I was just informed that the Idaho F & G put grounds squirrels on the endangered, protected list and we can no longer shoot them here. There's a few around McCall that can still be shot but that's all. I just can't imagine that, there's tousands of them out there. Must be some anti's running F & G here in Idaho. Our club, Idaho Varmint Hunters, had a whistle pig tournament scheduled for April 14th. As of today it is cancelled.

Can you post a link or where did this information come from?

Not to doubt your word, but I'm a bit skeptical that all ground squirrels in Idaho are protected.

I know we have a species of ground squirrel called the Golden Mantled squirrel that is protected and has been so for a number of years.

The president of our club has been on the phone with F & G today and he posted to all members on our forum. The F & G has been thinking about for a while. www.idahovarmint hunters.com/forum. Also Idaho Varmint Hunters on facebook. And you can always call F & G.

The president of our club has been on the phone with F & G today and he posted to all members on our forum. The F & G has been thinking about for a while. www.idahovarminthunters.com/forum. Also Idaho Varmint Hunters on facebook. And you can always call F & G.

sorry for the double post

BRoper: I am stunned!
I do some Ground Squirreling in Idaho from time to time and am shocked that there could be a "shortage" of them!
Its not April Fools Day is it?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

According to what the 2012-2013 IFG regs. say, an area from roughly Weiser to New Meadows is closed to shooting the "northern Idaho ground squirrel".
Also, the "southern Idaho" gs under consideration for protection from Weiser to Parma, roughly.
I found this under the furbearer page.
Hope this is what you are referring to and not a total ban.
We'll see.

They would be endangered if I showed up....

I just recieved some more info. Our club president and secretary have been in touch with state representatives. They said they would contact F & G next week and find exactly what is going on and why. In the meantime thay said we all should call F & G and register a complaint.

Poobah, I've heard about your rodent extermination prowess..........but then you fish, therefore you li.........I mean rule.

Thats exactly the way I read it also.

Personally it sounds like a case of wires getting crossed because according to the 2012-13 regs, the Northern Idaho Ground Squirrel CANNOT be shot are in the area around McCall. For someone at the F&G to say the only place ground squirrels can be shot is near McCall is exactly the opposite of what the regs say.

This decision was just made, after the regs were printed and put out. The F & G has been thinking a bout foor awhile. Our club sec. says he thinks the F & G director made the decision. I don't really think he can just make a decision anytime he wants too. I'm going to call F & G and the gonernors office on Monday. If I found out anything I'll post it. Probably get a run around but I want to let them know how I feel anyway.

Northern Idaho ground squirrel population grows
By Rocky Barker � [email protected]
Posted: 4:51pm on Oct 12, 2011; Modified: 4:53pm on Oct 12, 2011

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service says the northern Idaho ground squirrel is doing better than when it was listed as a threatened species, but it should remain on the list.
The squirrel, one of the rarest mammals in the United States, has been protected under the Endangered Species Act since 2000. The assessment came after a required five-year review.
The northern Idaho ground squirrel occurs only in Idaho's Adams and Valley counties. About 1,600 squirrels are known to occur on private and public lands, including U.S. Forest Service and Idaho State lands. The northern Idaho ground squirrel lives in dry meadows, surrounded by ponderosa pine and Douglas-fir forests.
It is protected because of a loss of native meadow habitat from forest encroachment, shooting, poisoning, predation and competition from other ground squirrels, such as the Columbian ground squirrel.


Read more: http://tlc.idahostatesman.com/2011/10/12/1837296/northern-idaho-ground-squirrel.html

WOW - Sounds like the efforts to save the black footed ferret on Charles M. Russel NWR. They figured the guys shooting prairie dogs might accidentally kill a ferret so you couldn't kill a prairie dog for a long ways around their ridiculous little ferret zone. The ESA is a total joke - nothing but a tool used by nut job envoronmentalists to stop consumptive use of resources. Cost my gun club tens of thousands in grant money because we have piping plovers that nest on the alkali slough on one end of our property - failed to pass the "environmental assessment" phase of the grant. Nevermind that they are still there and not bothered at all. Sorry for the off subject rant, I just hate to see these things happening. Next thing you know they'll have to close roads to avoid disturbing those same squirrels. Never ends once they are on the ESL.

