.

In the automotive market, the general thought is that 25% of the value of a new car is lost the moment you drive it off the lot regardless of how good a job you did in haggling.


Not counting antiques and other legitimate collectibles...

What would be the general rule of thumb for resale price loss from walking out the door with your new gun purchase ?

.

About the same, and for the same reason: if it leaves the store it's a used gun when it comes back. And you can no longer get full price for a used gun.

My guess (based on decades of walking out of gun stores with new rifles) is that 25% would be about right with firearms as well.

There are many exceptions, though. I've purchased new Ruger No. 1's and sold them for 90% of the purchase price within a year or two. And New Ultra Light Arms rifles tend to hold their value more than many other synthetic-stocked custom rifles. New NULA's cost around $3000, but I have seen used ones in good shape sell for over $2500. A rifle custom-stocked by Jerry Fisher is also more likely to retain value than one stocked by a good but unknown young stockmaker.

Probably the biggest losses I've seen have been with the common custom rifles built on a Rem. 700 action with an aftermarket barrel and stock. Unless made by somebody famous, they often won't sell for anything more than the cost of the parts, if that.

JB,

Good info!!!

DB

Could you somehow get that information posted at gunshows?

If well cared for and retained until unavailable, then likely no depreciation. I was offered $200 more for my last purchase before I had even left the store. A pre 64 Win.

Depending on the gun in question...Selling it back to a dealer will cost you about 50%,example......
no one will pay within 15-20% for a "used gun" vs "new" and most shops have to run on a 25% profit to keep the doors open and pay good people...

1minute,

A pre-'64 Model 70 would be considered a "collectible," not a new rifle, the subject of this thread.

Isn't that the truth, 9 outta 10 gun shows here in the Midwest they ask more for a used gun vs a new gun that's still being produced. I honestly don't know why some guys go to the expense to bring stuff and have it marked so high that you're afraid to even ask what they'd take.

Not to defend outrageous pricing, but it is also true that everybody who wants to buy a gun show gun also expects to dicker the dealer down. So if you want a given number, mark it higher and then dicker it down to what you really will accept. That's how it's done.

Most gun show prices are out of line,it's the couple of excellent deals you may find that can make it well worth your time.The last custom rifle I sold ,I came out better than what I had in it.It's all about how much of a effort you make.

Most guys won't dicker 200-300.00 though, realistically 25-50.00 yes.

I see something priced 150-250.00 higher than it's actually worth than I'm not even going to bother to try and dicker.

Does anyone know if Jerry Fisher is still around?

One of the few that I have ever paid attention to was a Herter's J9 in 7mm Rem Mag. Store wanted $200. for it. I paid about $95. for mine new.

Have seen a lot of used TC Hawken's that sell for about what the kit cost at one time. And that time isn't very recent.

djs,

My wife and I just saw Jerry Fisher last week at the Safari Club show in Reno. He was down there for the Custom Gunmakers Guild show, which overlaps SCI every year. We had a pretty long visit, along with a couple of other mutual friends. He's doing well!

Well if you priced a gun at what you would take you would not sell because you could not haggle.I always price stuff on my tables high because I always get ridiculous offers.It all seems to work out.

Hmm. If I really want to sell a gun at a gun show, I price it at what I consider a fair price, which usually ends up being considerably lower than the prices I see on other tables for a similar firearm.

The only trouble I've had is that everybody wants to haggle, just because gun-show prices have been so high for so long. So when some guy asks, "What's your best price on this?" I look at the price tag and read it to him. If he starts to whine I say, "I think that's a fair price. If you don't, fine." I generally end up selling my guns, while a lot of the "professional" dealers around me are bitching about not selling much, if anything.

A famous country singer used to have a table occasionally at shows in my area. He also put a fair price on his guns. When somebody would ask for his "best price" he'd say, "I don't come to gun shows to make money. If I need to make money, I put together another album. That's my best price, right there."

Gun show dude: Tag says $499...is that your best price?

Ingwe: Nope...$600 is my best price, but I didn't think you'd go for that....

MD, That would be Hank Jr, I suppose!

my local gun dealer wants 30% down when ordering a new rifle, this has to tell you something.........you don't pick it up then you are the only one that looses. another example is a Glock 19 cost about $110 to manufacture, manufacturers that double their money do real well, now up to $220, they retail for around $700 in my area, so the importer takes a cut and the rest is left to the retailer.

