I've seen "survival guns" in 22LR for many years but haven't tested one. It's intriguing being able to break it down and store everything in the stock.

Are they a decent value, accurate and reliable? Or is there something better to keep in your pack.

Thoughts? Opinions?

Hype.

A Rossi or H&R single-shot with 22 LR and 20 gauge barrels would be a far more useful survival gun, as would a Savage 24 in 22 LR or 22 MRF over 20 gauge.

JEff

The .22/.410s, flat rock.

I will definitely second that, not all that enamored with the Charter Arms AR-7 and it's continuing reincarnations.

The M6 Aircrew Survival Rifle was a MUCH better concept and they do turn up now and then.

My survival rifles are the old Marlin 982S; stainless/synthetic/bolt action/clip fed. 1 of them stays in my off-road Jeep in CO and 1 of them stays in my daily driver Mountaineer here in NE.

Although not very useful on flying targets, they work well for deer, rabbits, and turkeys. Currently mounted with Weaver RV7s, 2-7x28, in Warne TPA rings. I also keep a Rossi 515 revolver in my survival pack, which goes hand in hand with the Marlin.

For awhile, I stashed a Rossi 59 in its take-down form in my survival pack, but I can shoot the scoped Marlin better than the peep sighted Rossi.

JEff

I've got a Marlin 70 PSS or Papoose. It's a take down 22 LR semi auto and I use it a lot. It's accurate, reliable and IMHO a good value for the money. You can't store it in the stock, but it comes with its own carrying case. I fixed the buttplate so it comes on and off easily and store a small knife, para cord and an extra loaded magazine in it. The iron sites are okay, but I've got Weaver mounts on mine and use a scope/red dot interchangeably. I made up a sling that is easily detachable for it too. The bare rifle weighs in at 3.2 pounds.

My first mining buddy had one of the armalite takedowns...they are what they are...a couple pounds isn't much to carry & you don't have to worry much about getting them wet or getting mud sand or anything else in the action...they aren't the most accurate but they weren't designed for target shooting...they have their place IMO...

I sort of always wanted the little m6

Would be great to take along packed away in a backpack while hunting deer to blast some squirrels.

Have owned or have shot just about all of the survival guns...my thoughts:


AR7...Have had two of the original Armalite guns and still have one. If ones eyes are half way decent shooting something the size of a clay bird at 60 yards is no problem. They can be scoped but then can not be packed down into the stock. Easy to stow in a backpack, canoe or airplane. Mine have been very accurate and reliable. If reliability is not good it can usually be traced to the magazine/chamber interface. There are several companies who manufacture these, some good, some not so good. I use mine usually on canoe trips.

CharterArms Explorer II (pistol) with scope...very accurate at 50 yards...




Savage 24...have owned four, .22LR/.410, (2) .22 Magnum/20 ga. and a Camper Model .22LR/20 ga. In addition I have shot friends .357 Maximum/20 ga. and a .30-30/20 ga. For a pure survival weapon the very compact Camper model with 20" barrels was very accurate and easy to shoot flying targets with the 20 ga. barrel. I sold it only because I like the .22 Magnum/20 ga. more and still have those two. With a scope both guns shoot under 1/2" at 50 yards. Buskshot and birdshot patterns are excellent...slug accuracy with everything I've tried sucks. One of the Magnums with a Tenite stock is my truck gun...





Marlin Papoose...probably the best one for the money out there today, especially the stainless. I have shot two, both accurate and reliable. One of the new stainless guns is on my want list and may put a pistol scope out on the barrel.

Browning/Norinco Takedown..the old classic is very accurate and reliable. Don't bother mounting a scope on the receiver as it will not hold zero....that is why they now have the barrel mount. I've had one Browning, an older one with the grooved receiver and two Norinco's with the barrel scope mount. All were very accurate. The Browning and one Norinco functioned flawlessly one was very very ammo picky.

FI Bronco...these 70s vintage guns were all metal, even the stocks. They were a swivel breech design in .22 LR, .410 and an .22LR/.410. Very hard to find. Have shot a .410 and own a .22. A little hard to shoot with the open style rear sight but more accurate than a handgun for most people.