You're not talking about the million dollar ferrets served up on a silver platter to the coyotes ( also protected on the CMR...at least most of the time...) are you?

Those would be the ones. The USFWS guys are a special breed.

All I know is that the pres. of our club called F & G in Boise and asked if we could shoot ground squirrels in an area from Emmett to Parma to Boise, kinda sorta a triangle shaped area, and they told him no. They told him that only up by McCall, those are the bigger columbian ground squirrels. One of our state represntatives is going to look into it Monday. He says they can't do that with out it going be fore the legislature. Anyway, I'm not going to shoot them until I find out for sure. I've talked tp F & G here before and they are very evasive, hard to get a definate yes or no out of them.

Some Oregon patrol guys want to cite folks for shooting ground squirrels without a license so I had a letters back and forth project with them and finally got a letter from the Dept head stating in no uncertain terms that a license is NOT needed and I take it with me in case I am ever again disturbed by an overzealous warden.

I would suggest that you do the same so as to have a written record of correspondence and statements.

Very good idea.

I just talked to Idaho F & G about 15 minutes ago. They have been in meetings all day and still are. They are trying to decide which ground squirrels and where they should be listed. They said as soon as they had something definate they would notify our club, Idaho Varmint Hunters. We stirred up a real hornets nest, they have been getting calls all day, even from as far as California. If any one on this forum called, I'd like to say thank you. If any one wants to call the number is 208-334-3700, ask for Debbie.

Safariman,
Are you saying that an out of state varmint hunter can shoot hogs WITHOUT a lic. in Oregon? Thanks.

If you are hunting on private ground with the landowners request to do so, and you are shooting rodents, this is correct no license required.

MARK

Wow, that's a $352 savings. I'll write to whatever Oregon calls their fish and game for starters I guess. Thanks

Well, this Idaho ground squirrel thing is getting more complicated. Here in so. west Idaho they say there are four different species. Two are supposedly endangered and two aren't. The four all overlap and it's really hard to tell them apart. In any one area you could be shooting more than one subspecies. So they say it's best to hold off shooting any until they come up with something more positive. They met all day yesterday on this subject and one day next week there's supposed to be a coffee/meeting with rep. Bilboa and the director of F & G to discuss this with the public. Don't know which day yet. I don't know what's happening with the rest of the state.

If you'd like you can check out our club forum at idahovarminthunters.com/forum and look under the heading,Future I V H Events. The pres. and sec., Loren and Gary, are doing a good job of keeping us informed on there.

Thanks and good luck to you guys. ESA will screw up a lot of things.

Can they die by laughing to death?? Didn't know they had such a sense of humor

Theres a fine line between satire and cruelty....





And smoking a turd in hell, and not smoking a turd in hell....

Apparently now the Idaho F & G has decided that they misclassified some species. Now they're trying to decide which species is which and where they can be shot.

I guess they're going to let us shoot ground squirrels for now and have our "whistle pig" tournament. We haven't recieved the official ok, they are sending a letter to our club with the go ahead. But they are saying that shooting them might be restricted in the near future.

I've been to Idaho shooting groundsquirrels, and it's hard to picture any of them as an "endangered" species.

The lumpers and splitter are at it again.

went on a field trip last year over to New Meadows for a restoration ecology class at the U of I. the snaggletooth bioligist there seemed proud of herself for catching a ground squirell poacher. story is she seen a guy shoot a squirell, got his license plate, and later collected the dead critter. Guess the guy was fined around $1000.

You pay that to shoot varmints? I guess the $225 I pay to shoot deer 7 days a week for 5 months in SC is a bargain.

You can't put a price on good carnage.........

The "price" for not being legal is much higher.

I don't know if anybody on this forum was planning on hunting in the Idaho Varminter Hunters whistle pig tournament but, it has been canceled due to the indecisiveness of the Idaho F & G. They were supposed to give us a definate decision in writing but we have never received the letter they promised. They say it's ok to shoot them south of I-84. But they're being so indecise and not giving any "official" word. The fine for shooting an endagered species of squirrel is $1000 and confiscation of your gun. We don't want to take a chance on anyone getting in trouble so the tournament has been cancelled.

