PTL - Just purchased a Mauser 98 G33/40 action! I've been waiting many years for this find, so now comes the build job.

First will be to blue print the action and send it off for heat treating.

Second, is to pick the barrel and this is where I need some suggestions. Thinking about a Shilen Chrome moly as it can be made a 1/2 pound lighter than a SS. With those having experience, can a #2 contour in a 24 inch barrel be as accurate as a #3 since Shots will be limited to 3 or less?

Third: The stock will be a McMillan Sako hunter because it has a larger drop in heel than their light weight stock. This can be considered a light weight stock though.

Fourth: Banded Front and rear iron sights from NEC.

Fifth: Talley one piece Aluminum rings and bases. Rifle scope will most likely be a Zeiss conquest fixed 4 power if the ocular bell clears the bolt handle or the leupold 6x42.

Matt

It's a free country, and obviuosly you can do what you wish ..

And bear in mind, I am half kidding around here-

but-

I am sure there is a special corner of hell reserved for folks that take classic VERY hard to find actions like g33/40s and stock them up in fiberglass(and probalby finish the metal in polymer or paint). Espeically with a Monte Carlo stock with a palm swell.

It is like making a candy apple red street rod out of a Rolls Royce. Or converting Supermarine Spitfire made into aerobatics plane..

A much better action for a modern Mauser build would truly be a Commercial Husqvarna Mauser. It's just as light and due to the Alumunium bottom metal and other features, they end themselves to a modern build.

I don't know what you paid for that G33/40 action, but by the time you factor in the all action work on the G33/40, what you could sell it for as is, you will probably wind up with a Husgvarna action for about $200 ready to barrel up and stock.

Plus, the Husky built lightweight Mauser will be just as valuable in the end, because you will negate the value of the G33/40 to 99% of the folks that even know what that action is, by putting it in a glass stock with a modern finish.

If you must build a modern sythntheic stocked lightweight from that action, carry on- I wish you well. It just pains me to see an action so idealy suited for a high end, classic wood stocked rifle used in a project like that when there are equally good alternative actions..

Matt-it's been a long week and I'm hitting the rack but I've carried my G33/40 for about 2 decades now. I've always had it in a fine piece of African Walnut (Brown Precision.

I'll address this tmrw. IMO you've got the finest action ever made, it'll make you one heck of a pure plain hunt rig!

Dober

IMHO you should go english walnut for a mauser! There are many options with modern finishes. Good luck with the build!

...and if there is not, there should be.

For those that can't afford a really classy piece of walnut ( such as myself )...I see no problem at all with a good fiberglass stock. A glass stock just plain works. I know of 2 fellows both of whom have more $$ than myself who had what were essentially classic rifles built and carried to Africa multiple times. One rifle was a .375 H and H, the other a 9.3x62. 1st was on a FN Mauser and the 2nd on a Pre '64 Winchester. Both rifles were set up in glass stocks before glass became a common item. Both rifles are scratched, paint worn and the metal work is gray. They both still work. I see no problem with your G 33/40 in a glass stock. Dave

On the other hand, I'm always rather mystified by the folks who won't hunt with nice walnut-stocked rifles because they might get scratched. They use synthetic stocks because they aren't afraid to scratch them.

On one level this makes sense, because a synthetic stock that gets scratched can always be fixed (if you're the sort of person who wants to fix 'em) with a can of Krylon. But the fact is that a nice walnut stock that gets scratched still looks better than any brand-new synthetic stock ever made.

It's your action, do what you want.

Personally, I think all the oohing and aahing over G33/40 actions is a little comical.

To each his own.

I have read about the G33/40 action, but I know nothing about it.

What makes it more desirable that any other 98?

It's basically a 98 Mauser action that had some lightening machine work done, making it maybe 3 ounces lighter than a standard 98.

Back in the day when the standard "custom" rifle was built on a 98 or pre-'64 Model 70 and a walnut stock, G33/40's were in a little bit of demand because they were were the lightest "classic" action obtainable.

Since then dozens of lighter-weight bolt-actions have been developed, but for some the mystique of the G33/40 lives on, to the point where some will spend several hundred dollars for an action.

Of course though, that (the spending of several hundred dollars 4 an action) could be said about quite a few rigs out there could it not?

Dober

Yeah, but with G33/40's these days, that several hundred dollars is before turning into a sporter action!

Glad I bought mine early on...grin

Dober

That was the best time!

I can remember when you could get about any 98 military rifle with a desirable action for under $100, and often much less.

So, what's people been seeing G33's actually moving for this year? I'd think...that one could still get a clean one for sub 1K?

Dober

That'd be a about right. I was with a guy who paid $800 for a complete G33/40 rifle that was in good but not pristine shape maybe 3 years ago at Capital Sports. But you might be able to get a good action for a little less.

At that point, though, I'd be looking at a beater 77 Mark II real closely....

Hey Eldorado,do what ever trips your trigger. Personally I think synthetic makes a lot of sense for durability.I do like the feel and look of wood aesthetically.

It was just a few months ago when I saw a sporterized G33/40 at one of my favorite shops with an asking price of $600 and it didn't last long. I'd rather have a Husqvarna action for $300-400 for a lightweight Mauser type rifle which is what I'll do if I ever get around to another project. And it will have a synthetic stock.

About three years ago I paid $800 for a G33/40 that had been cleanly sporterized, apparently in the 60's as evidenced by the stock design. I bought it for the action. It seemed a bit extravagant, but I had decided I wanted a nice 6.5 x 55 built on that action before I died, and the birthdays were adding up. Roger Biesen recently turned it into a beauty for me.

Ain't that the truth........some 35 years ago I was young and broke, but wanted a "real" deer rifle. Not a brush gun (of which I had several) but a bolt action sporter in an all-around caliber.

Went to a local gunsmith and asked if he had any old bolt actions I could turn into a sporter (I was young enough I had NO idea what I was getting into). He told me to look in the back room as he had a "few barrels" full of old rifle actions he used for parts.

He wasn't kidding.....there were three or four barrels with various actions stuffed inside. I went through a pile of Mauser 94's, 95's and 96's and a LOT of '98's as well as several dozen 1903's, 1917's and various Enfields. I finally came across an FN '98 Mauser made in "Herstal Belgique".....with barrel included.

He and I both assumed it was an 8mm, but the hole in the barrel didn't look right so we tried various go-no go gauges and detirmined it was barreled in .30-06 (which happened to be the caliber I wanted anyway.

When I asked "how much" he told me to give him $15 and call it even. Can you imagine that today??

Under his watchfull eyes I learned how to contour the action, drill and tap, cut-off and re-weld a sporter bolt and install a scope-friendly safety. He also had a pile of walnut boards which I went through and picked one I liked (for $10)......which he taught me how to shape and inlet (not an easy job for an inexperienced "gunsmith"). I still wanted to pull the barrel and replace it with a "proper" barrel, but he convinced me to shoot it first.

WOW!!! it would keep 5 shots in a half-inch if I did my job......I never replaced it as I was afraid I'd never get back to that accuracy again.

Over the years I've slightly modified it and made it look a bit "pretty" (he also taught me the art of checkering as well as how to install a ebony tip ). That rifle has been my main hunting rifle for 35 years and even though I have owned some 200-300 different rifles over the years is still the "go-to" gun in my safe.

How I wish the days could return when you could buy a barreled action for $15.....a walnut blank for $10 more......and with sweat and "instruction" turn it into a piece of art.

When I read how you can't "ecognomically" turn a military action ito a proper sporter....I laugh. You MIGHT be able to buy a commercial action cheaper and you MIGHT be able to do things to it cheaper, but you will never be able to replace the pride or ownership and experience gained by turning a "cheap" military rifle into your dreams.

That rifle led me into a 30+year carrer as a "gunsmith". If I were to happen upon a young shooter who was willing to listen and learn, I'd gladly teach him what I learned under the eye of an "old-time" gunsmith who knew you don't "have" to have fancy equiptment or "magic" materials.

