I've shot 1911 and really like their trigger. I'm looking at polymer striker fired pistols in 9mm but I guess my "hang up" is their triggers kinda suck (or perhaps I'm spoiled by the 1911 trigger?)

A long time ago I did have an H&K P2000 in 9mm and did not like having two different trigger pulls with their DA/SA. Also the trigger reach was really long for me. Plus for some reason, the pistol seemed very snappy for a 9mm. I was surprised that a 1911 45acp was much more pleasant to shoot. The recoil felt milder, less snappy.

I also shot my friends XD 9mm compact. The recoil only felt slightly less than my 1911. The trigger felt "mushy"

To add insult to inquiry, the handgun has to southpaw friendly as I'm a lefty.

I'm looking at M&P 9mm as it seems the most southpaw friendly with many ambi controls. I was thinking of perhaps getting it with a thumb safety since I'm coming from a 1911. Is this silly?

I heard the trigger sucks on them. Smith & Wesson customer service said that I'd void the warranty if I put an apex trigger in it. But if it significantly improves the trigger, I'm for it.

I'm open to other considerations as well. Thank you for your help!

If you like the 1911 why not stick with it? The HK VP series and the Walther tend to have better triggers than most. Truthfully, the difference between all the poly triggers isn't enough to get worked up over, especially if you can shoot well in general.

With Glocks and S&W's there are many trigger options and you can get some pretty light triggers.

The M2.0 S&W M&P is said to have a really nice trigger. The Walther PPQ is considered one of the best, if not the best, striker fired trigger.

You will just have to accept, though, that a single action trigger like that on a 1911 is a completely different animal from a striker fired gun's trigger. You just have to learn it.

The reason for switching from 45acp to 9mm is economic/cost and higher capacity of the handgun.

I think I will have to rent a few of them at gun range to see witch trigger I gave live with, lol!

I will look into the M&P 2.0

Thank you for tip regarding Walter PPQ. I'm only somewhat familiar with the big 3 in striker fire polymers.

Folks get way too hung up on "nice" triggers on a fighting gun. They either work, or they dont...."nice" has nothing to do with it. Its not a bullseye gun, or a PPC revolver...

Perfectly stated..

Yep.

I have M&Ps with and without thumb safeties. I would not opt for a TS in a SF pistol - it's unnecessary and usually suboptimal ergonomically compared to the 1911 TS. They're different mechanisms altogether which require learning them and practicing with them.

I'd choose an M&P SF w/o TS and replace the trigger with an Apex system, in the scenario you're describing. 1911 triggers are great at the range on practice targets, but the difference between it and a good SF trigger for SD is mostly theoretical IMHO.

Gunfights are about getting hits. Good triggers make getting hits easier.

The best plastic gun trigger I've shot has been an aluminum FSS in an M&P. They're expensive, but if you want a good trigger in a plastic gun they're the best I've found.

I'm a 1911 guy also and mostly prefer Commanders. The only striker fire pistols I have are M&P's. I like them because they have similar ergonomics to the 1911.

I have a thumb safety and non thumb safety M&P's. I got the thumb safety version because of the 1911, but now prefer the non thumb safety version. All of my M&P's have Apex triggers. I have never shot an M&P 2.0 but on the original version the Apex makes a big difference. I would not own one without doing the upgrade personally.

While agree in a gunfight the trigger won't matter it just needs to go bang. But really most of us will hopefully never be put in that situation of being in a gun fight.

tag

Kahrs have good triggers.

I like my Sig p320 trigger.

vp-9 LE trigger , canick TP9SF trigger very good .

I'll disagree with this, even though for MOST self-defense shootings this may hold true.

But defensive shootings can very easily become offensive shootings. The recent active shooters that have been shot by good guys carrying concealed. Or the crazy dude that snatched a kid out of a shopping cart at War-Mart and held him hostage with a knife.

Shootings like that may very well require a much different shot than getting mugged in a dark parking lot.

Now a lot of difficult shots can be made with mediocre triggers. But my position is just that "it working" or "just going bang" should certainly not be our threshold of what's acceptable.

