Have a hankering for a .338 win mag. Should I sell off a few rifles and splurge on a pre-64 70 or keep a few of those rifles and buy a .338 in the $700-800 range? The pre-64 appeals to me because of the quality and also the value can almost only go up as I usually keep good care of my stuff.

Anyone have experience with a pre-64 70 338?

You could do worse than this deal.

https://www.cdnnsports.com/ruger-m77-hawkeye-338-wm-24-bbl-satin-wal-stock.html

That is a decent deal, but personally I'd hold out for an all weather Hawkeye if going the ruger route. A model 70 in a crf like a classic would be my first choice, although I do love my SS Hawkeye and it has filled my freezer every year, damn near.

My hunting partner bought the Ruger Hawkeye in .338 Win and put on a VX-II 2x7 and he is a Holy terror with the thing.

It has a stiff trigger but is smooth. Great wood stock that is simple but elegant. The thing shoots very tight groups even at the 250 range and just works.

It was simple to set up, shoots great with factory Federal and Remington ammo, and cost under $1000.00.

I guess it depends what you are looking for in a larger magnum but in my eyes it was a sweet setup that looks and works great.

I too also like the new Win Model 70. The action, fit, and quality is nice.

I like synthetic stocks on the lighter kicking rifles but the bigger boom gets me wanting wood on my cheek. So the standard or the Super Grade works just as well in my opinion.

I know guides that just carry in a .375 H&H Ruger or Winchester and "won't" use anything else. By preference.

Setting up a good wood stock can be just as tough as the plastic ones it just takes bedding, Oil finish, metal care, and fit.



So I guess it gets down to your preference.

Many years ago I bought a pre'64 M/ 70 .338 Magnum from Randy Shuman's gun shop. Thought I was being extravagent spending $675.00, turned out to be the most accurate M/70 I've ever owned. It had a Canjar trigger that made it a joy to shoot, cloverleaf three shot groups were pretty much the norm shooting Speer 275 grain RN bullets over a stout charge of IMR 4350. Don't remember ever needing a second shot, most kills were DRT. I would go for the pre'64, Randy Shuman always told me that use with care seldom hurt the value. Good luck with your .338 whatever your choice is, hope you enjoy it as much as I did mine.

I have a few rugers and have had good luck with them. Noticed you can get the Hawkeye SS for the same price. Thanks for the comments they have all been helpful. Still have a lot to think about. Really like the idea of the Alaskan though.

Pre-64 Winchesters are over-rated IMHO, but I'm not a collector.

A few years back I took my Ruger .338WM and a Ruger .30-06 to the range for one last time before elk season. After verifying the 100 yard POI I headed to the long range where, using 3 shots for one gun and two for the other, I hit a clay pigeon with each --- at 600 yards.

The .338 is built from separately acquired Ruger parts (action, barrel and Zytel "boat paddle" stock). The .30-06 is factory built but I swapped the factory laminate for another Ruger Zytel "boat paddle" stock.

If I wanted a .338WM today this is what I would get:

Ruger Hawkeye .338WM
$499 at cdnnsports.com

I have to say that if a Pre-64 Alaskan is what you want, that's what you should get. You already have adequate 338's so, it's not a need. Not a problem, sell of some that you're not into, and get the one you want.
Can't really go wrong with a Pre-64, if you decide to sell it, you'll get your money back unless you excessively over pay.

Pride of ownership, and content do count sometimes, IMO.

I agree with toa. Good post. I actually saw a nice 338 listed on one of the online auction sites a couple days ago and it wasn't excessively over priced. I've also seen some at cabela's for over $3,000.00. Look for one in good condition for half that price and you'll be doing great. I went though the phase of wanting for pre 64's or certain cartridges and opted for something cheaper and always sold off the "something cheaper" (Ruger 77 or CZ 550) when the right pre 64 came along. The other rifles worked in a pinch, but they were not a pre 64 by any stretch of the imagination. As "overrated" as they may be for guys like Coyotehunter, there's a reason they are called "The Rifleman's rifle"... .. They also hold their value much better than any Ruger I've ever seen/sold..