I had a side-by-side Ithaca 12-gauge shotgun for sale at the very reasonable price of $595 at a recent gun show. One guy came up and asked if he could take the barrels and forend off to examine it, standard procedure with doubles. I said OK.

It had plastic snap-caps in the chambers, in case anybody wanted to test the trigger pulls. He took one of these out of the chamber, leaving the other one in. Then he "rang" the barrels, doing the standard trick of hanging the rear lug over a finger then tapping the barrels near the muzzle.

But "ringing" the barrels with a plastic snap-cap, with another snap-cap still in the chamber, resulted in a dull buzz rather than the desired bell-like sound. He knew it would, and tried to tell me the solder between the barrels was loose.

I had rung the barrels when buying the gun a couple of years earlier, and knew they were fine. This guy is also fairly notorious on the Montana gun-show circuit. So I just looked at him, waiting to see what else he'd come up with.

He said, "But I'll still give you $400 for it, even though it has to be fixed."

I shook my head. "I'll sell it YOU for $800."

And he went away.

It takes profit to run a manufacturing facility and a retail shop. Wages, taxes, utilities, rent, advertising, etc. Not to mention potential litigation. Out of the profit a firearms manufacturer makes, how much of that do you suppose they need to cover that cost? That goes for anything we buy today, I'd bet they all have some amortized litigation costs factored into their pricing.

I have no issue on the mark up of firearms and related equipment. Just stating the obvious. Sometimes I wonder how some of these shops do it, what with the overhead, employees and all.

My employer, maker of pulp and paper, makes anywhere from zero to $600 a ton, paper is about +30% on cost. Times are good now with pulp selling at $960/ton and paper depending on grade up to around $15-1600 a ton.

Ya so that $90 serpentine belt for your car cost about $20 and you pay $80-90 retail. Just the way it is.

.

As far as the markup or margin that a manufacturer, distributor, retailer, or other business must make...

Any business that has been around a while knows that the natural business cycle produces good years and not so good years.

One has to make enough in the good years to keep the business alive and healthy in the not so good years.

Think old Aesop had a Fable about that.

But that was a while back.

.

Thanks for the update JB. I'm glad that he's still among us and doing well. He certainly did (does?) beautiful work.

I manage parts for a heavy equipment dealer and it costs between 12% - 15% just to unlock the door and turn the lights on. The expense happens every day whether we sell anything or not. Business hasn't been bad lately but there were some slow ones that made me break a sweat! Anyone that puts their hands on a commodity has to make something on it to stay afloat and keep them jobs.

.

I appreciate it when the seller puts a reasonable market price on their wares.


But no one should be automatically insulted because someone asks about a better price. Horse trading has been a proud profession for thousands of years. There is a certain amount of pleasure in the process without anyone getting mad. In "The Shootist", John Wayne's character haggles with the livery stable owner over the price of his horse and also with the funeral home director over the price of his upcoming funeral.



As far as buying a gun owned by a country singer or a gun scribe, figure it would bring top dollar for the honor of being able to own such an item. Just think, the lucky buyer could be the only person in their community to own a 16 gauge side-by-side once owned by...

.

Very nice

djs,

Oh, yeah, Jerry is still making great rifles! I doubt he will ever quit.

I know the wealth and social esteem of many a woman has increased exponentially after walking out the door with me, but I digress as I'm also quite the collectible.

Liar, liar - pants on fire.

Even if only briefly?

Preferably briefly.

There is a guy that goes to the gunshows in my area and
I have seen him a few times flicking the reciever of a bolt
action with his finger and telling the seller that there
is something wrong with the gun by the sound it makes.
He does this with the action open, most people just look
at him when he tells them this and a few guys have told
him to take a hike.

Yeah, there's always somebody like that!

The guy I'm talking about has even been been invited out to the parking lot--by a guy who is packing, and not concealed. Sometimes I wonder why he still shows up at the shows.

If your selling your guns at the gun show you have them priced to low.

I'll give you another exception. A couple of years ago, I bought a Ruger No. 1-H in 9.3x74R, unfired and NIB, from a well-known gun writer. As I recall, the purchase price was $750 shipped and I was happy to get it, as that was a little over $100 less than the best price that I had been able to find locally. The rifle was as advertised and has served me well. However, a few months after it arrived, as I was storing the box, I noticed a price sticker from Capitol Sports in Helena, MT, for around $669 or so. (I tried to find the box tonight to confirm the amount, but must have shipped another rifle in it.)

