Would anyone go 270 over 308? Assume factory ammo, 500y... steel, deer, and elk.

This was a recent topic of discussion at work. I would go 308 for no other reason than ammo selection. I know that similar threads have touched on this, but would appreciate you fellas entertaining this question.

Jason

There are a couple of 270 bullets that are being made that give it the ability to *beat* the .308 at similar distances.

However... I'd still gun 155 Scenars from 2850-3000 and call it a day.

Tanner

How much is the rifle realistically going to get shot?

If it will have 500 or 1000 rounds put down the barrel a year, the 308 makes sense from an economic standpoint, as factory ammo can be had fairly cheap.

If the rifle will be shot 50 or 100 rounds a year for practice, and then have a few rounds put through it during hunting season on game, the factory ammo cost is irrelevant.

In that case, 270, as lots of hunting ammo is available in bullet weights shot at speeds that don't require any dicking around with turrets or hold over for the range most game is actually going to get shot.

If you'll be shooting stuff at 500 you'll either be holding over with a ballistic reticle or turning a knob. Either one will work fine at that distance, and both have good availability and selection for factory ammo.

So the point about how much you're going to shoot makes sense, you can get .308 cheaper in general but the question is, will you shoot enough so that it matters.

I've pretty much given up on the bullet selection for the 30 cal's. Lets face it, your only gonna shoot one bullet at a time and for myself, I pick the bullet I think is best for the cartridge I'm shooting. have killed a truck load of deer with the 308, love it! Never shot a 270 at anything but, I doubt the 308 has any really decent advantage on the 270 with a 150gr bullet. I shot 165 gr Hornady spire points and inter lock's and they were all. Never left me wanting. I think that a 270 with the 150gr bullet would accomplish the same end!

What I was getting at with the not using dials or dots comment is that we need to be realistic with ourselves. If someone is a �Box of ammo a year� kind of guy, he really ought to limit himself to MBPR type shots due to limited wind doping skills, trigger time, etc. There�s certainly nothing wrong with these fellows, as many folks don�t have the time or interest in shooting the rounds necessary to develop a long range skillset. Heck, I�ve known several folks who were really gung ho about LR, but after a year or two their interest wained, or they had kids, or got really into flyfishing, or they simply got bored with LR. It may seem strange to some, but for some folks shooting steel targets from a bipod is as fun as watching paint dry. So if one finds himself in this situation, the cartridge choice makes essentially zero difference. Far more important is finding a gun that fits the shooter and is shootable from a recoil/muzzle blast perspective, as well as fitting in one�s budget - not just the initial purchase but from an ammo standpoint.

If a guy is honestly going to put in the time and money to get good, there�s a really strong chance he will take up handloading. Then the minutia can be sorted through, and a choice made based on all the various ballistic mumbo jumbo factors.

I agree with everything you said. But I was thinking there was a reason he posted on the long range forum, probably because he wanted some opinions on the relative merits of the two chamberings out past MPBR.

The reason I mentioned MPBR is because the OP wrote of a conversation at work, and centered on factory ammo. Thus I made an assumption (and maybe I'm wrong) that at least some involved are not prolific shooters, and should think of limiting themselves. We've all had those work conversations where opinions are bandied about, often by those with little to no knowledge of the subject at hand. The factory ammo issue is also an assumption, as I know of very few serious shooters who don't handload - those who don't are paid to shoot or their ammo is sponsored. Maybe I'm totally wrong and everyone involved is really knowledgeable, and blow a couple grand a year on factory 270 ammo!

The rest of my first post dealt with those who shoot enough to be at least somewhat proficient at longer yardages, so the MPBR thing was not my entire thought process.

Thanks for the feedback guys.

A few things:

1. Just for the record I've been reloading for the past several years and have not fired factory ammo in a long time.

2. The question was for a co-worker that has no intention of reloading (at least now).

3. He's very motivated to become proficient at 500y, but will be limited to factory ammo. Ideally he'd shoot ~40 rounds per month which would be ~480 rounds per year (or more). But realistically, let's assume half that or ~240 rounds per year.

4. My thought was that there is a much larger selection of factory ammo for the 308. For example, Cor-Bon has the 155gr Skinner pre-rolled.

Jason

All good points. I got started with some help from a friend who got me set up with an accurate rifle (a .308) and helped me get a good deal on a case of Black Hills match ammo. It was good, accurate ammo. but before I was done shooting it I was into reloading, it's just the natural progression.

So don't overlook the Black Hills ammo, 4th, they load 168 and 175 SMKs.

With those details in mind, I'd think a 308 would be an absolutely fine choice for your co-worker.

As smokepole mentioned, don't overlook the Black Hills ammo. It's good stuff.

.308 is a favorite of mine.
It's a good all around cartridge.

Smoke, Billy - I'll keep that Black Hills in mind.

John Boy - are you shooting factory or rolling your own?

I'm a 270 fanatic but the 308 wins this one hands down.

Shod

No....

You left out the 7/08 which has a lot less wind drift and bullet drop vs the 308.

Shodd, 2much,

The 308 seemed like the obvious choice to me, but he went 270 T3.

Keith,

I like my 7-08, but factory ammo selection seems limited for 500y compared to the 308. Only need one good load, but...

If only he were a reloaderer...