M6 Scout...looked at them all my life thinking how "neat" they were. Had a friend who bought a Springfield Armory in .22 LR/.410 and converted it to a Hornet...never did shoot his. About 7 years ago found a pristine SA pre-triggerguard M6 at a local auction house for $150.00 so gave it a try....after extensive testing I would rather have a sharp stick. It is the only .22 rifle I ever owned that I could outshoot myself with any .22 handgun I own..at any distance. Ergonomics sucked. Trigger pull and the unusual placement sucked. Sights sucked. I am sorry to be SO negative on something so revered in some survival circles but I sincerely wonder if any of these guys spend any time outdoors. Cord wrapping the barrels can both change the POI and once it gets wet will rust the bluing right off the barrels. .410 shot did have effective patterns but buckshot scattered and accuracy with slugs was poor and came nowhere close to where the sights were. Some of the later guns manufactured by CZ for SA could also mount a scope but that then takes all the compactness out of it. Many I have seen had red dot sights on them...have these people never heard of battery failure? And the chinese junk they mount on them also fail. Again I am sorry to be so negative on this gun but it is simply the worst thing I have ever owned.

Remington Nylon series....although not a takedown it is a very rugged, accurate and reliable rifle. Don't bother with a scope as the cover shifts and POI will not hold.

Cricket/Chipmunk....very accurate and reliable. I have an all stainless one in .22 Magnum.... Super lightweight and compact. easily taken down into two parts. Excellent peepsights with rugged course front sight.



Stock is hollow and will hold a lot of "stuff"...





Marlin 39...excellent guns especially the compact 16.5" Takedown Model.

Rossi Pumps (can't remember the model numbers). Easy takedown, very reliable and accurate. B-Square makes scope mount that replaces the rear sight for a scout scope. The little 16.5" carbine would make a nice backpack gun. I had one, sold it and currently have one in .22 Magnum.

YMMV...Bob

Survival 22 ammo test

I have read varying reports on the AR-7, some good, some not so good. Why not a Ruger single six? I have the single six 6.5 barrel or you can get the 9.5 inch if you want longer.

About 25yrs ago I bought an AR7. It was a cheesy piece of junk and nothing you'd enjoy owning or using. But ok for under the truck seat or in a backpack. I had that thing for about a week.......shot it once and sold it.

I have tried three or four of these and in my opinion they aren't worth a chit. Get yourself a SS 22 Pistol much better.

The Charter Arms version of the AR-7 and it's offspring the Explorer pistol are POS. Even if the design was okay - the materials were not, and they will not last with any extended use.

Personally, I don't see any reason to go beyond a good .22lr pistol for "survival" use. Anything larger will just get in the way.

I have one of those leaning up against the wall in the cabin, with the .22 LR barrel on it. It comes with a nifty little soft case that holds everything, and it easily would fit in a backpack. The strap for the carrying case doubles as a carrying strap for the gun. It was an impulse buy for $150 at Sports Authority.

If you're looking for a high quality take down .22LR you go with a Marlin 39A. They take down very easily with one large bolt and are probably a lot more accurate than the AR-7.

Best survival gun you can have is one you use a lot and are familiar with. Something that stows inside the stock or looks like a 'mater stake ain't likely to be that gun.

Light, accurate and in your hands, not your pack. That's a survival gun.

Exactly. I have 3 of them. You don't have put it together, it stays on your person in whatever holster you prefer, it has the spare 22 mag cylinder and there are no clips or scope to screw with...

Man if I gotta depend on a gun to survive for any length of time I sure as hell, don't want no damn pistol or some cheesy, unreliable take apart rifle. What the hell I gotta survive here and for how long anyways ? Foreign invaders, Government thugs, looters ? Or do I just need to be able to collect some vittles ?

My friend used to be a Merkel drilling fanatic. He had one he said was made for the German pilots in case they were shot down. What a nice thing to have with you in case you got dumped in the forest. It would be heavy, and the shot shells would be more weight too, but I'd rather have one of them in my pack than a papoose. It would be far more of a deterrent should a bear or mountain lion come down and try to gnaw on me. If I had to pick a "rimfire" survival gun, the simplest, most reliable rifle would get it. Probably a bolt gun with an internal mag and good sights. Your pick. I'd rather have a pocket full of snare wires and a gun for protection.

