I have started working with a new to me Tikka in .300 win mag. This will be primarily an elk rifle.
After some initial testing with various bullets it has averaged less then an inch for three shot groups with:
180gr. nosler partitions/handloads
180 gr. Barnes TSX / handloads
220 gr Sierra RN/handloads
180 gr Noselr Partition / Federal Factory loads

These were all shells loaded for other guns and they all grouped under an inch and all grouped to same relative point of aim.
I am gonna start assembly loads for it and am kinda undecided what I would like to use. Magazine restricts to an absolute max. length of 3.34" so it becomes an issue with heavier bullets.
All things considered equal what would you use for an elk bullet

P.S. Most shots 300 yds. or less

Nice to buy a new rifle that likes pretty much all the loads you try in it. It's sure hard to beat a Tikka for out of the box accuracy.

Personally, I'm a big fan of the Nosler Partition in both the 180 & 200 grain in a .300 Win Mag. Don't think you could go wrong with either weight for Elk. If I knew I was gonna be in prime Grizz country, I'd then go with the 200 grain Partition.

180 gr NP/handloads.

Although I killed an elk with a 180 NPT and it worked well, if I was going back, my .300 WM load would be with a 200 gr. NPT or a 168 gr. TTSX.

DF

I've killed a lot of elk with a 300 WSM which is so close to the WM that the difference is nearly negligible. For years I had great luck with Speer 180gr Hotcores but their quality control has apparently gone to pot. The last 2 boxes I've used haven't grouped worth a darn.
PT's are great. 180's are more than enough weight for elk. 200's are fine, too, but they'll arc a bit more on longer shots. They won't kill any deader than 180's.
I wouldn't waste time with the Sierra 220gr bullets. They're simply more than you need. A flatter shooting, lighter bullet will do just as well if not better.

180 TSX gets my vote. Last two elk I shot agree.

Of the listed loads I would go with a 180 Partition in handload flavor.

Ever think of trying the 168 TTSX instead of the 180? You lose some powder space in the 180 TTSX especially with the mag restrictions on the Tikka. The 168 would be a laser out to 300yds started off around 3150 fps.

180 protected point.

3.34", man I can see why tikka's are so popular.

180 Partition.



P

+1 for the 180 grain Nosler Partition, 200 grain also works. If you don't handload the Federal Partition load is good.

I would use a 168 TTSX over a 180 TSX.

Either would work.

DF

I would use a 180 gr NP,but that's just me.

Either way,if he puts the bullet in the right place it 's a moot point.

I use 180 grain Nosler Partition Protected Points in my 300 Win Mag. They are accurate and work really well in my rifle. I reload and use H4831sc with Winchester large rifle magnum primers. I'm a bit lazy and use these hand loads for hunting deer, hogs and elk.

I'd certainly consider the TTSX, especially if magazine length is an issue. Most of the time Barnes bullets perform better when seated pretty far off of the lands. Plus they are one hell of a performer on game. memtb

The 220s were on hand that my buddy had loaded for some close quarters bear hunting years ago. I tried just to see how they shot.
I like the Noslers personally and have never been a barnes fan as the only ones I have ever shot anything with were the old xbullet style , but the ones I tried today (TSX) shoot into .6" at 100. so that really got me thinking. The nosler I have shot shot well also though.

If you can keep any bullet group under 4" at 300 yds, that's easily good enough for elk. Nitpicking between a 1 MOA bullet and a .6 MOA from the bench isn't worth the effort. The trick is to do it in the field.

Accuracy I am not worried about , I am more curious about terminal performance. I just was wondering people's reasons for choosing one bullet over another. I am sure both the Nosler Partition and the Barnes TSX will both be a very potent elk killer.
I just wanted to hear others opinions on why the would choose one over the other.

Why not the 165 rather than the 168?

Barnes FAQ's says the 165 was designed specifically for the 300WM with a tangent ogive to make it easier to fit in the mag box.