I'll gladly take the best trigger I can get on any gun; no downside, lots of upside.

MM

Bluedreaux, is this the trigger you referred to? The Apex Forward Set Sear?

http://www.brownells.com/handgun-pa...ward-set-sear-trigger-kit-prod45404.aspx

Yes.

Thanks, I'm getting used to my new M&P9 C.O.R.E. w/Trijicon RMR, and the trigger could use some help.

This falls along the same lines as betting on the "average" number of rounds in a gunfight. You get what you get, not what you want, and probably not something "average".

Just because you might slap the hell out of the trigger in a gunfight, doesn't mean you should carry and train with a pistol that requires a jerk for ignition.

If your trigger is giving you so-so results during training, things aren't going to improve during a fight. That may or may not matter, as explained by Blue.

I expect my XDS and my Glock to reliably go bang when I pull the trigger. It won't be a long range, it won't be to punch paper for points. Self defense in a time of crisis does not need a target type good trigger. It needs a trigger that works. Every time. That is the first consideration.

Thank you to all who replied. I appreciate you input and advice. You may have saved me some money or at the very least know where I'd have to spend money to improve certain guns.

I think I'm going to hold off for awhile and try to get more involved with IPDA with my 1911 this year and become more familiar with it.

leo,

I can't say any of my plastic guns have a bad trigger. But I did put a spring kit in my Glock 23 recently and it is pretty damn nice.

I don't have Bluedreaux's bankroll otherwise I'd try that APEX Tactical.



Dave

Hi Dave,

I only have a Colt XSE 1911 Govt and Ruger GP100 and was looking to explore my options. Both of my firearms have limited capacity, 6-shot revolver, and 8+1 1911.

The 1911 is a 45acp which can get expensive even though I handload. I can find used 45acp brass pretty cheap if I'm willing to put in some elbow grease. The powder and primers are a wash, 45 acp doesn't use much powder. The bullets however, are a bit more expensive across the board.

Given that the 1911 also has reputation of being finicky eater in regards to hollow points, I figured I'd explore the polymer striker fired pistols since they have a reputation of eating any and every thing plus are "cheap" as least compared to 1911.

I don't go hog crazy spending big &&& on 1911. I try to stay in the $1,000 range +/- $100.

The polymers look to run in the $550-$650 range. But as I look more into them, they seem to have hidden costs. If I want to use the cheap lead bullets in glock, I have to buy an aftermarket barrel. So there's $100+. Plus heard glock sights are junk and need to be upgraded? More $$. For M&P, there's the Apex which is what? Around $160 and voids S&W warranty. For Xd, I think what I read is that I'd have to step up to the XdM which is about $100 premium.


So, I guess I'm getting more sticker shock regarding these cheaper polymer striker fired pistols. There's seem to be some hidden costs in regards to getting them up to where most people want them to be that makes them not a whole lot cheaper than a 1911. Especially after continuous hearing on internet that they can get two glocks or two of this handgun for price of one 1911.

I'm not a 1911 fanboy, at least I don't consider myself one. I realize that they're not a perfect platform and have their quirks that one should be aware of if they want to run a 1911.

I like revolvers a lot. They meet a lot of my needs but not good choices for CCW.

I just haven't found a platform that I like yet so getting frustrated in my search, without trying to broke in my search, lol!

Leo

You dont "need" any of that for a modern service pistol.

Get a trade in Glock 19, and shoot it. Period. Anything above and beyond that is a want, not a need.

