I have a Weatherby Vanguard (Howa) in 30.06. I want to re-barrel it to 25-06. Reading forums leaves me with a bunch of questions on barrel length and twist, etc. I have read that the round prefers longer barrels due to the slow burning powder.? However, I cannot find a manufacturer that uses a longer than 24” barrel. Remington USED to catalog a 26” Sendero model. These are now super expensive on GB. I also have read that the round likes faster twist rates when shooting heavier rounds, like 1-7. Most of the manufacturers are using 1-10 twist barrels. Will a faster twist negatively affect lighter bullets? Is there a tradeoff here concerning the twist rate?
I have not yet figured out whose barrel I am going to use. Local qualified gunsmiths are non-existent in Chicagoland. I will likely send the barreled action out to have the barrel installed by the barrel maker. I am interested in a 25” to 26” stainless barrel with 1-7 twist in a #3 heavy sporter contour. If anyone has done something similar, I would welcome you posting about your experience. If anyone can expand on my questions on the 25-06 round, and the length, twist preferences it has, that would be much appreciated. Please recommend a barrel maker if applicable. This is going to be a rifle to shoot at the range, and to possibly varmint hunt prairie dogs or coyotes. I have zero need for a 30-06, so this build is to have something different.

Bought my first 2506 in 81 and another in 2000 both have 24” barrel 1 in 10 twist. Never wanted/needed anything longer. The twist rate was just fine for 75-120 grain bullets with 120 being the heaviest at the time. A 120 leaving at ~3000 kills just fine. RL22, Norma MRP and 4831 were the powders I found worked best and still use in both rifles.

Need? Probably not, but I’d decide based on the use I planned to put it to. With some new long bullets available, a feller looking to go long might want to squeeze out as much speed as possible. Carbon fiber barrels can help keep a long one light. I hunt mostly woods and edges, but have never found a long barrel to be a hindrance, except maybe when crawling around in the puckerbrush, and I don’t do much of that anymore.

Do you have a projectile in mind for your project? Bartlein barrels is ~2hrs from Chicago and per their website does installs on customer actions. Hart in NY, Douglas in WV, and Pac-Nor in OR are 3 other barrel makers that will also do installs.

Both of my 25-06 rifles are factory 22" barrels (700 SS Mt Rifle, M70 Fwt) and will shoot 100gn TSX @ 3300fps.

I like 24 inch barrels , seems 26 inch barrels are just that much too long to easily get out of the truck with. That said I always felt the 25-06 kinda sucked. Too much gun for most varmint hunting and doesn't come up to the larger game capabilities of the 270 in a rifle of the same weight. To add barrel life can be short depending on how much it's shot. Makes a pretty good antelope, whitetail and muley rifle.

Rickt300 I’ve got a Remington 7mm Mag. for anything larger, thus the reason I don’t need a 30-06. Dad won the Weatherby rifle in a raffle, and gave it to me. It is in a really pretty Boyds laminated stock. Kind of a little sentimental about it, just would like to have a use for it.

I’ve had my 2506 since 1963. In my opinion it’s about perfect for deer where I hunt. It sends a 120 at about the same velocity as the 270 130. Deer can’t tell the difference and recoil is just enough less that I can watch the impact . 24 inch barrel is fine as is a 10 inch twist, unless you are into long range hunting or shooting and need the super BC projectiles.

One might need a 27 or 8 inch barrel to obtain the most velocity available. But have had a 22" out speed two different 24" barrels I've had since, so ya never know. A barrel length that gives the rifle a good balance point may be of more benefit than another 30 or 40 fps.

Unless very cold temps at low altitude an 8 twist will stabilize most of the longest 25 cal. bullets there are. And light bullets don't usually mind faster twist.

Talked myself out of building a 25-06 several times, as I have several 270's. I did pick up a 257 Roberts though. It isn't so blasty with lighter projectiles, seems to kill deer nicely and barrel length isn't an issue. Feeds fine through a long action. I have a friend who has done all his hunting with a 25-06 using factory loads for years. His rifle has a 22 inch barrel. He is happy with it and you just might be also.