Is the 168-grain .30-caliber TSX the same as the 165-grain TSX? Is it really a match-grade hunting bullet?
These bullets have different ogive geometries. The 165-grain TSX incorporates a shorter tangent ogive in the nose profile. It’s designed for cartridges with short magazines such as the .300 WSM and .300 Win Mag. The 168-grain TSX BT has a secant ogive which lengthens the nose profile and has shown superb accuracy downrange. It offers the best of both worlds because it’s also a premium hunting bullet offering exceptional terminal performance. It is best suited for cartridges such as the .308 Winchester, .30-06 and .300 Weatherby.

http://www.barnesbullets.com/faq/

+1

My Damara .300 WM has a 3.6" mag, chambered with longer throat, so I have COAL options. I would pick the 168 TTSX over the 165 TSX because the TTSX, reportedly, opens a bit faster than the non-tipped version. If I had a .300 WM with a 3.4" box mag and the 165 TSX fit better, I'd go there.

Good friends shoot the 168 TTSX in their .30-378 and .300 RUM, both swear by that bullet.

So, for elk it would be a toss up between 180/200 NPT and 165/168 Barnes. I'd probably go with the load the gun liked and my thinking at the time. Good shot placement with any of those would fill a freezer with good elk meat.

IMO,

DF

guys worry far too much about their equipment, and small differences, in rifles ammo etc. and tend to ignore the important stuff like your physical condition, keeping warm and dry and well fed on a hunt, and studying topo maps. Id bet good boots and socks vs badly fitting boots, and having a warm sleeping bag vs freezing your butt at night, have had a bigger effect on a hunts outcome that rifle calibers, being used, and getting into an area a few days early to get used to the altitude before strenuous activity prior to a hunt starting, preventing altitude sickness, has sure helped more, and spending an hour a day for a few months prior to a hunt in 4 15 minute sessions on a tread mill or running laps will sure benefit you more than any change in bullet design between a 180-200 grain bullet.
I can,t help smiling reading through this thread and thinking back 35 plus years when two of the guys in our elk hunt club had this big debate on the merits of the hornady 190 grain vs the speer 200 grain 30 caliber bullets.
I do most of the hand loading of ammo, for most of the members and either bullet can be loaded to similar velocities.
these guys got a whole bunch of old wet phone books and did penetration tests because they were curious, concerning penetration, and just if your curious the hornady usually penetrated a bit deeper, the speer opened faster,
(btw both bullets are accurate)but the end result was over at least a decade of hunting both projectiles proved very lethal on elk, so it mattered not a bit what was used.I know, that in 30 plus years neither guy has killed an elk at over 300 yards, and regardless of which bullet is used,a good shot in the heart/lung area results in a dead elk.

http://handloads.com/loaddata/defau...;type=rifle&Order=Powder&Source=

Nothing wrong with any of 'em. I will be trying the 175 LRX. The 165 HIB worked just fine before, but I never leave good enough alone...

I've had great results with the 180 TTSX's out of my 300 H&H

Just part of the disease process...

Evidence of being a Loony...

DF

I've settled on the 180 TTSX in my 300 Weatherby and the 150 in the 7mm RM after trying lots of different bullets including partitions and Accubonds. The tipped Barnes just shoots better for me and has worked better on elk than the others. I have to agree all would do the job just fine with decent placement, With a raking angle at 200+ yards I have more faith in the TTSX.

Beings I live 15 minutes from the area I hunt elk for. And usually walk 10 plus miles a day at work ( field surveyor) I am all set in those areas. And I sleep in my own bed every night during elk season...

Elk milk is the chit if you can get a steady supply.

Good points, 340.

But Loonies aren't wanting to hear logical discourse...

DF

No need for you to die, you are already in heaven. Consider this an exemption. lol.

LOL, I am lucky to be positioned here!
I guess I need to restate my original Question. If accuracy being the same , Would you use the Nosler Partition or the Barnes TSX. I have killed elk with a Shot raking from the last rib forward and it was plenty dead. That was with a 7x57 and a (GOD Forbid) Remington Corelokt. I am well aware either will kill an elk , I am just wondering why some would choose on over the other?

For the same reason that some would choose a brunette over a blond, a Ford over a Dodge, a 270 over a 308, etc. Personal preference whether any benefit can be proven or not.

