Most of you know that I've gone to llamas for backpacking. The question often comes up about how they are with predators. To start with, llamas are NOT silent. They have a warning call that I can best describe as a cross between a horse whinny and a hyena. When they get mixing it up with other llamas, they make all kinds of hellacious growls and screams.

This morning in church I was talking to a guy who does a lot of serious mountain climbing. They're planning a climb in WY this summer. The standard climbing pack weighs 65lb and for this climb, there's a 25 mile approach. So, they've hired a llama packer to haul their gear for the approach. They got to talking about llamas and bears and the packer told them about an episode that happened last summer. They were awakened in the night by the llamas raising all kinds of hell, screaming and growling. They went out to investigate and found that 3 llamas had treed a bear. They had the tree surrounded and were making sure that Smokey stayed up there. I would sure like to have been there to see that.

On a milder note, I have a book on llama packing written by a woman with many years of professional packing experience. She said that after they had a bear in camp episode, she's always tethered a llama in the kitchen area at night. After 10 years of that, they've never had another bear incident. Bears just don't like llamas.

I've noticed most horses don't like llamas either. Llamas are either intimidating as hell or look goofy as hell to them. Haven't figured it out

Sounds like the llamas would have to be left un-tethered at night for three to tree a bear. Is that a common practice?

I know some guys will bell one and let them run free but I don't dare do it with mine. I'd have to trail them all the way to the truck if I did. For the most part, they're very hard to catch. They'll stay just barely out of touching range. They're also nearly impossible to lasso. Their eyes are too good and they'll drop the head to duck it every time.
If there's a way to train them to run loose, I haven't learned it yet.

Last summer I was enjoying a restorative beverage in camp when one of my llamas started making his alarm call and pulling at his tether. He was looking at some willows about 25 yards away. I pulled my pistol and my wife and I walked down to look, and saw a large black bear stalking along the willows. I yelled at him and he ran off. Never saw him again. This is the only time we have ever had a bear get close to camp when the llamas were there, and we cook and keep food in the tipi.

If we have 6 in camp, I will let 2 roam free when we are in camp (daytime only). Less than 6, one gets to be free. They take turns except for one bronc that I don't trust. They like to stay close to the herd. Most days when I go out to the barn I give them all a horse treat or two and practice putting a catch rope around their necks. After a year of this they come running when I call for them and I can catch them easily out in the pasture using horse treats.

I'll have to give that a try. Usually I can get within a couple feet but no closer unless I corner them.

The other thing you can do is leave the 20 or 30 ft tether attached to the halter. Then you can nonchalantly walk over and grab the tether.

with mine, that's a WHOLE lot safer.

Last Fall there were bears in the area we camped. Or at least, signs of bears. Heck, we left our food out without any precaution at all. I would have never done that camping, not here, not there.
Apparently your llamas kept them out of camp if the bears ever had an interest in our camp.

I bet that won't work with goats.

Last time I was out with goats we had 14. We'd let half off the leads at a time. Rattle the bag with salted peanuts and they'd come running.

The trick with goats isn't how to catch them. It's how to keep them out of your sleeping bag and your groceries.

Last fall if we'd had a bear near camp, the boys would have let us know.

Might I suggest the use of one of the really big tazers that are used on cattle, it probably won't agree with the llamas but will be wonderfully restorative for you...particularly after chasing one about the countryside.

We found a lama on an October hunt in the Scapegoat. He had his halter rope tangled on an alder staub on a steep hillside above a creek. There was over a foot of snow with no tracks in or out so he had been there for several days.
He hung out at camp with us for several days and then we led him out to the trailhead and tied him there.
When we went to the FS ranger station in Lincoln, we found out a hunter from Great Falls had lost two lamas two weeks earlier when a griz came into camp while he was out hunting.

He came right over to get the lama, but never did find the other one. I'll see if I can dig up some photos of him.

My horses and dogs have run into llamas a few times, they are scared of them.


We once had our mules chase a grizzly out of the meadow at camp.

