I'm thinking about getting one. Don't really need one but I think lever gun be a fun gun to hunt with and the 45/70 is a little more exciting than a 30/30 or 35 rem. The thing is lever guns do not appear to be designed with recoil in mind. How is muzzle jump? How hard is it gona hit me in the face? What is the difference between normal factory and +P stuff.

I have 2 Marlin 45-70's. One is the guide gun with the factory recoil pad, and the other is an older gun with a curved hard plastic butt plate. With standard 405 grain loads at about 1300 fps neither one is that bad. Less recoil than a standard 30-06 in my opinion. I also have some 300 grain loads at about 1800 fps that are unplesant in the older gun but no problem in the guide gun. I have very little experience with loads any hotter than this as I feel I don't need it. If I were going to Alaska I would be tempted to try some of the hotter loads in the guide gun but not my old gun unless I replace the butt plate with a good pad. Years ago someone gave me a few really hot 500 grain loads that I ran through my older gun. Let's just say it nearly brought tears to my eyes, and I was a lot younger and tougher then. I have the Limbsaver recoil pad on several of my guns and it really works. If I ever decide to seriously hunt with my older gun I would put one on it and feel pretty confident it would make most loads manageable.

Only marginal experience here, and that with a .444 so take it for what it's worth.

The recoil is not problem, it's that sloping comb made for open sights. My .444 whacked my face worse than any other rifle I've owned. A .458 or .375 Ruger #1 will rock your shoulder pretty good (and I do know that from personal experience) but they don't really hurt. That dang Marlin hurt my face and gave me the worst flinch I've ever had.

I know lots of folks shoot these big bore Marlisn with no problems and maybe it's just my build - 5' 10", medium build and about 165 lbs at the time. Maybe a shorter neck or thicker cheeks would have helped.

Also FWIW, I always thought a plain old 30-30 Marlin or Winchester 94 kicked more than it should. Not bad by any means, just more than they ought to for that little 30-30 round.

That's the part I was worried about.

My only experience with a lever gun has been a m94 in 30/30. Like you said it seemed to recoil way more than it should. That got me thinking about the 45/70.

that sounds like trouble

When Marlin first re-introduced the 1895, in 1972 I think it was, they came with a 22" barrel and a straight stock like the guide gun or cowboy rifles they make now. The butt is curved, but not as sharply as many of the guns made in the 1800's. I've been tempted to put a better recoil pad on it, but you don't see many of these rifles and I want to keep it original

Regarding the comb hitting your face. Remember that traditional lever rifles were not designed to be shot from a bench. They are much more comfortable shot from other positions.

When shooting the guide gun from the bench it is best to be sitting upright, not hunched over and leaning into the bench. That hurts. I put 4 or 5 sandbags under the forearm and drop the seat low. Otherwise, they certainly get your attention with faster loads but the standard factory stuff is pretty mild. I can not see parting with mine, even though I usually chose bolt guns to hunt with...

One reason for the fear put into folks over levergun recoil is that the levergun has to be correctly placed, or it will seem to kick righteously.
It is very important to have a proper cheek weld, and a secure placement of the stock into the crevice between the deltoid and the pectoral muscles. Many bolt gun shooters like to pull their guns into the shouldre via the pistol grip, this helps to tame recoil with leverguns as well, but the pulling must be done from the forearm, not the lever.
If you have been used to soft recoil pads, and had the easy life with heavy bolt guns shooting moderate cartridges, the levergun will wake you up, but I am no superman, and I can easily shoot heavy 45-70s, 30-06s, 450 Marlins, and even 30-30s with out hospital visits, and Ive been doing it for some time now.
Use correct technique, master it, and you wont have to regret that new guide gun.
Good luck n good shootin

I have the ported guide gun with a pachmayer recoil pad on it which really helps.My .338wm kicks alot more than the 45-70.

The recoil is about what you want it to be. Stick with factory loads and it is mild. Add powder and bullet weight and you can probably reach your recoil tolerance limit. With hard cast 420 grain bullets and max charges of RL7, my ported GG makes you careful with shots from the bench 'cause I can only do about 8-10 and I'm done for the day. No sense wasting any. Standing up and shooting at steel is much more fun and pleasant.