I still like the rifle and the deal, but it obviously didn't diminish 25% in value after it went out the door!

Hammer,

I have tables at the local gun shows several times a year. I would PREFER to put my best price on the items on my table. Here a few years ago, I made a bulk purchase of new RCBS dies. I had about $12 into them /set. So I marked them $16 at the show. There was NO other vendor at the show that had new dies for less than $20. But yet, every single customer wanted to jew me down... Because of this attitude, I am forced to mark my merchandise up 10-15% to be able to get the fair price that I really want... That's not the way I prefer to do business, but what can I do?

GH

Strange, but the same thing happens at yards sales. Several years ago, we had a yard sale and I wanted to sell some sports equipment that I hadn't used in a long time.

I priced them at yard sale prices, and everyone wanted me to take less. After a few customers tried to get me to come down, I doubled the asking price, came down to for what I originally wanted for it, and sold every item.

That is both hilarious and terribly sad... (but I'm glad you were able to sell everything!)

Bingo,that is my Gunshow policy.Funny thing is that I still sell lots of stuff cause people know I can be haggled down.When folks ask me about lowering the price . I ask if they want my bottom dollar or my haggle price.When they ask what is the difference????I tell them my bottom dollar is as cheap as I will go.If we haggle,you will never know if I sold for my bottom dollar !!!

I always like the guys who paid close to MSRP for a rifle and scope at the local gunshop, and then two years later want to sell the combo at the "normal" everyday street price of a new rifle and scope........




Casey

And don't want to separate them....

I looked at one yesterday that a guy didn't want to separate. He wanted $100 above the price of the rifle for scope and mounts (Bushnell Sportview and old Weaver rings). I didn't buy it.

.

How much extra over the price of NIB are you willing to pay someone for having taken the time to "break-in" the gun, work up a good load, and find the best factory ammo for that specific gun ?

Typically, they tell me that it takes about 500 rounds to "break-in" a new gun.

Finding the best load may take more.

Count the cost of the ammo they shot and their time...


.

.

How much more than NIB should you be willing to pay for the custom bedding job they did, the trigger job, and the special features they added ?

And the story about the trip to Montana for elk and bear ?

.

I personally LOVE to deal with the seller who has a medium-to-high pricetag on their scoped rifle, and can't resist trying to justify the high pricing by bragging on the value/cost of the scope: "And, by the way - that's a $300 scope on there."

I almost always pull out some large-denomination bills, and tell the seller:
"GREAT ! I'll take the rifle - but you can keep the scope. I already have one for the rifle."

(and then shut up & watch them........... )

.

.

With rare exceptions, I don't have any luck offering to let the dealer keep the scope on a used rifle in return for a discount on the price of the gun.

Again with a few rare exceptions, don't think the dealers have even offered a whole dollar discount to let them keep the scope.

When making such an offer, have had the dealer raise the price of the gun because of the work to remove the scope from the rifle.

.

As mentioned ... depends on the rifle. In Australia, Ruger No1s hold value due to difficulty in sourcing them, particularly certain chamberings. Many second hand No1s even of 10-15 years vintage are selling at new prices ... but with perhaps a $200-$300 Leupold on top. Ruger 96/44s are now THROUGH the roof! People are asking and getting double what they paid, Winchester BigBores in 375Win ... double what they paid. Don't mention SMLEs ... compared to say 5 years ago ... x4 to x10 what people used to pay ... much of which is thanks to the UK and a resurgence in restoring wall hangers which got a lot of rifles parted out so that now entire matching SMLEs are at a distinct premium. Funnier yet ... WSSMs were worth nothing even new. Now that a few wildcats are floating about here like the 44WSSM/458WSSM/375WSSM, price has risen even though the rifles are being parted out.
Cheers...
Con

Local gun shop sold a new S&W Bodyguard to a couple. They went to the range and shot less than a box of shells and brought it back saying they just didn't like the way if felt.
Dealer said he could only give them 60% of the cost, he needed to make 20% and it was now used so it had to be listed at, least a 20% reduction below a new one or it wouldn't sell.

I think (hope) that you forgot to include the - right?

Even some private seller are guilty of it. I love my Savage Rifles, but I am not going to pay $150 over what they sell for new. Why ask $350 for a basic Savage or Stevens when they sell for $199-$250 new?

This is like real estate. Everybody has an inflated value in their mind, even though the market is lower.

How much depreciation for reduced barrel life?

Jim