A couple years ago we were hiking with some llamas up a trail through heavy deadfall. Several riders on horses were coming down so I got the llamas as far off the trail as possible, which wasn't more than 10 yards. 1 of the horses started acting up and the guy decided he was cowboy enough to hold it without dismounting. Dang fool. The horse about went down over some logs. He risked breaking a horse's leg just to prove he could ride. That wasn't a good place to play games.
Most horses won't do more than look and maybe snort but once in a while one will spook. Most of them are just curious because llamas aren't something they see every day.

Here are some photos of the Lama that Levi and I found in the Scapegoat in October of 2008. We named him Les, in honor of our ultrarunning, pack Sherpa friend.





The staub he was tangled in:



Levi leading him to camp:



On the way out, several days later:



Back at the trailhead:

I'll bet he went through some groceries when they became available.

Funny thing is, he was tethered on that hill side for at least 4-5 days and he never drank on the way to camp. We too him to the creek twice a day for 4-5 days and he never took a drink.
We crossed a couple big creeks and a small river on the way out... never took a drink.
Finally we got to this big mud puddle in the trail, must have been 30 yards long and he stopped and darn near sucked that brown muddy puddle dry.

Can sure see how they are related to camels.

One of the things the locals here do in pasture a few llamas with the livestock, particularly sheep. They apparently protect the sheep from not only bears, but Mtn Lions as well. E

Llamas can't store water like a camel but it's normal to be on the trail for up to 3 days before they'll drink unless it's really hot. Last fall when Snubbie and I packed in for hunting, they didn't drink until we got home. If the grass is wet, they won't drink at all.

Llamas are getting to be pretty common for guard animals. Some people with put 2 or 3 in with sheep or goats but a single one will work much better. It will bond with the sheep instead of with the other llamas and will be a lot more protective.
If it thinks the crowd is threatened by a dog or coyote, it will put it's head near the ground and charge. I've seen them run a long ways that way and your pet Fido doesn't want to be there when it arrives. They're not slow.

The drinking, or lack of drinking rather, was amazing to me. Nice clear cold mountain stream... they'd wade right through and rarely touch it. I bet I didn't see them take two sips if that.

I researching the goats, I read somewhere where llamas, donkeys, and goats have great eyesight. They will spot a predator a ways off and immediately go on alert.
Apparently, this has the effect of un-nerving the predator somewhat.
They like to be in control of a predator/prey situation.

When all eyes are on them, and especially in the case of a llama or burro which may have enough bravado to take a few steps ore even run toward the predator, suddenly they don't feel quite as secure and oftentimes that's all it takes to cause a predator to head in another direction. Even one who could easily take down the llama.

Contrast that to say, a sheep. They're more likely to spot a predator, turn and run away. This is exactly the expected response and triggers a pursuit.

Anyway, that makes sense to me.

But I was reading about pack goats at the time. Not sure about the "bravado" part in goats, although I have heard of people using goats with sheep for "guard" animals. I will say goats apparently have a natural curiosity which may cause the to head toward a coyote or other animal which could possibly unnerve the predator. Dunno.
I wouldn't bet the farm on goats turning away bears.

From my experience with our goats in the pasture, they'll go on alert if they see something but they sure don't hang around if they think there's danger.

Llamas seem to have exceptional eyesight. If you have them along while hunting, it pays to keep an eye on them. They can spot game for you. They're very alert all the time.

I do know goats work with sheep and coyotes. Growing up a neighbor ran sheep and was losing 30-35 lambs a year to coyotes.
He tried about every thing including hunters but continued to loss lambs, we kept telling him to get goats to run with his sheep, he finally said ok that year he lost 7-8 lambs and became a believer. Cheers NC

When I had to live in Kansas, my neighbor up the hill had a small flock of sheep and one llama for protection from coyotes.

They are supposed to be very good at it as long as only one is kept. 2 llamas will bond to each other and hang the sheep out to dry.

I believe a horned adult goat, IF he stood his ground and decided to fight, could disembowel a coyote without too much trouble. A coyote is kinda like a street thug, opportunistic and looking for an easy,(defenseless) target. Neither likes their "victims" to fight back.
Whether a goat would hold his ground or run, I don't know. I guess it depends on the individuals.

snubbie
We had nanny goats with horns and I have seen what they can do with a black and white collie dog, they fly through the air with the greatest of ease and they weigh much more than a coyote. So I have no doubt with a one on one the coyote losses.
Cheers NC