I acquired a McMillan std fill stock and it does not look like it is pillar bedded. I do plan to have the action bedded later, but do you suggest it be pillar bedded as well?

I have ordered them both with, and without, pillars. I've never noticed any kind of stock compression issues without pillars in my McM's so I don't use them anymore.

I just pillar bedded one this weekend. I owned one without pillars in a Remington Custom KS about a decade ago and it did just fine. I just skim bedded it and left the escutcheon in place for the front action screw. All the rest were blanks that I've used pillars in.

I always do the pillars at the same time as bedding. Here is one my 14 y/o nephew did under my direction just a few days ago. It is a simple job. I use my mill and lathe, but most could be done with a drill and a hacksaw.

Eddy, have you guys seen problems that would make you run pillars? Or is it more like "why not"? Thanks, Brad.

If done right, pillars will definately give a good, solid, and stressfree platform for the action to rest on. Also, it will eliminate any chance of the stock, whatever the material, from being crushed from tightening or over-tightening of the guard screws.

All of the above are desirable if you are wanting an accurate rifle, and in my opinion, a rifle that will range from a little to a lot more accurate than a rifle with conventional bedding.

I've ordered them both ways, but if you want/believe in the insurance value of pillars, McM's factory installed pillars are pretty inexpensive, at least they are compared to the prices that I generally see 'smiths advertising for the installation of pillars.

JEff

123, So you've crushed McM's without pillars? I go TIGHT with bottom metal and haven't seen any compression with any of mine, ADL's/BDL's/and various mag systems.

I've not seen an accuracy issue stemming from a stock not having pillars....not yet anyways.

More a why not when dealing with Mcmillan stocks. I have a couple that have no pillars that are fine.

Having a custom McMillan stock without being pillar bedded is like having a mail order bride with no boob's....you just got to have them to make thing's right!!!

There is NO arguing with that kind of logic! case closed!

That's TFF!

Alright, you win! LOL.

Yep. -Al

On a solid fill, the stock will withstand action screw torque without movement. McMillan confirmed this long ago in their testing. They install pillars in their bedding jobs on the solid fill stocks for technique only as it adds no additional strength.

Best

I pillar bed everything; on the ones I do I just enjoy the process, and having all my stocks (not many really) pillar bedded gives me piece of mind and confidence in my equipment.

All of the really experienced stock people I've talked to says it simply isn't necessary. I've got two that work fine w/o them. Had a 3rd which I sold for other reasons. Simply not necessary with a well built synthetic.
Barsness, in one of his latest books, discusses this at lenth. It seems tha the old military Mausers had pillar bedding. Apparently necessary because their stocks were made from indifferent wood that often became oil soaked. E

JB also uses the term "farmer tight." I believe there are people who could compress any stock material by cranking down on the action screws/bolts. I use a torque wrench on all my action screws even though I don't need to since they're pillar bedded. Again, it makes me happy.

Looking at a McMillan for a Ruger Mk II. Gift for a buddy who has done a ton of favors for me over the years. Never owned a McMillan before. His Ruger is bone stock. Any ever problem with the factory installed pillars not lining up correctly? (I'm assuming the answer is "no," but thought I'd ask before blowing five Benjamins.)

McMillan's pillars are little more than tubing and hardly qualify as pillars in my mind.

If you are a guy who installs the stock, torques it down and leaves it alone, you probably don't need pillars. What I like about them is that it relieves you of the necessity of a torque wrench and when you take the barreled action out and put it back in, the zero is maintained. I used SS pillars and tight is tight. I travel with the barreled action and stock side-by-side in an aluminum shotgun take-down case inside a duffel. When I arrive at my destination, I reassemble and the rifle is still sighted in. I didn't have good luck with this before I went to SS pillars.

No matter what anyone tells you, a metal pillar is NOT going to compress as much as any fill that McMillan uses.

+1 McMillan only charges $26 installed.......

I have quite a few varmint rifles with custom barrels and match chambers in McM stocks, they all shoot very tiny groups...it would take good wind flags and good conditions to tell the difference between any of them.

My conclustion that the individual barrel quality means more than pillar bedding McM stocks unless you are talking a benchrest rifle where you are not going to glue in the action and shooting registered matches are your hobby.

Of course, I had to put a halter on my excessive compulsive traits so I could own more guns. I even did tests on McM stocks, bedded and unbedded with custom 223's and 6 PPC's, there were about 3/8" difference in the group size. Then I did tests on non trued Rem 700's vs trued Rem 700's in bedded and non bedded McM stocks, still about 3/8 difference in groups. Next, I did a test on Rem 700 hart barrels (12" twists) in 243 AI in trued 700 actions comparing Ruger and Mauser actions fitted with same make barrels pillar bedded in McM Hunter class stock fitted with leupold 36 x scopes. Ruger and Rem gave same size groups, mauser was only about .065 larger groups which could attribute to many things including difference in how one particular barrel will shoot slightly better than others(which benchrest shooters are very familiar with). Next I started comparing the tricked out and non tricked out Rem 700's in 6 PPC to custom benchrest rifles with Hall M actions and Stolle panda actions. Again, there was very little difference, and the conclusion of which were best was determined by what rifle I was shooting on the day with the best wind conditions.

All actions were fitted with Hart Max Heavy varmint barrel contours that were 26"-29" long on varmint rifles and 22 and 24" long on the benchrest rifles(light varminit class and heavy varmint class).

There is a hell of a lot of BS out there that plays on our weakness of having everything perfect, which my also be a point on ownership pride....choose your poison.

The most accurate rifle I have ever owned was a trued 700 in a pillar bedded 40x wood stock with a 28" Pac Nor super match barrel(13" twist) chambered with a short leade 6PPC reamer shooting 60g Bergers..no one would believe the accuracy of this rifle and I burned the barrel out shooting p. dogs. I shot more "zero's" with this rifle than all my other rifle's combined. This rifle defies all logic on which platorm a super accurate rifle should be built, of course by this time I was out of Benchrest competition and into shoot'en critters.

Keith, re: "excessive compulsive traits," I feel ya, man.

It must have hit him when he was trying to spell conclusion.

"My conclustion that the individual barrel quality means...."

You really have to try hard to get a 6mm ppc to not shoot small groups!

I'm not good at proof reading either.

Regardless of the stock material "If done right, pillars will definately give a good, solid, and stressfree platform for the action to rest on."

This is the point I was trying to make, and in my opinion, pillars are the only consistant way to get that precise of a fit. And I have seen accuracy issues stemming from a stock not having pillars.

You don't know if you were having accuracy issues until after you pillar bed. If accuracy improves, then, yes, you were having accuracy issues.

I've got four rifles with synthetic stocks that don't have them. I've had the stocks off of three of them. Two of those have had their stocks removed several times. All of them have always returned to zero.
I've never seen a quality synthetic that anyone has ever compressed the stock by over tightening the action screws.
That's not to say that some cheaply made synthetics or soft wood stocks can't be so done. I've owned a cheap synthetic that would shift zero after 15-20 rds. simply because the stock compressed. But I doubt that is what is being discussed here. E