

He was correct on all counts.
Put me with some seasoned hands, young and old. they frequently showed me just what a dick I was, along with a bit of trade craft.

taken me a fair ways...

Isn't that the truth... Give me a humble young man who is secure in his own skin, that doesn't need to show you his confidence with his mouth, and things will probably work out.

I've gotten to the point where I cringe when I hear some young guy 10 seconds into a conversation say, "I took welding all 4 years of high school and my grandpa was a journeyman welder." As if welding is a hereditary thing and most high school Ag teachers teach more bad habits than anything.

Full disclosure; The old man fired me for being a dick when I was 17...

I bless his memory for that...

Teal, I have the same issues in the workforce. Boredom.
I grew up on a farm where a person needs to be a jack-of-all-trades. I took up welding as it was something that that took a lot of patients and practice to get it right. I'm a perfectionist so it was years before I felt very good about my talent.
I eventually hit the top of my trade with MIG, Stick and Tig while welding aluminum, stainless, mild, cast, pipe, structural, pressure vessels and whatever was tossed in front of me. It got boring after that.
I spent some time as a mechanic but not much money in that. I eventually landed a job as a maintenance tech for a large factory. There I honed my skills in hydraulics, pneumatics, plumbing, electricity, building construction and anything else you can run into.
That got old after a while and I took a job as basically a facilities manager. I was in charge of the maintenance dept. as well as doing a lot of the design work and working with contractors for all factory expansions and overhauls.

Guess what. Climbed that mountain and it got old after 8 or so years. I just started my own excavation business. Dozers, excavators, skid steers, etc. It's going well so far. Not much moving up here during the winter so a fall back on my welding and mechanic skills to stay busy. This spring cannot come fast enough and I look forward to a new set of challenges.

All of that being said, it's been a wonderful employment career so far. I'm 40 now so another 40 and I can hopefully retire. I'm very satisfied and wouldn't trade much of it. If that's what it takes to keep a person happy in life, go for it. I know that I'll never be unemployed.

Good posts guys. I've seen it work both ways. I'm a supervisor, so I need to be able to find ways to work with the young hot shots and get them trained right. If there's absolutely no hope for them, they get sent packing.. We need to get more young people interested in this trade, or we are going to be hurting!!!

Almost indicates a pattern of sorts...

as a "cocky newb" myself. I guess im lucky to have had a pipefitter no less (im an electrician) with 40 years of doing and not talkin' come into my welding booth and watch me (im self taught) for about 40 min. Didnt say a word. Then he said give me the stinger and do this... so i did. 3 weeks later he called and said the nuke plant is putting calls in for electrician welders, take the call, you'll make the test. rest is history. Turned out he was the welding coordinator, i got put in every f'd up nasty, high rad area you could think off, but made a lot of damn money, and NO ONE messes with the welders in a nuke plant, its kinda like bein' royalty haha

I earned an Asso. Degree in Welding back in 1977 from Ferris State College, Michigan. Offers came in from all over the country including Ironworkers Union, Steel Workers Union, and Auto Workers Union. I took an excellent paying job with Auto Workers Union in Warren, Michigan working at the Dodge van division. But the work was quite boring. When laid off in 1979, I enlisted with USAF and trained to be an aircraft welder. Mostly I worked on jet turbine parts. The work was clean but boring. But I had a chance to cross train into a Civil Engineer Unit named PRIME BEEF and travelled the world as a Metal Worker. Many great adventures. I retired in 1999 from USAF and currently work as a Building Code Inspector.

Sherwood

Sam like you I am just a burner of metals lol. Learned on the ranch and high school. Have built some equipment and repaired a lot. Built several set of sucker rod and drill stem corrals. Lol better cowboy than I was welder. Ed

Yer dreamin', Coop...

Everybody messes with the welders in the nukes...

Done that gig, and in every active nuke (-Zion) in illinois, the TVA system, and a few others...

This ^^^^^^^ I don't see what the OP is asking as he seems to be overqualified to share our oxygen lest boredom should set it in.

Drill stem corrals? What are you running, cape buffalo? Nice material if you can get it cheap.

I just deliver my standard line when someone gets'ta playin [bleep] [bleep].. "ill cut cho a$$" its all fun and games untill someone messes with my welding machine, then it gets serious, and ill get someones money for that [bleep] :-D

The shop I work at now has a permanent sign out hiring welders. I haven't been here long enough to know what they pay the welders. We do a mix of carbon steel and alloys like inconel and it's various varietes. We do large plate fabrication of up to 4,000 tons. Not all single pieces at that size obvioiusly, panelized etc...

