John, When you publish an article about a certain cartridge, is the reloading block of loads that's usually included with the article actual testing done by you or where does it come from ? TIA, Ben

I do the handloading and shooting, which usually requires a minimum of two range sessions.

John

I heard a rumor that you have a large callus on your shoulder.

Speak louder, he might be hard of hearing also.

John need another question answered please in the 1st Gun Gack book about 35 Whelen it says all groups shot at 50 yards . i am in the process of having a Ruger #1 barrel rebored and chambered to a 35 Whelen . so here is the question did you do any 100 yard group shooting ? and if you did could you somehow let me know your thoughts on reloading this fine old cartridge . thank you much ,Pete53

You mis-read the chart:

The line at the bottom which says, "Groups shot at 50 yards" has an asterisk in front of it--indicating only TWO loads were shot at 50 yards, those using handgun bullets, the 140-grain Speer JHP and the 158-grain Midway cast SWC. All the rest were shot at 100 yards.

I also described my thoughts on handloading the .35 Whelen in the 2000 or so words preceeding the load table--where I mention having owned four of 'em over the years.

John

Attention span, it's a thing.

Recently I became curious about how many rounds of centerfire rifle handloads I've been shooting since most of my writing income came from "gun writing," which began around 20 years ago. Before then my career involved writing on a bunch of subjects, including fishing, Western and natural history, and a few others--basically anything some magazine was willing to pay pretty well for. (Since starting to publish in the mid-1970s have had articles appear in over 40 magazines.)

By around 2000 I was handloading and shooting around 5000 rounds of centerfire rifle ammo each year, but when I retired from Handloader and Rifle last December, I'd been averaging around 8000 for several years. That did not include factory centerfire ammo, shotshells and rimfires. I didn't develop a shoulder callus (at least not one large enough to notice) but did grow a little weary of shooting rifles of around .300 Winchester Magnum recoil and up.

Around 15 years ago I also noted that even lighter recoil can grow wearying, if you shoot enough. The occasion was a prairie dog hunt in Nebraska for a number of gun writers, hosted by a major American rifle company, which had just introduced a new bolt-action primarily designed for hunting coyotes.

They didn't have a heavy barrels, but between the mid-weight barrel and the heavy scopes on 'em, the total weight was a little over nine pounds. They were all .22-250s, and we used a then-new factory load from Winchester. The shooting started late in the morning, shortly after we arrived at the ranch, and continued until near sundown. We got out again in the morning around 9:00, and before noon I noticed the .22-250's recoil started feeling harder and harder--and eventually realized I'd started to flinch--because every time the rifle went off it started feeling more and more like a .375 H&H. So switched to one of the .22 rimfires the company also brought along, which soon cured the flinch.

One of the nice things such companies usually do on such shoots is give the fired brass to the shooters. I was putting mine in the empty liter water bottles. They'd brought along in a couple of big coolers full of water and ice--and the high temperature the afternoon before had been around 100, so there were plenty of empty bottles.

After getting home I counted the fired cases, and there were more than 600. So now I know my one-day tolerance level for shooting a 9-pound .22-250....

It's not just recoil, it's the noise. It can be tiring.

Yes, it can be--but I was wearing custom plugs made for my ears, covered by muffs. What I remember most, years later, is the way the rifle came back, both against my shoulder and my cheek....

Something I've wondered about also: do sound waves traveling through stock, skin, and bone into the inner ear contribute to hearing issues even if the outer ears are heavily muffled? (Sorry, this has nothing to do with .35 Whelen's specifically but since we're already off the road into the weeds...)

From the research I've done, they do--but most importantly through openings such as our mouth, nostrils, etc.

Our head is apparently a relatively easily invaded "space." Maybe it would help to stuff compressible ear plugs up both nostrils too....

From JB. when I retired from Handloader and Rifle last December, I'd been averaging around 8000 for several years. That did not include factory centerfire ammo,

Holy Crap! That’s a lot of rounds. I get it, in your case, that’s what put food on the table and money in the bank. My attention span would run dry long before 8000. But as they say, thank you for your service, we’ve all learned a lot from your wonderful writing and enjoyed it also. Gonna miss it.

