What do you all recommend for elk? This is for Colorado, so sabots are out.

JV

I use a .54cal 430 gr T/C Maxibullet that a friend casts for me. I bought the mould 30+ yrs ago and it shoots 3" or less at 100yds. 120 grs of pyrodex in my Renegade and I have a great 150 yd Colorado setup.
John

I asked that a couple months ago and opinions were widely varied. Although I've never shot an animal with one, I have been impressed with the 300gr Thor solid copper bullet in my backyard. I plan to use them this fall in front of 100 or 110 grs of BH 209.

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/3809444/1

If I can get them to shoot well, I will be using the 300 gr thor also next fall.

that said, I have killed an elk the last two years with the 350 gr Hornady FPB. Great bullet, accurate, and cheaper than thors or powerbelts.

I also like BH 209, of couse not every gun will shoot it. What gun will you be shooting.

Only shot one elk with BP. It was a traditional hunt, no optics, sabots or the like. Used a 50 cal. with a 320 grain T/C mini Ball. Broke a front shoulder with the first shot, second went through both lungs and exited. Elk only went 30 feet or so.
I am for sure no BP expert, but like most hunting do think shot placement is far more important that what bullet.

I'm shooting factory open sights so I'm not going to talk about my group size but, last week my brother shot 300gr Thors and 300gr fpb's out of a scoped Knight disc at 100 yds. They were ALL in the same 2 1/2" group.

Jester,

Your brother must practice a lot!

Folks.....if you go the lead route you are doing yourself a great injustice if you don't strongly consider No Excuses Bullets. They are simply the best conical I have ever shot, and it appears that I am not alone in that judgment. Take a serious look at them...they shoot great groups and knock a hell of a hole in the animal.

http://www.muzzleloading-bullets.com/

What rifle?

I agree as long as your rifle will shoot them. Chances are a T/C with a QLA won't. My omega shoots no excuses at 5-8 inch groups at 25 yards! That is NOT the bullets fault. But it will shoot thors, FPBs, and powerbelts OK due to the rear bell skirt that locks the gasses in. But then, the Omega is not designed for conicals, only sabots. Yes, some of them will shoot conicals OK, but you have to be lucky to get one that does.

If my gun shot no excuses well, I would seriously think about using them. I have heard only praises from terminal performance.

I have a Traditions in-line I bought from Bass Pro Shops in 2002 that is almost identical to the E-Bolt. I don't remember the model name, but I think it was sold exclusively through Bass Pro. I used it that season in Virginia, but moved west in 2003 and have not drawn a muzzleloader tag since then. I'm thinking about picking up a new muzzleloader though, one that's easier to clean, and more accurate. I'm looking at the CVA Accura and a few others.

I picked up some 270 grain Platinum Powebelt bullets and some 325 grain TC Maxi-Balls on sale. I'm sure the latter would be good for elk, but I wonder if the Powerbelts would open up too soon.

JV

The Platinum Powerbelts work great, much more controlled expansion versus the traditional Powerbelts. I still prefer the Hornady FPB, however, given the cost of the Platinums.

If you're serious about that Accura, check out Midway USA right now. Heck of a deal going on.

I have had the 54 348G aero-tip not exit on the broadside shot of a 180lb deer. Rifle was a Lyman deerstalker 1/48 twist. I just do not have confidence in these bullets for big stuff. With a 54 cal. hole I am looking for more penetration than this on an elk.

I am going to be trying the No-Excuse conicals as I just drew a bull tag for unit 43.

I'm loaded with a round ball in the Mortimer, a 540 grain (can't get 'em any more?)TC Maxi-hunter in the .54 (used to use a Precision Rifle "Ultimate 1 Colorado Conical"), and a Cabela's 450 grain "x-tended range conical in the 50 cal. Any of them will kill an elk, some closer, some farther away. But I've only killed a couple of elk with a muzzleloader, so heck if I know what's best for you to use.

I shot these heah 54 cal. bullets into soaking-wet newspaper. I forget exactly how fast they were going, but I usually use modest loads of around 100 grains of FFg for conicals and more for round balls;
left-to-right: round ball, 460 grain round-nose flat-base Buffalo Bullet, 425 grain hollow-point hollow-base Buff bullet, 425 grain Hornady Great Plains, and 540 grain Maxi-Hunter.

Nice picture. I have never understood the "need" for a hollowpoint in soft lead either.

I really like the looks of that 460 grain round-nose flat-base Buffalo Bullet. Decent expansion and short profile for a 1/48 twist. Where did you get those?

djb....give that guy an email and he will be glad to give you suggested loads that work for the bullet chosen, etc. He was such a nice guy in his email....just asked me what I needed and said "Its in the mail...send me a check when you receive it." The customer service aspect (along with the bullet performance of course) really sold me on his product.

I am not surprised they didn't shoot in some guns....I get the feeling that they are designed for "traditional" muzzleloaders, but am not sure on that.

Umm..I don't know. I'm afraid that most of the stuff I shoot is unavailable/outdated these days. I think they shut down some time ago.... Its lucky that I buy in bulk.

Thanks. I will take your advice.

I have become a "hoarder" of late when I find something I like. Those bullets look a lot like a lengthened Ball-et I have tried before.

