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We will have a big problem with jobs building infrastructure, and bringing manufacturing back, millennials. Most of them can't or won't do anything that requires manual labor. Not all but most. Most people in big box stores who are building things are in their 50s. Most today don't know what it's like to actually put in a hard days work, where your sore and tired when you come home. I have seen so many 30 somethings that won't even mowe their lawns, or do any maintenance on their cars. Am I wrong, or just getting old, your thoughts

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/16/millennials-literally-cant-pull-their-weight-either/
You are wrong and (apparently) getting old...
Cut off welfare and see how fast those 30 somethings toughen up and get to work.
This coddling shiett from cradle to grave by .gov is ending on 1/20/17..
You might be kind of right and wrong. A lot of us became hands-on in part because of jobs we had.

For instance, now-days most gasoline is self-pumped at some sort of convenience store but in our day it was pumped by gas jockeys at service stations where this entry-level job exposed a lot of us to working on cars.

Just having more good labor jobs in our economy should expose some people to working with their hands who wouldn't have been otherwise.

But you might be right about millennials who won't do a thing. I think they will develop into a new underclass when their parents die. Or maybe they'll get a wakeup call?
When I was in high school, many kids bucked hay bales. That was before the bale wagon was invented so it was all hand work. I was tall and skinny but it's amazing how strong a skinny kid can get from throwing 80lb bales all day.
Root hog, or die.
That might be a problem with some millennials, but my son's a millennial and he'd work your butt off.
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Root hog, or die.


That's truth!

To the OP;

Perhaps you're living in the wrong part of the country. Around here, it's the exception to find a millennial not holding down a full time job.

Ed
Depends on the kid. Damn sure a bunch of them are lazy.
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/13/millennials-are-falling-behind-their-boomer-parents.html

One of the problems with your stance is that a lot of those in the big box stores building things are working on their own homes, and home ownership isn't as obtainable as it was for your generation, and incomes certainly aren't keeping pace either... We can blame lazy millenials all we want, but baby boomers that didn't plan for retirement, were laid off pre-retirement, etc. all staying in the job market past retirement are negatively affecting all the younger generations' job prospects and mobility. It's easy to look down upon them as lazy do-nothings, but you've probably never had a student loan payment that's as big as a house payment, which many of them do. We can argue whether those student loans were necessary, but the facts support having a college degree leads to on average higher earnings so the investment is hard to argue with even though the consequences of that debt is far-reaching. You also have to consider that some of your observations could be biased as many baby-boomers were pot-smoking flower children at similar points in their lives so it's hard for me to understand that generation casting stones at anyone for "laziness"...
I know I'm doing right when I get home from work and my boy is already out shoveling snow. I could see him from the time I turned the corner towards the house. I never asked him to do it.... good kid.
Horseshit. Plenty of good millennials out there to fill jobs.

We should call the boomer generation the "insecure" generation..
I ain't a 'generation' blamer, folks are folks.

That said, if I was one, I'd put it square on the Boomers. What a worthless bunch of f*cks, as a whole. Especially the early part of that generation.
Originally Posted by Steelhead
I ain't a 'generation' blamer, folks are folks.

That said, if I was one, I'd put it square on the Boomers. What a worthless bunch of f*cks, as a whole. Especially the early part of that generation.


+1
People grow up in different times so acquire different cultural values but given the chance I’ve found most millennials to be decent workers. They definitely have different expectations at work than I did at that age but then their employer’s values and loyalty to their employees have changed as well.

But there is another event on the horizon. If this column has any prognosticative accuracy, robots are going to change the whole job market in ways we haven’t seen since the Industrial Revolution began.

For those with twitter attention spans, the gist is:
Robots will replace more and more jobs, especially the entry level and/or more menial or physical kind. They make sense to employers since they don’t have any of the problems human labor does. But robots don’t spend their wages – they don’t make wages. So who is going to buy all of the products that robots create? And what are we going to do with the social problems caused by all of the people who can’t find jobs since robots have them all?

Link here: http://fredoneverything.org/ready-new-rossiters-universal-robots-toward-a-most-minimal-wage/



Ready: New Rossum’s Universal Robots: Toward a Most Minimal Wage

Being as I am a curmudgeon, and delight in human folly and thoughts of huge asteroids, tsunamis, incurable plagues, continent-shattering volcanoes, and the Hillary administration, I follow the advance of robots with hope. They may finally end civilization as we know it. Currently they spread like kudzu. Herewith a few notes from my favorite technical publication, the Drudge Report. It may convince you that the robots are upon us like ants on a sandwich.

Navy building autonomous sub-hunting submarine. Robots deliver food to your door. China’s use of robots set to surge. Amazon uses 30,000 robots in warehouses. AMBER lab robot jogs like human. Japanese farming robots. Burger-flipping robot. World’s first sex-robot. China’s robot cop. China’s road to self-driving cars. Bloomberg uses robot story-writers. In theme park, robots make food and drinks. SCHAFT unveils new robot in Japan. Boston Dynamics has several ominous robots paid for by the Pentagon. Robot does soft-tissue surgery better than humans. Robotic KFC outlet in Shanghai. And of course everybody and his dog are working on self-driving vehicles.