I have had 3 Win Model 70's in my 338, 2 New Haven built classics, and my current FN built Extreme Weather. I cannot see that the quality of a pre '64 would be much better than the current FN built rifles.
I like mine. Shoots very well, too.
I've been looking at a Super Grade in 300 Win Mag, might ve my next purchase?!

Cheers.

I would rather have this over pre-64 M70 .338.....

Better wood, bolt release, scope mount setup. Don't for see something like that loosing value.

Be careful to note the SS All Weather that they have is actually the 338 RCM, not the 338 WM, which they are all sold out of. The RCM has the same bolt face as the WM, but the body diameter is based on the belt diameter of the WM, so you can't ream the RCM to take the WM case.

The blue walnut one I linked is the WM.

I sure would not invest in that Kimber over a pre 64 338. Those Kimbers were an attractive turd. If you got one good for anything other than to look at, you were lucky.

Everyone wants a 338....for awhile.

Some find a real use for them but they seem to end up as dust collectors. The novelty wears off and I find many (not all) shooters go back to more mundane stuff that kills about as well and kicks a lot less.

I'd get one if I wanted (BTDT), but would not purge many good rifles to do it.

Truth.

Bob is quite correct. Have had several. Have a .340 now . Like it better than the .338, but still haven,t shot it 7 or 8 seasons. But scratching an itch is a whole lot of fun! Expensive maybe, but fun!

True story.

I would opt more recent than a pre-64 in the 338 if you plan to shoot much. (Later stocks will handle recoil better and not bite your cheek so much.)

My '338' has been scraped out 20 thousandths and bears a feminine-sounding name on the barrel now. It's a rifle that shoots 250s so reliably that I can keep it locked away for months, and take it hunting with high confidence. It shoots where I point it whenever it comes out of the safe. It's a MK II Ruger...stainless but stocked in walnut.

Find a nice New Haven Win. Model 70, SS, Classic, but it! And, never look back!!!! memtb

I have a Sako L61 338WM that shoots the 210NP's awesome. Out of all my hunting rifles if I was told I could only have one it would be the one I would pick. That factory Bofors barrel just plain shoots.

Got the exact same rifle. Mine is a 1968 (approximately) vintage, and sits in a McMillian stock and will stack factory 210 grain partitions in nice little tiny groups. I currently use 225 gr Northforks and they did a grand job this past fall. Love those Bofors barrels too.

I love my P64 Alaskan 338. Since I got it ive hard a hard time leaving it at home. It seems to shoot 200-275's real well and just does an excellent job for me. It wouldn't be my first choice as a deer rifle but it does a first class job for me hunting elk. Don't really use it for much else.

I did restock mine with a McMillan stock cause the original stock came with a split tang. Didn't really bother me as I'd always intended on putting it in a good stock.

Your at a cross-road just thinking you would like a Pre-64.

1) If you don't have a Pre-64, Go for it!

2) If you'll take care of it like you said, Go for it!!

3) If you don't, You'll always being looking back AND wishing you had >>> Gone for it now!!!


I own 2 and still use'em for hunting.
A friend of mine has only one rifle - a Pre-64 in 338.
He uses it for everything. His rifle has served him well for many years.

A sree serty ate velly big burret. Make a such big a ho.

My farite sree serty ate is a supa glade.

Sups glade velly a nice.

Don't let these guys talk you out of a .338 if that is what you want.

That said, there is a lot of truth in what they say. I scratched the itch for a .338 and have taken a couple of elk with it. Nice rifle and I would have taken a third elk with it last year if I hadn't loaded it with ammo for my backup rifle, a .280 Rem. (Doh!) Ended up taking it with my buddy's 7mm RM, 4 steps and down at 411 yards. While I did take my longest big game shot ever at 487 yards on a cow elk with the .338, I could have used a .30-06 and it would have probably have fallen just as quickly.

Much as I like my .338WM, the .280 Rem, 7mm RM, .30-06s and .300WM get the job done for me and get the call more often. Glad I bought the .338m though, and it isn't going anywhere.

The truth!