M721,

Thanks!

But I'm still writing some--a rifle column and feature article in every issue of Sports Afield, and 3-4 articles in every issue of Rifle Loony News.

I was told by a hearing doctor, I forgot what they are called, that shock waves reverberate the skull and so can still damage the ear. I had told him I used ear plugs and wore ear muffs . When he looked at my graph, he asked what rifle I shot. He was a South African.

Have read the same thing, but apparently the other "holes" in our head allow even more of the shock waves to reach our ears.

All of which is partly why my choices in hunting cartridge have generally been down-sized over the past couple decades. But that's also partly because I've found less difference in how well different cartridges kill big game the longer I hunt, as long as the bullets penetrate and expand sufficiently.

Have investigated some of the reasons for that, which I reported on extensively in Chapter 41 of The Big Book of Gun Gack II, "Opinions of Killing Power."

Your article had a rare commodity , common sense. I remember the formulae articles, the cartridge tables that had energy as well as drop.

The company supplied molded ear plugs, which I wore all the time at work ,and Peltor muffs around the really noisy machines. But I found quality foam plugs worked better than the molded ones, so I wore them at the range with the muffs. That's a long ways from the "Swedish Cotton" that the old Swedish carpenter used when he used the Ramset. To a young apprentice, he was really old, 62. I'm well past that now,chuckle. He was funny with that a dry understated humour said with a Swedish accent.

Yep. There isn't anything I hunt that can't be killed by a .260 Rem with a 140 grain partition.

If I'm hunting in open areas where shots may be over 250 yards, I use my .25-06 with 115 grain Partitions.

yes i did i should have put my glasses on " which i hate to where " i did find & read the little hand book too. thanks,Pete53

thanks for the positive comment Pinky .

Years ago I remember a lot of discussion on the vibration of fiberglass vs. Kevlar stocks and inner ear issues. It may have been on the old shooters.com site. The thought was the kevlar stocks created more hearing issues. Anyone else recall that?

See the smiley. That's a symbol indicating friendly ball busting.

wonderful your always so positive .

Mule Deer;
Top of the morning to you sir, I hope that you and Eileen are well and surviving the heat wave if you're getting what we're getting.

It's been another odd year for gardening up here for sure, always a challenge to see what the heat and fresh kinds of bugs will do isn't it?

When I read your comment about ear plugs in the nose, I was reminded that when the girls were young and shared hotel rooms with us they'd fight over who was furthest away from me, they'd wear ear plugs and yes, it was discussed whether or not plugging my nose with ear plugs would decrease the volume level on my snoring...

Kids, you know?

I'd think that if one had ear plugs in the nose and had a chunk of closed cell foam in the mouth for good measure it'd help one get the shot off quicker - before fainting and all that.

Anyways on a bit more serious note I very much enjoyed that chapter and have re-read it several times. Will again now in fact.

We've noticed there seems to be less correlation between perceived "horse power" in a cartridge and actual killing or even "knock down" somehow. I really wanted to see more too, since I was putting up with the recoil right?

One of the less than cool things about aging for me personally is that a lifetime of abusing my shoulders seems to be coming to roost and I just cannot shoot many rounds out of even my fairly light .308 Norma anymore. Last fall after 3 shots to confirm zero, my shoulder was done for the day for anything other than the .22 and .223.

This aging thing is - as we've discussed previously over the years - complicated.

Anyways here's to good enough gardening weather and healthy enough bones, joints and muscles that we can tune up the rigs for the season which is fast approaching.

Dwayne

Aging is complicated....but the worst thing is, now it's happening to US

My wife likes me to use my Cpac.

I'll probably get stoned for heresy for this, but I most often hunt with a 260.The load development with IMR4350 and a 129 Interloc was "Oh, that's good nuff. " Which is bit of a crime as the barrel is a Gullard that was chambered and finished by Mick McPhee. Mick did a background check on me to see if I was to be trusted with a Savage barrel. Dwayne might know who they were.

downwind;
Good morning to you sir, I hope you're staying cool enough down on the coast. Our family down there reports it as being quite toasty enough thanks!