People seldom click on links. This one, Atlas, from Boston Dynamics, is truly worth a click. Think of him coming through your door by night. Many similar critters exist, often in Asia.

These machines either work well or come very close, and impinge on manufacturing, delivery, war, policing, the restaurant industry, journalism, and service industries perhaps soon to include prostitution. We ought to think forethoughtedly about what to do with these machines. We won’t.

Photo: Amazon’s robots. Video. These orange devils carry heavy racks to humans who pick ordered goods from them for shipment. Amazon is working on robots that can do the picking. Who will be left? In principle, 30,000 robots can work 90,000 shifts, plus weekends. With a predictability that makes sunrise look like a long shot, the company says that the robots do not replace but “help” humans. If you believe this, I’d like to sell you stock in my venture to make radioactive dog-food on Mars.

Automation of course means more than robots. As newspaper after newspaper goes all-digital, less pulpwood will be needed to make less newsprint, pressmen will be fired, delivery trucks will no longer needed, and so on. Such ripple effects get little attention. They should.

The capitalist paradigm in which companies think only about themselves, seeking to increase productivity and reduce costs, is going to work decreasingly well. Replacing well-paid workers with robots means replacing customers with a lot of money with customers with little money. People who are not paid much do not buy much. Robots buy even less.

The first crucial question of coming decades: Who is going to buy the stuff pouring from robotic factories?

The current notion is that when a yoyo factory automates and lays off most of its workers, they will find other well-paid jobs and continue to buy yoyos. But as well-paid jobs everywhere go automated, where will the money come from to buy yoyos? Today participation in the work force is at all- time lows and we have a large and growing number of young who, unable to find good jobs, live with their parents. They are not buying houses or renting apartments. (They may, given the intellectual level of today’s young, be buying yoyos.)

Enthusiasts of the free market say that I do not understand economics, that there will always be work for people who want to work. But there isn’t. There won’t be. There is less all the time. Again, look at the falling participation in the work force, the growing numbers in part-time badly paid jobs. Short of governmentally imposed minimums, wages are determined by the market, meaning that if a robot works for a dollar an hour, a human will have to work for ninety-five cents an hour to compete , or find a job a robot can’t do–and these get scarcer.

From a businessman’s point of view, robots are superb employees. They don’t strike, demand raises, call in sick, get disgruntled and do a sloppy job, or require benefits. Building factories that are robotic from the gitgo means not having to lay workers off, which is politically easier than firing existing workers. Using robots obviates the Chinese advantage in wages, especially if America can make better robots–good for companies, but not for workers in either country. That is, production may return to the US, but jobs will not. In countries with declining populations, having robots do the work may reduce the attractiveness of importing uncivilizable bomb-chucking morons from the bush world.

A second crucial question: What will we do with people who have nothing to do? This has been a hidden problem for a long time, solved to date by child-labor laws, compulsory attendance in high school, the growth of universities as holding tanks, welfare populations, and vast bureaucracies of people who pretend to be employed. Few of these do anything productive, but are supported and kept off the job market by the rest of us. But there are limits to the capacity of Starbuck’s to soak up college graduates. (The economic fate of America may depend on our consumption of overpriced coffee.)

As time goes on and fewer and fewer people can find work, and particularly the less intelligent, something will have to give. We won’t see it coming. We never see anything coming. Businessmen will observe productivity going up and labor costs going down. What could be wrong with that? Businessmen do not concern themselves with social questions. Methinks, however, that social questions are about to concern themselves with businessmen.

As standards of living decrease, unrest will come. I will guess that much of Donald Trump’s popularity arises from the sending of factories to China by the corporations that rule America. Now the robots are going to take the remaining jobs. Economists will chatter of this principle and that curve and what Aristotle said about Veblen, but in a free market for labor, robots will win. If we have a high minimum wage, business will automate. If we have a low minimum wage, they will automate, but a few years later.

The obvious solution, one I think inevitable within a few decades unless we want a revolution, is a guaranteed minimum income, enough to live on comfortably, for everyone. Whether this is a good idea can be debated, but it seems likely to be the only idea. Capitalists will tell me that I do not understand markets, or capital flows or pricing mechanisms, and that I am against freedom. I will respond that they need to wake up and look around. And I will point out that economics has become a tedious form of Left-Right metaphysics, Keynes versus the Austrian School, capitalism versus socialism, all unconnected to onrushing reality.

What would be the effects of a guaranteed income? Godawful, I would guess. Some people, probably including those who read columns on the web, would read, listen to music, drink wine and talk with friends, hike in the Himalayas, scuba dive, and earn doctorates in physics. But most would get up every morning, bored, without purpose, anticipating just another of unending days of television, beer, tedium, no driving desire to do anything but discontent with nothing to do. Would the young even go to school? They would have no need. What has happened among the welfare populations that in effect have a guaranteed minimum income?

