I was burning some Wolf ammo through my Armalite the other day and had a thought: Why don't gunmakers go back to rimfire cartridges for more than .22 and now .17? The Wolf ammo might as well be rimfire, for as much reloading one can do with it.

I'd think a .25 or .32 rimfire with low muzzle velocity and a bullet weight idealized for 50 yards would be the absolute cat's whiskers for squill or rabbit.

Start up costs, would be my guess, and then the competition with the firmly entrenched .22 rimfires, and now the .17s.

FWIW - a .25/20 can be loaded so low and slow that it can be essentially a rimfire, and then up to a bit more. Same thing for a .32/20, or better yet, a .32S&W. I'm planning on trying that S&W route really soon via a certain S&W revolver.

The .25-20 covers a lot of bases, when handloaded. From what little I know about the .25 and .32 rimfires, they were never as accurate as the .22 LR.

My last .25-20 was very accurate, with a mild report and no recoil.

It's a shame Cooper doesn't offer the cartridge in their Hornet length action. I know Kimber made a few, as I've seen one.

I'm likin' the .25-20 also, but it is a bit short on availability. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I'm also liking 120mm's thoughts. I've shot a .32 Long RF, not too long ago actually. Shot quite well truth be know, but the Stevens Favorite it was chambered in had a weak firing pin strike and did not go off every time. I would actually like to see a .40 something caliber with a 200 grain lead bullet. Something I could actually kill big animals with and not reload...just because. Maybe stainless/synthetic, in a lever gun...black powder? Why not, it would appeal to the CAS folks, and I could clean it with a garden hose.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> I'm serious....about 90% of that. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Talking about the .32 Long RF, I just saw a nice Marlin chambered for it. Slick vintage rifle with a good bore and beautiful patina, but where does one get ammo? I think CIL made some years ago, but have not seen any in a very long time.

My last .25-20 was a nice first run Marlin CL. Put a Lyman on it and punched cloverleafs at 50 yards.

JB in SC;

IIRC, Dixie Gun Works does, or used to, stock ammo for the .32RF. Check on that, and the Marlin might be a STEAL!.

IIRC a friend of mine has a .56 rimfire round in his collection...

IIRC, the .56 Rimfire was one of the first cartridge firearms invented.

Digitaldan, you have just described the Henry rifle, except of course the stainless/tupperware part. .44 rimfire, arise!

I think Aquila was supposed to come out with a .223 rimfire round a few years ago.

And the stars collide.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Somebody..Uberti or another Spaghet oriented gun builder was making those back in the '80s...ammo was difficult to find, even from them, or I woulda done it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Somewhere, some day, someone will start thinkin' straight again....

Dixie has the .32 Long ammo for sure...go get that Marlin and stock up!

The Marlin 1892 has an interchangible firing pin. It will also shoot 32 Colt long and short. The Colt brass is available

Couldn't find the .32 RF ammo at Dixie, only .41 Short @ $55 per box. Doubt the rifle is still available. Might check again this weekend, but have too many other irons in the fire....

Well dangit....they must be waitin' for another delivery from the Land of Brazillians. It was in their catalog for a long time....maybe a call would reveal the future... The older I get the more quicksand I find... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Had some of that Brazillian .32 RF....and a beautiful platform....The batch I had was super erratic, and accuracy.....absent.

Converted it to a CF.....................it shot like blue poison.

GTC

I have some 32 rimfire ammo in 3 different legnths...
Came with the house as well as a bunch of STUFF

Although sold, this one was an 1891.

Cross, I have a Remington #4 Rolling Block in 32 RF long in the pipeline, haven't seen it yet. I figure my options are to reline it to 22LR or 22Mag, or convert it to center fire and chamber to 32 H&R. Any helpful hints or other ideas?

I have a remington #4 that was relined to 22mag. The action is spring enough that you have to de-oil the chamber to avoid case head bulging. DeHaas warned against anything with higher pressure than factory 32 longs. I believe him, dont go to the 32 mag.
Good luck!

The .32S&W long, and the capability to back down to the .32S&W would be a sweet rig.

Thanks for the tip about the 22Mag. Aren't the 32 S&W short, 32 S&W long, and 32 H&R mag the same chamber dimentions except length?

Yup, keep your pressures........................DOWN. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I can't get behind any of the zippier Magnum numbers, for this particular action. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

You will have to sneak the firing pin into a new position, whether for a .22 LR configuration, or a mild centerfire #.

It is not a particalarly difficult, or High$ job (................so, why do I see so many hack jobs?) <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

These make up into a sweet little woods walking gun, and are a delight to carry with one hand, as they balance very well.

These actions can be slicked up, and "toughened "with a bit of judicious Kasenit casing. I've seen 'em battered and peened from hard use . I reckon it was SOP for the things to see duty as a kids cowboy and indian rig, with lotsa dry firing as a matter of course.

I've had the best of luck with "squaring" everything into skew, after a re-barrel, or reline.............fixturing the the block / hammer into final intended position with cerrosafe, and than pin honing the action pin holes and their mobile components...and making up new oversized pins. Works really slick, and is well worth the troble if any signifigant 'shuck and jive" is present.

Real care should be taken in supporting the case head, if a rimfire .22 LR is chosen. I would look at going outside of the original extractor configuration, and fit a Ballard style. If you're reading this Joe, could you slam up that pic, of that set up....I can't find the sucker.

Idorado....is this a "takedown" #4?

My call, a "Redman" liner. in a .22lr match chambering.Golly those things 'll shoot.

If you want a real heavy barrel, PM, and I'll send a pic of a rather interesting big ole' octagon, that's loitering on my premises.

I hope you see that rascal, soon, they're a sweetheart.

GTC

HMmmm.....