.488 135 SMK's at 3,000.
.463 129 LRX's at 3,100.
.531 150 VLD's at 2,850.
.377 110 TTSX's at 3,400.

Not shabby, but handloads.

Hell, I'm considering dumping a Faux 260 for a 270 Montana lopped to 22" just to cut down on the crap laying around my bench and maybe shave a few ounce of a rig in the meantime...

But with factory ammo, you got a PILE more choices in 308. Midway offers 163 loads for 308, 60 for 270.

Narrow the list by what he WILL do, not dream about. Wishes get guys in more trouble than wills....

See if he can get some Superformance 150g SST ammo for his 270. Those bullets hold up pretty good at range and near 3000fps isn't shabby.

One ONLY "Needs" a good supply of ONE good load....

Then LEARN it

Logic will get you banned.

Just sayin......

Good case for a 6.5 Creedmoor, a case of 140 Amax...

You've been warned!!

At 500 yards it doesn't matter...just about any highpower round will get the job done.

The real question is why you guys are sitting around talking about this instead of working...??

.270W the best !!
Howa 1500 Fed 130 Nosler Ballistic Tip or Hornady SST for medium range (350yds) "light game" or "european mountain game" else .150
The choice is wider with .308W but is it interesting ? The choice is sufficient with the offer .270W ...
30-06 -270w -308W -7x64 - 280R -7.08 are very very closed ..
Does the game make the difference ? ..
On the range I prefer the .270W ...

There are no really good, high BC long range bullets or factory ammo available for the 270. Therefor the 308 takes top honors by default.

Quite a while back, a couple of friends came over to use my range to prepare for deer season. We were not testing the rifles or ammo, but they did want to know the speed of their loads. On 2 different .270 rifles and 2 different boxes of ammo, the .270's were slower than published speeds by around 350 fps, while the 2 .308's and one 3006 was close to published speeds. All over the same chrono on the same day. I can't say if this is normal as this one time was all that I was around a .270. miles

Unless you are a long range target shooter, I can't see much reason to own a 308.

I don't spend a lot of time around factory ammo in any chambering,but the last time I checked a M70 FW chambered 270 Win the Federal Blue Box 130 gr stuff did slightly over 3100 fps. Most 30/06 stuff I have checked ran below what the cartridge will give with hand loads.

Ammo from years ago was slower for both cartridges but the doggiest stuff has been in 30/06 overall.Anyway this is common with factory ammo in general.


Just got back from a hunt with two old chums who,between them, have about 80 years of competitive match shooting experience,nationally and internationally. One reminisced about the days when all match rifles were chambered 308,and all 1000 yard rifles were 300 magnums.

But unless required he said few shoot the 308 anymore. One has a 6.5/284 built by Al Warner that he loves for 1000 yard work,but thought the 6.5 Creedmoor was a better bet due to longer barrel life. When I mentioned a mild recoiling long range rifle he suggested the 6XC with 115's because it is so well proven in competition.

Their hunting rifles? Both have exactly two,chambered 300 Win Mag and 270 Winchester.They both said they don't use the 300's much, but when they did stuff up to moose,elk and grizzly have just fallen down.

One 270 is on a Mauser action, the other on a LH Rem 700 with PacNor barrel. They both laughed when I told them some internet folks think the 270 is a lousy hunting cartridge.

On Saturday one of them dumped an 11 point buck at 200 yards that dressed 192 pounds at 200 yards with a 140 BT that raked it from shoulder to hindquarter before exiting.The buck just collapsed in place.I am no BT fan but have to admit I was pretty impressed.

all 270 factory ammo is long range ammo if you are only shooting 500yds.i've killed a few deer between 450-500,all were clean one shot kills.

not a big 30cal fan at all.i've tried to shoot the 308 at longer ranges and just can't get it to shoot as well as i like. i'd go with a 7mag over 500yds.

I saw something similar with 130gr and 150gr Core-lokts last year. IIRC, the 130gr went 2850fps. Just the other day I read an article about slow CL ammo. The slow stuff was supposed to have been fixed, but the author claimed that the problem has recently re-appeared. That mirrors what I saw unless I had an extremely slow rifle but it shot handloads the same speed as two other rifles with the same charge weight.

i'm handloading 140gn hornadys in my 270 tikka at 2880fps. i'm a full grain from max load.

even with the crappy bullet selection the 270 will still beat a 308 with the right loadings, with the heavies in 308 your clear down to 2600 fps. with that said I did a 270 win for long range and really wish I had done something in 7mm. 280ai would be top of the list. the biggest problem I have is I have a short throat setup to shoot 130-140 class bullets. then out comes the nosler lrb, I have to really seat it deep on my gun.

I'd go 308 just for the fact that factory ammo is plentiful and cheaper than any 270 Win ammo, at least around here.

Both calibers are good and popular. In my experience, when ammunition is on sale it is on sale for both of these calibers, normally for the same price.

I would make my decision on the rifle. Some brands have rifles with better feel and balance in short action configuration, some in standard length configuration. How a rifle fits and feels is more important than caliber, in this instance.

I would take the 308 over the 270. Both great cartridges but a .30 caliber hole is comforting to me? It plain works with mild enough recoil to shoot for extended periods of time. Easy on the barrel, less powder burned, great accuracy. It's hard to not like it.

Both equally effective to that distance, limited by bullet choice and shot placement.