You'd be amazed at what can be done with files and hand tools.....with a LOT of sweat and work.....and end up with a rifle you can't buy for love nor money.

Even today.....when prices are higher (no more $15 barreled actions) there is nothing like the pride and experience gained from doing it yourself.

so all the hoopla over the g33/40 is 3 oz,?!?!??! 3 freaking ounces???? are you kidding me??? that proves it right there gun people are loonies.

I think building on any mauser is crazy especially these days, just go buy a brand new winchester or even a ruger, it has all the features the mauser has and then some, 3 pos safety, hinging bottom metal, more scope mount options.

the dirty secret about alot of customs is they don't shoot as good as factory rifles in alot of cases but no one on the internet will tell you that. after 3 customs and thousands of $$$$ spent on them, I am done. I will just buy a factory rifle and if doesn't shoot buy another one, till I find one that shoots to my standards. It will be alot cheaper in the end.

Not ragging on you......but just how old are you???

None of the "modern" actions can compare to a good example of the '98 Mauser. Paul Mauser perfected the bolt action rifle in 1898.......everything else has been a step backwards, except maybe in cost of manufacturing.

Guessing this sort of argument isn't as common these days, in places where one is limited to what can be legally owned and hunted with?

Lucky fer us, we can still haggle over the sanity of squandering thousands on customs. Or just thumpin' big game with off the shelf rifles, most of which are far more accurate than those which were offered years ago.

I like all kinds of rifle stocks, but there's just something special about a nice piece of walnut with good checkering, done right they can be a thing of beauty and grace. I have such a rifle and I do not baby it. I have had it re-finished once to remove dents and scratches, but I don't think I do that again. Some of those dings had memories associated with them. I find as I age how I do a thing and who and what I do that thing with is more important than simple out comes.

yeah, back when Lugers were $39 on the back page of the Rifleman. If only we'd have knowed.

Truth told. This has the makings of a signature line.

funny that I see most people building mausers with the features that winchesters already have. why reheat treat a mauser, drill and tap it, bend the bolt handle, find suitable bottom metal, add a 3 POS safety, when a winchster has all this done, has CRF and all good features of the mauser without modification. the action will not be a sloppy rode hard military action. different strokes for different folks I guess.

Taking that quote litterally, all I have to say is ..

Horseapples.

The 3 position safety, trigger design and cocking cam on the Winchester m70 are an improvement over the military m98 action for any sporting use.

The Remington m700 reciever layout is an improvment in pure accuracy. It's not even debateable. Benchrest shooters a lot older than you (as in long dead and gone) settled that issue in the 1950s and 60s.

You can love, revere and idolize the m98 all you want, but it still does not make it superior to every turnbolt repeater that has come after it.

Two things I find really amazing is just how good the Mausers are and how good the pre 64/70's are. And then to think how much older they are and how far ahead those designs were b4 there time amazes me as well.

I'd be for betting that in this world, and in this market that one could find (with some searching) a decent G33/40 for $700-$800. It may take a while but I bet it could be done.

By my way of thinking, the best running rigs I've ever been around (taking into account, how they feel when worked, how they feed, and good things like that) have been by far good Mausers and the Pre 64/70's. The only rigs I've been around that come even close to these are one of Tom Burgess works of art around a Enfield. A couple friends of mine had Tom build them 416 Rigby's and they were totally incredible. Of course, so was the price at 5K plus over a decade ago (for the barreled action)...

D'Arcy's Legend, and Millers Marksmen and Simillions rigs come to mind as well and are super stars as well but then the price is as well..and way above my pay grade!

Nope for me I like the Pre 64/70 with a lightish barrel and or the G33/40 with a lightish. While I appreciate a nice stick of wood, the cost of what I would call a stick of wood worthy to be toted around is rather prohibitive as is the cost of having a sharp smith do his magic on it to turn it into something decent.

Plus, I prefer "African Walnut" (fiberglass) cause it's tougher, holds zero better, and gives me a nice weight forward feel that I love. I want the weight out front not towards the rear.

As to the weight savings, I don't have any want/need and or desire to have the lightest rig. 4 me...something that is over 7.5 lbs and no more than 8 lbs all up (scope, rounds, sling) and with a tube .6" to .62" at the mzl is just right for me.

Bottom line, I feel I can take 2K and have any # of decent smiths do their magic on it (using a pre64/70 or a G33) and have what I feel is the finest working rifles going. They feel great when I run them (and to me that's important with the tiny artistic side that I have), they're tough, work well, feed incredibly well and so on and so on.

What's gonna compete with that 4 me?

A 700 in a piece of African walnut works (I've hunted my old Mashburn 700 very hard and am my 8th tube and about ready for the 9th so I sort of have some experience with this) but it feels like a shovel when running it. but it is cost effective and it works!

How about a Montana, once again it feels like a Shovel Plus P (a bit too much of a Mattel feel to me), and it's barrel at best is a crap shoot...

How about a NULA for $3500 or whatever, once again it feels like a shovel Plus P when I run it (which by my way of thiniing means it works, may feed well enough but doesn't feel very good to me while running it, just utilitarian).
Now I'm not saying it doesn't run and feed, I'm just saying that for me I don't like how it feels too much like a 700 4 me to really likey. The bolt handle is tiny and feels like a raisen to me and the idea of having a Douglas barrel on a high end semi custom kind of gags me as well. And yeah I get it that they do have some Douglas tubes that shoot well and last, I also get it that the vast majority of the NULA customers aren't running them very hard hence their standards are a bit, dare I say low...ouch I know roast me for that one but I find it a lot like Wby owners and many of them.

Bottom line, we need to use what we want. People try hard to make this crapola rocket science and yet we'd never dare to try and pick out the perfecto woman for one another..

Use what works for you, I could really care less. I only care and hope that you actually get out there and use it!

Have a super day and get to the hill and fill up an ark or two..

Dober

Sounds like your choices in 'smiths, sucks.

Nahhh . . . .

He is just gonna buy a Savage . . . . . .

BMT

To paraphrase the oft spoken quote about Harley Davidson :

"If I have to explain, you wouldn't understand anyway!"

but then, I'm nearing the end of my 6th decade on this here Earth.... Likely I come from a different generation than you... (No offense meant)

GH

Alright Men:

I got the G33/40 as a complete rifle with a beautiful wood stock (too short for me and not enough drop in heel) in caliber 6.5-06. I forgot the action was already blueprinted, and if I remember correctly the G33/40 does not need heat treating as some of the 98K's do, however that will be double checked. It has only been fired a few times and an accurate load has not been determined yet. It is blued very nicely.

The price was $600.00. Some people say that the tulsa area has a gunsmith on every corner. Our gun shows are so awesome.

I bought it from one of my gunsmiths who just refuses to charge high prices. I previewed before opening the day before and found it. He does work for some of the better known gunsmiths
out of his home shop. He especially likes the 280 Akley improved
which I would choose, but times are getting tough, don't reload, so I'm going for standard calibers.

Anyway. My question is still not answered. Can a #2 contour in 270 be plenty accurate in a 24 inch barrel or should I go for a #3 contour. Since this is for hunting, can't see shooting more than two or three shots at a time.

Matt

Matt: OK I'll go out on a limb and say "yes",a #2 should be fine. I have had quite a few 270 barrels of #1 contour(mostly Krieger),along with M70 FW contours(factory and Douglas)that easily stayed under an inch,and some substantially better than that.Several would cluster shots.

Also had #2's chambered for 7RM that shot very tight groups as well. I think you will be fine with a #2.Personally,unless it was intended for varmints,I wouldn't want a barrel any heavier than a #2 on a 270 for hunting.

Eldorado.....you are on the right track.

Naysayers, if you don't like the G33/40.....then buy a Brno Model 21 and have the whole kit and caboodle at once.