Engineers keep our welders really busy. I've been fighting it for the last month. They have us putting a complete pentration weld where a 3/4" plate attaches to a 3/16" beam web. So we are putting a 3/4" weld into a 3/16" web....then they complain it's taking too long. They really are having an issue of us charging a crapload more when the job was bid as a fillet weld standard.

But the guys in the shop are staying busy, we do a fair amount of submerged arc joining our panels etc...

We're actually hoping to pick up some welders now that the frackers are just now starting to lay off in the area.

Besides the normal cert testing etc...we do a fair amount of testing on a fair number of the welds, non destructive. Sometimes 100% of welds have to be tested. They get picky on a $1 billion structure. But nowhere near as much as pressure vessels.

When it comes to inconel, I'd rather weld the festered crack of an elephants ass...

We don't do a lot of inconel, it's just certain parts and it's normally a tiny percentage. I can't imagine what it would cost to do a 4,000 ton job out of 100% inconel. Lot of nickel allow stuff in some of the portions, but normally the casing is good old A36 which accounts for the bulk of it.

actually sounds alot like me.....prolly part of the reason i didnt finish college cause picking an actual major/school to go to was a PITA cause i had a huge range of interests and no clue what i wanted to do....hell at 33 im not sure i could pick a major if pressed now.....fell into the newspaper work just like i did this state highway job more or less....

looking back bout the only thing i know i might have been happy doing was paleontology cause it requires a huge range of disciplines and you get to be outside alot....b!tch of a place to make money in though

Our insurance inspectors got really, really fussy on an all code requirement low temp pressure vessel jobs but nowhere near as much when we did nuke submarine components.

X-Ray and ultrasound to the max and paperwork, paperwork,paperwork, paperwork,..... out the kazzooo

Pak in the 80's and 90's it was the cheapest way to build corrals, and they last forever. Built several sets that you could ship and work several hundred cows at a time in. ED

Same at the company I used to work for. Basic 6G required to even fill out the application but less than 10% of the applicants could go beyond that. They finally started hiring the best of those that failed and started an in house school.

Darn great idea that worked out well for all parties.

Yep - people don't realize, it sucks to be easily bored. Expensive too.

H13
S7
A2
420S
440S
P20
4140

Sounds as though the OP cannot decide if he wants to be a brain surgeon or a fry cook. Manufacturing in the US does not hold the opportunities it once did especially since outsourcing and the use of temporary and contract labor became the norm. The days of converting a temp or contract position into a permanent hire are gone, employers are controlling costs by utilizing employees that they can pay the bare minimum benefits. Having all kinds of qualifications not relavent to the job will do more harm than good. Overqualified employers will tell applicants, seeing that type employee as one who will not be happy in the job. A threat to morale of other employees and someone who will leave once something that seems better to them comes along. As far as a position that offers challenges and the opportunity to work on different things,those kind of positions go to internal candidates. You won't walk in the door into one of those kind of positions no matter what your qualifications or experience, it just won't happen. Don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, these are just the facts. I switched to Quality Assurance to finish out the last 18 months of my career and I couldn't have been happier. I walked in the door at night and the wife saw a difference like night and day, much happier, much less stress. To work in QA you need some training on the Coordinate Measuring Machine (CMM) the CNC of the inspection world. That and the many other computer based equipment found in the inspection world. In my case I had to learn 35 different software programs as record keeping in QA is largely electronic. You'll find yourself spending as much time in front of a computer screen as actually taking measurements. It is a good gig and pays pretty well once you work your way up and gain the necessary certifications.

Naww - for those that read the OP, I mentioned picking it up for giggles/fall back later type of deal.

Simply adding skills and learning for the sake of learning but I'll not waste GI bill money on learning something I can't make a nickel with were I forced to.

Both the welding and machining programs here have a 2-3 year wait for placement, there's a lot of competition for spots.

Boring aze work...

I'm trained to work in our validation room running CMMs to do PAC checks on our castings. I prefer to be down in the shop getting my hands dirty making parts. YMMV

Ed, it looks like a herd of geese chit all over the place when I get done....grin


Steel corrals tough to beat, literally.

We use mostly continuous for any new projects. Fast and way stronger than wood.

Yes and no. Lloyds is there to confirm we are complying with our specs and procedures. They know we know what we are doing.

Cooling water pipe.



Lifting trunnions. One on each corner.



6,500 tonnes on the hook. Yours truly in the center.



And away she goes to be set on the hull.



No boredom here.

WOW!



That is bad ass Ed.

Ed,....that last pic,...of the Crane Barge and that lift.

Below the spreader bars,....what SIZE are those slings ?

