Ok, here�s the deal. I get this question 50 times a year and they all originate from web sites. The problem with the internet is that there are so many �experts� who really have no knowledge but want to portray themselves as the keepers of all knowledge as long as they can hide in the anonymity of the internet.

Yes, Pyrodex contains pecrhlorates.

No, they do not etch the barrel at some minute level so small it can only be viewed under a full moon while wearing a wizard outfit.

NASA and the DOD both have tested and used Pyrodex over the past 35 years. Their testing contradicts the �experts� on the internet. They found Pyrodex to be no more corrosive than black powder.

Cleaning of Pyrodex residue is the same as black powder. No petro solvents, only water based or polar solvents. Soap is great. Windex with vinegar is great, Ballistol is the best thing for cleaning muzzleloaders I have ever seen, with all powders.

I don�t know how to make it any more plain, no special problems with Pyrodex. Shoot the gun, Clean the gun completely and you are just fine.

Those who want to continue to spew about their �expert� knowledge about the corrosiveness of Pyrodex and how it magically micro-pits barrels are going to continue to spew the same old tired stuff. How could the continue to be the anonymous �expert� hiding on the internet if they gave up. That is just the nature of the internet. I (we) are bound by truth, the �experts� are bound by their imaginations.

I hope this helps. I would say that it may be best to just give the best advice ever, �When you want to know about a product, call the maker. 800-622-4366�


Mike Daly

Customer Satisfaction Manager

The Hodgdon Family of Fine Propellants

Hodgdon Smokeless Powders

Winchester Legendary Propellants

IMR Propellants

Pyrodex

Triple Seven

Goex Black Powder

Bigblock455,

Those "Micro pits" the internet experts speak of must be from the CVA barrels!!!!! Just pulling your leg.

If you have a reloading powder question Mike Daly is the man to talk to at Hodgdon.

I remember a conversation I had with Mike concerning 777 powder, it went like this.

When 777 powder came out Hodgdon was forced to set self imposed pressure & load limits on the powder because the rifle manufactures would not test their guns with the 777 loose powder because if they did they would have to add "Warnings" to the barrels indicating load limits

This is why 777 pellets has a filler and similar power levels to pyrodex. Hodgdon knew if they powder level was the same as 777 loose powder some shooter would place 3 full powder pellets down the barrel. This could have "LEAD" to a cross over lawsuit of it was the powder..NO it was the barrel.

Doc

I don't know how to be more plain about my experiences, but I shot a lot of pyrodex once upon a time. Many pounds of it. I shoot many more pounds of blackpowder now. There is absolutely no comparison in the corrosive properties of their fouling. Pyrodex is way way more corrosive. It is not close, it is not similar, it is not even kinda sorta the same. Pyrodex fouling is horrible.

It is also pretty damn inaccurate.

Why would NASA and the DOD waste 3 seconds testing either Pyrodex or BP?

Brent

Has the NMLRA (via Muzzle Blasts) tested the myriad black powder substitutes along with one (or more) black powder controls? Has the NRA (via American Rifleman) tested? If not, why not?

Wrong!..you gotta clean your gun when your done...simple.

Wrong again...I can prove otherwise.

Well, let me restate that.

I can prove pyro is accurate in my gun.

I picked out the one statement that I can agree with. It does produce some pretty good crud/fouling in my guns, almost as bad as 777. But crud/fouling is not rust/corrosion.

As stated, both black powder and pyrodex ARE corrosive!

However, both need to be cleaned at the end of each shooting session. POOF! No corrosion from either! Who cares if one is more than the other. Take care of your guns and won't have a problem.

Of course, I like BH 209 better than either. And yes, it can promote corrosion too, but not if handled properly.

But in one of my guns, pyrodex is more accurate hands down than any other powder.

I now shoot B209. I still clean fairly soon after shooting, carry over from the pryodex days. I may now go a day or two if on a hunt though. I do agree, don't shoot pyrodex & let your gun sit uncleaned for a few days.

Anytime Guy. Raton and the BPTR and BPCR. I'll be there. There will be less than one person on the line shooting Pdex.

Pyrodex is VERY Accurate.

AT point blank range and on the internet. See ya at the match

Yeah, banging silhouettes is truly what separates the men from the boys. After that, you'll likely put up a challenge race for pink slips in your Subaru Forester.

I was suggesting 1000 yds Creedmoor dufus. Got no Subie - sorry about busting your bubble. It would be a fair trade for your VW bug though.

Anyway, 1000,900,800, 60 shots for score. You are welcome to try. I don't think you can score above the fold much less win with Pdex. I am certainly willing to wager, but cash only. I don't need your Bug

100 dude.

Okay, let's try 1000. I'll be there.

I am saying my gun likes Pyro...I'm not saying one is more accurate than the other..

To say Pyro is not accurate is a dumb statement.

Mine does better at 100 than my friends gun and he's shooting BP....go figure.