BRoper: Thats a shame, the tournament being cancelled.
I hope this gets straightened out and soon.
I got in a 2 1/2 hour Hunt today and ran off 360 rounds of rimfire ammo in 38 degree temps with blazing sunshine on 5 inches of snow. The plentiful Ground Squirrels stood out like big black thumbs on the snow.
I do know this the ranchers where I Hunt are CERTAIN the Ground Squirrels are not "endangered".
This Idaho conundrum sounds politically motivated to me.
And thats a shame also.
Sounds like the Director of the Idaho Fish & Game Department is a real wishy washy squishy turd to me.
Best of luck to you this season - if there will be one.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Sounds like you had a bunch of fun. If we don't get someting worked out here in Idaho, other states may pick up on it. The director of F & G here is a non hunter! Can you believe that? Thanks to our governor who appointed him. Anyway, I just read on our club forum that we received the letter yesterday. I haven't seen what's in it yet or how it's going to affect the tournament. We've already informed quite a few that it's cancelled. Probably just have to forget it for this year. What a mess.

Tough deal, sorry to hear. Your club needs to figure out a way for the IFG to make a buck off your tourney. THEN they will be interested in moving forward. Sad.

Man, isn't that the truth.

If the F&G could come up with a plan for the sale of ground squirrel tags and a controlled hunt drawing for the variety that is endangered and suddenly things would be fine with the population.

Getting back to BRopers comment about the F&G director, it seems the guy, (Moore) is heavy on the fisheries stuff, which in my mind means almost nothing when it comes to directing the states hunting and wildlife.

Yep, you nailed it. Controlled hunts (antlered) have gone from trophy hunts to F&G cash cow.

I found out today that our club president received the letter yesterday afternoon. It says we can shoot ground squirrels south of the payette river and north of the snake river. Eastern Idaho is closed. He assured us that all officers have been informed not bother anybody or issue citations in this area. The tournament is still cancelled. We've already informed everybody that it was and it's getting to close to the date. There's just been to much confusion to go ahead with it now and I wonder if that wasn't intentional.

Sorry to hear. At least you can still hunt. Good luck and have a fun season.

Thanks. We have a badger tournament in June. Hope they don't become endangered by then.

I have been following this thread with interest since I shoot the Parma area when I am down that way. I fail to understand how F&G can arbitrarily close an area with no published criteria, normally if an area is to be closed they would have to notify the general public, have hearings and publish a decision.

I have been watching the Boise paper and there has been nothing published, no hearings scheduled and no public notification of any sort that I can find. Something just doesn't seem right about this - are you sure that they are not just jerking your club around?

Could you get your hands on a copy of the F&G letter and post it? I am curious as to how they worded it and the criteria they made their decision on - it just doesn't seem on the up and up.


drover

Hello drover,

My name is Gary Mathews, I am one od the Founders, and Sec/Tres of Idaho Varmint Hunters, Inc.

I am the one that got this whole issue started. One day the IVH President Loren, and I got our hands on the new Upland Game Regs. If you will look at page 44, the Ground Squirrel page, you will see a list of squirrels that IDFG listed as protected. Loren and I were concerned about this list because neither of us actually knew what species of squirrel lives in the area South of the Payette River, on south to the Snake River. Therefore Loren called the Nampa Regional F&G Powerline Office to talk to a Biologist, to confirm what species of squirrel we are shooting.

The lady that Loren spoke to on the phone told him that there were no squirrels in Idaho that were legal to shoot, except North of McCall (Columbians) and South of the Owyhee Mtns.

Loren then called me to tell me that he has cancelled the IVH Whistlepig Tournament due to the information he had just gotten. Well needless to say, I was instantly upset. I have been shooting whistlepigs for the past 35 years, and I didn't want to have that taken away from me, or anyone else. Therefore, I told Loren, that I was going to fight this thing. He said OK! So, On Friday evening, I got on the phone and called both my Idaho State Representatives. I was able to talk to State Rep. Carlos Bilboa. I introduced myself, and I represent IVH, and all Idaho Hunters. I then explained what Loren had told me. After I explained, Mr. Bilboa was quite upset. He told me that there had been nothing from IDFG come before the State Legislature in the form of a Bill.

