I have a 1909 Argentine Mauser action for a project rifle and am at a impasse as to what cartridge I want to build the rifle around.I already have some medium bores (35 Whelen, 375 H&H), and more .30 and under rifles than I know what to do with.

I'm looking at a 20-22" barrel, something handy but packs a punch when needed (already have a Marlin 1895 in 45-70, so don't go there).

So give me your suggestions/praises/heartburn on either of these.

What do I want to shoot with it?




Anything I want!

I'd say for the true big bore experience you need a .458. That's not to say a 416 lacks anything for dangerous game hunting, but IMHO there is a power/recoil threshold that starts at 500 gr @ 2100 fps, and anyone interested in big guns needs at least one true big bore. It's also more practical in terms of availability of brass, component bullets and bullet molds. 350 gr @ 2400 fps is just as shootable as a .375 and plenty for NA game, and you can crank it up to 500's @ 2100+fps or shoot cast bullets at revolver velocities.

Just to get things started right, I'll say the 416 is a better all around cartridge, penetrates better, shoots flatter, and does anything the 458 does.
I have no use for a 458. Now a 470, now we're talking.

That should get things going for a few pages. I'll be back when the dust starts to settle.

I vote for the 458 Win mag. I built one on a VZ24 Mauser action.
It has a 21" barrel with N.E.C.G. express sights.
It is just plain fun to shoot. Most of my loads are 440gr gas check lead at 2200fps.
It's always a hit when I go shooting with the guy's, everybody enjoys a turn shooting it.

They're both great rounds.

Often a 98 action will require some more modification to get the .458 to feed slickly, due to the fatter bullet causing the round to tip upward more. The .416 is a little easier, and the .375 Ruger will generally feed in any Mauser that will feed the .338 Winchester Magnum, or even the .300 Winchester.

As far as "killing power," I've known too many very experienced African PH's who believe the .416's are just as good as the .45's (or even a .470) to debate that one much.

I have owned several .416 and .458 caliber rifles over the years and I dropped the .416's in favour of the .458 Caliber.

If the .416 is good, and it is, the .458 with more caliber and more bullet weight is a step up if the animals are larger or considered dangerous and as previously stated, you can load back to a 350gn TSX and cover a lot more turf.

Just a preference I guess.

I currently have 2 458's ,a Whitworth and a custom with a 16 1/2" barrel on an 03A3 action. The only 416 I own is the only 416 I ever owned, a CZ550 416 Rigby custom. I have killed an elephant with the 416 but have never shot anything but targets with the 458's. Were I to back up someone I would use the 03A3 458 without hesitation. It is one of the fastest handling rifles I have ever had. However the punch at both ends is significant.
On top of all else it has a Neidner steel buttplate.

A steel butt plate on a .458?
Bloody Hell......

irfubar - that's a great looking rifle! Doubt I would be able to put such pretty wood on mine. That's almost too pretty to hunt with......almost....

Thanks MD, good info on the mods required. I've not personally done such modifications, but my dad has lots of experience with 98s so we'll tackle it together. He doesn't build much anymore due to his hands shaking too much, but he has 50 years of knowledge that I'm trying to absorb.

That takes some stones.....

Think I'll have a nice squishy 1" pad on mine thank you very much.