...or you can go to the next tupperware meeting and bitch at the other women, for God knows that you do not deserve the pleasure of owning fine equipment.

I agree with this....damn near, just about,every single word.Not that it matters a whit.....

I have heard tell of those Enfields by Burgess but never had the pleasure of running one of them.But I did have a 300 Win Mag on a 1909 Argentine built by Burgess with stock by Maurice Ottmar....first time I ran it with a full magazine and chambered round number two,I thought the bolt overrode the next cartridge,so I opened the bolt expecting an empty chamber....no chance...it was "hot"...not many metal guys like Burgess....

I held a G33/40 last week that was a work of art, can't fault anyone for going that way if they want. I would have bought that rifle for 6 bills in a heart beat, stock length be damn.

I just shipped a HVA smll ring to CAS to be laid into a McMillan Sako Hunter pattern with edge. For cheap the HVA has a whole lot to offer with much of the work already done to it. However $600 for you got is a screaming deal. For what it's worth I've been picking up the HVA for ~$300 for barreled action.

I would have no trouble with a #2 in .270. Also thought that the weight savings of a G33/40 was close to 8 oz. over a standard large ring? Is that not right, 3 doesn't seem like enough.

Cummins you are about half right and half off base IMHO of course...

.....first off the Hoopla was because back "when",there were no actions that were CRF and as light as a G33/40,and it was the darling of the custom rifle trade,and many Mausers were used to build rifles..Things have changed and maybe for the better,and maybe not.

Yes, you can have some of the features of a Mauser in a M70(which is more like a Springfield/Mauser hybrid).And of course it depends on "which" M70 you're discussing. FYI the Mauser,not the M70,had the original 3 position safety(it just swung up over the top instead of on the side;or on top of the cocking piece in the pre war M70. The Ruger is only superficially a Mauser derivative.

If you think a M70 of any vintage,or a Ruger has "more features"than a Mauser 98,well...you're wrong. Please go read a few books because I don't have time to explain them all to you.....

Yes it is easier to build on a M70 because there is less work involved in the action....but you can build on a million M70's and you still won't have all the features of a Mauser.But for guys that know the differences, it may be important to them,which is why they do it.

As for the "dirty secret" about customs not shooting better than factory rifles,it depends on who is building them.....and "which" factory rifle you are comparing them to....all I can say is I suspect you have been seriously hosed by cutom smiths a few times if you believe that.

I also might add that the sole function of a rifle is not to just shoot tiny groups...but that fact is lost on many today,as evidenced by some of the incredible crap out there called "good" by some because they will bug hole a few times over sandbags at 100 yards.....big friggin' deal....

If they came out with all the features of a Mauser 98,today,brand new,in say titanium,at an affordable price,the minions would beall over them like a cheap suit....unfortunately this will never happen,bevause like Texas Rick says,most of the "improvements" we have seen in rifle building were concessions made to make them cheaper,and not necessarily "better".

There, I feel better now.....

Matt:

I agree with Bob on the barrels. Like him, I use either a #1 or #2 taper on my hunting rifles. All shoot sub-MOA and most are well under that. Several of the best shooting rifles that my two offspring and I own are built on Mauser actions. The most accurate hunting rifle I own is built on a FN action with a #2 Brux barrel. To answer your question as to a #2 barrel in 270 working on a Mauser action, you bet. My son has a military Mauser action with a #1 contour barrel that is sub-MOA by a good margin. Just this week I shot one for the first time that I bought here a while back that was put together on a FN Mauser action with a 25-inch #2 Shelin SS barrel housed in one of Dober's African walnut stocks and it touched bullet holes at 100 yards.

I really like the 700 action, but a Mauser put together by a competent gunsmith is as fine a rifle as you can go own. One put together by a hack is just that, a hack job. And when that happens, the make of the action is really a moot point.

Bob,
Very, very well said!

Jesus Bob.....I like your attitude.

Thanks for the post, Bob.

I was going to write a medium-long post, listing and describing the advantages the 98 Mauser has over every other bolt-action invented since for our friend cumminscowboy. But your advice for him to actually do some reading, and thus fill in the enormous gaps in his knowledge, is much better.

As I have pointed out before on this forum, there are many who log on here whose knowledge of rifles and firearms history goes back no further than when they started to shoot--and apparently some started to shoot around Y2K.

Excellent, Bob! I am very reluctant to come on here and pretend that I have the way, the truth, and the light. It is great that we can all make our own choices. As for me, I am delighted and feel very lucky to have two rifles on G33/40 actions, and with nice wood to boot.

I have owned mausers and read about them so the model 70 doesn't have a 3rd lug and it doesn't handle gas as well. I am missing other features?? the mauser will have inferior metallurgy in alot of cases, its not drilled and tapped, it will most likely have a sloppy feeling bolt, unless its a commercial action like a husky or FN. it doesn't come with decent bottom metal already in most cases. the safety will have to be altered, to the style the model 70 already has. the bolt will have to be bent or rewelded and replaced. its not 1950 anymore a mauser is not $10 bucks, its several hundred now, and better hunting rifles have been produced since.

so with all that said, when it comes to a hunting rifle that is functional makes some since at building, seems to be most people are trying to imitate the features the model 70 already has. so if a 3rd lug and better gas handling is more important to you than, having to reweld the bolt, drill and tap it, reheat treat it, find bottom metal, change the safety, I suppose one should go with the mauser.

That was gracious of you trucker.....now explain to me why anyone would even want to heat-treat a G33/40?

I consider the G33-40 the ultimate rifle action for any standard 06 length caliber, short of a Brno mod. 21 or 22, and the Brnos are many times more expensive to convert.

To start with the G33-40 is a small ring action and that slims up the gun and cuts down on weight, they turn out lean and mean..Also its one Mauser that does not need to be heat treated, its good to good as is...

I cannot imagine a nicer rifle than a G33-40 in 7x57 in a manlicher or short forend African style stock of high grade Circasian walnut, however I am of the opinnion that putting a G33-40 into a plastic stock is akin to Sodomy or incest! ...

About everything else has been covered in the above posts.

I have never felt the need to convert my 7x57 1949 Model 21 to anything, thank you.

And I am well aware of the attributes of the G33/40.....so you may stop preaching to the choir.

Cummins I completely get where you are coming from...I love the old M70 as it is one of the great actions but has some faults beyond the conveniences that it affords for a contemporary sporting rifle action.It is true that it has some advantages over a Mauser for building a sporetr but that doe snot keep it from being in some ways inferior.

Yes there are more differences than you state.There are many on here who know Mausers better than I(JB included) but I will try to explain some more:

There is the guide rib on the bolt body, which fits into a corresponding groove in the inside of the receiver bridge to ease operation.

There is a tongue, or hook,at the head of the extractor which fits a corresponding groove around the head of the bolt.Its' function is, that in the event of a stuck, oversized or dirty case,the harder one pulls on the bolt, the tighter this tongue grips the groove.This prevents the extractor from pulling over the case head;at the same time(part of the SYSTEM), the wide bite of the extractor keeps it from pulling through the soft rim of the case(hopefully),leaving a stuck case in the chamber.In a Model &0,the tension exerted on the rim is entirely dependant on the spring steel extractor without support like the Mauser provides(see above),so a M70 could, theoretically,"jump" the case rim and leave a fired case stuck in the chamber.We know the M70 certainly works well enough under tough conditions but it can be argued the Mauser system is superior.

The M70 relies for ejection on a pivoting arm (ejector blade)which rises up into a slot located on the underside of the bolt from a tiny spring.If that slot gets dirty, gummy, frozen,that tiny spring can fail to force the ejector blade up and when the bolt is withdrawn quickly COULD leave you with a case sitting on the bolt face.You push forward, stripping another cartridge and you have a jam.This is not good.The Mauser, OTOH,has an ejector blade that pivots into a recess, but relies only on this pivoting action(don't know how to explain this)to force the ejector into the slot to kick the case out.Again maybe a bit more reliable under really tough dirty conditions.