Are they assembled with a splice, or clamp ?

Beautiful riggin' !

GTC

Teal,

Use the rest of the GI bill going to line school. Lots of job openings now and if you do it wrong you get to weld some......if your lucky!

Greg,

The slings are spliced and 10" in diameter. This is the largest crane Samsung has at 8000 tonnes. Hyundai just completed building a 10 tonne one. Another favorite photo I took from my office, a hunk of ship... They are masters with rigging no doubt.

Glad I don't have to carry the fid for that. Or to use it...

Welding is a nice hobby, took a travel trailer frame from this,


To this.

I plan to retire very soon and bought myself a Miller 211 for Christmas to learn with. Really looking forward to it.

here is my take. I have held a D1.1, 1.5 and a heap of pipe certs for a long time. I own a very nice machine shop and make my bulk of money sitting in crane.

what ever you are going to do, be better than most at it. make sure that a robot could never do YOUR job. have a STEADY hand and the ability to stay calm 100% of the time.

I spend a good number of hours working iron around some instant death if I let confidence get ahead of talent. stay focused, continue to chase knowledge and try hard to have fun at what you do.

if I had a do over in life, I would be working for a local utility as a natural gas meterman/welder or a lineman.

if you think you may want to become a welder, I would suggest you throw a handful of bb's in a frying pan and get them up to high heat, dump a few down your shirt and be certain at least one goes into your ear.....that sizzle you hear, is normal. did you jump, wiggle or move? if so.....you are gonna need to repeat until you don't. it takes a steady hand, good eyes and the ability to not mind picking your nose at Christmas dinner to dig out those smoke induced bugers.

think service of needs of those who have money...utilities, governments...etc they pay the bills and have positions that will not me turned over to a robot anytime soon.

I make a bit over 51 dollars per hour with over time after 40, benefits and 17 dollars per hour for my truck and machine. I weld pipelines and you could not pay me enough to work in nuke plants or refineries.

To me, the trouble with welding is that if you can, then you must, or your world will not be at peace.

It's like a pronounced doom, or fate...

I am old. My eyes aren't all that good any more. Aint' nobody wants to hear it, though...

I suspect one day their gonna miss me at dinner time, and find me wedged back into a [bleep] hole.
Dead with a stinger in my hand...

The welding programs that do placements are largely Mig schools looking to fill factories with piecework laborers doing low pay production welding.

Yes, they are welders, but there is no draw for me.

Pick up some basics from an experienced welder. Buy a machine and practice.
Practice a lot...

I'm going to Frame this and post it on my shop wall, Amigo.

Damn...

Excellent post buddy, but I have to say if I get a hot one down the pants I'll be dancing like Michael Jackson... I'm big I'm bad, I know it, but molten metal on the balls or schlong hurts!!!!

Hey, has anyone posted pics? We know who welds here. This is what I do:








Good thread guys. Keep up the good work!! To the newbie welder/fitters out there, don't be too quick to say something can't be done!!

I have caught on fire several times and you just halve to hold your self some times to finish what you are welding before you can even flinch.

If you do not like fire stay away from welding

I have my CWI and the illegals here is Cali have destroyed the construction market here.

I am inspecting two different company's on the job I am on right now and the certified welders in the field are making $12.00 per hour.

I have a full rig set up with a 500amp. diesel welder , 80 gal. air comp, 45 ton iron worker, 60 amp. plasma and all the extras. I use to get $80.00 per hour with my rig.

Physically I last 1 day and I am down for 3 or 4 getting old sucks and welding and iron takes its toll on you.

Good luck on what you decide on doing.

I have worked with a lot of welders pipelining in the Arctic. While I would like to be able to lay a decent bead I wouldn't want to do it for a living.

Getting burnt is all part of the job. Look at a welders arms and the scars tell the story..

That's a fact

And to fuel the fire.....a bunch of "welders" are not worth the cost of a used 4" rock on a torch. Spend time fitting your own connections without power tools. ....it will make you a hand or realize that this is not your cup of tea.

Dunno about that... I've worked with guys who went to the school of hard knocks and they were still trying to get a chance to learn TIG pipe welding 20 years into their career. Not many employers I've been around say "Let Jim weld that, he needs to practice his 5G stick pipe today." They go with the people who already have the basics down and pretty much know what they are up against.

When I qualify people it is really apparent on the test who has had some quality school/training time as compared to those who are just hoping to figure it out during the test and their company sent them in hoping to get them certified.

While an AAS degree isn't everything and it often comes down to the person, not many people aspiring to weld, go to Home Depot and buy a stick of XXH 2" pipe to practice on it in their garage and teach themselves.