There is indeed that part of it. I was loading my .444 with 240 grain bullets right up around 2200 fps. In a Marlin 1894 .44 Magnum, a lighter weight rifle, shooting those same 240 JHP bullets at 1400-1600 fps wasn't bad at all.

Looking back, it wasn't firing off a bench per se that hurt, it was using a scope on that hard kicking rifle. With that stock you have to raise your cheekbone a good bit to acquire the scope image, letting the comb have a good running start at your face.

Using a peep sight with your head right down on the comb mitigates this greatly. Have really noticed this when working up .30-30 loads with a scope, then switching to a peep for field use. Same load and less weight on the same rifle but perceived "facial smack" was much reduced.

By Rick Jamison in Shooting Times.


The 450 marlin is basically the same as the 45-70 with Buffalo Bore ammo or loaded to it's potential..I find it not feeling any worse than my Ruger 300 Win Mag from 525 grain cast at 1550 to 300 grain Nosler at 2300 fps and a 350 North fork at 2100+++ fps in my ported Guide gun.

Ain't bad at all.

Jayco

thing to remember about the marlin is that even though the new ones LOOK like they have a nice vented recoil pad, the SOB is harder than a rock.......switching recoil pads does wonders. also when yah start lobbing 405 grain hard cast at critters at around 100 yards or less you dont need a ton of speed to hit them like a freight train. occasionally ill load up a bunch of real mild loads with the 405's and hand the gun off to my recoil shy wife and she will spend an afternoon trying to find a chunk of sectioned but not yet split firewood she cant put that chunk of lead through with our soft ol' cottonwoods, it takes several feet of dried fire wood to stop one..........after awhile i get yelled at that i shoulda loaded more than 100 rounds cause she went through them all.......so if yah handload, the 45-70 can be had in any power you wish easily and cheaply.....

Atsa fact. Especially if you cast your own lead.

What a bunch of wimps.......I have shot the older model .45-70 with the longer barrels and the newer guide guns. They kick....damn rights, but it is not that big a deal. The velocity of the kick is not very fast.

Bottom line is ...want to disperse it...have a big but plate surface area and use a good pad like Pachmyer.

K

Damn babies!!!

I've been shooting a 444ss(22" barrel) for years with nothing but the brick of a pad Marlin used to put on them. No vents, nuthin'. I load it pretty hot and never shoot anything lighter than 270gr bullets. It will send you home a bit sore after a range session, but it ain't that bad IMO. With a better pad, like a Decelerator, it would be much better. My friend shoots a 450 Marlin with the short(18.5') ported barrel. I absolutely hate it. Yeah, the ports reduce recoil, but the muzzle blast is deafening. I'd rather more recoil and no porting.....

Amen.....that muzzleblast can hurt.....affect your hearing for the rest of your life.

i generally dont push the bullets out fast enough to notice an increase in noise......full house loads are prolly different....if your just out to smack deer and black bear and such at close range i dont see much difference cause you dont need the Garret type loads. mines ported and the few times ive shot it without hearing protection its MUCH more pleasant than my 270 Win.

All I can say is that you must have the loudest 270 on earth.......

I currently own the 444P and the marlin 1895gs. With 265gr load from the 444 you better have a good hold of the forearm if you have a scope mounted, or you will be visiting the EMERGENCY ROOM for stitches. MY 1895gs with 350gr Hornady and a max load of 4198 will also award you a few stitches if you creep up on the scope.Both are deadly on whitetail, Just use a scope with 4+ inches of eye releif.

45-70 is a powder puff with factory loads. I've tried that Garretts in my wifes 1895 GG, and those hurt worse than my 458.

doubt it. boom of the the mild loaded 45-70 is much less painful than the crack of the 270, atleast to my ears......the guide gun is ported, not braked...it throws gas out to keep muzzle rise down but atleast with mine the ports are not directed back twords me. it doesnt have that loud of a muzzle blast if im not using max loads.

stand next to someone else while they shoot it and then tell me that........

not worried about someone standing next to me. im worried about me. i dont shoot at a range and have yet to be in a situation out hunting where someone is positioned directly to the left or right of my muzzle to where it would be a problem........has happened a few times shooting ground squirrels. however with only one person shooting at a time out walking with hunting rifles anyone standing at the side had adaquate time to protect their hearing.