On the M70, there is a small projection on the underside of the cocking piece which bears against the camming surfaces of the bolt body.My gunsmith has a box full of these that snapped off of M70's used in highpower matches.It takes much use and abuse for this to happen but it does occur now and then.

The plunger to dissassemble the bolt is likely a better, tougher design than the M70...I had a finely polished and honed action on a Griffin and Howe 338 built on a pre 64 action;it had been so finely tuned that the side wall of the cocking piece gave out and the whole plunger unit came out, tiny spring and all. The plunger arrangement on the Mause is far more robust.

The sloppy bolt travel on the Mauser is intentional;made that way on purpose so that fine grit,ands, snow and ice will not prevent bolt manipulation,at least in theory.Lets say it has to get really bad for a Mauser to quit. I have had the M70 keep trucking under conditions that seized up other actions on two companions at the same time.So the M70 is no slouch here, but I suspect a Mauser will hndle more dirt and grime and keep trucking,mostly because the M70 bolt travel is just tighter.

The original military Mauser trigger is double stage rugged, simple,and superb, utter simplicity,as is the M70,which is single stage.Both require the removal of minimal wood to function well and neither require the removal of the amount of wood that an aftermarket trigger does,making for a stronger stock in that area.This may not be as important with synthetics as it was when both these actions were designed....I often think that the ultimate BG stopping rifle should have the Mauser military trigger because it is so rock-stupid simple and reliable.

On the Mauser,nside the bolt body is a groove through which fits the head of the firing pin;unless the rifle is in full battery,with the bolt handle fully down, this arrangment prevents the firing pin from moving forward,which means no weak strike of firing pin on primer.To my knowledge a M70 has no similar arrangement.I have a friend who last fall fired at a buck with his Rem 700 while the bolt handle was partially raised....a weak tap and no ignition...hence, no buck...shidt happens.....

Then there is the breaching system which encloses more of the case hed within the barrel than even the vaunted and innovative Rem 700......we KNOW the Mauser beats the M70 hands down in that department....,things are what they are.....

There are no doubt other things I forgot or never knew.....

I guess some Mausers need heat treatment...so be it,a labor and cost of love;and yes they need a lot of coddling and expense to make them first class sporting rifles.But the superb design is there,really unequalled in sporting arms.And when I think of Mausers(and pre war M70's and Mannlicher Shoenauers(sp)for that matter) I think of craftsmen in greasy aprons with tiny tools paying great attention to small details who had to apprentice for years before they were allowed to touch them and work on them......

OTOH when I think of some of todays sporting rifles I think of Harvard B-Scool grads and efficiency experts brought on board to figure ways to make them cheaper.....because they learned in school they will sell to schmucks....and what the hell do we know.....

Thnaks to JB an all others for the kind comments

We are here to exchange info and ideas.

You covered it quite well, Bob.

I would like to make some further comments:

The M70 safety is merely a variation on the 98's, with the safety working horizontally rather than vertically. There are some people who don't feel the Model 70 safety is the answer to everything, despite the very long push needed to go from safe-and-locked to fire. Yes, the M70's safety can be pushed to the middle position, where it's easier to work quickly, but then there's the risk of the rifle not firing if the bolt handle isn't fully down. The 98, on the other hand, can easily (and cheaply) be fitted with a vertical safety that works under a scope that merely requires one simple, downward movement to go from locked to fire.

The military form of Mauser bottom metal is one-piece and absolutely reliable, one reason some people prefer it to any hinged floorplate even on sporters. My own .338 is built on an FN action with their civilizan version of the 98 floorplate, and I deliberately did NOT replace it--but did replace the FN trigger with a 98 military trigger converted to single-stage. This cost about 10 bucks.

Essentially both the safety and bottom metal are cosmetic differences between the 98 and M70. Bolt handles and drilling and tapping are cheap and easy to do, and don't even have to be done on commercial 98's.

In finishing I must also point out that some people, including Jeff Cooper and even me, don't think all that much of the vaunted Model 70 safety. Jeff preferred the safety on the 1917 Enfield, since it was much easier to operate and didn't stick out nearly as far as the Model 70 safety. And yes, it also held back the firing pin--as does the CZ 550 safety, which is very similar to 1917's.

Yet people who have been brainwashed about Model 70 safeties go to great expense to replace the very fine CZ and 1917 safeties with Model 70 safeties, which to me is yet another piece of evidence that most shooters don't really understand how rifles function, and instead blindly follow whatever cult is popular.

Couldn't agree more about the drawbacks of the M70 safety or the benefits of the 1917 safety.

I don;t really agree that cults and brainwashing are the reasons people convert CZ's and 98's to Model 70 type safeties.

Could it be that they prefer or are familiar to the feel and look?, and understand rifle function just fine?

Are you sure that is true?

I would like to hear specifics in defense of that statement.

If it wasn�t for the �requirement� of a scope would half or even all of the things done to a military Mauser need to be done to convert it to a sporter?

A fellow at the range a few weeks ago had a sporterized K98. All that had really been done was to take off the handguard and shape the forend to more of an African or British style. Whoever did it did a very nice job as it was a graceful and slender thing, he even left the barrel band in place. I think the rear sight was removed or replaced but don�t really remember. The caliber was the original 8X57.

My friend Bill bought one of the K-98�s my father brought back from WWII. The stock had been broken on that one at the pistol grip when the German soldier surrendered. All Bill did was buy a replacement Fajen stock and then went out and used it.

I know scopes are de rigueur these days, but I think a stock military Mauser of whatever variety with a good peep would still work about as well as anything for a practical hunting rifle. Without scope and mounts you could keep the weight down and the sighting system would not have handicapped me at the ranges and times of day I�ve taken all my game.

Bob and JB, thank you for taking the time to write that explanation.

bob, thanks for educating me that was cool. but what you described to me is a superior battle/military rifle. I have never had a stuck case in any gun provided the gun was fired with a load that was in the right pressure range. I don't stick muddy or dirty ammo in any of my hunting rifles. I clean my guns so the spring on the ejector is not gummed up. all the benefits the mauser has is oriented toward working in battle and under those conditions. for a guy that has spent several thousand $$$ on a custom mauser, will he ever stick dirty ammo in it, we he drop it in the mud and then without cleaning it go shoot it. will he maintain it so terrible that the ejector spring gums up?? we he shoot it so much the superior stronger cocking piece is needed to keep from braking? I think we all can say no on all counts, and that the real benfits of the mauser is when the gun is abused, neglected, and has to keep firing in battle conditions. none of these conditions happen to a expensive walnut stocked, converted, thousands spent on the rifle mauser.

Here's one that has (as far as I can tell) most of the original features Mauser designed into it and it seems to have worked okay for the owner for several years.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...2637106/1/Osa_Johnson_s_Oberndorf_Mauser

I was cheating a bit there as most people really don't subject their rifles to the kinds of hunting conditions that a lot of people put up with for a long time.

They take them out of the case, maybe pack them in for a couple of weeks at a time on a really long hunt, then bring them back out. No one except possibly Alaskan guide types really have to keep their rifles out in the mud and blood for weeks and weeks at a time.

At every gunshow I still look for that table with all of the left hand Mauser 98's. Maybe someday...

What about someone who prefers a 98 over anything else, and has no logical explanation as to why other than that is what I want?

Sure, it would be expensive at today's prices to install a M70 type safety, new trigger, drill and tap, bend bolt, but so what, if that is what you want and can afford it?

Cummins you and jim In Idaho hit the nail squarely on the head and many of us don't subject a rifle to a lot of field abuse;and we cann hunt a lifetime and not have to operate a bolt fast enough,or depnd on a rifle to keep a Cape Buffalo or Brown Bear off our belt buckle,so lots of systems and actions work just fine for us....but then again,many do hunt frozen, wet,nasty conditions,trudge through sandy desert, drop rifles in dirt or otherwise end up in conditions that can shut a rifle down.