I always suggest that big game rifle shoppers buy a rifle whose stock places that shooter's eye in alignment with the sight/scope. MOA grouping at the range is pleasing, but animals move. Get a rifle that fits like a favorite shotgun.
For me, that's a Ruger stock. And my 338WinMag shoots little groups. But its prairie dog accuracy off sandbags isn't the reason for owning one.

The way I read it, nobody's trying to talk anyone out of anything... at least not in the English language.

I guess I've had 5 338 WM's; 3 SS M70's, a SS MKII M77 RS and a SS M700 ADL. All but the M77 had their barrels cut to 22". The 338 is a handy rifle built that way. With a bore volume/case-capacity ratio essentially identical to the 30-06, it works to perfection in a 22" barrel, and I see no need for more than 23".

Great round, but haven't used one for 15 years because I found other cartridges that kicked less, could be built around a lighter rifle, while still working well on elk. And elk and moose are the main reason for the 338 WM IMO.

And BTW, while none of the M70 Classic SS rifles were very accurate, the M700 remains one of the most accurate factory rifles I've ever owned. It was a first Gen SS rifle from the early 90's. It shot varmint sized groups.

I understand the cartridge itch as much as the next guy. I just found that it was a chambering I enjoyed more in my 30's than in my 50's.

There is a gun shop near work that has a used ruger .338. Might have to take a better look at it. Guess it would be smart to start there and if it makes me happy look further into the pre/64.

I do have have a pre-64 but its chambered in 270 and after checking the forums here I didn't want to be caught at the range with "my wifes" rifle. I have a few other older winchesters so I thought the alaskan would be a nice addition.

I also have a 375 RUM in the old XCR and have shot that quite a bit so I'm not too scared of spending some time with the 338. That xcr is pretty light for a 375.

Really do appreciate the responses. Pretty good supply of knowledge here.

I'm with your wife... these days the 270 is my "big rifle."

Kills mature bull elk just like the 338 WM.

But the 338 is an itch that has to be scratched if you're a rifle nut.

Looking at 200gr and 225gr ammo offerings it seems enough people are buying them. If one only uses those loads I see no reason to pick that over .300Magnum.

Not all pre-64's are created equal. Most of them are just 60 year old rifles that have no more value than any other 60 year old rifle. The ones made prior to WW-2 and some of the less common rifles made after the war tend to be quite valuable. But not all.

If I wanted a model 70 to shoot and hunt with I think you're better off with a newer version. One of the Classics made in the 1990's would be an excellent choice.

And I just don't see them offering anything a 300 won't do unless you are shooting 250 gr or heavier bullets. Even then there isn't anything I'd hunt with any .33 that I'd not hunt with a comparable .30 with a lot less recoil.

I agree if we're talking about toting a 24"+ bbl'd rifle. For me, the reason to pack a 338 WM is a handier 22" barrel... the 300 WM really needs a 24" bbl. IMO.

I can identify with that!

My personal pick in an old M70 would be the 300 H&H!

338 threads are great. As soon as you mention you want one, people start giving you every reason not to own one. I am surprised someone hasn't come out yet and said if you buy one you will never be able to hunt in Africa with it because it's not a 375. Or that if you do own one, you can look on the bright side and shoot it with reduced loads and not live in fear. Always remember when reading 338 threads that a 200 gr .308 bullet at 2950, kicks substantially less than a 200 gr .338 bullet at 2950, and if you are only shooting 200 gr. bullets you might as well just own a 300. You can rationalize owning one of any two cartridges but the most important reason is whether you want one or not. I am like many, as I get older I like lighter kicking rifles more but the 338 is a fantastic cartridge.

My 338 itch was a bad one. I now own three 338s. A Savage 116, a Ruger #1 and a Ruger 77. The 77 is my current favorite. I replaced the boat paddle stock with a Hogue full bedded stock and it handles the recoil very well. My #1 is the best looking by far. The Savage shoots the best but all three shoot minute-of-Nilgai anytime.

Get you one. Buy the one that looks and feels the best to you!