See? We are doomed. It warms the cockles of a curmudgeon’s heart. Whatever a cockle is.
I have a son and daughter that are millennials.

They probably work harder than I did at that age. For less gain too. It's hard to make ends meet in today's world.

There's a difference in "millennial" and "snowflake".
There are a lot of kids acing to work with some skills.

Around here it is who you know and not what you know.

I talked to a kid last night that has a lot of welding and fabricating skills. He's 25 a hard worker and no one will hire him.

I have been out of work for 4 months with 27 years in my trade and 12 years welding and I am loosing my job to the 30 year old's that know people and do not know the first thing on how to do their job.

This kid has high hopes and drive. He told me last night that we need to go into business together and I am thinking about it.

There are some good kids out there. We just need to feed their drive.
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
It's hard to make ends meet in today's world.


Agreed. Look to the Boomers who made sure they got theirs, and left their kids struggling. In many ways.
I think the view of Millennials is very different in an urban environment. Out here in my world they are fairly typical kids, some good some bad, some lazy some work. As mentioned earlier, if we take away all the damned bennies and free rides folks would have no choice but to rise to the occasion. They, and the country, will be better off for it.
I wish I could have got a robot to build my house.

My observation is, as time goes by fewer and fewer people have to do manual labor to make a living. So fewer and fewer people are accustomed to it.
Hard to find a kid that wants to work around here. Too many under the table cash gigs growing, cutting, and processing pot. Plus the bene's if you know what I mean. Must pay well, Dorito sales up 65%.
Originally Posted by Steelhead
I ain't a 'generation' blamer, folks are folks.

That said, if I was one, I'd put it square on the Boomers. What a worthless bunch of f*cks, as a whole. Especially the early part of that generation.

Yep, it's us boomers that coddled and handed out participation trophies. Luckily our son saw the light after a year or two of Liberal Arts and shifted gears into welding.
One thing that bothered me as he was finishing up HS was how those that were going the CC or trade route were looked down upon by the ones going the BA etc route.
Around here the local CC is called Harvard on the Hill by HS seniors and most that plan to go there don't really want any of their peers to know. crazy
After 2 years there our son stepped immediately into a $100K year welding position.
I think it varies by the person, just like it always did. I have two boys, one 18 and one 13. The 13 year old is still somewhat lazy, but I'll get it out of him.

I've so far been very impressed with the willingness of the older son to work and learn. He performs all maintenance and repairs on his truck, plays baseball, works in hay, builds barns, has straight a's in school, and is taking all the dual enrollment college courses available to him.
Originally Posted by bobhanson1
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/13/millennials-are-falling-behind-their-boomer-parents.html

One of the problems with your stance is that a lot of those in the big box stores building things are working on their own homes, and home ownership isn't as obtainable as it was for your generation, and incomes certainly aren't keeping pace either... We can blame lazy millenials all we want, but baby boomers that didn't plan for retirement, were laid off pre-retirement, etc. all staying in the job market past retirement are negatively affecting all the younger generations' job prospects and mobility. It's easy to look down upon them as lazy do-nothings, but you've probably never had a student loan payment that's as big as a house payment, which many of them do. We can argue whether those student loans were necessary, but the facts support having a college degree leads to on average higher earnings so the investment is hard to argue with even though the consequences of that debt is far-reaching. You also have to consider that some of your observations could be biased as many baby-boomers were pot-smoking flower children at similar points in their lives so it's hard for me to understand that generation casting stones at anyone for "laziness"...

I was born in '56 and I never met a flower child in my life. I knew a few pot smokers in college, But they sure as hell were.no hippies.

The hippies were definitely around on the 60"s. But from observation they were a tiny minority who made noise out of all proportion to their numbers.

Having worked as a foreman of a crew for 35 years, It is a hell of a lot harder to find young men today who are willing to put in a 10 hour day of labor than it was in 1980.
Nobody likes real work anymore
My kids are in their 30s, not sure where millennials start and stop. But my kids did work hard in high school and college. Now they have jobs that require far less physical labor. But they work long hours with lots of responsibility.
Its how they were raised, not what generation they come from.
I shucked many bales as a farm kid and worked 60-80 hours a week in the summer. Many friends did the same. Some others whose parents had money went to the swimming pool to work on their tan.
Could bring legal Latino's into the R side once they start making legit construction/skilled labor wages.

It will throw the middle class labor workers into the R side and out of the old Dem/union model.

Get used to work kids, because opportunity knocks.
I think it comes down to the circles you find yourself in. More of less, lazy worthless kids are sired by lazy worthless parents. I don't associate with such parents, and find that their kids seem to be like their parents: intelligent, hard working and motivated.

I'm pretty confident if you see the high school kids that are taking multiple AP classes, have a high GPA, play varsity sport(s) and have a part time job you'll have an entirely different viewpoint on the future.