Here in the big woods of Maine I watched an afternoon and evening of trudging through deep snow and freezing temps shut down two rifle so that neither one would fire...at all.They were not Mausers.

Some, being aware of this might figure that the cost is worth it to have the most rugged design they can find;and make no mistake that a lot of experienced traveling trophy hunters world wide depended on fine wood stocked custom rifles in decades past, simply because those rifles represented the best technology available at the time...Warren Page and Bob Hagel hunted far and wide with wood stocked 7 Mashburns,both built on FN Supreme Mauser 98's,Page's built from the ground up by Mashburn Arms...there are many other examples from years past.Even Eleanor O'Connor hunted the world with a little 7x57 on a small ring Mauser stocked by Russ Leonard.So some of these rifle stook a lot of travel and abuse even though they are by todays standarsd high end wood stocked cutoms.



Jim62,others may explain it better than I but the way I understand it the publicized "3 Rings of Steel" of the M700 requires that the head of the cartridge protrude further from the barrel in order to allow enough room for the nose of the bolt to fully encircle the case head,and the extractor to engage the rim of the case.And adequate clearance has to be built in to allow the system to function.

This condition does not exist with the Mauser,and more of the case is supported by the barrel with the Mauser,with the extractor still able to engage the rim of the case for extraction.

I was told this a long time ago by a riflesmith in our area, and have seen the same thing in print several times since.Sorry I cannot supply exact dimensions on this.

Maybe Greydog or another of the Mauser experts on here can explain it better

NO one,
I only convert the Mod.21 and 22s that have bad barrels or trashed stocks, whatever..otherwise I agree they are as good as it gets right out of the box! but if you find a junker you found a pot of gold..

Thanks everyone:

#2 contour it is.

There is a new heated resin bath treatment for wood that completely seals it. Supposedly. What it would do to the beauty of wood I don't know. I may look into this as a local gsmith does it and is currently cerokoting my colt .45. Some wood stocks are as light as many synthetic stocks. My purpose is to have a reliable stock, able to hunt in snow and wet weather over several days. If this is doable in wood, great.

My understanding in mauser actions the best metal production occurred between about 1948 thru 1959 in the Obendorf factory
and BRNO in Checkoslavakia. With the Model 21 & 22 being the epitome.

The winchester pre-64 also had similar metal but suffered from
not having the gas porting of the mausers. It can be corrected though.

Model 2000 and 3000's were slightly altered from the original mauser design. I am not an expert so can not explain what those differences are. This is not in reference to the weight of the action and components.

regards: Matt

That would be Oberndorf 1937, as they stripped that factory after the war....and VZ24 or G33 or G33/40 of any era.

Model 21 and 22 from '46 to 55, being round top to '48 and dual dovetails from '49 to '55, with the last of these having the round ZG47 bolt handle.....and if you are extraordinarily lucky, the ZG47 safety as well.

If you can find the later variant.....feel free to do away with the owner and steal the rifle.....as even God would forgive and understand such an act of avarice.

I hear ya, loud and clear. And, my FN Sporter is almost as old.

Ted

Very interesting discussions. This brings up a question I've been curious about for some time. How does the intermediate length Mexican small ring 98 action compare to the 33/40 as the basis of a lightweight custom build? I assume the weights would be similar, but what about the other issues involved?

The weights are pretty similar, but sometimes the Mexican actions need heat-treating. On the other hand, sometimes the bottom metal is pretty good-looking, without the extra set-screw holes found on many military 98's, and can be really cleaned up to look nice.

Of course, the magazine is also shorter than in a standard 98, since the Mexican actions were designed for the 7x57. And often the actions aren't as nicely machined as some other actions. I once made up a .257 Roberts on a small-ring Mexican action, thinking that would be a snap since the .257 is the 7x57 necked down and would feed perfectly. But the action wouldn't even feed 7x57's! It took some extra work just to get it to feed right.

That's interesting, John. I have a nice Mexican sporter that has been rebarreled to 243 Win and I am seriously considering putting it back to a 7X57 or, maybe, a Bob. Given the typical smoothness of operation of the normal 98, I never would have suspected that feeding problems would occur when using the case for which it was designed.

Concerning the potential need for a re-heat treatment, I suppose there is no way to ascertain it's need without sending it to a specialist....correct?

Yeah, I never would have guessed that a military 98 wouldn't feed the round it was designed for! You might try a 7x57 round in yours just to see. It might have had some work done to it to feed the .243.

There are a quite a few competent gunsmiths who can test your 98 for possible heat-treating. When I was fooling around with military 98's a lot I used the late Dave Gentry, who knew about as much about 98's as anybody around, but there are others. You might try Dennis Olsen in Plains, Montana.

Thanks for the info, John.

My great uncle died and left me a 3/4 full 55 gallon barrel full of Mauser actions and Mauser barreled actions. I haven't sorted thru them all but I know he ordered them way back when and I wouldn't be suprised if he paid $5 or less per action and probably ordered all at one time.

FYI if you need to move a 3/4 55 gallon barrel full of Mauser actions take your forklift, makes it much easier.

EDIT - No none of them are for sale currently. Some are not salvagable. Some will be built into guns by me/for me, the rest will stay as my inheritance from my uncle.

jim62,

There is an excellent discussion about breeching of various bolt actions in Stuart Otteson's book "The Bolt Action." In regard to the Mauser, here is what he says:

"Only about 30% of the case head protruding from the chamber is shrouded or encircled by the M98 bolt-head rim. This sound pretty inefficient, particularly considering that newer systems like the latest Winchester and Remington types encircle a much greater percentage.

On the positive side, however, the cartridge seats deep in the M98 chamber, all but the last .105 in. This seating depth in itself, regardless of encirclement detail, makes the Mauser strong. most later and supposedly more advanced systems with their full and deep counterbored bolt heads also leave the cartridge head exposed .025 to .050 in. more from the chamber mouth than does the M98. This is not criticism of modern breeching techniques, which can be quite effective, but puts things in perspective. The Mauser breech was a carefully engineered system, particularly considering the emphasis required on feed, extraction, and ejection in designing for military use."


cumminscowboy

While your comments about the military Mauser are true, commercial Mausers such as the FN answer many of your criticisms about the bolt handle, drilling and tapping for scope sights, and trigger. I would classify these criticisms as being about the cost-effectiveness of converting a military action rather than of the desirability of the Mauser action in and of itself. Sort of like criticizing the fellow who just bought a Purdey double shotgun when he could have gotten a Stevens 311 for a lot less money.

Perhaps the finest commercial large ring Mauser type according to both Jack O'Connor and renowned gunsmith Tom Burgess, was the Brno ZG-47, which had a bolt handle modified for scope use, a good scope-ready safety, adjustable single stage trigger, hinged floorplate and integral dovetail bases for scope mounts while retaining the good points of the original Mauser design such as the superior gas handling, feeding, extraction and ejection. All with very fine workmanship and metallurgy, made when old world craftsmanship had real meaning and wasn't just a marketing slogan. I recently picked one up in 30-06, in very good to excellent condition for little more than a new deluxe M70, that I would take over any Winchester M70 or Ruger.

A close second, or first depending on the application, is Brno 21/22 series which may be the best small-ring commercial action ever built. Mine in 7x57 feeds empty cases without a hitch.

Does it feed full cases upside down under water? Just kidding, good post and good info on these action types fellas.
Have a great day.

378Canuck
"A close second, or first depending on the application, is Brno 21/22 series which may be the best small-ring commercial action ever built. Mine in 7x57 feeds empty cases without a hitch."