200 grain bullets will outperform 180 grain counterparts at point blank range as in under 50 yards and about 520 yards at 300 win mag stats. Monolithic ie Barnes will perhaps not express the frangebile energy at point blank. And they should penterate well but not produce as big of a hole. Not really much difference other than personal preference.

Hard to go wrong with a partition. I prefer the 200 but there is absolutely nothing wrong with the 180.

I killed my one and only elk with a 180-grain Partition in the Federal factory load, a friend told me to either use that or a Barnes TSX or TTSX in the 165-grain (may have been the 168-grain load, I don't remember). I picked the Nosler because he had a bunch of Barnes bullets that he had recovered from deer and elk, and my train of thought was that if he was recovering the Barnes from deer it might not give me the penetration that I want with an elk. Don't know if that's the right way to think, but it worked for me. Now for my next elk hunt I'm thinking of trying the Barnes bullets, just to use something different (and I do believe it will work just fine).

Of those listed, in no particular order:

Nosler Partitions, handloads or factory won't matter as long as they shoot well.

Barnes TTSX, not TSX.

For myself, Barnes TTSX, North Fork SS and Nosler AccuBond. Again, not necessarily in that order, as I tend to prefer the North Fork.

I've been using 180 gr Nosler E-tips.
The reason is that I came up with this load for a Bison hunt on the Elk Refuge and they were asking us to use non lead bullets. (didn't kill a bison) I bought some blems from Shooters Pro Shop for the same price as I'd have bought any other bullet anywhere, so why not? They're accurate and effective. They put this years cow elk down with one shot from 100yds in less than 50 feet. Last year's cow was spine shot so I won't count that towards performance.
My previous elk was shot with a 180gr PPU softpoint. It did the job as well. I was using them because they were cheap, accurate, and available.

If you don't "need" the solid coppers, I'd just use the partitions.

I think I am gonna stick with the 180 gr. Partition . Accurate and I never heard of a Partition not expanding. The Tsx's Shoot awesome but in the back of my mind I wish they expanded faster. The TTSX's are too long for my liking to fit neatly in the magazine.
I have a couple of bullets I dug out of my backstop. One partition and one TSX, The TSX hit a 1/2" piece of plywood and the came to rest in a mixture of sand ,dirt and gravel. It is expanded , but not near as much as the partition I have that I shot into a 15" cottonwood limb and then came to rest in the same dirt gravel sand bank. The TSX was further into the dirt but did not have to get through a tree to get to the dirt....
I can not figure out how to get pictures loaded on here . but the Nosler is text book for what a bullet should look like.

Nosler Partition is never the wrong answer.

Only reason I questioned a change was a couple of groups with the TSX's averaged .6" at 100. The Noslers average about 1". so far.

For LR target shooting, maybe that difference in groups would show up. For general hunting, not an issue, IMO.

I agree that PT's are hard to beat. I've recently had good luck shooting mono-metals and think either would work.

DF

wyo - the difference in accuracy between those bullets is in the "noise" - which means nada. There are an infinite number of other things that you can do or change that will matter more.

I'm back to using the 180 gn partition in my 300 after a few decades of using the 200 gn partition. A 180 at 3100fps will easily kill anything on our continent.

Shooters Pro Shop has a TON of 180 partition Blems right now.
http://www.shootersproshop.com/shoo...0-180gr-partition-spitzer-blem-50ct.html

Yup and yup.

Yes, but I already bought a chit load of 200's when they were $13.45/bag..... ... I used/loaded 200's in my 300 win and wby mags. They worked great too... The 180's are awesome killers in the 300's as well. I'd be all over those blems...They actually are pretty damn good bullets..

My .300 WM has been set up for 180's for years. I, too, like you bought 200 NPT's from SPS and am working up loads.

I know personally that a 180 NPT will kill an elk, even a big one, but Loonies NEVER leave good enough alone...

DF

180 NPT.

One in the boiler room did the trick, but he didn't know that and ran. Another to the spine dropped his rear quarters and he was still trying to get away, using his front feet. I was about to nail him again, but the guide said he was done for.