1000? I havent even shot mine past 200 I couldnt tell you what mine will do at 1000.

Okay, I will say this then. In the old days (1980s and 1990) when bpcr was in its infancy and bptr (cartridge and muzzleloader) was just being reborn, folks showed up to matches with pyrodex and got whupped over and over and over again. They don't show up any more. BP is more available now than ever. It works better than Pyrodex and that is all there is to it. If you want to guess at how well it might do at 1000, start with running it over a chronograph and compare with good bp loads.

No serious competitor in schuetzen shooting will use the stuff either. It is fine for what it is - 100 yd deer rifles. But it is expensive, less accurate, and its fouling is more corrosive. Those facts have been well established over the last two decades. And that is not simply my experience, but that of 100s of damn serious competitive shooters all over the nation.

Brent

I agree! I use two Pyrodex pellets and 295 grain Powerbelts. It'll shoot 1/2" groups at 100 yards all day without a lot of effort from my Omega. 1000 yards? Not interested. i'm not going to shoot at a hog at 1000 yards.

Nah, those are manufacturing defects.

Hah, more leg-pulling!!!!

This is it in a nut shell. Let the residue sit in your gun long enough there will be a problem. Using Pyrodex for years with no corrosive problems mainly because I clean my MZ every time I shoot it. I go to the club the day before the opener and shoot a fouling shot, then I go hunting. Simple.

CLB

I would have to agree with many of you here . Myself I used Pyro for years , still do in my cartridge guns .
I don�t find any accuracy issues , as long as a load is worked up for Pyro .
Now if you are using BP and then try and use the same charge with Pyro . Then you may have a issue .

As to cleaning . As was said . Both powders . BP and Pyro are IMO corrosive .

Now to clarify that . BP is corrosive once fired and if moisture fouls the charge or fouling and its left in the bore .
Un fired and without moisture contaminating it � humidity �
You will not find corrosion in the barrel any more then you will in a 100 year old can of powder .

Same thing goes with Pyro . The powder and fouling are still hydroscopic and as such will leach in moister is added . The longer its aloud to set . The more the moisture will etch and corrode the barrel .

Many folks have done tests on this . I seem to recall even an article on it in Muzzle blast some years back , in that test both Pyro and T7 were compared to BP . All of which were placed on a polished steel plate . After a few days the plate was inspected .

Now as I recall � trying to remember � but as I recall the rust that had formed was greatest on the T7 and the least on the BP .. However all 3 showed clear signs of corrosion.
Now does that mean that�s what happens in your barrel . Well no . again it shows moisture � IE h humidity � and its effects on the powder .

Now what I can tell you that I find is that Pyro in Damascus barrels will leave un real fouling . Fouling that does pit the barrel if left un cleaned
Much ,Much greater then the same loads of BP .
I believe though this heavier fouling is do to the effects of the burning powder on the shot cups .
But do to pyro being alittle hotter . I still use it . I just clean the CR@# out of things a days shooting and thus have found no issues

I've shot a lot of Pyrodex. It's exactly like blackpowder as far as I can tell. I don't use it in flintlocks because it's supposed to be hard to light. I buy it dirt cheap at the end of the season when Walmart is closing it out.

Pyrodex is fine, just needs more cleaning as it is harder to remove. It does not want compressed too much and compression needs controlled to make it even. It does not work real good in BPCR.
My best accuracy in a cap lock has always been with Pyrodex.

It doesn't need more cleaning nor is it harder to remove.

I have used balck powder, Pyrodex and Triple seven. I have found that with Prodex, it does degrade if not sealed extremely well.
I don't hunt ML a lot , bit shhoot once ayear,and several times before season when I do draw a tag.

At least three times now,I have ended up chasing ghost, before I bought a new jug of Pyrodex and everything went back to noraml. I ended up screwing the lid on with plastic bag beteen the lid and the jug, then putting the jug in a baggie and then that in a sealed 30 cam ammo can.I live in CO,where it is not very hunid to boot.

I cannot tell if the same is true with 777, as I now take the same precautions.However, I used some 777 this year tha tI have had for at least 5 years and it was good.

I cannot tell nay difference in accuracy between Black Powder, Pyrodex and 777 as long as I work up a load for each.

I don't know about corrosion as I clean my rifle the day I shoot it

What I meant by that is it takes more patches before I stop getting black out of the bore. Not that big a problem but it is there.
BP cleans up quicker. Most likely why some say Pyrodex is more corrosive because some is left in the bore. You need a good product to halt corrosion after cleaning and most gun oils don't work.
About the best stuff I have found is LPS-3. You can store a gun for 3 years and it only takes one patch, fire a few caps and load the gun. Any left in the bore will not harm powder. It turns to a waxy coating and might work as a patch lube in itself. I have to try it but the stuff is hard to find.

Ultra Bore Coat is a good product to look into. I can clean my rifles out now with 3 windex patches when using blackhorn209.