I just picked up a Mark X in 25-06 that feeds empty cases slick as can be. I also have a Bishop 10 with a Mark X action that feeds .338 WM empties pretty well. My Mexican Mausers feed 250 SAV and .308s as well. --- Mel

I've never tried feeding empties in my Mark V but I don't think a push feeder would do such a good job. But still it shifts the full ones nice and smooth. Mauser and deviants are usually control fed which is why you could do what you state but let's be realistic gents, who spends time feeding empty casings to a hungry rifle? Or upside down for that matter? Interesting observation on your part.

My old Delux 378 has a few deep dents, so how do you fix that? I don't believe can be done unless I sand the crap out of it shaving a lot of wood off. I don't think I could ever get it the same again.

I do....with my Model 21.....because it amuses me greatly.

I have a G33/40 sitting in my safe. I have been studying waiting for inspiration to build a rifle.

I have read all information, I understand the practicality of it all. It is going to get done right. Kind of like a Harley vs rice burner, or as stated above Purdy vs a Mossberg.

I have it narrowed down to 4 cartridge choices. In no particular order.

6.5x55
270 WCF
275 Rigby
338-06

A very nice list! The final selection will be tough, but you can't go wrong.

378Canuck,

Are they dents, or actual gouges where wood was removed? Even pretty deep dents can be fixed (or at least made a lot better) by steaming the wood.

Mule Deer,
I have converted a number of Mexican Mausers to custom rifles and they all fed the 7x57 like poop thru a goose. I am wondering if yours had been tinkered with or was a reject or whatever?..It wasn't but a few years back when you could buy them for little money and I bought about 25 of them for next to nothing..Wish I had bought 100 of them..Also got about 5 1912 Styrs in that bunch as Mexico had some of those small rings in their arsnal..

One must be aware when purchasing Mexicans as their are a number that come under that catagory such as the Mod.37 (35?) that has the Springfield cocking piece (these are really nice ) and then you have the short action mod 98 that is decieving in that many call it a small ring and its is a large ring short action..

The Mexican action, although desirable, does not compare IMO with the G33-40, the 33 German Customs action, or the Brnos..The early round top Brno,s with the clip slot are G33 German Custom milsurp actions, then shortly thereafter the Brno factory had their own round top action in the works and it had no clip slot, then they later added the double square bridge action..I prefer the double square bridge action..

My 9.3x62 is a Brno double square bridge Mod 21. It had a chunk out of the barrel when I bought it, so I had the barrel traced with a Lothar Walthar barrell, replaced all the barrel hardware and it looks original except the barrel is 26 inches..It is a geat rifle..I have taken Buffalo and most of Africas plainsgame with it along with elk, deer and black bear..I couldn't ask for a better rifle in a better caliber! It talks!

Ray,

That's the only Mexican action I've ever seen that wouldn't feed 7x57's. I bought an entire military rifle to get the action, and it didn't appear to have been fooled with.

378 Canuck,

Re feeding empty cases, here's what John Barsness posted a couple weeks ago in another thread about D'Arcy Echols' custom rifles:

"...D'Arcy's customers often change their mind about what bullet they want to use. Plus the vast majority are globe-trotting hunters who may end up using whatever ammo is locally available, because their ammo with the "right" bullet didn't show up.

So D'Arcy makes damn sure the rifle will feed anything, and has found that feeding empty cases is the best test. His rifles have a reputation of being absolutely foolproof, which is why his waiting list is very long--for rifles that cost $14,000."

So, yeah, nobody feeds empty cases to a hungry rifle, but it does indicate something useful. It's nice when a 60 year-old stock rifle does that.

This is the rifle. Not a very good photo but steam, you say. What is the recommended procedure MD?

They do more than just talk, don't they Ray.
....they sing, dance and play all of the band instruments as well!

Pearls of wisdom right there!....note to self Mike write that down somewhere for later use...

As a Mauser lover I never try to discourage someone from building one! You will spend more, but you'll get more IMHO!

I only wish I had more money to build more Mauser's and clones!

Mike

My question is this, to those who have shot these weapons, how accurate were they when they were stock??

Case Head Protrusions after Otteson
Action______________Protrusion (inches)
M98_______________0.105�
03 Springfld_______ __0.147 to 0.148
700 Rem____________0.160 plus any chamber mouth radius
Sako 461 (Vixen) _____0.107 annular ring around breech face of bbl for extr nose clearence
Win mod 70 (post 64)__0.125
Weatherby Mk V_______0.13�
Savage 110__________Pre �66 (rem type extr) 0.144�--- Post 66 win mod 70 type extr 0.128�
Ruger 77_____________0.132� (push feed � controlled feed may be less � I really don�t know)
Carl Gustav
(Dovetail shaped lugs)___0.120
Browning BBR_________0.160 (0.13 counterbore, +0.015 clearence + chamfer)

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/gunsmithing/sako-extractor-rem-700-bolt-194240/

bcp: Thanks!

I knew it was true but was too lazy to look it up

To each his own and if one feels that some mauser action is the best then fine with me.

Looking at such a project and considering where it will end up with a semi-light rifle in a plastic stock with some sort of 'blue' on the metal it is just not special to me.

Its half way on the barrel weight, action weight, finish, weather resistance, lock time and how it will look to me.

If one must 'build' on such a mauser consider it in a fine grained walnut stock with superb metal finishing as well.

There are lightweight CRF rifles out there that you can get right now that are true lightweights with SS metal.

Jim is spot on. You're not going to save weight going to the barrel you describe, and the G33/40 is renowned for it's light weight and ability to be worked up into a classic sporter - Featherweight taper barrel of about 22", juglans regia walnut stock done up in classic style. There are actions that will be on average better than the Mauser for pure accuracy potential. The discussion of blueprinting conjurs up a Remington 700. The niche for the small ring Mausers is not so much accuracy (expect 1 MOA or so), but weight and style. And I'd sure reconsider the heat treating (have it Rockwell tested if you must); most of these are just fine.

Save your clams or sell your Harley and put this action into the hands of Roger Biesen or his ilk and tell him to have at it. You will walk in the shadow of the Lord...

Unless you can do it yourself, it is a mistake to think that you can take an older Mauser action, either commercial or military, and convert it to a sporter and save money.

By the time you pay for drilling and tapping, bolt bending, hand lapping the bolt race, heat treating, if necessary, a barrel, and having it blued, you will have as much or more in it that you would an off the shelf M70 or M700.

However, if you have deep pockets and want a custom rifle, you can pay a first rate rifle builder and stock maker to build for you possibly one of the nicest rifles in the world, out of a 98 action.

The only reason, and the best reason, in my opinion, to convert one of the older 98s is to make a very fine custom rifle, and again, my opinion, you would have a much nicer and more valuable rifle than anything you could buy off the shelf.

Also, if this is what you want, and you can afford it, what difference does it make what it costs?

Why? Because it's a Mauser.....

This is a great thread and I've learned quote a bit from it. therefore, I have decided to dig it back up! Sorry 'bout that, but it would probably be a good read for many anyway.

I am starting a G33/40 custom build. Yes, it would be a lot easier to buy a custom wood stock, or a McmIllan stock, or even a pre-inletted stock to finish, but I am going to shape and inlet my own stock. For that matter, yes it would be easier to just buy a Winchester 70, Remington 700 etc. I have a 1,000 yard rifle with all the good stuff and it can regular shoot 0.25 MOA groups out to 300 yards and under 0.5 MOA groups out to 600.

But people who question why someone would go to so much trouble to build a classic custom sporting rifle instead of buying a Remchester deluxe are silly. It is like asking someone why they built a 57 Chevy instead of buying a new 2012 Mitsubishi Evo. The new car goes faster, uses less fuel and handles 10 times better. Why would anyone want to drive around in a cherry red 57 Chevy or a 69 Mustang Fastback? They're just heavy gas guzzlers that will cost way more than a fast new Japanese commuter/sports car, right?

I sure like my 57 Chevy...