Maker .. IMHO the best .25 caliber barrel out there is Lilja. I haven't used them all by any means, but the barrel he made me a few years back for a .257 Roberts build was pretty incredible. Basically I was having a Remington 700 LVSF in .22-250 that I'd shot to death rebarreled to .257 Roberts. It would shoot 100 grain ballistic tips into the low 0.2" range for 5 shots.

For .25 caliber, I'm not on board with the heavy, long, high BC bullets. If that is your goal, go with 6mm or 6.5mm. You'll have a lot more choices. With .25 caliber 1-10" twist is fine. I've owned 8 .25 caliber rifles that I can remember, all with 1-10" twists, and all handled the 120 grain partition just fine. I don't need a bullet heavier / longer than that in .25 caliber. I might hedge my bet just a little by going with 1-9" but probably not. I definitely would not do 1-7 or 1-8.

Length .. depends on the purpose of the rifle. If it's a sporter for hunting medium game and maybe coyotes, duplicate the factory contour and stick with 24". If you're changing stocks, etc, and planning to shoot colony varmints, then 26" is fine. I hunted deer a couple seasons with .25-'06 varmint rifles .. because it's what I had. Both had 26" heavy barrels and 6.5-20X scopes. I was hunting thick brush. It can be done, it's just not ideal.

do as you like ,but i have 1- 257 Creedmoor , 2 -257 Roberts with new Brux barrels on them 8 twist and yes just cause i could i made them all 25 inches , but on my new 257 Weatherby mag. Brux barrel 8 twist because that has a lot of powder to burn in this cartridge i went 28 inches its more of a longer range open deer and antelope rifle. i average 3680 FPS with a 100 gr. bullet and i could push it a lot faster but the recipe shoots so well out of all my 257 Weatherby mags. why change for more velocity. > back to the barrel length i feel because most 25 caliber cartridges don`t use as much powder as the magnum does 25 inch barrel with 25 caliber is just kinda neat , if your ordering a new barrel 8 twist really makes the 25 caliber /cartridges shoot well. good luck,Pete53

One thing to keep in mind is it's not a big deal to shorten and recrown if you go with a 26" barrel and find you don't like it but if you go to short your stuck with it .

A really good way to "visualize" the effect of a shorter barrel is to use a ballistic program and input both expected velocities.

Come up with some comparison criteria such as; MPBR, energy, drop, and the max range that you'll get guaranteed expansion ( I use 1800 FPS).

Then check out the effect of the delta in MV due to barrel length. A general school of thought is an inch of barrel usually equals about 30 FPS all things being equal (but they never are.) Once you realize that the 2-3" shorter barrel equals something like 30 yds in MPBR and expansion distance, it makes the decision easier.

I happened to run a sort of test on this a decade ago, using the two .25-06s I had at the time, a Ruger No. 1 AB, one of a limited run with a 24" barrel, and a custom 98 Mauser with a 26" P.O. Ackley barrel. Both barrels had 1-10 twists, and were in very good condition.

I tried 10 different handloads in each rifle, using bullets from 75 to 120 grains, with everything identical in each load--brass, primer, powder and seating depth. (The rifles had very similar throat lengths.) The tests were shot on the same day, using the same chronograph.

Every load chronographed faster in the 26" barrel, but the least difference came with the pair of 75-grain loads, at 6 and 15 fps. The most difference came the single 115-grain load, at 168 fps.
Overall the loads with 110-117 grain bullets showed the most difference in velocity, ranging from 78 to 168 fps. The single 120-grain load only gained 42 fps in the 26" barrel.

The powders included Accurate 4350, H4350, Hunter, Magnum, Magpro, Reloder 17, Reloder 25 and Retumbo. The complete results, and other details, appeared in Chapter 23 of the first Big Book of Gun Gack, which is available from www.riflesandrecipes.com.