What I am entirely sick of is the self absorbed baby boomer generation that thinks the world revolves around them. It's time for them to move over and let the next generation take the helm. Perhaps the next generations will see how hollow the me generation was and not follow their mistakes.
What I do see is a lot of boomers who want to enrich themselves off the backs of the x and mill generations. Pay dirt cheap wages, treat them poorly, and expect 100% effort and loyalty. Mills don't put up with that.

Whenever I hear someone complaining about nobody wanting to "work" for them, it's usually an indication of leadership skills rather than the workforce.
Originally Posted by hanco
Nobody likes real work anymore


That includes me


I've worked hard

I think it sucks

Used to take pride in it, but I was dumber back then
I blame it on the "Greatest Generation". They did a great job defeating the Germans and Japanese but then totally effed up raising their kids, and it's been downhill ever since with an increasingly steeper slope at every generational classification.
To me it's a matter of opportunity. I was one of those early boomers. I learned hard work from my parents. I also learned hard work by the fact that if I wanted something as a kid, I needed to work to earn money, to buy it. I wanted to go to college, which would be the first person in my family to do so. I took the opportunity to work at the local plywood mill. On a quarter to quarter basis they allowed me to shift from graveyard to swing shift, and to arrange my college schedule accordingly. I made good money, enough to help my divorced mom pay a mortgage and to save for educational efforts after college. I worked full time (actually more than full time as I worked as much overtime and holiday time as I could) all during college (3.5 years). Those jobs don't exist as they did 40 some year ago. We now value owls more than people. And now kids are told that their future is in outdoor recreation - a service level job that is certainly not 24/7 365 days a year, nor does it pay as much.

Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Root hog, or die.


^^^This^^^
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by bobhanson1
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/13/millennials-are-falling-behind-their-boomer-parents.html

One of the problems with your stance is that a lot of those in the big box stores building things are working on their own homes, and home ownership isn't as obtainable as it was for your generation, and incomes certainly aren't keeping pace either... We can blame lazy millenials all we want, but baby boomers that didn't plan for retirement, were laid off pre-retirement, etc. all staying in the job market past retirement are negatively affecting all the younger generations' job prospects and mobility. It's easy to look down upon them as lazy do-nothings, but you've probably never had a student loan payment that's as big as a house payment, which many of them do. We can argue whether those student loans were necessary, but the facts support having a college degree leads to on average higher earnings so the investment is hard to argue with even though the consequences of that debt is far-reaching. You also have to consider that some of your observations could be biased as many baby-boomers were pot-smoking flower children at similar points in their lives so it's hard for me to understand that generation casting stones at anyone for "laziness"...

I was born in '56 and I never met a flower child in my life. I knew a few pot smokers in college, But they sure as hell were.no hippies.

The hippies were definitely around on the 60"s. But from observation they were a tiny minority who made noise out of all proportion to their numbers.

Having worked as a foreman of a crew for 35 years, It is a hell of a lot harder to find young men today who are willing to put in a 10 hour day of labor than it was in 1980.


That was my point-entire generations are being written off based on the actions/mentality of a few, and in many cases it's a function of who you associate with or where you live. You weren't a flower child, but some minority of your generation was so do you agree with all of their positions? Same goes for the millenials as many are working twice as hard to get half as far as others have noted, but yet we're stereotyping the entire lot based on the ones we see living in the basement or rioting on TV while ignoring the ones working 80+ hours a week trying to get by... It's been that way forever and probably always will be in terms of wanting to think those that come after have it easier, but the numbers seem to agree with the fact that millenials are getting a raw deal in general...
I think it goes back to that old proverb about finding what you look for. If you look for lazy millennials, X-ers,boomers,etc. you will find them.

My kids are x-ers/millennials and they and their spouses and most of their acquaintances are good honest hard working folks.
Originally Posted by CEJ1895
Cut off welfare and see how fast those 30 somethings toughen up and get to work.
This coddling shiett from cradle to grave by .gov is ending on 1/20/17..


Well, maybe.............time will tell how successfully that can be done.

MM
Originally Posted by nealglen37
We will have a big problem with jobs building infrastructure, and bringing manufacturing back, millennials. Most of them can't or won't do anything that requires manual labor. Not all but most. Most people in big box stores who are building things are in their 50s. Most today don't know what it's like to actually put in a hard days work, where your sore and tired when you come home. I have seen so many 30 somethings that won't even mowe their lawns, or do any maintenance on their cars. Am I wrong, or just getting old, your thoughts

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/16/millennials-literally-cant-pull-their-weight-either/


No schidt...

Gen "X" ain't much better. They're having a hard time getting enough production employees to work overtime so they can run the plant on weekends. Even the union told them at a meeting a few weeks ago that if they don't want to work we can find someone who will.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter

Having worked as a foreman of a crew for 35 years, It is a hell of a lot harder to find young men today who are willing to put in a 10 hour day of labor than it was in 1980.