I had a gentleman cast some Lee REAL's for me and they shoot well, problem is they are so undersized that I can literally shake them out of the bore.

i've killed several elk with the same ml, a 50 cal tc black diamond shooting 100gr of pyrodex and 348gr hollow point powerbelts. all were one shot kills and all were braodside at less than 100 yards except for one cow coming head on and shot at a distance of 8 steps. i gave that gun away and now use my old 54cal tc renegade. a couple elk killed at less than 100 yards, one using great plains bullet and maybe 2 using the maxi hunter.

Have you tried giving them a good "rap" with ramrod to partially obturate them after seating?

I like REAL bullets and use them in my two Thompson New Englanders (1:48) for plinking because they are easy to load. I certainly can't shake them out of the barrel, but for plinking, I like 60 grains of FFFg, which obturates them well. Light loads with FFg doesn't seem to obturate them well (poor accuracy). I killed an antelope with a 300 grain 54 cal Real bullet about 25 years ago. It was my "flat-shootin'" bullet way back when. They probably need a good jolt to "bump" them up, as they are flat based and light.

If you require a larger diameter, you might want to ignore the Buffalo Bullets too, as they are fairly easy to load in my New Englanders(so may be undersize for your bore). However, the Hornady Great Plains are hard as H to load and the TC maxi-hunters are just a bit less so. I like the looks of the Great Plains, but they are far too tight for a quick second shot. I literally had to push them in by shoving the ramrod against a tree and pushing the rifle into the tree to get them seated. Hornady used to sell flat-nosed Great Plains, but I think they now only make HP, except the 50 cal Pennsylvania bullet. You could check Graff & Sons for any discontinued bullets as they seem to have stores of older bullets. They have the lighter, 350 grain maxi-hunter listed as well, which is fairly short. The Great plains Pennsylvania bullet is only like 240 grains, so need to get close. Yet a 50 cal round ball at about 180 grains, or a 54 ball at about 220 grains will kill elk.

If you stay with modest loads of BP, and not the new super loads of BP subs, a Minie bullet works well. I use a cheap Lee Minie mold to cast .533-inch dia. 410 grainers. They shoot well in my 1:48 twist.

This photo includes a 300 grain 54 cal REAL bullet (center), and on the far right is a 50 cal HPHB Buffalo Bullet that I sent a bit faster into the medium. Its kinda cute; got a hole right through it; like a donut.

I would NOT use the powerbelt 270 gr on an elk. 338 platinum would be OK in my book, but I still have more confidence in the 350 gr Hornady FPB. FPB are a lead alloy and stay together better. All powerbelts are esentially a soft lead bullet. The platinum cover is just that, a cover, and it does not strengthen the bullet. What makes it hold together better is that is has a smaller hollowpoint than the standard powerbelt. That said, it would probably get the job done, but I still give the nod to the FPBs and they are MUCH cheaper.

With any soft lead and elk, bigger is better. That is why the No excuse bullets (460 gr) do so well. They are much cheaper than powerbelts as well.

The only bullet that I feel is big enough for elk and less than 350 gr is the Thor 300 gr. Being a barnes solid copper bullet, it should hold together and push on thorough.

Thanks for the info. I have tried several bullets. The REAL that shoots well for me is the 380g. I also have some of the 300 grain. I have shot Ball-et's, Maxi hunters/maxi balls, Powerbelts, rb's, and the Hornady's too. The REALs are the only ones that I had the problem with. Must be sized a little too small. It's not as much a problem with a fouled bore, but I really don't want to hunt for a week or more this way, CO can get really wet in Sept. and I want to be very sure I get a 'boom' when I pull the trigger

Some people love RB's but I had shot three deer with them and have yet to get an exit. I tend to view muzzy hunting much like archery; I like two holes as there is not the impact force (energy, shock, whatever people term it) as with rifles.

Yeh, he's kinda like obsessed with it.

I would opt for one of the T/C's, Maxi-Hunter or Maxi-Ball bullets. If you could use sabots, I would say Hornady's SST. I toted the 250 gr version the last time I hunted NM and it worked up to par. I recovered the bullet, a perfect mushroom and it retained about 80% of its origianl weight best I recall. Ribs, no shoulder bones.

Joseph

Has anybody tried the Harvester hard cast bullets? I'm going to be trying the 330 grain in my 54 caliber Lyman Deerstalker this year.

http://www.harvestermuzzleloading.c...6&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=3

Don't know about elk, yet, but the 378 gr. Powerbelt works just fine on Colorado moose.

I plan to use the same bullet for my bull elk hunt this fall.

Assume you mean the 348 gr?

If you shoot them behind the shoulder through the chest AND don't push them too hard you will be fine. But I killed an elk last year with a FPB that busted the big leg bone just above the elbow and still had enough umph to take out the heart. I feel pretty confident that a powerbelt would not have performed as well.

Just remember with powerbelts, pushing them too hard equals LESS penetration.

But, of course, that is why there are Fords and Chevys! Eveyone's personal experience with different thinks is different.

Mine are 50cal 370 grn Maxi-balls. Great penetration and one shot kills on elk, shoulder bones or not.