I'll also comment that I've played around considerably with various computer ballistic programs, and in general their number don't match real-world tests nearly as often as some rifle loonies believe. There are various reasons for this, including variations in individual barrels and manufacturing lots of powders.

Also, while I've hunted with the .25-06 quite a bit, including some deer culls, I eventually concluded that at "modern" pressures the .257 Roberts comes pretty close to .25-06 in 24" barrels--and if somebody wants to really gain noticeably different field performance the .257 Weatherby is the way to go, even in 24" barrels.

Curious about the bolded, do you mean ballistic programs like "Quick Load" or something along the lines of Strelok?

QuickLOAD.

I love the .25-06. For what it is worth, I have an old .25-06 built on an FN Mauser action. I bought it from an old man who had built it sometime in the 1960s and who sold it to me as at the "kid's price" of $275. He said he had taken many antelope and deer with it, but his kids didn't hunt and he was too old. It has a nice heavy 26" barrel. I cannot tell you scientifically that this is the optimal length for the barrel, but it works beautifully for me. And it makes sense to me with an overbored cartridge like the .25-06 that a long barrel would be more efficient. I also like the long barrel, even shooting offhand or at a moving target, because it balances so well. I've had nearly as many snap shot "lead him by aiming at his nose" kills with it as I have had "long range" kills. In the Virginia woods, an average shot is often under 100 yards, but I have killed many deer out in the pastures, hayfields, and clearings at further ranges. I'd love to test it out at ranges that really stretch its legs, but the opportunity hasn't appeared yet.

I never bothered to check the twist rate, but it loves 117/120 grain bullets and 75 grain bullets propelled by H4831. It shoots cloverleaves at 100 yards with those two weights. It was nothing special with 100-grain factory ammunition (like, 1.5"), so I never bothered to tinker with that bullet weight. The wannabe ballistician in me drools over the BC for the 120-grain bullets.

I'm also a big fan of the .257 Roberts. One of the sweetest shooting cartridges I have ever handled.

That's what I thought when you mentioned powder lot variance etc.

Strelok for me has been very good, as long as the entry data is valid, the standard "garbage in, garbage out" applies.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/19130506/1

Dave

Makes a good case for a modern single shot - a long barrel on it equals overall length of a bolt gun with a 22-24" barrel.

My .25-06 is a 26” Encore barrel in .25-06 AI.

I like the cartridge. As Mule Deer implied above, it’s the perfect happy medium between the .257 Robert’s and the .257 Weatherby Magnum.

Ah the 25-06... Love it.

The usual standard is a 22-24" 1:10 twist barrel. Mine is a factory Remington 24" 1:10 twist.

100's at 3340 fps
115's at 3100 - 3190 fps

First round "hold on hair" kills at 400 - 420 yards using a 300 yard zero. Mild recoil. It's my go to rifle for mule deer, pronghorn and coyotes.

I have considered a fast twist .257" barrel, 26" long and chambered for 25-06 AI, but... Dunno if I'll ever do that. Would be pretty cool to shoot the new high BC .257" bullets from it. Then again I could just build a 6.5-06. Who knows? At this point it's all just a bit of a game. The standard 25-06 works great.

Enjoy your project and put the money into a quality barrel that you will enjoy using.

Regards, Guy

I currently have 2 rifles chambered in 25-06, a 24" Remington 700 and a 22" Marlin XL7. Until I spent some time with the Marlin I thought that a 25-06 need a longer barrel, but the Marlin is only slightly slower than the Remington with the same load and not enough different to make a difference at ranges under a quarter mile. It has been a popular loaner and a couple of people who used it went on to seek out a Marlin XL7 of their own.

I have a 26" No5 contour SS fluted barrel with standard twist but did have a little extra leade added and fitted to a model 70 Blue Printed action.
It's one I don't play with much. Its best load generates a smidge over 3500fps using the 100gn TTSX.

I have a lot more time using various .257 Weatherby's going back to the 1970's.