Well my current 338 Winchester Mag is a Sako 75 SS that I bought going on 20 years ago, when I paired down my collection some years back, it was one of the 4 out of 65 rifles I kept! Look if you can find a Pre 64 M-70 so chambered and you can afford it then go with it! I am not going to tell you not to! If you just want a good durable hunting rifle, its hard to not go with a Ruger M-77! They just do the job, and at most you might have to do a bedding job and that it! Sako's are good ones, so are the Tikka's, heck even a Remington 700 would be fine way to go!

I actually don't think anyone on this thread was trying to discourage the OP... I know I wasn't.

It's not terribly important whether people are or are not. I was more pointed out that 338 threads often read strongly that there are better choices out there. Really Bob and yourself are spot on, the 338 is a cartridge many grow out of.

My 24" 300 shoots flatter with 180g bullets and should do so even at 22" according to my ballistic calculator. But I sure like the .338/225g hole size and the AB's .550 B.C.

Never owned a 22" 338 but I've never been one to be bothered by 24" barrels.

I cut my .338s to 20" and 22"

Smart feller.

22" is about perfect IME.

Perfection...


L to R:
.338WM, 22" fluted factory barrel, semi-custom
.300WM, 24: barrel, factory configuration
.30-06, 22" barrel, came in brown laminate stock



Bear Paw Jack / Cariboujack provided the .338 barrel. The fluting was done by a previous owner. My gunsmith had to straighten the front sight when he recut the threads. I suspect they were misaligned when the fluting was done.

In any case, all are great rifles.

To Bear Paw Jack, thanks again!!!!

That's a very cool rifle for anyone to own. At the time I had 3 other 338 WM rifles. Glad it worked out. I've lost track of the number of 338's I've had over the years. Most were Winchester or Rugers. Strangely I'm down to one of them that I used in Africa for 8 animals. Doubt I will ever sell it. Should I run into the right Ruger I'd probably buy another, I just like them. Got a Zytel stock standing by when I find the right one which will be a stainless Mk II. The one over at CDNN is a fine one. https://www.cdnnsports.com/338rcm-hkm77rfp-22-m-sts-syn.html?___SID=U

I like 375's as well but the Winchester is heavier than it needs to be for that caliber. OP didn't say where he lives or what he's going to do with it but Ruger Stainless rifles hold up pretty well in Alaska, good or better than any other stainless rifle IMO. Hope the OP finds what he wants.

I've got two 338s, both tack drivers...a Model 70 Classic from the 90s that are mentioned above, and a Browning A Bolt I got new, for cheap as the hunting season was over...

However after having a Model 70 in 270 rebored to 338/06...
the two 338 Mags hardly leave the safe...its a 100 fps slower than the Mags, and does so burning 20 plus less grains of powder... and the recoil is proportional to that decrease in powder used...

but I encourage anyone to get a 338 Mag if the itch is there...appeals like they are magic... but after owning one, you'll realize they aren't... they sure work, but so do less recoiling calibers...

Again, that is the 338 RCM, not the WM. The RCM chamber cannot be rechambered to WM. They are all sold out of the stainless WM, but do have some left in blue/walnut.

I agree with Brad. I also cut my 338 barrel to 22".
I cant say for a fact my 338 kills faster than my 270, 30-06 etc...

But I know it gives me confidence if I am hunting elk and am presented with a less than ideal shot angle.

Also I often hunt alone in grizzly country and it helps me sleep better in my tent in the back country.

irfubar,
Can you tell me a bit about the rifle stock, barrel and such?

Smallfry,

The stock is a Basner hi tech, with a blind magazine
and a Sunny hill trigger guard.

The barrel is a Douglas #3 , 1/10 twist.

The action is a 1909 Argentine Mauser.

Total weight is 7 3/4 lbs.

Take your pick, $499, synthetic/stainless or walnut/blue, RCM or WM.

https://www.cdnnsports.com/firearms.html#category_2=FIREARMS%2FHUNTING%20RIFLES&manufacturer=RUGER%C2%AE&caliber=338%20RCM,338%20WM

I have 8 .338's. 3 Remington Ultra Magnums and 5 Winchester Magnums. I have taken several Elk, Bear, and Mule deer with them. You can't beat a .338 for Elk and Bear. None of mine are for sale!!