The guide was right. But, sometimes a "dead" elk will run...

DF

I am not saying, "Don't handload" but I stand-by the 'ole REM Core Lokt 180 grain. They will work. I have some Barnes that I have reloaded and they are more accurate at the bench but I think if I was in a real world situation the Core Lokt would do the work out to 270 yds safely. That's just me though. But if I was to get technicle I would choose Swift brand in either A frame or the Scirocco. Try some H1000:)

I am not saying, "Don't handload" but I stand-by the 'ole REM Core Lokt 180 grain. They will work. I have some Barnes that I have reloaded and they are more accurate at the bench but I think if I was in a real world situation the Core Lokt would do the work out to 270 yds safely. That's just me though. But if I was to get technicle I would choose Swift brand in either A frame or the Scirocco. Try some H1000:)

_________________________

I am not saying, "Don't handload" but I stand-by the 'ole REM Core Lokt 180 grain. They will work. I have some Barnes that I have reloaded and they are more accurate at the bench but I think if I was in a real world situation the Core Lokt would do the work out to 270 yds safely. That's just me though. But if I was to get technicle I would choose Swift brand in either A frame or the Scirocco. Try some H1000:)

_________________________

At other times, I think they will go into shock and just stand. Some years ago, I shot a 4x4 bull at about 250 yds. He just stood there. I shot 3 more times before he went down. He just stood there looking dumb and I wasn't sure I was even hitting him. I was, and hard. I could cover all 4 shots with my hand, all rignt in the center of the lungs. The lungs were obliterated, like a jello that just hit the floor, and the far shoulder was broken.

When in shock, the blood pressure plummets and the heart races. I think that often a bullet will cause rapid internal bleeding and the blood pressure drops fast. Then the heart takes off at high speed to try to compensate. It causes malfunctions of many other organs in the process. Of course the heart can't keep it up for very long with no blood supply. Meanwhile, the animal goes nowhere, as in the case with this elk. As the blood to the brain is shut down, they lose the go power to run. My elk likely didn't even know he was hit the last 3 times.

I've seen that. My hunting pard shot a big elk and he just stood there for a while.. He eventually turned all the way around and got another 180 NPT thru the boiler room. He stood even longer, head drooped, looking pretty weak, then slowly rolled over.

DF

My elk hunting partner has been running a 300 Win Mag with 180 PT's since about 1970. He showed me a film canister with a handful of 180's he's recovered over the years from elk. Usually he takes 2 elk a year and I don't think he has ever gone without. Pretty good track record for the bullet in my opinion.

Yep.

Could be why the Partition is the standard by which others are judged...

DF

Winchester once developed a bullet called the Fail Safe.

Story taken from the: (Firing Line Forum)

Last year was my third season elk hunting, and the first year that I was successful. But something about that day last fall has been bugging me. I'd like to figure it out before I go out again in October. Bear with me here....

I have a 300 WSM for elk. For ammo, I've been carrying Winchester Supreme 180 grain Fail Safe. Last fall, I got very lucky on opening morning when 7 cows and a bull appeared in the trees 55 yards away from where I was sitting (I paced it off later). After they looked at me for a few seconds, they turned broadside and ran down the hill. As soon as the cows got out of the way, I had an easy (but split-second!) shot between trees at the broadside bull who was just beginning to run. The bullet entered his right side, just behind the shoulder and near the center (top to bottom) of the chest. He ran downhill about 30 yards and dropped.

There was a small entrance wound on the right side, where the bullet passed through a rib. The heart and liver were in good condition, but the lungs were just a mass of jelly and the chest cavity was full of blood. But there was no exit wound on the left side. I wasn't exactly performing an autopsy or searching for the bullet, but I never did come across the bullet or any fragments. And there was NO exit wound. We skinned him out back in camp and still found no exit.

According to the ballistics charts, the bullet was moving about 2800 fps and carrying 3000 ft-lbs of energy when it connected on a medium-sized bull. Did it just break up in the chest cavity? I'm thinking that if the bullet expended ALL of it's energy on the target without exiting, that's a good thing.