The difference is simply that promising young men have more choices OTHER than a labor job. Any hardworking kid with half a brain has an opportunity to go to college, and many, most, do.
Originally Posted by Jim in Idaho
I blame it on the "Greatest Generation". They did a great job defeating the Germans and Japanese but then totally effed up raising their kids, and it's been downhill ever since with an increasingly steeper slope at every generational classification.


Sadly I agree with you, but I also understand why they did what they did. I'll give my dad as an example. His dad fought in WWI, got gassed by the Germans but didn't die, immediately, did die when dad was two. Single mom raised two boys during the great depression, she worked a full time job and dad and his brother worked with mom on side jobs. Uncle got killed in WWII.

Needless to say dad had a bit of suffering growing up. He wanted it better for his kids. Fortunately we saw his work ethic and mostly followed along.

That said, I think to a degree the greatest generation didn't want their kids to suffer, but in so doing made the softest generation. Struggle and hard work is imperative to forming people of character. And those boomers who were deprived of that necessary struggle grew up to be the self absorbed narcissists they are.
Originally Posted by Jim in Idaho
I blame it on the "Greatest Generation". They did a great job defeating the Germans and Japanese but then totally effed up raising their kids, and it's been downhill ever since with an increasingly steeper slope at every generational classification.


I agree. Seen it in real life more often than not.
Additionally, many of "The Greatest Generation" tenaciously clung to the Democratic Party, even when it shat on them.
I professionally cared for those folks, and most I had experience with, were abrasive and uncaring toward their children, when then as adults, rarely visited even prior to their death. Money doesn't equate to love and teaching.
That is telling. Kids mirror their upbringing.
I have two "worthless millennials". My son has two college degrees (one before leaving high school) and is entering the fire Academy with the next class. He is trained for fighting wildfires now, and working manual labor now because he LIKES working with his hands and is good at it.
My second "worthless millennial " is an EMT, entered bootcamp to become a combat medic, and blew out her knee in training. She is now married (to navy) and raising my first grandchild. (Did i mention she has a "save pin" from her very first squad run? Or that she took 11th and 12th grade simultaneously, because it bored her?

I'm damn proud of both my millennials.
Originally Posted by Wyogal
Originally Posted by Jim in Idaho
I blame it on the "Greatest Generation". They did a great job defeating the Germans and Japanese but then totally effed up raising their kids, and it's been downhill ever since with an increasingly steeper slope at every generational classification.


I agree. Seen it in real life more often than not.
Additionally, many of "The Greatest Generation" tenaciously clung to the Democratic Party, even when it shat on them.
I professionally cared for those folks, and most I had experience with, were abrasive and uncaring toward their children, when then as adults, rarely visited even prior to their death. Money doesn't equate to love and teaching.
That is telling. Kids mirror their upbringing.


I was thinking. How many of the Great Generation came back from the war with undiagnosed PTSD? Only the most severe symptoms back then were recognized, but also not understanding on how to treat it. Could this possibility have affected how they raised their kids?
But then, need to look at the Viet Nam War veterans, and how going to war may have affected their ability to raise kids.
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by nealglen37
We will have a big problem with jobs building infrastructure, and bringing manufacturing back, millennials. Most of them can't or won't do anything that requires manual labor. Not all but most. Most people in big box stores who are building things are in their 50s. Most today don't know what it's like to actually put in a hard days work, where your sore and tired when you come home. I have seen so many 30 somethings that won't even mowe their lawns, or do any maintenance on their cars. Am I wrong, or just getting old, your thoughts

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/16/millennials-literally-cant-pull-their-weight-either/


No schidt...

Gen "X" ain't much better. They're having a hard time getting enough production employees to work overtime so they can run the plant on weekends. Even the union told them at a meeting a few weeks ago that if they don't want to work we can find someone who will.


Maybe they want to go fishing or hunting, or spend time with their wife/kids?

Sorry, but the days of owning your employees are coming to an end.
I used to work on cars up though the 70s models.
Now I pop the hood and don't even know what I'm looking at
Over the last 5-7 years I have been involved in interviewing applicants for for several Technical positions. We don't seek a degree, we just seek someone with a mechanical,electrical,hydraulic background that is willing to travel. While everyone here may have the perfect kid, I can tell you it is almost impossible to find a younger person that has a mechanical background and is willing to travel. If you were just a little motivated and had people skills, you could pull down $80k/yr easy and if you were very motivated, you could probably come close to $100k. This is all without a degree. Sometimes you have to sacrifice the weekends hunting and the evening with the kids to get ahead. IF you think someone is just going to walk up and hand you these things, you are part of the problem.
Originally Posted by hanco
Nobody likes real work anymore



Another completely wrong and out of touch answer. I have a slew of millenials that work for me...I am classified as a millenial. I work them hard and they make me money...It is a mindset that is compounded by nonsense drivel like this. You all need to get off your self appropriated high horse and actually learn what the younger adults of this nation are capable of.
WE ALL??

You obviously haven't read all of the posts. Most of them are very supportive of "you all".