Yes I talked to Mick a couple times on the phone and always meant to get up to visit in person. Those who did told me you could eat off the floor in his shop.

He did this one up which is a 722 action with an RKS "Grampa Smith" SS barrel on it. As far as I can measure, it's one of his gain twist barrels and Mick thought it was as well if I'm recalling correctly.



I've shot against Ted Gaillard barrels back in the day when I did some hunting rifle weight competition. They were extremely well thought of out here.

If I'm not wrong Mick McPhee made some .308" barrels too before he passed on too soon. Not sure if anyone is making RKS or Gaillard barrels anymore - sorry.

All the best.

Dwayne

Mick passed away about a year after his wife died. He only made 30 caliber barrels. I think Mitch has his machinery, but doesn't make barrels. I only met him a couple of times, but Steve and Mitch knew him well as did Greydog. Your comment about a RKS "Granpa Smith" gain twist barrel has me wondering. I bought a unused 6.5x57 barrel off Gunnutz classified and Greydog and I decided to rechamber it 6.5x55 because of the brass and die issue. It got a Zastava action. Greydog thought it was a gain twist. The guy who sold it to me was from the prairies . That's all I know about it. So it might be an RKS barrel?

We live in the Fraser Valley and are getting fairly regular 30 Celsius weather.

This thread has more twists and turns...

Though I like my more powerful rifles, I too find myself shooting more with milder rifles such as my 308 Win, 25-06, several varmint cartridges and of course the 22 rimfires.

I'll be adding a suppressor to my inventory of shooting goodies as well.

8,000 rounds a year John! My goodness. When I was competing in NRA High Power matches I managed to load and fire a couple of thousand 308's a year, but not anywhere near that many!

Regards, Guy

JB , that is a lot of ammo shot every year i don`t know how you can handle that much shooting off the bench but good for you ,i appreciate what you have learned and help us with reloading , plus all your books you have wrote are another plus for many of us . i added up kinda what i shot every year for the last 20 some years 15,000 - 18,000 target and hunting arrows out of a drawn bow ,12 gauge for trap 3,000 - 4,000 ,centerfire fire of the bench 1,500 - 2,500 all per year , plus i climbed at least a 1,000 poles 40-50 ft. tall a year as a REA lineman . its no wonder why many of us have bad shoulders some of us have even had surgery on our shoulders . i no longer care to shoot bigger centerfire rifles , never again a 870 trap shotgun i now have a Perazzi single barrel trap gun, i have to use a x-bow now left shoulder is ruined . > what i have learned to late is a person does not need a rifle that kicks more than a 30-06 or less is better ,you don`t need to bow hunt with a bow over 60 lbs. ever , and if you shoot trap buy a decent o/u trap shotgun at least a Browning or better and shoot 1oz. loads . > and if your young and still in school don`t play football ,basketball or hockey learn to golf that you can do the rest of your life . Pete53

HUH?

Hi Dwayne,

Hope you and yours are doing well too!

So far we haven't had the really high temperatures some other areas around us have had, but the weather guessers are predicting around 95 F. for the next three days or so--around 35 C. But will see what happens, as so far it's generally been slightly cooler than predicted at our place.

The garden is doing well, but we planted a little earlier than usual this year. Have some tomatoes already pretty red! Those are the "heirloom" seeds Eileen has been "recycling" for several years now. The original seeds were mailed to her by one of our customers in upstate New York, which has an even colder climate than our part of Montana.

Glad you like "Opinions on Killing Power" enough to reread it As discussed before, we've had similar experiences with some of the popular "powerful" cartridges. (Have also heard a similar opinion from long-time Alaskan and African guides....)

Good hunting,
John

Have been pretty lucky that way, mostly because I started shooting a LOT back when foam ear plugs were getting popular--and have been pretty careful since.

But don't guarantee I'll hear everything, especially with my left ear in a crowded bar....

That's funny 🤣

Have heard that one before--or at least I think that's what I heard!