Can't say much about the ar-7 type guns. I do have an m-6 which I got before they went out of production. Once I got used to the funny trigger I found it shoots as well as any other 22 I've ever owned with the exception of the Anschutz I used to use for smallbore competition (and my 39a). The rifle barrel and shotgun barrel on mine shot closer to the same point of aim on my m6 than the rifle and shotgun barrels did on the Savage 24F I used to own. It shoots pretty good groups with the little .410 slugs too. When I'm hiking during small game season (as opposed to actively hunting) I sometimes put the m6 in a NEF takedown case that I found on clearance for $5.00 and stuff it in my day pack. For something to stuff in your pack just in case you might want to take small game I don't think they're bad. They sure aren't worth what people are asking for them now.

My first 22 was a Nylon 66 (well, the box magazine version - that one was $5.00 cheaper at the hardware store). I always felt like if you wanted a light 22 to actually take into the field that the Nylon 66 was hard to beat. They were rugged, light to carry and plenty accurate for small game or plinking. They also had a decent sight radius and an actual forend.

I have the trapper version of the 9422. It's a little on the heavy side but it's a handy little rifle too (they do take down and mine will fit in the NEF case I use for the m6). They cost too much now that Winchester doesn't make them anymore. However, Browning is making a youth version of their lever 22 (it has a 16.25" barrel). I've only handled one in the store. Length of pull is short (especially if you're tall) but I think a lot of people could choke up on it or one could put on an adult stock if that didn't work.

16 years ago when my oldest daughter was 6 years old, I bought her a Chipmunk made by Oregon Arms. I taught her to shoot a long gun with that rifle, and her younger sister and brother learned with that rifle too. We still have it. It's rugged and well made, and has a nice peep sight on it. For a .22, I think it'd be a great survival gun. It only weighs 2 and 1/2 pounds. It's accurate. And it's easy to pack.

I had one of the Springfield 22/.410's, nice idea, beatable rifle, but the grip trigger was not really usable.

I like the Henry stowable in the stock, accurate, holds two or three loaded magazines, floats.

The Marlin paposse is a great choice, stows with a scope on, very accurate, and tough beat design.

The .22/.410 option is a great combo. The weight factor of a full size combo long gun is not necessarily a true stowable option in all scenarios. I have seen a few of these in the used sections of shops. Are they accurate?

Probably? Understatement....big time. I would say the AR-7 could not hold the 39's jockstrap. IMHO

I know how accurate my 39a is. I've never fired an AR-7...so, I was giving it the benefit of the doubt.

Ar-7 can have questionable functioning, reliability and accuracy. And that's their good points. Generally they are trash IMO. After carrying one for a year on differnet chores I decided I was better off with my Ruger 22/45. Yes the AR-7 will generally out shoot the Ruger at least in my hands. Other than that the Ruger smokes it in all catagories.

Never seen an M6 and don't care if I do.

CB

Ruger Standard, MK I, MK II, and MK III are a decent kit gun, as well as the Single Six. Mine have all shot well.

If I'm limited to a rimfire, I'd take a .22 RF Magnum any day over a .22 LR. If I can pack a rifle, then I'd do that. If not then a Ruger Stainless Convertible would be my choice. Which I own and have used alot, BTW.
If the sky is the limit, then I'd take one of the Mil Spec AR-15's with a 16 inch barrel or a Ruger SS Mini something. E

Unless you absolutely need the minimum weight of the survival rifles, I think either one of these take-down rifles would be preferable:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=239279260

or

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=237867641

Quality seems far superior to that of the survival-types, many of whose bulky stocks look like they'd be very uncomfortable to shoot.

No matter how you package it, the 22lr round is hard to argue against. It has and will give anything walking a "bad hair" day.

My favorite article on the 22lr as a survival round.

Before you put too much stock in Annabell's article you may want to read this link, it pretty well sums up what I have heard about him from a couple of folks who knew him fairly well.

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/503013/1

But with that being said I did enjoy reading him but also kept in mind that the facts were less than "factual".

drover

Yeah, I am listening to a History of Rome podcast that is constantly reminding you that the more "vivid" accounts are from one historian in particular.

I don't read too many articles all the way through. Annabell can sure spin a tale with an accent though.