If you dropped the "all" from your post I would agree with you. Hanco is out of touch on a lot of subjects and loves the sound bite.
A lot of the Trades are hurting for apprentices.Kids now a days are brain washed into thinking they need a College degree and then find out four years with a BS in Basketweaving is worthless. Journeyman Electricians,Plumbers,Pipe-fitters are pulling in some good money.
Originally Posted by nealglen37
We will have a big problem with jobs building infrastructure, and bringing manufacturing back, millennials. Most of them can't or won't do anything that requires manual labor. Not all but most. Most people in big box stores who are building things are in their 50s. Most today don't know what it's like to actually put in a hard days work, where your sore and tired when you come home. I have seen so many 30 somethings that won't even mowe their lawns, or do any maintenance on their cars. Am I wrong, or just getting old, your thoughts

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/16/millennials-literally-cant-pull-their-weight-either/


Only partly true. Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.

If Trump is even halfway successful, it is the hourly wage and middle class salary earners who will see the fastest rise in wages--as opposed to the upper middle class and very wealthy class who have seen the biggest rise in income.

Casey
Maybe if parents take away the kids cellphones the kids may stop acting like media zombies.
Remind me never to get stuck in a foxhole, or on some bastion with you.

You sound like a specialist in snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

....this is no time for defeatism.

GTC
Casey I hope you're right but I'm not seeing Trump load his cabinet with people showing a track record of concern for the hourly worker and middle class. The 1%ers will take care of themselves long before they'll concern themselves about the rest of us. Congress for far too long, both Republican and Democrat, has passed tax laws that have resulted in the have/have not separation in our country far more than an unwillingness of millennials to work. I'd love to see a flat tax applied to all forms of income including dividends, bonuses, etc. Warren Buffet hit it pretty square when he said his secretary paid a higher rate of tax on earned money than he did. I don't see the incoming administration leading the charge to change that. I certainly do hope to be surprised but I think it's unlikely.
Originally Posted by alpinecrick/
Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.Casey
Exactly right. The trouble is far too many companies expect folks to work for wages they can't possibly live on.
I posted on another topic.

Early this week I certified a welder for a gas pipe welding project he has been asked to work on.

He has been welding since the mid 70's. The company that employs him is paying him $25.00 per hour.

He told me that he is making less now than he was 20 years ago. I agreed with him I have watched the wages go down and down as time has went by. And with Obummer i office they have crashed big time.

The welder was a very good welder with a lot of skills.
he has worked all over the country chasing the money to support his family that is all grown up now.

The company can not find good quality welders willing to take the low pay and the company to be competitive can not pay any more than they do already.

Insurance killed my company. I had 3 Mil. and was required to take on another 9 Mil. to keep my client so I was finished.

Company's can not pay more to there workers when they have to pay out so much in extortion insurance.

When they hire Illegals it is for the most part under the table and they do not have to carry the insurance for those workers and they still pay them less money.

This cycle needs to be changed before things get better.

20 years ago I was making almost double what I can get now and I can not find a job they all say I am over qualified for the jobs I am trying to get.
Originally Posted by Old Ornery
Maybe if parents take away the kids cellphones the kids may stop acting like media zombies.


And quit letting them live in the basement till they are 30.
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by alpinecrick/
Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.Casey
Exactly right. The trouble is far too many companies expect folks to work for wages they can't possibly live on.


You are never gonna get rich flipping burgers and working the production line. When you can do something the next person won't or can't, then you become valuable.
Originally Posted by bobhanson1
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/13/millennials-are-falling-behind-their-boomer-parents.html

One of the problems with your stance is that a lot of those in the big box stores building things are working on their own homes, and home ownership isn't as obtainable as it was for your generation, and incomes certainly aren't keeping pace either... We can blame lazy millenials all we want, but baby boomers that didn't plan for retirement, were laid off pre-retirement, etc. all staying in the job market past retirement are negatively affecting all the younger generations' job prospects and mobility. It's easy to look down upon them as lazy do-nothings, but you've probably never had a student loan payment that's as big as a house payment, which many of them do. We can argue whether those student loans were necessary, but the facts support having a college degree leads to on average higher earnings so the investment is hard to argue with even though the consequences of that debt is far-reaching. You also have to consider that some of your observations could be biased as many baby-boomers were pot-smoking flower children at similar points in their lives so it's hard for me to understand that generation casting stones at anyone for "laziness"...


Something you might be missing is the number of jobs those baby boomers had were destroyed by Obama and some were taken by illegals when an unscrupulous business owner cut some cost.
Originally Posted by WeimsnKs
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by alpinecrick/
Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.Casey
Exactly right. The trouble is far too many companies expect folks to work for wages they can't possibly live on.


You are never gonna get rich flipping burgers and working the production line. When you can do something the next person won't or can't, then you become valuable.
Nobody said anything about getting rich flipping burgers you dumb SOB.
Entry level jobs that used to be a stepping stone for high school kids are now locked up by 40 something year old Mexicans. That's also the reason that there's a push to raise minimum wage to a "living" wage. Without work experience, any work experience, it's tough for kids to get to the next level.
Originally Posted by Brazos
WE ALL??