I have looked at my #4 and wondered about larger pins.
What size would you use?. However I'm not sure that the action spring would be cured. Centerfire rolling block actions often bend the case such that it can only be inserted in one position.
Good luck!

Well, they are turned to the diameter of the freshly lapped / honed bores in the Hammer, Breechblock, and frame....they won't nesacarily be the same dia., either.

What you're calling "action spring" sounds like a standing breech headspacing problem.

it's best to set em' up so that the block , when closed leans ever so slightly foward, and will drive back to a vertical, "Square" attitude on firing. A worn gun will show the block leaning past plumb / vertical on lockup.

Hence, fresh pins.

Guys, don't forget the propensity, and natural inclination of the roller for "Slamfire".........................keep those firing pins free, and lubricated properly, and correct overly enthusiastic lever lock springs, before runnin' 'em.

best regards, GTC

On a related note, I noticed that Sarco has .41 short rimfire rounds for sale, former Navy Arms.

The construction of the rolling block is such that any loose fit
or flex at the pins is multiplied by the relaitve long distance to the bolt face. In addition movement of the hammer is added to the movement of the breech. That is why the action "springs".
Good luck!

Crossfire, the #4 Roller came in Friday. Old and a smidgeon of surface rust but sound. It is a lever takedown and the tapered groove under the barrel is a little battered so it won't go together real tight. The action is near perfect, no wear or slack. The rifling looks shallow with a few pits. Don't know if it will shoot or not and can't find out till I get farther along with it. Haven't slugged it yet, but I will.

My inclination is to go to centerfire and 32 S&W, just because I think it'd be cooler than 22. Then try the old barrel and reline it if it won't shoot. That's my tentative plan anyway.

I think I can convert the block from rimfire to centerfire but have never done it. Would much rather farm it out than end up with a hack job. Could you be persuaded to do it, or can you reccommend someone?

Yup, PM me.

GTC

Just saw these .32 rf long at Scrounger today. I apparently missed the first run.

http://www.ows-ammo.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/1003

Rimfire start up cost, as someone said, plus limited market. You can get 40 Rimfire for the REmington Derringer some place, I don't know where.

I've got 2 25-20s and they are WONDERFUL rifles. You can find one if you look hard enough. Both are bolt guns and you can fire them up hotter with a 60 gr. BT bullet and Lil' Gun.

Yes.

Cost is probably going to be the killer for big bore rimfire. After all, you can't reload them and they will cost about the same as centerfires.

Another killer is getting the primer compound evenly distributed in the rim. This is a problem with .22 rifles, though it's about been whipped. Seldom get a failure with a .22.

The idea of a heavy rimfire I think is impractical. The ignition, being rimfire, wouldn't be all that consistent, I'd think. With centerfire, the ignition is in one place, and at one time. Rimfire, the ignition would have to occur all the way around the rim. That doesn't speak for accuracy.

The other problem is the relative weakness of the rim. It has to be soft enough to crush under the hammer to ignite the primer, and if you loaded one up to modern pressures, it would likely separate the rim from the case.

I'm just interested in shooting from time to time this old rifle my dad left me. It sure is fun. I've been using the Dixie Gunworks cases, and I'm anxious to compare that with the factory ammo.

Is that a Burnside carbine?

Gene, thats a .32 rimfire Frank Wesson tip-up rifle.

It says:

FRANK WESSON WORCESTER MASS
PAT'D OCT 25 1859 & NOV 11 1862

I can't find much on these. If anyone knows anything about them, I'd love to hear. They don't fetch a whole lot in the auctions and the bore and action looked in really good shape so I decided to shoot it rather than hang it on the wall.

It kind of whistles when it shoots, not a typical rifle crack. More like a ricochet sound.

I'm wondering how difficult it would be to rechamber a .32 Rimfire to .32 S&W.

Sweet. Serious cool factor there.

Rechamber would be fairly easy, getting the firing pin properly located a bit tougher. Then you also need to first check actual bore diameter, some of the old .32's were .315. the .32 S&W run from .311 to .314.

Here's what I found in guns and ammo:

Wesson Rifle
Q: I own a Frank Wesson single-barrel .32-caliber rifle. It has two triggers. The front trigger opens the rifle to load or unload. It has an external ejector, a 30-inch octagon barrel and is marked "Frank Wesson Worchester Mass. Patented Oct. 25, 1859 and Nov.11,1862." It's in good condition. What's it worth? --C.F., Fort Ashby, WV


A: There were three types of Frank Wesson single-barrel rifles manufactured, and it is possible that each type had its own serial-number range (about 35,000 were made in total). The first type had no extractor while the second is discernible by a slot link moved to the left side of the barrel and a manual ejector. This is more than likely what you have. The third type has an adjustable hammer striker for either rimfire or centerfire cartridges. This value range is between $275 and $675.



Remington New Model Army

I appreciate that Gene. Thats alot more than I knew. This one is a type 2 then.

The Power of Google. Took about two minutes to find it.

I feel even more stupider than usual. I googled on "frank wesson tip up rifle" and that particular site did not show up for at least 5 pages. I should have googled on the whole stamp.

Would you do the conversion on an antique that goes for that price range? I'm a bit confused since last night some auctions were getting up to $2000 for type 2's. Two years ago, they were right in the range of your post.

I wouldn't convert a rifle worth $2000 as is. You can only take away from the value. It's a nice-looking rifle as it is.

It's obviously a black powder rifle. If you converted to a .22 LR, I am not sure the action would take the pressure.

The magazine article I quoted was from G&A. I don't know the date; things may have changed since then.

FYI, SOG has .32 Long rimfire listed for $25 for a box of 50.

Newly manufactured, and supposedly safe in older rifles.

Gene, I owe you one, or more. Thanks muchly.