For most of its life, it was topped with a 6.5-20 Leupold AO scope and for no reason, changed it out with a 3-9 VX2 where after sighting, it has assumed its previous position in the rear of my safe.

Some rifles are there just in case. This is one.

Had a Browning Abolt with a 22” barrel. Did just fine. Never chronographed it and never felt the need.

Exactamundo^^^



On a bolt gun, I'd run a 22" with no problems. A single shot, give me a 26". Again, no problem..

My first centerfire bolt action rifle was a Remington 700 BDL 25-06 sporter. It was very accurate, and I loved it. I shot many woodchucks and one whitetail buck with it. I had no problem getting 3,100+ fps with a 120 grain bullet. The one buck I killed with it dropped like a stone at 175 yards. My load was the old 120 grain Hornady hollow point bullet, long since discontinued.

Regarding your question, I think a 24" barrel is about right for this round. Good luck whichever barrel length you choose.

I'll also comment that prior to "affordable" chronographs for handloaders, relatively few handloading hunters obsessed over another 100 fps in velocity--or if they did, just believed what the loading manuals said their load achieved.

I bought my first light-screen chronograph in 1979, when I was living in Missoula, Montana and shooting at a local range. Chronographs were very rare back then, and on several occasions somebody else who was shooting there asked if they could take a few shots over it to test their load. Just about every time they got pissed-off, because the velocity didn't match their "estimate." Yet they'd been killing stuff with it for years.

Also, my fellow gun writer John Haviland had a similar experience with his first chronograph, purchased about the same time. (John's a year or two younger than I am.) At the time the 7mm Remington Magnum was THE super-round, and he loaded 160-grain Speer bullets with a load that according to their manual got around 3000 fps. Then he went out and killed a bunch of Montana big game with the rifle and load, from whitetails to black bears to elk, and it killed 'em quickly.

But when he finally chronographed the load, it got around 2700 fps--about like a warmly loaded 7x57. Of course, a warmly loaded 7x57 will kill such animals very well. I've done it myself in North America Africa on animals up to around 1000 pounds....

But apparently to some hunters a .25-06 won't be a "real" .25-06 unless it has a barrel longer than 22-24".

The people who I've seen most disappointed had had their rifles rechambered to an AI configuration and were often disappointed the the speed that they were sure that they were getting wasn't much more than it would have been in the pre-AI configuration.

My .25-06 got an average of 3350 fps with my load using a 100 grain Hornady flat base bullet out of a 24 inch barrel. The same load through my father-in-law's rifle got 3300 fps in his 22 inch barrel. I don't know how anyone could tell that little difference in the field.

Bosshoff: My "real" 25/06 Rifle has a 26" medium heavy barrel and it is a Deer and Antelope killing machine!
I say go for the extra length/mass/velocity with a 26" barrel.
Best of luck to you with whichever you choose.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

They can't.. which is why I like running the numbers through a ballistic program like Strelok to visualize the effect.

Once you realize that that 50-100 FPS delta translates into 30 or 40 yards difference in effective range, the shorter barrels don't seem like such a hindrance on performance at the normal distances the majority of game is taken.

For a couple of my long shooters I still have 24" barrels, but for the rifles I know will be used out of stands, blinds, still hunting and drives, I've gone to 20" or shorter.

I have a couple Remington 700 25-06's. I never wanted a shorter or a longer barrel or a faster or slower twist as far as that goes. As is, my favorite pronghorn rifle and as for me, great whitetail rifles.

An 80 Barnes TTSX is a laser beam at 3590 in a 22". Yes a longer barrel can make it go faster.

I get 3100 with 117's too.

It is already easy mode for deer and antelope.

My 1st year production 700 wears a Shilen 24" stainless #5 in 25-06. I've been a fan of the cartridge for many years and think it's a top choice when it comes to light recoil, trajectory and killing ability. A 24" barrel is my preference, but a 26" is also nice if the balance is to your liking.

Amuses me a fair bit to see discussion that debates the difference between a couple or three inches of barrel length. Likewise, the fascination for fast twist barrels cracks me up.