The better the cut=the better the fit-up=better welds. Win/win

The first thing I learned was never loan out cutting tips. Too many think a file and or chipping hammer is the way to clean one.

That's fuel that SHOULD be thrown.

Some of the hacking and outright steel butchery that goes on commonly now would have the hands that brought me up shakin' their heads in disgust.

I've made the mistake of letting some of these apes use my equipment once or twice,... = ruined tip, and crushed valve seats in the torch bud and body.

As far as competency with oxy cutting gear, or a lack thereof,...I find it PARTICULARLY bad here in S.E. Az.

GTC

Seems a welder hasn't arrived til he's stood 170 ft in the air on an 8" beam and poured a paper cup of gator-ade on his sack for relief...

Lonny, I'd say that the U.S. is still just a little to BIG, with marked geographical variations in Apprenticeship / Training protocols.

I'm a LONG way from "The Valley" ,...but from what I'm reading in the local trade rags, the Aero-Industrial industries in Phoenix are more and more leaning towards in-house curricula, and bringing up their top hands in house.

Worth noting as well that The technical schools up there, in synch with the process equipment manufacturers are starting to push HIGH SCHOOL Vo-tech again,machining and welding, as well as engine building, and such. This is something IMHO that's been sadly lacking from the American landscape for a while, and damned good to see.

GTC.

Hell man,....you could become to the welding game what Baxter Black has to ranching and cowboyin'.

Had to google that one.

Him and me share a birthday...

Your approach to the humorous aspects of our "occupations" certainly fall under the same stars.

I'll be REALLY pissed if you ever start posting dead serious gloom and doom, "America as we knew it is gone....' Horse apple posts.

GTC

I'm a welder, and that's about all I'm ever dead serious about.

America will never be gone while I draw breath...

Seriously...

john, just dont cash out at byron lol

Speaking of [bleep] holes...

I worked the head repair there and braidwood...

A guy I worked with for a while had been a pipe welder for a long time. He did pipeline and had worked on the Alaskan pipeline etc...Then he worked on the nuclear plant they built nearby.

He said it was the best job he ever had. Two fitters getting everything ready to weld and then he would weld. An inspector would come look and fill out a report, then a second inspector would come by and fill out another. If they didn't match that was a week shutdown while they hammered out the issue, all the time he sat there waiting for them to decide how to go forward. He said lots of weeks he would work 8 hours max a week.

You are correct as I know how they work and it is BS, a lot of wasted time for no real reason. A very boring job IMHO.

If you put it on the wall, we oughtta at least try to spel it rite...

A proper fit up makes it easier to make a quality weld, but a quality weld can be made without a good fit up.
I made this high pressure pipe weld with out a good fit up, the x-ray wS good

Man,.....

.....whole lotta' stringers later, eh ?

GTC

http://www.indeed.com/forum/job/Tool-and-Die-Maker/Boom-bust/t2014

I learned at 16. I was handed a hood and told to follow Charlie, a pipeline certified welder around, and "watch the bead." After doing that 14 hours a day for two weeks, I was handed leads and several sticks of 7018. We had I-beam laid out on the floor and I was told to weld the flats and make the bead look like Charlies'. I did so and as I completed each weld the slag would curl up and start peeling off revealing a perfect 7018 weld. Those welds were for a reverse pit for a workover rig and had to stand a lot of stress, including being sucked onto a semi trailer via winch, but I guess held up fine. At that point, I still had a lot to learn, including running 7018 vertical, but basically learned to weld better than most, including some "professional" welders, just by "watching the bead" of a really good welder for two weeks.

What's the Theme Song for that Site,....

"Music to slash one's wrists by ?"

More sad defeatist horsechit.

Things may get real slow, but to posit that these skills will "Die" is blithering idiocy, rooted in depression and unhappiness.

GTC

Whatever you wanna think.

I spent decades mastering the trade,....got decent at it.

There's better ways to make a living,...but nobody could tell me either.

You can spend your life learning a trade,...or for a few bucks less you can just go drive a taxi.

http://www1.salary.com/Machinist-I-Salary.html

http://www1.salary.com/Taxi-Driver-Salary.html

Location, location, location...

I haven't made less than $60k in 25 years as a toolmaker. Most years are within spitting distance of a six figure income. Lot of overtime, still have had time to enjoy life.

My son started as a machinist, worked his way up to process engineer in a non-union shop. His income ain't chump change either.

It matters less about what you do and more about how much people want YOU to be the one doing it. Be good at what you do....and don't be afraid to take a better gig.

Rollin, that's damn funny!!!!