But not so good IF you do have to trail it any distance.. Glad you got your bull..

WyoCoyote, I've yet to take my first elk but the day I do will be a wonderful day to remember.

I am lucky to have a lot of great memories, but taking an elk, first or my last (not for a long time I hope) will always a great memory for me.

Good luck when you do get the chance.

+1

I agree. Good luck!! Elk hunting separates the men from the boys..

Ha ha. Isn't that the truth. I hear you about the 180gr. nosler partition. I shot my bull last year with the 300 WSM and 180gr. nosler partition. Worked like a charm. The bull wasn't huge, but it still worked great. Punched right thru the boiler room and the bull slid about 30 ft in the snow. Pretty much DRT...

The nosler PT still offers the best blend of killing quick and dead reliable penetration.
If Nosler offered a boat tail, tipped and high BC partition they would dominate the market.

If people knew how good the 180 Nosler Ballistic Tip really is, they wouldn't need partitions...

I'm tempted to try the 180 accubonds, but I've got enough E-tips to last the rest of my hunting career so I don't really see the point.

I have shot 18 big game animals with Nosler Ballistic tip bullets.

The guys I hunt with think I am nuts.

They hunt with partition bullets.

I know that terminal ballistics is a few anecdotes with dominating out of control variables.

But when they hunt with me, I can show them the wound channel. I aim for the lungs and the reaction is either bang flop or bang stagger stagger flop.

They say that someday I will have quartering away shot, and wish I had a partition.

How can anyone live in a free country and hunt with dictators? Lol.

It's your hunt, enjoy it.

Lot of truth to that. I am very fond of the 180 BT.

I tried BT way back and thought the accuracy was great but on game wasn't. I haven't bought any BTs in probably close to twenty years.

There are so many good bullets available it isn't hard to find "good" performers. I have been using Etips in my .300WM but have yet to decide if they're the bees knees.

I actually think highly of some of the C&C HP's from both Hornady and Sierra but haven't been finding them lately. I pass through Bend going to visit family so pick up seconds regularly from Nosler.

Hornady interlocks or the bt's worked well for me

They work quite well in a 300 win mag.

I ran 180 BT's out of a 300 WM back in the mid to late 80's and used it exclusively on whitetail. Long(ish) range crop damage shooting when they had that here. I turned average sized whitetail deer into a dish rag at any range. I tried the same bullet about three years ago in a 300 WSM at the same perhaps a little higher velocity. Different story. Much better bullet and expansion control. So much in fact I bought a box of 150 BT's and was much happier with those results on deer. I would say the the 150 BT's did less damage on whitetail deer running at 3300+fps than the older 180's did running around 3000 fps. Just my experience comparing the old with the new so don't rule out 180 BT's. Yes it's on WT and not elk but just the same they are tougher than what their reputation is.

Still don't trust the leadless bullets. Have had absolute great success with Nosler Partition. Shooting <1 MOA is less important than bullet performance, IMHO. But I am always satisfied with Nosler PT accuracy and am always happy with the performance. Often the partition's shoot as good as any. Including the old Nosler's I tried in the 60's that were turned out on screw machines. Those old Noslers made my 264 a big game rifle. Otherwise I considered it about like a 270 -- a good crow rifle and good for coyotes. (the 270 was a big game rifle when using the partitions also. But please forget that I ever said that about the 270's.

180 if TTSX
200 if lead.
I like the heavier bullets and 300 pushes them plenty fast.

I killed a few elk with the 150 ballistic tips and thought they were great until one blew up on a couple of ribs on a nice bull, the palm sized entry wound and 600 yard tracking job was enough to have me switch. I like how the TTSX tends to anchor them in place. They have had similar performance in 7mm 150's and 300 Wby. 180's - the elk tend to stay where you shoot them in my limited sample. I used 180 grain partitions in a 30-06 and didnt think they performed as well as the Barnes in either accuracy or stopping power on elk or deer. As a deer bullet the ballistic tip is hard to beat for knocking them down. We have had a couple of deer it took a while to find since they dropped on the spot cross canyon with no blood trail.