A lot of people claim it is hard to shoot magnums well and I'll agree tiny groups are easier to come by with my non-magnums in .223-.264 calibers. Light bullets and smaller powder charges lead to lower recoil which, IMHO, is never a bad thing.

That said, my second tightest group ever was made with my 7mm RM and my .300WM has turned in some very respectable groups as well. The .338Wm bumps up the recoil but still shoots pretty well and I used it to fill my freezer with my longest shot ever on game, a cow elk at 487 yards.


Here's a 3-shot scope-check target shot with the .338WM. The third shot was taken several minutes after taking and marking the first two:

PM coming..

The .338 RCM is essentially a short, fat .338-06 using proprietary brass that may be expensive and hard to find. Otherwise, it is a good choice.

Settled on an Encore barrel in .338. Going to cut 4" off the 28" length and do some playing around.

Just for your background information, I had a .338 win mag with 29" barrel, and COAL 3.48". 75 gr Rel 22 gave the 250 gr 2900 fps. That is better than Ken Waters reported for a stock 340 Wby 26" (2821 fps).

Pre '64 and Browning Safaris for investing, a $500 Ruger for shooting. You decide. Consider that if you care for the Ruger well, there may be money to be made when you tire of it.

I have had close to a dozen .338s. Most are too heavy to pack. Those that are not, kick like mules. Most shoot better than good enough.

Best wishes,

Jack

My 338 win mag with 29" weighed over 9 lb and gave 40 ft-lb recoil due to the high velocity 250 gr. At regular 338 velocities for the 250 gr, you will get mid-30s in recoil with rifles weighing 8.5-9 lb.

One way to improve the recoil situation, if you can stand to cut the velocity of the 250 to 2500 by going to a 338 RCM or .338-06, recoil will be about 33 ft lb at 7.5 lb rifle weight and around 30 at 8 lb. If you download a .338 win mag, it will use about 10 gr more powder and bring recoil up some unless the gun is about 1/2 pound heavier.

Another way to lessen recoil is to use a cartridge "sock" holding 9 rounds on the buttstock, adding about 3/4 pound, and keep the magazine full. Each .338-06 cartridge weighs about 1-1/6 oz.

Or you can do what I did - go with a 225g AB (B.C. .550) at reduced velocities. I run 2742fps out of my 22" Ruger and calculated recoil, assuming an 8.3 pound rifle/scope, calculates out to 33.8 foot pounds using 69.0g H100V. Add in a decent recoil pad and some fall/winter clothing and recoil in the field doesn't seem bad at all.

That load worked fine on my longest game shot ever, a cow elk at 487 yards. That said, I consider my .338 more of a 600 yard hammer than one for longer ranges.

I have the 338 Win Mag, the 338 RUM and the 338 Ack Imp. and prefer the Ack over the others for an all around hunting 338

The .338 Win Mag is a fantastic all-around rifle! My first was a 70's vintage Ruger 77 that shot MOA groups with Federal Premium ammo. The previous owner was afraid of it and let it go for $300. I then purchased a Browning SS in 338 as my son wanted one. His shot cloverleaf groups with the same ammo. Several years later, I bought a very accurate Browning FN Safari rifle in 338. My son killed a 200+ inch whitetail with that gun. I like the Browning more so than the Winny, and a 1961 Browning FN can be had in excellent condition for about $1000, considerably less than the pre-64 Winny. You do have to stay in the market. Regardless, the cartridge typically seems to be quite accurate.

If you truly like the Winchester Model 70, and are willing to spend the money, by all means, get one. I have no doubt you will enjoy that rifle immensely! We only go around once in this life. No one wants to depart this world saying "I wish I would have.....".

Good luck on your decision!

Finally shot my encore 338 barrel today after work. Only 50 yards but didnt have much time. 3/4" 3-shot group with old rem 225gr core-lokts and 7/8" 4 shot group with federal fusion 225gr. Think I'm going to keep it and put on a good scope and load up some accubonds or ttsx's. Might leave it at 28" for a while. The 338 was pleasant to shoot after 10 shots from my turkey gun, just 3"ers but man my cheek still hurts.

I appreciate all of the comments and suggestions.

That's awesome. The 28" barrel in the encore probably doesn't make the OAL too bad does it?