After a lengthy conversation with Mr. Bilboa, he told me that he would on Monday go and talk to the Director of IDFG, and find out why the closure has been initiated.

The rest of the story has been posted, along with the Letter from IDFG, that includes a map, and a boundries description, on our forums at: http://idahovarminthunters.proboards.com

It is way to long to type all the info here, so please visit our forums for the whole story and all the updates to the story.

drover, it was no joke, squirrel shooting was shutdown. There was a fine of $1000.00, suspension of license, and confiscation of your guns.

Although, the area north of the payette river is closed to squirrel shooting due to it being Federally Protected - There are 4 other areas that are in Idaho that have State Protection, due to a low population, or habitat threatened status. IDFG is working to keep the Fed's from locking down the rest of the State.

Thank You for your time and attention to this issue. It was very important that we didn't lose this freedom!!!!!

Gary Mathews
Idaho Varmint Hunters, Inc.

We better hope they don't start breeding with the Preble jumping mouse

Thanks for the link, that clears things up - I will be down in a couple of weeks to do some shooting. I am glad that this has turned out okay.

drover

Ingwe,

Bring a semi load of ammo, and a truck load of replacement barrels.

I live half way between Emmett and Parma, as mentioned earlier. The critters in question are so thick that our local highways are often carpeted with their dead carcasses. In some years, it can be a real challenge in the spring to avoid running over two or three ground squirrels with every mile traveled.

If you wish to assist the locals in our annual attempts to eradicate these nasty, sometimes bubonic plague infested, vermin, come on over.

Get off of I-84 at exit 13, drive to the nearest cheat grass covered hill. It is a free fire zone. While you are exiting the freeway, pull into the RED Neck Cafe and enjoy some of Shooterwife's home made pie.

Does your rancher/agriculture lobby know about this? Don't think they'd be happy.

That was one of the things with this whole issue, NO ONE knew anything about it. It was not advertised, there was no notices. The list just showed up in the new IDFG Regs Booklet. And they told me that there was a $1000.00 fine, suspension of hunting licenses, confinscation of guns.

I talked to State Rep Bilboa, he told me that IDFG didn't even send a proposal or a Bill before the State Legislature for approval. The decision to place all the squirrels on the protected list was all within IDFG.

But? We have gotten it fixed. We can once again hunt squirrels in SW Idaho, from South of the Payette River to North of the Snake River. Checkout the posted map on our forums at: idahovarminthunters.proboards.com - scroll down to the Idaho Fish & Game Forum, there you will find the IDFG Letter with a map and description of the boundries for the protected species.

I would think that all ranchers and their advocates, lobbists, and every Idaho Hunter, would have be steaming if they would have known about the closure?? We are going to watch this issue closely, to insure that it continues to remain open to hunting for a everyone to enjoy, and future generations will have the opportunity to learn to hunt and shoot, and are able to enjoy it as much as I have in the last 35 years.

Gary Mathews
IVH Founder/Sec/Tres
IVH Idaho Hunters Advocate.

I sent an e-mail to Idaho F&G asking about the closure, here is the question and the response received from F&G.

I would have posted this sooner but I have been gone for a few weeks.

drover

MY QUESTION TO THE IDAHO F&G
"Over the weekend (24-25 March 2010), I read on an internet forum that the Weiser - Parma area was is closed to shooting gophers (ground squirrels). True or not? If it is true why was it closed?"

ANSWER FROM IDAHO F&G
"Gophers are different from ground squirrels. Most ground squirrels in the Weiser area are southern Idaho ground squirrels and are protected and cannot be killed. The ground squirrels found in the Parma area are Piute ground squirrels and are not protected. Hunting ground squirrels in the Parma area is legal."

LINK TO THE REPLY FROM F&G - https://fishandgame.idaho.gov/content/question/gopher-hunting

Yeah, they finally said they weren't endangered in this area and we can shoot them south of the Payette river and north of the Snake river. They did have the whole state shut down for about three weeks though and it would have stayed that way if we hadn't put the pressure on them. We had people from all over the country calling them and they had so many hits on their web site that they took it off. On behalf of the Idaho Varmint Hunters club I'd like to say thanks again to all of you who contacted them and expressed you're opinion. Just proof again that if we stick together we can get things accomplished.
Bob