You obviously haven't read all of the posts. Most of them are very supportive of "you all".

If you dropped the "all" from your post I would agree with you. Hanco is out of touch on a lot of subjects and loves the sound bite.



The "all" is inclusive of only those that feel "all" millenials are useless and do not want to work.
Originally Posted by Calvin
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by nealglen37
We will have a big problem with jobs building infrastructure, and bringing manufacturing back, millennials. Most of them can't or won't do anything that requires manual labor. Not all but most. Most people in big box stores who are building things are in their 50s. Most today don't know what it's like to actually put in a hard days work, where your sore and tired when you come home. I have seen so many 30 somethings that won't even mowe their lawns, or do any maintenance on their cars. Am I wrong, or just getting old, your thoughts

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/16/millennials-literally-cant-pull-their-weight-either/


No schidt...

Gen "X" ain't much better. They're having a hard time getting enough production employees to work overtime so they can run the plant on weekends. Even the union told them at a meeting a few weeks ago that if they don't want to work we can find someone who will.


Maybe they want to go fishing or hunting, or spend time with their wife/kids?

Sorry, but the days of owning your employees are coming to an end.


I think this has a lot to do with it. They saw their parents work to death and not there for them . Then they saw their parents get laid off after decades of loyalty to the company. I think they understand better than our generation that there is no such thing as loyalty in corporate America and they need to look out for themselves.
Originally Posted by CEJ1895
Cut off welfare and see how fast those 30 somethings toughen up and get to work.
This coddling shiett from cradle to grave by .gov is ending on 1/20/17..


I wish...
Originally Posted by fshaw
Casey I hope you're right but I'm not seeing Trump load his cabinet with people showing a track record of concern for the hourly worker and middle class. The 1%ers will take care of themselves long before they'll concern themselves about the rest of us.


We had eight years of a administration that supposedly had concern for the hourly worker. Warren Buffet and many other 1%ers threw their support behind that administration and the democrat nominee in this election. Guess Warren wasn't to influencial on getting himself to pay his "fare share".
.................................No, the only problems are your negative, defeatist attitude, grow a pair neal.
We have certainly seen this problem in the masonry industry. I don't know of a masonry contractor that is not hurting for masons and laborers. The industry is working hard to attract young people and instill a solid work ethic. It seems to be working, just going a bit slower than we would like.
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by WeimsnKs
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by alpinecrick/
Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.Casey
Exactly right. The trouble is far too many companies expect folks to work for wages they can't possibly live on.


You are never gonna get rich flipping burgers and working the production line. When you can do something the next person won't or can't, then you become valuable.
Nobody said anything about getting rich flipping burgers you dumb SOB.

Wages will be what the market bears. Standing around a production line with one's thumb up his azz isn't all that valuable either, despite what the union bosses would have you believe.
Originally Posted by fshaw
Casey I hope you're right but I'm not seeing Trump load his cabinet with people showing a track record of concern for the hourly worker and middle class. The 1%ers will take care of themselves long before they'll concern themselves about the rest of us. Congress for far too long, both Republican and Democrat, has passed tax laws that have resulted in the have/have not separation in our country far more than an unwillingness of millennials to work. I'd love to see a flat tax applied to all forms of income including dividends, bonuses, etc. Warren Buffet hit it pretty square when he said his secretary paid a higher rate of tax on earned money than he did. I don't see the incoming administration leading the charge to change that. I certainly do hope to be surprised but I think it's unlikely.


fshaw,

I gotta agree with you. I'm not entirely thrilled with a lot of Trump's picks either. I'm' hoping Trump "directs" them in a fashion that mostly lives up to his promises. I don't see Trump keeping somebody around that doesn't perform to his expectations--at least that has been his track record so far.

Trump has to be moderately successful early on because their is a LOT of people who are waiting to maul him and throw him aside otherwise.

Casey
this is not a single tier issue, there is plenty of blame to go around,
Single mothers? No one to teach a boy how to change oil, or replace brakes and rotors.
Section 8 housing, where we house a bunch of inept people, to teach each other how to fail at life, and breed children that are F.A.B.
And an economy that stagnates its way through 1-3 % growth, killing jobs and opportunity for all but the luckiest who have ties to good jobs or education.

We need to show these young people that rewards come from sacrifice, and that sacrifice does have its rewards, neither of these are happening today.
Originally Posted by gregintenn
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by WeimsnKs
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by alpinecrick/
Americans regardless of age are willing to work--they just want to be paid an honest wage that will support them (and their family).

A lot of this is the same BS that claimed "illegal aliens are doing the work that Americans don't want to do". No, Americans don't want to be paid slave wages.Casey
Exactly right. The trouble is far too many companies expect folks to work for wages they can't possibly live on.


You are never gonna get rich flipping burgers and working the production line. When you can do something the next person won't or can't, then you become valuable.
Nobody said anything about getting rich flipping burgers you dumb SOB.