If it ain't broke it don't need fixin'. If you feel the need for speed you won't find happiness with a short barrel. High peak pressures are not your friend. -Hints-

My 25-06 is a Forbes 24 b at 5.75 pounds and a 24" mid-weight barrel. Rl 17 gets the 101 grain LRX (bc of .400) to 3336ft/sec into 0.75 MOA and the little bullet is death on caribou as far away as I want to shoot them with a 300 yard sight in. The 120 Speer BTSP (bc of .480) is going 3070 fps with RL25 with even better accuracy but I haven't found a pound of RL25 in the last 3 years!. I like the rifle/cartridge combo and while more velocity is always nice the 24" is about as long as i want in a rifle. Interesting that Mule Deer finds LESS velocity loss with the lighter bullets but that might explain my relatively faster lighter bullet loads.

I agree with the poster who mentioned that he liked being able to spot his own shots. Even in this light rifle I can spot impacts past 200 yards due to the light recoil and excellent stock design on the Forbes. If I ever do shoot it out I'll re-barrel with another 24 " barrel but it might sport a faster twist. Why not experiment with the new batch of super long, high b.c. bullets?

I like a .26 inch barrel on almost all long distance rifles. I have had 24's in the 25-06 but they never stayed long.

I have a good deal of experience with my model 700/ 25/06 on game and paper....24" tube.
I have to disagree with Muledeer over is position on the 25/06 comparatively.
I used this rifle exclusively for 8 years in the last century on Sheep, Goats, Deer, Elk and Moose and one Black Bear.
It also would shoot the ocassional bughole off the bench.
I have not owned the Weatherby but my limited experience with the Robert's prove disappointing.
The 25/06 rifle of mine is a confidence builder, most anyone can shoot it well. Translates to Big Game- Big Time with Nosler Partitions, imo.
I wouldn't use a repeating rifle with a longer barrel than 22" these days. The 25/06 needs at least 24.
In my humble opinion.

comerade,

We've used the .257 Roberts on the same basic array of big game here in Montana, with the exception of moose--and I would bet the same bullets we've used in the .257 on elk would work on moose. The .257 loads have been either 100-grain Barnes TSXs or Nosler Partitions at 3150-3250 fps from 24" barrels, or 115 and 120-grain Partitions at around 3000. The longest shot was on one of my biggest pronghorn bucks at around 450, and several of the other have been 300-350.

Might also mention that the .257 Weatherby has also worked extremely well at the same basic ranges on the same array of animals--again with a 24" barrel, with either 100 monolothics at 3550 or 120-grain Partitions at 3300.

All of which is why (as I have stated before in recent years) that the longer I hunt, the less difference I see in the field performance of different cartridges--especially when they're of the same, or similar, bore-size.

But whatever....

Thanks Muledeer

Have had Browning A bolt, Ruger 77 SS/LAM, 2 Rem 700's 1 a mtn contour at 22", and a Pre 64 Mdl 70 with a douglas barrel at 26" Medium HVY for Rock Chuchs to Mule Deer in Eastern OR. I need a longer LOP and like a well balanced rifle. I like my 25-06 barrels at 24" magnum sporter profile and straight flutes to make me look cooler:} with a 14.5 LOP They seem to balance out about right for me. RL19 is my favorite powder with 85-100gr pills within book specs.

YMMV

25-06

I thought I repond ( again) John.
Yeah, I agree the bullet construction and placement overrides cartridge case design.
We all have prejudices, myself, predudiced against Weatherby's( from my time as a Elk Guide) the .257 Robert's - my annoyance of the owner of one.
On the flip side, I have witnessed the 25/06 well anchor Bull Elk & Moose .
Primarily with the 120 Nosler Partition .
The .257 Robert's might of done as well, and perhaps the .257 Weatherby wouldn't of disappointed.
Life is like that.

Velocity seems to be a major component in perceived success. But, I have seen where a 257 Roberts and a 30-06 are capable of killing reliably over their perceived ability…