Dober

If you're gonna stock a G 33/40, you could do worse than following this guy's lead:

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7971019521/m/1661078671

Curious where I can find some good reading on identifying the different Mausers. It seems a sea of info with no starting point. How do you identify the 33 or what would you consider a good alternative. Thinking 270... I know. It's gay. But I live in Vermont so I get a free pass....

W

Go to this link and scroll down to Forrest Bruch's post on different 98 Mausers.

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9411043/m/861105007

I like Turkish walnut better than African walnut, but that is pretty slick. What stock pattern did you use?





Chet

I have noticed this phenomenon myself. I know guys that won't hunt with a pretty rifle because it might get scratched and instead lug around rifles that are ugly to start with.

That is like refusing to marry a pretty woman because she might get wrinkles and instead choosing a girl that is ugly to start with.

Chet

Wow. Nice. I just re-read Jim Carmichael's section on rifle stocks out of his Book of the Rifle. He pretty much heralds French Walnut as the best.He then explains how English, American Black, Turkish and others all have their finer points but also some detrimental traits. But after looking at yours, assuming it is Turkish, I might have re-think my strategy!

I'm with you. You can't beat the African variety for hard use. I can always put a triple X stock on when I'm too old get out of the yard....suggest the glass critics open a museum and I'll gladly sell them my actions to preserve them for posterity--that should get a guy up to purgatory.

IIRC the actual spread when the actions were stripped was 3.5 ounces...:) That along with a Lupy over Euro glass covers the lunch and lately, lunch AND ammo.

You KNOW I'm going to steal that!

Matt:

I certainly would put a g33 in a tacky artificial stock particularly if it was going to be a serious hunting tool in nasty places...which is what the mauser action represents to me. Have a 7x57 chambered g33 in a Bansner which I like very well and am sitting on another g33 action that will probably go into a Brown Pounder and be chambered to a 280AI...nearly bought a Kimber, but repented.

I also like beautiful walnut, beautifully finished--on shotguns, guncases and pianos. No checkering on the pianos, though.

The guy to talk to about light contoured barrels that shoot well is Dan Petersen:

Classic Barrel Works

Here is a pic of my 7x57 and a rare two-legged deer that are found in upper MN. It is a good place for scratches and dents

[img:left][/img]

Feel free! I just made it up anyway.

Chet

Chet,

That's great!

I'm always astounded how these threads turn into an either/or argument. I was an early fan of synthetic stocks and own a and hunt number of syn-stocked rifles, but I would hardly call a little snow in typical deer woods "extreme conditions."

Sometimes I wonder how anybody ever killed a big game animal back when the only stock material was wood.

John,

I agree that there is a place for both synthetic and wood stocked rifles. If you are trying to go as light as possible or are going on a backpack goat hunt in southeast Alaska, then synthetic really has it's charm. If you are hunting with a standard weight sporter under more "normal" hunting conditions, wood works fine and is nicer to look at.

I have a pretty even split of wood and synthetic and use them all.

Chet

I don't want to be overly sensitive here...but are you referring to my response, John?

Well...maybe a little. But it was actually a general comment on how adamant many hunters get about the "necessity" for synthetic stocks.

This is just me, but for me (and I know I'm an odd one...grin) I really like African Walnut cause of the fact that generally one has a rifle that is weight forward and for me I like that feel.

This is especially easy to accomplish if one keeps the weight of the syn handle to 28 oz or less. I do not like a rig that light in the barrel and heavy in the handle. If that makes sense?

For years Wby rifles/cartridges got a rap for being over aggressive when it comes to recoil (in other words people thought they kicked too dang hard). I've worked with a few of those rounds in a action that wasn't quite as heavy as the MKV and with a syn stock and kept the weight out front in the tube and viola it was mucho easier to deal with. Sorry bout the side rant there.

Dober

Well, by way of justification the hard part in the picture is certainly not the snow. One-half (and especially the custom rifle) have to go the first trip out. No roads or quad trails make it just a little harder than standard carcass removal over the rocky tops and stick for "mature" hunters. Bottom line--it ain't a pretty exit considering what one envisions as bipedal locomotion.

I also felt kind of sorry for the OP after his synthetic idea got bruised in the first half dozen posts....

Not by me it didn't...

Dober

Irfubar did his g33 with a light blank that must have finished close to 28oz or less but I'll bet they are few and far between.

irfubar's

I like the feel of more barrel out front too, and have used the syns and aluminum bottoms to get there. 24oz w/the Bansner and the Brown claims lighter--will see.

John, I have come to the conclusion from reading posts here, that no one actually hunted and took game (At least trophy game...) before the inventions of Cerakote, Stainless, Fiberglass, etc...

tomk,

There is certainly nothing wrong with putting a synthetic stock on a Mauser 98 actioned rifle. One of my take-everything rifles is a .338 Winchester Magnum on a commercial FN action with a Bansner High Tech stock. It has gone a lot of places and been abused considerably over the decades and held up well!

John, after looking around a bit I may actually have a mauser or two in wood

[img:left][/img]

Very nice!

The oft neglected Swede makes into nice lean ??x57 rifle, all steel and wood to boot. Have condidered an MPI for my 7x57 96 but just can't get there.

Yeah....Elgin Gates,JOC, Warren Page,Bob Hagel,Charles Sheldon,Pinnel and Talifson,Ralph Young......hunters and guides all and some were afield 2-10 months at a stretch..... wood/blue Chrome Moly Southgate Weatherby's, pre 64's, and Mausers.

What did they know? They never shot anything.....except trophy BG from the Himalaya's to Alaska and everywhere between.Filled a couple of books and some Grand Slams to boot...

Today the average rifle nut is moaning and wailing because Krieger won't turn a SS barrel light enough for him to maneuver a 5# rifle under the umbrella of his Summit tree stand to weather out a sunburst.


Only kidding!

Bob,

Very true! I noted something while I was at the Jack O'Connor Center last month. Jack's old #2 270 with scratches, dings and all still looks better than my new green McMillan stocked M70 with speckled paint and alloy bottom metal. Hmmmmm.....

Chet

And Bob, please don't forget Parker and Bowman...and of course that Dobrenski character

Dober

Chet: Yeah maybe you and Dober are tougher on the rifles than JOC was....I guess the Minar Springfield 30/06 got beat up more than the #2 M70...IIRC by the time Jobson got it, the checkering was gone and the stock was pinned together at the wrist.

Dober I forgot Parker,Bowman and you Hard to remember them all

What a scurvy bunch eh......

Dober

I have to agree with Chetaf, a wood and blue rifle that has been used hard and is well cared for, such as O'connors M70 is a piece of working art, thats a rare combo, most tools are just tools, but a classic rifle is a tool and a work of art.
Each scratch and dent has a story!
I have owned a few such older rifles and always wished they could talk! I would love to hear the storys they would tell.
The best ones are the ones we own and storys we have together.

I also have and use synthetic stocked rifles, I even have an 1909 Argentine Mauser in a Basner! But my favorites are the wood stocked Mausers and M70's.
If the hunting is slow I can always pass time admiring them!

Ideed! LOL!

I had rather my woodstocked customs had no injury to them, but they are working, hunting rifles. I guess a few dings lend character. My problem is just looking at one of my rifles puts a ding it. I don't believe in safe queens.

butch I think it runs the gamut with the collector types not wanting to use them. But many like yourself are willing to hunt them..I don't want to abuse one myself but have hunted them and enjoyed them more because of it.

TexasRick, love these kind of stories. I know I would never be able to build one like that, but would love to see a pic of your gun that you put together posted if you don't mind. I bet others here would to. Good job and appreciate the story.

Guess what? I was installing a scope on my 250-3000 that Kobe just finished. How in the 'ell it happened I don't know, but the scope grew wings and flew up into the air. The front bell came done on the right hand side of the fore end and cut two pretty good divots in the stock. Kobe may be slow this winter and maybe have time to repair it. The rifle is still going Axis deer hunting the first part of September.

