I guess this would be a "price check" and also your opinions.

This is the 2d muzzleloader a guy wants to sell me. Hem-Haws on the price too. But he's thinking around $600 and I'm thinking more around $200.
The rifle is in excellent condition and looks to have been hardly used/fired.
I've looked around on the web to see what I could find, and the pro/cons flex around quite a bit.
The reason I'm thinking $200 is because I've read you have to almost completely take it apart to clean it properly, and it's a chore to do.
That and you get a lot of blowback gas in your face when shooting it.

I don't know anything about the cons of these muzzleloaders, so, I'm hoping some of you have or have had one that could guide me in it's worth,
or should I just stay clear of it?

Thanks

Me and a few friends have been shooting the 700ML/54 cal, for over 25 years, with great results. And you are correct, you have to keep them clean, like any muzzleloader.

The thing with these is, while it may look pristine on the outside, you have to check inside the bolt assembly, due to blowback. The crud gets inside and corrodes the bolt spring. The bolt must be disassembled and cleaned, after shooting it.....every time. Replacement springs are available from Wolff, if needed.

We shoot stout loads out of the 54 calibers, and never have had any blowback, that makes it to our faces.

Brownells sells a very handy 700 bolt disassembly tool....that I highly recommend. It really speeds up the take down process.

As to value.....if it's like new, including inside the bolt. And, it has all the take down tools and cleaning accessories, I'd go up to $400 max. If not, I'd just pass on it, unless you want to gamble that you can save it (for a very reduced price)?

Andy3

It's just the rifle and No accessories. I love bp guns, they're fun to shoot. But I'm a bit leery of this one, just because I do not know enough about them.
Thank you for the info.

These are great platforms, Badger Ridge makes an upgrade breech plug and bolt nose for 209 ignition, to virtually eliminate any blow by. They also were used extensively for smokeless conversions with the barrel and breech plug upgraded for smokeless applications. They are somewhat out of vouge for the conversions now with a preference on a CF action with locking lugs on the bolt.

If it's in it's factory configuration, as Andy3 said, blowback is an issue and disassembling the bolt is a must to keep it from seizing up. IMO, the best thing you can do is convert it to 209 primers with one of the kits by Arrowhead or Badger Ridge unless you're using it where an open breech is required. That's the first thing I did when I picked one up a few years ago. As far as price, unless it's coming some good glass, $600 is way too high. Looking on Gunbroker blued models are selling less than $300, stainless a bit more. The stainless/thumbhole laminate one I bought was under $200, but that was a few years ago. Converted with one of the kits above that eliminate the blowback into the bolt, they are very nice rifles.

Thanks everyone who replied. It's helped a bit to a better understanding of it and the price factor.
I will probably take a walk on it tho, unless I can get it for around $2-250. I just think he overpaid for it when he got it, and trying to make a few extra bucks off it or trying to re-coup a bit from me? He sold me an as new unfired cva optima V2 .50cal pistol with a Leupold var-x 2.5 x 8x EER scope mounted for $300. Retail for the pistol alone is $400 (camo furniture), and the scope is perfect, so I'd think between 300-$400 on it.
He also has that Thompson Center .50 cal Scout Carbine he's wanting to sell me. Today he gave me a definite price of $300 for it.
It's nice, but not too sure on it's price either.

I would not pay over $200 for it. I have had one and replacing the bolthead to work with 209 is a pain. I had to drill something to make it work. After it was done it was great. By the way the #11 percusssion caps the orignal uses are impossible to find right now.

Yeah, it'll be nearer to $200 on the 209 conversion kit for it. I'm just going to sit back on this one for a little while. Wait him out on the price, and if he sells it to someone else, good for him.

$600 for the ultimate ML is pretty close. The early model doesn’t bring that much. I bought the ultimate for an elk hunt in New Mexico that fell through. I put a red dot in mine and it’s good for 300 yards shots up to and including elk.

I have used one since they made them. The original Breech plug and firing pin for percussion caps suck. The Badger ridge conversion is a nice upgrade. It is BS to have gases blowing back at you and into the trigger. With the conversion that doesn't occur. I have killed a pile of deer with mine.

I'm pretty sure it isn't the "Ultimate" model. I wouldn't know the difference either way unless the barrel is stamped Ultimate and I don't recall seeing that.
But it is stainless-steel. I'm going to hit him up tomorrow for $200, but I'll go $300, but no more. Guess time will tell.

Yup, not the "ultimate" model. But I did buy it for $250.
Going to buy the 209 kit for it and do away with the #11 cap breech plug, like smokeeter and tmitch said (thanks for that info).

Got the breech plug soaking right now, it's in tight.

I had a latter model that used 209 primers. Shot great no problems. As stated, you must take the bolt apart each and every time to clean it. It was heavy but not overly so. Got tired of it. Sold it then bought a CVA Accura. Simpler, easier to clean and just as accurate if not more so. Plus, lighter. $200-250 tops.