Wages will be what the market bears. Standing around a production line with one's thumb up his azz isn't all that valuable either, despite what the union bosses would have you believe.
Then why bother bringing manufacturing jobs back to the US ? Why all the excitement for Trumps plan to do so ? We don't need a bunch of low paying/minimum wage jobs in this Country. We've already got plenty of those and the middle class is shrinking up to nothing. We'll never have a booming economy again if nobody can afford to buy anything.
Originally Posted by wilkeshunter
We have certainly seen this problem in the masonry industry. I don't know of a masonry contractor that is not hurting for masons and laborers. The industry is working hard to attract young people and instill a solid work ethic. It seems to be working, just going a bit slower than we would like.
Masons don't deserve to make shyt for wages either. It's too easy and anybody can do it. Only doctors, lawyers, dentists, engineers and those who work in the oil industry should make a good living. Everybody else should resign themselves to a life of poverty.
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.


yep. already seeing videos of 'printed' concrete houses and castles. a programmable concrete pouring device that runs along the lines of a CNC kind of device.

maybe the only breedable pairs or groups of humans will be living on the moon or Mars by then. who could possibly know. before WWII, noone would have believed anything about nuclear energy. but thanks to the Germans (Werner Von Braun), the rocket age was borne.
Originally Posted by Gus
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.


yep. already seeing videos of 'printed' concrete houses and castles. a programmable concrete pouring device that runs along the lines of a CNC kind of device.

maybe the only breedable pairs or groups of humans will be living on the moon or Mars by then. who could possibly know. before WWII, noone would have believed anything about nuclear energy. but thanks to the Germans (Werner Von Braun), the rocket age was borne.


You and Blackheart should commit suicide to end your fugging miserable lives.
Originally Posted by Huntz
Originally Posted by Gus
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.


yep. already seeing videos of 'printed' concrete houses and castles. a programmable concrete pouring device that runs along the lines of a CNC kind of device.

maybe the only breedable pairs or groups of humans will be living on the moon or Mars by then. who could possibly know. before WWII, noone would have believed anything about nuclear energy. but thanks to the Germans (Werner Von Braun), the rocket age was borne.


You and Blackheart should commit suicide to end your fugging miserable lives.


lol. thanks for your opinion. opinons are solcited on forums of this sort & type. oh, btw, i've already reproduced, even got male & female Grands, and a lot of distant kin that's much more intense in terms of the thinking about the human condition than i. in fact, i'm only the tip of the iceberg. but, please carry-on, ok?
Originally Posted by Huntz
Originally Posted by Gus
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.


yep. already seeing videos of 'printed' concrete houses and castles. a programmable concrete pouring device that runs along the lines of a CNC kind of device.

maybe the only breedable pairs or groups of humans will be living on the moon or Mars by then. who could possibly know. before WWII, noone would have believed anything about nuclear energy. but thanks to the Germans (Werner Von Braun), the rocket age was borne.


You and Blackheart should commit suicide to end your fugging miserable lives.
I'd much rather kill the likes of you and certainly would if not for the pesky laws against it.
If there is any concern about creating jobs, its overshadowed by the prospect of not having any to offer!
If you don't work, you don't eat.
Originally Posted by Gus
Originally Posted by Blackheart
Originally Posted by Gus
the Storyline is fairly complex.

the final chapter will likely be pretty complex and maybe even painful, at least for some.

America is not the center of the "growth industry" any longer. read it and weep. we must now compete w/the rest of the 7 billion humans breathing air and dragging around down here on the Earth.

wonder how it'll all look in another 100 years?
I figure in another hundred years nobody will have a job. Computers and robots will do everything, including repairing and reproducing themselves.


yep. already seeing videos of 'printed' concrete houses and castles. a programmable concrete pouring device that runs along the lines of a CNC kind of device.

maybe the only breedable pairs or groups of humans will be living on the moon or Mars by then. who could possibly know. before WWII, noone would have believed anything about nuclear energy. but thanks to the Germans (Werner Von Braun), the rocket age was borne.


A lot of truth in that....

http://newatlas.com/3d-printed-office-dubai-completed/43522/

http://newatlas.com/wasp-big-delta-3d-printer-clay-housing/39414/

http://newatlas.com/custom-3d-printer-concrete-castle/33577/

http://newatlas.com/nasa-3d-printed-habitat-challenge-design-competition-winners/39673/

http://newatlas.com/wasp-clay-straw-home/44856/

Careful Gus, i think you may be wading in the shallow end of the genepool....
well, there it is. the dilemma that everyone faces, both the employed and the un-employed also. the challenge or problem is serious w/both groups.

in an age of automation (ever heard of it?), the challenges are clear.

how to re-distribute the wealth, value, outputs in order that all humans get to live, eat, stay warm & sheltered. notice that i did not include being able to "breed." right now anyone and every one, ever tom, dick & harry around can breed as much as they want, and the rest of us will pay, at order of gun-point (taxes).

but, maybe we can change things?
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