Anybody visited with this guy lately? He has disappeared with my custom 40X, walnut, and money. Jim62 seems to have disappeared with my stuff and other peoples projects.

Ouch....... Sorry to hear that Butch.

Butch, FYI -

jim62 (Member #6678)
User
Registered On: 12/09/04 03:58 PM
Last Online: Yesterday at 05:25 PM


Looks like he is still alive, must be seeing who may be coming to pay him a visit?

He's a trip. I've got some things working that he will not be pleased about.

Good on you, shame on him. In the past, I like others seen his posts.....so I am not surprised, but am disappointed. NOBODY should be on 24hr exploiting others.

Unfortunately a few have, and some good people have been on the wrong end. Hope it all works out in the end, and I am sure you will resolve this matter Butch, one way or another.

Too bad good people like you have to deal w/a hassle but glad you are pursuing means to right this wrong.

I have 4 g33/40 rifles(6.5 x55, 6.6-06, 2-25-06's) one synthetic stock, one curly maple, one new zealand walnut, one plain walnut, will use them when ever I need I don't ding any gun on purpose but they are a tool, to be used . I have one more g33/40 action don't think I will build may trade for a Tikka creedmoor.

I wouldn't put a synthetic on a 98. That's what 700s are for.

I had a faux Rigby Stalker built last year in a nice pc of english walnut. The 1st trip out with it was to NFLD on a moose hunt last fall. It rained and I dragged it through the alders. It shows some marks but that's what I bought it for.

The Shilen #2 contour is still a fairly heavy contour; especially in the midsection. I doubt there would be a huge difference in accuracy. If I was looking to build a lightish rifle, I would probably lighten the #2 a bit in the midsection. I like the Sako Hunter stock. The drop at the heel is decent and the comb is at a good height. I also like the grip angle and fullness. The swell helps to position your hand. All in all, the design manages to incorporate the beneficial features and doesn't look bad doing it. It deviates from the severe classic design popularized by American makers today but it is a good, functional design. The modern classic often has insufficient drop at the heel and while it is a decent prone stock, it is not great offhand.
98 actions are great. Perceived shortcoming are just that; perceived. Lock time is a little long? Who cares? I've never seen an animal duck after the trigger tripped. Recoil lug area is small? Maybe in a 458. The action is strong, safe, and stone reliable. The original two-stage trigger, properly tuned, is a trigger which pulls three pounds and cannot fail. It consists of five parts; including pins and springs.
I put one of Jim Wisner's Winchester-style safeties on one of mine because, at that time, it was the thing to do. My other Mausers have Beuhlers or trigger safeties, if the trigger was replaced with a Timney or Sako (another popular but unnecessary alteration IMO).
If one wants to save some weight on his Mauser build, there are aluminum bottom metal/magazine parts available and they work just fine.
As far as the choice between wood and glass, for a stock, is concerned; that is personal choice. In the mid-seventies, when Chet Brown and Lee Six were producing glass stocks, those of us who had gravitated toward these stocks for benchrest rifles, were somewhat willing to try them for hunting rifles as well and they worked great. They didn't look real great; mostly because the concept of finishing them well was kind of in it's infancy and a lot of us just sprayed them with the rattle can of choice. Today, finishes by good builders are durable and attractive, Sadly, I have never gotten much past the rattlecan approach!
Although the glass stocks provided real benefits (light weight, durability, weatherproof etc.) a lot of us still liked wood for the feel and for the opportunity to show off our ability to shape, fit, and finish a piece of wood. Many of todays stockmakers produce truly remarkable pieces. Others, like myself, make extremely functional handles; much like that found on a hammer or post hole digger.
Anyway, for the OP's 33/40, the Shilen #2 would be great (I would modify the contour slightly) and the MacMillan stock, in the Sako Hunter pattern, would make a nice handle. The NECG sights are nice but I have to ask, Why in the hell would one want to saddle the rifle with Talley One-Piece mounts, in combination with the sights? Do you plan to carry a Torx wrench with you, to remove the scope for quick use of those nice iron sights? Steel Weaver bases, in combination with any one of the quickly detachable rings which fit them. An alternative, if you prefer, would be Talleys QD rings and bases. The right answer is; anything but Talley one piece LW's.
I would stick with the original trigger (most would not) and a Beuhler-style safety. GD

Good to see BobInNH posting again!

That post was in 2012

He passed away a few years back

Yeah, this is a very old thread.

One alternative some might consider if they REALLY want a traditional rifle on a G33/40 action is to look for a used one. Since this thread first started I came across this one at a local gun store, maybe 4 years ago.

There are no markings to indicate who made it, but it's a top-notch job. The stock and bolt handle obviously have Germanic influence (not unusual in the older custom rifle business in the U.S.), but it also has a Jaeger trigger, made in the Paul Jaeger shop in Pennsylvania. With the scope and mounts it weighs 7-1/2 pounds, and shoots VERY well. Oh, and the chambering is .30-06.

It wasn't exactly cheap, but cost a hell of a lot less than getting a similar rifle built today.

Glad someone brought this thread back up. I had my first rifle built on a Springfield action in the 1960's. It changed several times over the years and was eventually sold. That was a big mistake, but I was hooked on rebuilt military rifles. I only messed up a couple though. I always tried to find one that was way down hill from collectable.

While I never really cared one way or the other for a G33/40, I have always liked the Mexican 1936. I think it is the best looking of all Mauser rifles and have had my eye out for a good one for years. I found it some years ago as a poorly done, halfway put together sporter. As Muledeer said, used ones are out there that someone else has taken the big bite on and if you are careful they can be very reasonable to re build. This one had a nice piece of wood that was shaped all wrong, the action metal was nice but the bore looked like the inside of an old chimney. Exactly what I was looking for. It made into the rifle I have wanted for years. I had it re barreled in 7mm Mauser and had the stock re shaped. The metal was cleaned up and cerakoted (for now). The action is slick as a ribbon and feeds the 7mm very smoothly. I'm still tossing around getting the checkering done on it or just leaving the wood as is. I might get a nice wraparound pattern on just the grip area.

One thing about this thread is that the topic is great, but there just aren't enough pictures....

Nice walnut!

Very nice stick.

No kidding, I miss his posts, talked to him on the phone a couple of times before cancer got him.

Is this not the action that is used on Phil Shoemakers 505 GIBBS ?

Beautiful rifle.

Personally I agree with the Mauser action needs to be in a nice piece of walnut crowd. Nothing against synthetic/fiberglass stocks. I have two customs built; both in 35 Whelen. Both will shoot under MOA. The one I had built was based on a Win70 action. Schneider heavy barrel and McMillan stock. The other I inherited. 1909 Argentine action in a nice walnut stock. Cost about the same total to build by the same 'smith but at least 10yrs apart. I built mine as a target rifle; yeah I'm loony like that but I like the cartridge. The other was built for hunting. Absolutely perfect for that. Reasonably light and comes to the shoulder perfectly. Push comes to shove I know which one would head out the door. The other would be the last one to ever leave. I'll see if I can dig up a picture.

I think right now is a great time to be looking for a good 98 action already in a walnut stock. That doesn't seem to be what the new generation is looking for and the "old pharts" (I'm getting there, but I'm not there quite yet!) that built them in the early 60's and 70's are turning them loose. Or their estate is turning them loose. I've seen several in the last few months on the internet that were worth a second look and I'm watching a couple of them right now. A couple of the ones I saw were the G33/40 actions that a nice custom had been built on. Couldn't build a new one for what it would take to buy one of them. Just have to study the pictures and know what you are looking at. Many of the sellers really don't know what they have.

My gun smith doesn't gouge me for that. He bends the bolt, removes the rear sight, installs a stronger firing pin spring, adds a Timney Trigger and a 3 position safety. nd screws in \the barrel of my choice and head spaces it for about $600. if I supply the barrel and the action.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/gallery/80/full/163611.jpg

That's some of my favorite looking wood. I like the shade and tone