Why don't you think revolvers are a good choice for CCW? Me personally, I prefer the greater capacity of a double stack, but you carry a 1911, which holds eight. That's just two more than a six shot revolver. Is there some other reason you don't think revolvers are a good choice? Just curious.

leomort,

I have two 1911's, one a S&W assembled in their Custom shop, and a Kimber UC II. Both have exceptional triggers. I wanted something with a lot more capacity, and I bought a S&W M&P Pro 9mm, 4.25" barrel. I must say it could become a favorite. It is very accurate, and the Pro series trigger is supposed to be an improvement over the standard M&P trigger. Since I live in Kolorado, I am supposed to use 15 round mags, but even these are a big improvement in capacity over my 1911s. I have also been CCW with this piece in a N82 Pro Tactical IWB holster, and it works fairly well, but not as concealable or comfortable as my Ultra Carry II.
The difference between sriker fire triggers and 1911 triggers is something you can get used to, but nothing will ever beat a good 1911 trigger, IMO.

liliysdad, if I decided polymer striker fired I think I would definitely look at used or police trade-ins.


The_Real_Hawkeye, I think my GP-100 is too big & bulky for CCW. While the smaller SP-101 may help with concealment, I loose another round. So the bulk & size of my revolver combined with only 6 shoots makes my 1911 with 8+1 look like high capacity with 50% more rounds.

Also I've shoot revolvers enough to know that revolvers are not necessarily more reliable. Revolvers are more tolerant of neglect than semi auto but are revolver are NOT tolerate of abuse as much. So when a revolver goes down, it goes down big time! A semi auto is a quick tap, rack, pull the trigger to get them back in order.

What I like about revolvers are that they are relatively intuitive to new/inexperience shooters. Don't have to worry about whether this type or that bullet shape will function in a revolver. I don't have to worry whether this powder puff loads I've load for newbie will cycle/function in my semi. Likewise I don't have to worry about full power loads battery my pistol and need to change out springs. Don't have to worry about whether they have hand strength to rack the slide or about decocking DA/SA, etc. Added bonus is that I get 100% of my brass back to reload

Bighorn, I will look into the M&P pro series. Thank for the tip. It's hard to beat a 1911 trigger. It is both a blessing and curse at same time.


Leo


PS. In edition to cheap cost of 9mm to shoot, it also help my logistic to stock only small pistol primers instead of large & small pistol primers.

How many times have you experienced "self defense in a time of crises" to know what you next "time of crises" will be?


The world has changed. You are realistically as likely to be in the middle of an active shooter, singleton or multiple person terrorist attack, or violent mob attack as you are a "typical" mugging.



There are no "average" fights. People that say they are ready for the "average fight" are really just ready to fail in the fight that they will face.



The reality is-

I do not know when my next fight will be- I must assume it will be today.

I do not how good my adversary will be or how many- I must assume that they are excellently trained and that there will be many.

I do not know what my condition will be- I must assume it will be the worst day of my life and that I will be wounded.

I do not know what shooting task I will face- I must assume it will be a small target, surrounded by innocent people, at long range.

.

Leo!

I am not a fan of the 1911 but if I were in your shoes I'd be looking at one of these and tripping the one you have.

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/products/sr1911/specSheets/6722.html

If you're anti-double stack but want to try a polymer, striker fired gun I'd get a Shield in 9mm and not look back.




Travis

Worth repeating.

Hard facts to accept for those wanting to feel comfortable armed with a J-frame and no fighting skills.

The Walther PPS-M2 has a darn nice trigger.

I have the original series Walther PPQ. Identical to the M2, apart from the Euro style mag release on the original series. Nice triggers.

The best triggers I've ever felt on striker fired pistols, to me, are in a Walther PPQ. A very close second would be Kahr.

Yeah, I have an early PPQ, and I must say that when you take up the slack all the way to the wall, the break is pretty close is crispness and lightness to that on a single action auto like a 1911, and once the first round is fired, with just a little effort, it's easy to train your finger to return only just forward of the reset for follow up shots, eliminating the take up entirely. I only wish I had waited till they switched from the paddle style of ambidextrous mag release to the American push button style. Hate that paddle mag release, as it requires a total break away from the firing grip to engage it.

Use your index finger to trip magazine release. Grip doesn't change.

I've tried that. Doesn't work for me. Still have to alter my grip a little.

Copy that.

No comment on quality but I agree that the trigger on the Canick is awesome. Good triggers also include the Walther PPQ and the H&K VP9.